cables and the foo fighters brigade ...

[John Duncan]

Oh well then.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority

 

[Ajani]

I never imagined my comment about diamonds would be more contentious than cables.... :dance:

@ The Foo Fighters - If you want a cause where you can really save a lot of people from wasting their money, then you should start spreading the word about how ridiculously overpriced diamonds are. Unlke cables. many people spend obscene amounts of money on diamond engagement rings and other diamond jewellery. Also, most persons really believe that diamonds are expensive because they are rare.

So rather than trying to "educate" people who already know all the dbt claims against cables, why not focus on something else? Or not campaign at all and just enjoy life.

 

[CnoEvil]

Your position is an entirely faith based one. I go with the science.

Faith based, in the sense that I can't prove to your satisfaction that what i'm hearing is genuine.

FWIW. here is a blind test that shows a correlation between perceived sound quality and the price of the cable: http://www.nordost.com/images/review-images/review-pdf/15-hifiplus_issue34.pdf

 

[daveh75]

FWIW. here is a blind test that shows a correlation between perceived sound quality and the price of the cable: http://www.nordost.com/images/review-images/review-pdf/15-hifiplus_issue34.pdf

By Nordost...

 

[pauln]

Oh well then.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority

sigh

 

[Vladimir]

@CnE

I own audiophile 'designer' cables paid beyond reasonable price and I bought them because of reviews and I heard an improvement over my stock Jamo OFC cables I had.

I understand your POV. Do you understand mine?

Yes, of course I do.

I welcome reasoned argument in an atmosphere of mutual respect.....though this almost never happens.

What audiophile designer cable do you have, and if you don't mind me asking, what do you consider "beyond reasonable price"?

Yeah, well this thread is a bit cocky but still not that bad.

BTW I have Audioquest Type 4, unterminated, paid 25 quid. Clicktronics Y interconnect paid 10 quid. Powercord is stock and USB noname.

That's 35 pounds worth of beer wasted on cables!

 

[CnoEvil]

FWIW. here is a blind test that shows a correlation between perceived sound quality and the price of the cable: http://www.nordost.com/images/review-images/review-pdf/15-hifiplus_issue34.pdf

By Nordost...

By Hifi Plus (though RG subsequently joined Nordost).....doesn't necessarily invalidate the test though.

 

[CnoEvil]

Yeah, well this thread is a bit cocky but still not that bad.

BTW I have Audioquest Type 4, unterminated, paid 25 quid. Clicktronics Y interconnect paid 10 quid. Powercord is stock and USB noname.

That's 35 pounds worth of beer wasted on cables!

:cheers:

 

[hifikrazy]

It’s also been my experience that most HI Fi Nuts don’t get out much, so haven’t a clue what music should really sound like, so therefore cannot be taken seriously when making any form of subjective observation about how accurate something sounds.

Wow!.....just wow! :O

Since when has the nerdy geeky guy without the social skills and who never goes out, not been the techy science guy? (ie. those of you here who insist on measuring and abx-ing music rather than listening to it)

 

[daveh75]

FWIW. here is a blind test that shows a correlation between perceived sound quality and the price of the cable: http://www.nordost.com/images/review-images/review-pdf/15-hifiplus_issue34.pdf

By Nordost...

By Hifi Plus (though RG subsequently joined Nordost).....doesn't necessarily invalidate the test though.

Oh yeah sorry, not a cable manufacturer, a publication that reviews them...

 

[plastic penguin]

Holy coppersilver, Shatman, no-one's mentioned Gotham for so long! :dance:

 

[Alec]

Holy coppersilver, Shatman, no-one's mentioned Gotham for so long! :dance:

They do make the best cables, so I share your surprise.

Thanks for the info, TrevC.

Oh, and I cannot see swears when I quote. The system is cheating me!

 

[CnoEvil]

FWIW. here is a blind test that shows a correlation between perceived sound quality and the price of the cable: http://www.nordost.com/images/review-images/review-pdf/15-hifiplus_issue34.pdf

By Nordost...

By Hifi Plus (though RG subsequently joined Nordost).....doesn't necessarily invalidate the test though.

Oh yeah sorry, not a cable manufacturer, a publication that reviews them...

The sceptics demand blind testing from these publications, and when they do......

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Hi Uncle CnE

Of course i see the merit in decent cables as according to you i sell decent stuff

Or did you say this because it suits - for show (not showing off) again :shifty:

Anyway, with your 40 years experience you should look at selling cables

Given your enthusiasm and energy you should make a mint and laugh all the way to the bank

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[daveh75]

The sceptics demand blind testing from these publications, and when they do......

What sceptics are these?

Those publications are absolutely the last people (aside from cable manufacturers) you want running tests.

 

[Covenanter]

Your position is an entirely faith based one. I go with the science.

Faith based, in the sense that I can't prove to your satisfaction that what i'm hearing is genuine.

FWIW. here is a blind test that shows a correlation between perceived sound quality and the price of the cable: http://www.nordost.com/images/review-images/review-pdf/15-hifiplus_issue34.pdf

I'm really disappointed in you. I've always taken you to be a really sound guy, ok someone I disagree with but sound. This is the most compromised test ever undertaken and you suggest it as valid evidence!!!

Chris

 

[Anderson]

It’s also been my experience that most HI Fi Nuts don’t get out much, so haven’t a clue what music should really sound like, so therefore cannot be taken seriously when making any form of subjective observation about how accurate something sounds.

Wow!.....just wow! :O

Since when has the nerdy geeky guy without the social skills and who never goes out, not been the techy science guy? (ie. those of you here who insist on measuring and abx-ing music rather than listening to it)

Tim, I've read this a million times, still doesn't make sense. What point are you trying to put across?

