Nice mains cables

[drummerman]

I expect they got them gratis.

TBF. What you "expect" is of little relevence.

The argument was being made that, since expensive cables were not used in professional recording studios, spending money that's over the odds on cables, is a waste.

Since some studios do use expensive cables, this argument is much less valid and not proof of anything (either way).

As fitting boutique cables doesn't achieve anything at all performance wise my assumption is a reasonable one. Either that or the studio owners fell for the flim flam.

C'mon TrevC, admit it ... you've never even tried/compared different cables

 

[TrevC]

I expect they got them gratis.

TBF. What you "expect" is of little relevence.

The argument was being made that, since expensive cables were not used in professional recording studios, spending money that's over the odds on cables, is a waste.

Since some studios do use expensive cables, this argument is much less valid and not proof of anything (either way).

As fitting boutique cables doesn't achieve anything at all performance wise my assumption is a reasonable one. Either that or the studio owners fell for the flim flam.

C'mon TrevC, admit it ... you've never even tried/compared different cables

I most certainly have. How could I listen to my music otherwise?

 

[Gazzip]

I still don't have the foggiest idea as to the relevance of what recording studios use in the context of home audio playback.

 

[drummerman]

By the way Trev, where are your sidekicks, fellow scientists Anderson (or whoever he may be today) and AndyJim?

My guess would be they probably followed my advise and bought some Audiofriendly Silver Mains Cables and are marveling at the clarity/transparency of sound and sheer good looks of the product. So much so that they forgot this forum. Of course they won't admit to it ;-)

Have a go ... live dangerously and invest fifteen quid of your hard earned.

Join the dark side and get some fun back in your life

 

[TrevC]

By the way Trev, where are your sidekicks, fellow scientists Anderson (or whoever he may be today) and AndyJim?

My guess would be they probably followed my advise and bought some Audiofriendly Silver Mains Cables and are marveling at the clarity, transparency and sheer good looks of the product. So much so that they forgot this forum. Of course they won't admit to it ;-)

Have a go ... live dangerously and invest fifteen quid of your hard earned.

Join the dark side and get some fun back in your life

You aren't paying attention. Mains leads can have no effect on performance. It isn't possible.

Now write 100 times, 'I must not be a silly billy'.

 

[CnoEvil]

As fitting boutique cables doesn't achieve anything at all performance wise my assumption is a reasonable one. Either that or the studio owners fell for the flim flam.

Since you have no idea why the Studios mentioned above have used more expensive cables, your comments are still pure speculation.....and speculation has little place in your so called, fact based argument.

 

[TrevC]

As fitting boutique cables doesn't achieve anything at all performance wise my assumption is a reasonable one. Either that or the studio owners fell for the flim flam.

Since you have no idea why the Studios mentioned above have used more expensive cables, your comments are still pure speculation.....and speculation has little place in your so called, fact based argument.

Prove it!

 

[CnoEvil]

As fitting boutique cables doesn't achieve anything at all performance wise my assumption is a reasonable one. Either that or the studio owners fell for the flim flam.

Since you have no idea why the Studios mentioned above have used more expensive cables, your comments are still pure speculation.....and speculation has little place in your so called, fact based argument.

Prove it!

The fact that you used the words "expect" and "assumption" means you are guessing.

 

[steve_1979]

Trev, Native,

I am not trying to say that you are wrong about cables, just that the "recording studios don't use them so why would you" argument sucks badly. You can drive a bus through it guys.

When you put forward science as your anti-cable reasoning it is much more compelling.

Most recording studios spend many thousands (or sometimes even millions) of pounds on their equiptment. Monitors, mixing desks, acoustic treatment (or even specially built buildings with optimised acoustics) and other equptment like microphones and computers etc.

They are knoledgeable and experienced professionals with a budget of many thousands. They spend these huge budgets optimising their studios for the best possible sound quality and yet they are still happy to use cheap Van Damme cables or similar for their cables and interconnects. Doesn't that tell you something?

 

[steve_1979]

By the way Trev, where are your sidekicks...

...Have a go ... live dangerously and invest fifteen quid of your hard earned.

Join the dark side and get some fun back in your life

 

[drummerman]

Trev, Native,

I am not trying to say that you are wrong about cables, just that the "recording studios don't use them so why would you" argument sucks badly. You can drive a bus through it guys.

When you put forward science as your anti-cable reasoning it is much more compelling.

Most recording studios spend many thousands (or sometimes even millions) of pounds on their equiptment. Monitors, mixing desks, acoustic treatment (or even specially built buildings with optimised acoustics) and other equptment like microphones and computers etc.

They are knoledgeable and experienced professionals with a budget of many thousands. They spend these huge budgets optimising their studios for the best possible sound quality and yet they are still happy to use cheap Van Damme cables or similar for their cables and interconnects. Doesn't that tell you something?