 

[Vladimir]

Denon AKDL1 Dedicated Link Cable

1 new from $9,999.00

Customer Reviews

Solved Global Warming Locally

By Daniel A. Koblosh on June 16, 2008

After I took delivery of my $500 Denon AKDL1 Cat-5 uber-cable, Al Gore was mysteriously drawn to my home, where he pronounced that Global Warming had been suspended in my vicinity.

Yes, I had perfect weather: no flooding, no tornadoes, the exact amount of rain necessary, and he pronounced sea levels exactly right and that they were not going to rise within five miles of my house.

Additionally, my cars began achieving 200 mpg and I didn't even need gasoline. I was able to put three grams of cat litter into the tank and drive forever.

What's more, the atmosphere inside my home became 93% oxygen and virtually no carbon dioxide. In fact, I now exhale oxygen.

One heck of a cable.

Didn't notice any improvement in audio quality though.

The $800 Apple iCable is clearly superior.

Rift in the time-space continuum

By George Takei on May 15, 2013

The minute I plugged this cable in, I knew something was amiss. The first evidence? The small wormhole that appeared in our living room, right next to our holstein cowhide recliner. Peering into it I could discern the snarling face of a Ferengi, likely somewhere out in the Gamma quadrant.

Then things got really hairy. Brad shouted from the kitchen that he was detecting elevated tachyon levels from our Vita-Mix, so we immediately diverted power to our forward Romco Rotisserie array. Set it and forget it, indeed.

Still no go. The wormhole continued to grow. So I did what anyone in this rather awkward situation would. I recalibrated our George Foreman Grill (about 10 picometers), ejected the warp core from our Dyson Ball Vac, and unplugged all the Magic Jacks in the house. Bingo. No more worm hole.

I guess what I'm saying is that you can use this cable, but only if you have substantial Star Fleet training.

 

[CnoEvil]

Hi Uncle CnE

Of course i see the merit in decent cables as according to you i sell decent stuff

Or did you say this because it suits - for show (not showing off) again :shifty:

Anyway, with your 40 years experience you should look at selling cables

Given your enthusiasm and energy you should make a mint and laugh all the way to the bank

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

You really don't have to follow me round the forum trying to wind me up. Contrary to what you may believe, I'm on the side of the small independant dealer.

I admire those who can hold their own in the current economic climate, where access to the internet makes it all too easy to push a button and pocket a saving. This however means that the essential backup, advise and ability to dem, are sacrificed....which in turn leads to the amount of discontented members posting threads on here, looking for help.

The odd disagreement and slagging is simply that, and not an indication that I have a problem with you or your business.

Now if you don't believe that, I'm not sure that there is anything else I can say.

 

[chebby]

What's the score?

 

[Alec]

What's the score?

Objectivists, one; subjectivists, eleventy four.

 

[steve_1979]

Few misconceptions about what objectivists say need to be addressed.

1) We don't say cables don't make a difference. We say many cables don't make an audible difference despite what manufacturers marketing and paid reviews claim.

2) We don't want audiophiles to do DBT and ABX before every purchase. We want every manufacturer to do measurements and DBT for every product performance marketing claim and provide results of tests in public and be legaly liable about the truthfullness of those results.

Or to sum it up, We want manufacturers and media to stop selling lies and start selling real performance for our money.

How can you opose that?

I would like WHF and other magazines to run a null test between standard copper cables and overpriced foo cables to see if they make ANY difference to the sound at all. It will never happen though.

 

[Covenanter]

Few misconceptions about what objectivists say need to be addressed.

1) We don't say cables don't make a difference. We say many cables don't make an audible difference despite what manufacturers marketing and paid reviews claim.

2) We don't want audiophiles to do DBT and ABX before every purchase. We want every manufacturer to do measurements and DBT for every product performance marketing claim and provide results of tests in public and be legaly liable about the truthfullness of those results.

Or to sum it up, We want manufacturers and media to stop selling lies and start selling real performance for our money.

How can you opose that?

I would like WHF and other magazines to run a null test between standard copper cables and overpriced foo cables to see if they make ANY difference to the sound at all. It will never happen though.

WHiFi have already said they won't run such tests. They can't as it would be commercial suicide. I don't blame them for this, it's just business.

How the individuals live with this I don't know but then they are journalists which tends to imply they have no morals.

Chris

 

[steve_1979]

So if I was to say that the sun produces all the natural light and heat on earth and subsequently refuse to reconsider that statement you would describe it as an entrenched position, whereas I would call it knowing the facts.

Technically speaking some of the heat on the surface if the Earth comes up from its moltern core as it takes millions of years to cool. There's also a very small amount of heat produced from natrually occurring radioactive decay too.

I'm just being a padantic EDITED here though. I totally agree with everything you've been saying about cables.

:cheers:

 

[CnoEvil]

I'm really disappointed in you. I've always taken you to be a really sound guy, ok someone I disagree with but sound. This is the most compromised test ever undertaken and you suggest it as valid evidence!!!

Chris

The test isn't perfect, but provided you believe there was no cheating involved, it does show that:

- The test was conducted blind

- There was a difference in the sound of the cables

- They were honest about the actual results, even if you don't agree with what they did with them

- The most expensive cable came out on top (nothing to do with VFM)

- An audible gap between budget and expensive cables

- There was a consistency in what was generally heard (as seen in the notes).

- Extra money doesn't necessarily mean an improved performance in the more expensive cables.

People reading this test will latch onto those areas that support their position, but if on the level, it shows some interesting correlations.