Many are probably just sound factories these days, processing and churning out Talent contest winners, loosers and everything in between to keep going and pay their bills as best as can.

Most of it is probably mixed so it sounds good in the car and through cheap in ear headphones, given away free with phones. I bet any audiophile pretentions come way down the list ... if at all.

Saying all S/studio Engineers are master of their craft and only aim for the best is a bit like saying all Hifi sounds the same ...

 

[drummerman]

By the way Trev, where are your sidekicks...

...Have a go ... live dangerously and invest fifteen quid of your hard earned.

Join the dark side and get some fun back in your life

Do we have to do the cats again?

 

[steve_1979]

Many are probably just sound factories these days, processing and churning out Talent contest winners, loosers and everything in between to keep going and pay their bills as best as can.

Most of it is probably mixed so it sounds good in the car and through cheap in ear headphones, given away free with phones. I bet any audiophile pretentions come way down the list ... if at all.

Saying all S/studio Engineers are master of their craft and only aim for the best is a bit like saying all Hifi sounds the same ...

Take a look at THESE pictures.

Professional recording studios spend $$$ on equiptment. They usually spend tens of thousands on the speakers alone because the sound quality and clarity is very important. Why would they do this if they didn't care about the quality?

They NEED good sound quality for them to be able to do their job properly and they can afford to use whatever cables they want but they usually use Van Damme or similar.

 

[drummerman]

As regarding Van Damned cables ... there is an interesting article in one of the recent mags.

Their reputation is built on reliability, probably often the only major criteria of touring bands and studios, where stuff is plugged in/out/in ...

 

[TrevC]

As fitting boutique cables doesn't achieve anything at all performance wise my assumption is a reasonable one. Either that or the studio owners fell for the flim flam.

Since you have no idea why the Studios mentioned above have used more expensive cables, your comments are still pure speculation.....and speculation has little place in your so called, fact based argument.

Prove it!

The fact that you used the words "expect" and "assumption" means you are guessing.

Prove that speculation has no place in a fact based argument. I can think of a number of instances where speculation is entirely appropriate.

 

[Gazzip]

Trev, Native,

I am not trying to say that you are wrong about cables, just that the "recording studios don't use them so why would you" argument sucks badly. You can drive a bus through it guys.

When you put forward science as your anti-cable reasoning it is much more compelling.

Most recording studios spend many thousands (or sometimes even millions) of pounds on their equiptment. Monitors, mixing desks, acoustic treatment (or even specially built buildings with optimised acoustics) and other equptment like microphones and computers etc.

They are knoledgeable and experienced professionals with a budget of many thousands. They spend these huge budgets optimising their studios for the best possible sound quality and yet they are still happy to use cheap Van Damme cables or similar for their cables and interconnects. Doesn't that tell you something?

Yes. It tells me that those recording studios that use inexpensive cables do not consider exotic cables worth the investment. They have made a commercial decision that their money will offer better returns in SQ if spent elsewhere.

It is definitely not however evidence that cables make absolutely no difference to SQ. You are confusing the competitive, commercial world of the professional recording industry which is there to make a profit, with the world of the Hifi hobbiest where some are prepared to pay whatever it takes to glean an improvement, however tiny that improvement may be.

Oh yes and as Cnoevil has clearly highlighted some studios are prepared to go the extra mile.

 

[steve_1979]

Do we have to do the cats again?

 

[Vladimir]

Almost all studio professionals (with exception of those on the sponsored take) consider audiophile = moron, purely because they buy overpriced cables expecting improvements in sound quality in domestic music reproduction. Studio professionals like collecting records, valve amps, old R2R decks etc. They sell pricey microphone and guitar cables and they know they make a difference for creating music, but not for transfering processed signal component to component. They will never say someone is an idiot for liking analogue sound reproduction. But if you are an audiophile, that means you buy 1000 quid power cords, and that necessarily translates as you are an imbecil to a studio professional.

I personally have had plenty of fun moments with pro gear shop employees and studio producers/engineers making jokes about audiophiles, not admiting I am one (although not a cable nut). Overpriced cables are audiophile's reason d'etre in the pro's mind. Those more informed will add few extra jabs about cable elevators, special crystals and resonators, but rarely if at all a pro will comment on overpriced speakers, turntables or valves, considering they used to own overpriced speakers, TTs and valve amps in their line of work before SS and digital came to existance. Vintage audio collectors are deemed collector of cool old gear, not audiophiles.

I personally do not think cable believers are idiots or morons. These are smart and successfull people in their line of work (how else would they afford pricey hi-fi), which happens to be not related to electronics and this makes them vulnurable to audiophile snake oil. However, in my interaction with studio and shop pros, there are no compliments or balanced response for the term audiophile. It's always spiced with pejorative attributes and chuckling. The main reason why I removed 'Audiophile' from my CV hobby category is the widespread stereotype for all audiophiles being gullible idiots with more money than sense, especially regarding cables.

 

[drummerman]

Many are probably just sound factories these days, processing and churning out Talent contest winners, loosers and everything in between to keep going and pay their bills as best as can.

Most of it is probably mixed so it sounds good in the car and through cheap in ear headphones, given away free with phones. I bet any audiophile pretentions come way down the list ... if at all.

Saying all S/studio Engineers are master of their craft and only aim for the best is a bit like saying all Hifi sounds the same ...

Take a look at THESE pictures.

Professional recording studios spend $$$ on equiptment. They usually spend tens of thousands on the speakers alone because the sound quality and clarity is very important. Why would they do this if they didn't care about the quality?

They NEED good sound quality for them to be able to do their job properly and they can afford to use whatever cables they want but they usually use Van Damme or similar.

I bet you some spend money on impressive speakers and mixing desks (sofas, bar ... ) because it looks impressive to clients. A lot of the crxxx mixes that appear on the market probably speak for themselves.

Cables are out of sight ...

It must be hard to survive as a studio nowadays. Things have changed and big productions are probably a rarety.

You can look at my comment cynically but I would guess that for many clients sound quality comes second to quick and cheap production in the right location.

 

[steve_1979]

I bet you some spend money on impressive speakers and mixing desks (sofas, bar ... ) because it looks impressive to clients. A lot of the crxxx mixes that appear on the market probably speak for themselves.

Cables are out of sight ...

Ahhh. So recording studios don't actually need good sound quality speakers to allow them to do their job properly? They just spend $$$ on speakers and acoustics to look good. *ROFL*

I advise that you have a quick read of one of the pro audio forums. You'll find that that don't agree with that.

 

[CnoEvil]

Prove that speculation has no place in a fact based argument. I can think of a number of instances where speculation is entirely appropriate.

The very definition of speculation means that there is no firm evidence to back it up; so at this stage, I think it is down to you to prove that you have special insight into the thinking of all the studios that I referred to.

Now don't be such a Silly Billy and write out 100 times - "I must not confuse proven fact with speculation".

 

[drummerman]

I bet you some spend money on impressive speakers and mixing desks (sofas, bar ... ) because it looks impressive to clients. A lot of the crxxx mixes that appear on the market probably speak for themselves.

Cables are out of sight ...

Ahhh. So recording studios don't actually need good sound quality speakers to allow them to do their job properly? They just spend $$$ on speakers and acoustics to look good. *ROFL*

I advise that you have a quick read of one of the pro audio forums. You'll find that that don't agree with that.

Well, based on some of the stuff that leaves these studios ...

You could probably do an equally bad job at home, on your pc

(or better if you use the AudioFriendly Silver Mains cable)

 

[steve_1979]

Yes. It tells me that those recording studios that use inexpensive cables do not consider exotic cables worth the investment. They have made a commercial decision that their money will offer better returns in SQ if spent elsewhere...

Exactly!

Many studios have over £100,000 worth of equipment. Yet they deem £5 per meter cables to be sufficient.

...and remember that most of these studios are built and setup by professional companies that employ qualified acoustic and electronic engineers. It is these engineers that deem £5 cables to be sufficient dispite them having the kind of budget that would make most audiophools jealous.

 

[Gazzip]

Yes. It tells me that those recording studios that use inexpensive cables do not consider exotic cables worth the investment. They have made a commercial decision that their money will offer better returns in SQ if spent elsewhere...

Exactly!

Many studios have over £100,000 worth of equipment. Yet they deem £5 per meter cables to be sufficient.

...and remember that most of these studios are built and setup by professional companies that employ qualified acoustic and electronic engineers. It is these engineers that deem £5 cables to be sufficient dispite them having the kind of budget that would make most audiophools jealous.

Jesus Steve, talk about quite literally quoting out of context. I think I may have gone on to qualify that statement but you seem to have cut it.

 

[steve_1979]

Yes. It tells me that those recording studios that use inexpensive cables do not consider exotic cables worth the investment. They have made a commercial decision that their money will offer better returns in SQ if spent elsewhere...

Exactly!

Many studios have over £100,000 worth of equipment. Yet they deem £5 per meter cables to be sufficient.

...and remember that most of these studios are built and setup by professional companies that employ qualified acoustic and electronic engineers. It is these engineers that deem £5 cables to be sufficient dispite them having the kind of budget that would make most audiophools jealous.

Jesus Steve, talk about quite literally quoting out of context. I think I may have gone on to qualify that statement but you seem to have cut it.

I cut it to highlight the bit that I was commenting on. I added "..." to the end of the section quoted to show that it was cut short so that people didn't think that I was quoting out of context.

Sorry if this caused offence.