Rega Elicit R - Happy

[CJSF]

Been to listen to a Sugden A21 today - well somewhat dissapointed with presentation - I don't know if its my thing or not, found it a little duller than the Elicit R, Speakers were PMC GB1. I guess you could listen to it for hours and hours, think I would get bored though.

A small point, one of the good things about full set valve amps, 'change the valves to give you the sound you like' . . . something I am in the process of doing at the moment, getting a lot out of the 'speakers' by matching the valves to their strong points. I'm finding the bias setting can also change the presentation (bias setting kept with in the limits of the manufacturers recommendations). On my ST40, the less the bias, the warmer/smoother the sound becomes, but still retaining the drive and dynamics or feeling, sensitivity on the recording that the artist intended? 'Adding what is not there' seems to defeat the object at this level . . . :?

CJSF

Mmmh, double edged sword that one. Not unlike switchable digital filters on DAC's, valve rolling, bias tweaking etc. can lead to endless tweaking ending in more confusion than musical satisfaction.

Kinda better to accept that all recordings/media are not equal and just enjoy them for what they are ...

regards

Spot on in my opinion! Although my M-DAC has several filter options, I stick to just one - otherwise I'll start worrying if certain recordings suit another setting rather than enjoying music. It's a bit like computing, I've stopped fiddling & just use the damn thing. Life's too short for endless tweaking, chopping & changing stuff.

Mmm . . . I dont disagree, however when I look at what I have invested in hifi, I want the best value out of it, 110% . . . are you satisfied with second best?

So, being the hands on type, its no hassle for me, I like to know how things works, in the case of valve rolling, its an intangible, but a satisfaction to sit back and enjoy the music, just like I'm doing at this very moment as I type . . . close field listening, source; Spotify, artist; Stefan Grossman 'Shining Shadows',

I keep saying it, the trick is knowing when to stop and enjoy the music, its the reward for the frustrations of tweaking

CJSF

Part of my job entails repairing electronics. Most of the time it's straightforward enough but occasionally the fault is stubborn: do I spend another 30' investigating down to component level or cut my losses & fit a new assembly? Professional pride tells me to spend more time but common sense tells me to ignore my ego & fit a new module/PCB.

I also want to get the best return on investment with my system but good music does not require endless fettling - my Hi Fi is just the means. I do experiment with stuff like speaker & listening position tweaking but I stop & leave well alone for months on end.

Back in the 70s, a friend would have something new (to him, often 2nd hand) every time I visited, be it a NyTech receiver, new speakers or stands or whatever. This was a defining moment for me when I realised that for some, the means was more important than the end. Great music sounds great & hence enjoyable out of a radio, listening on my system only ices that cake, it does not transform the music I don't like into something I do! We collectively need to realise that HiFi can develope into an OCDlike persuit. Knowing when to stop is not always clear cut.

Even with a stable system & demeanor, stripping down, vacuuming then checking wiring is worthwhile once a year.

Back in the 80's 'busb', I made my living from evaluating hifi SQ and improving it passively. I new and know when to stop, but I enjoy fiddling, be it hifi, or in other hobbies which are/were even more minute in there 'fiddleology options', we are talking to the levels that you will find in F1 racing these days. One has to say, my time is cheap these days being retired, and I dont go into the detail I used to.

I sort of agree, bad music cannot be made good by putting it through a good system. However I have a few recording that have become favorites from my to large a 'duff pile', as the improving system has revealed inner qualities of the recording, one notable is Paul Simon's 'Grace lands'. Equally, I have enjoyed records that the improving system has ripped apart . . . reveling limitations in the recording . . . Bad music is still bad music.

The whole thing is a compromise in the end, some of us prefer one end of the compromise some the other, its the middle ground that is the 'holy grail' . . .

CJSF

 

[drummerman]

I did think of BBB when I was staring at offending hole - they really are made of paper aren't they - monitor audio driver cones are a composite I knew PP was right I should of stuck with MA.

In the shop I caught my jacket sleeve on the big chunky staple used to secure the speaker box - so I really must of upset somebody!

I nearly asked to take some Kudos home but was restrained by the missus who was eyeing up the bag store next door! I must say I'm reasonably in a good mood - it's only a driver!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/KUDOS-X2-in-Cherry-PRISTINE-CONDITION-/291056048581?pt=UK_AudioVideoElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_HiFiSpeakers&hash=item43c44ad9c5

regards

 

[jamesrfisher]

I did think of BBB when I was staring at offending hole - they really are made of paper aren't they - monitor audio driver cones are a composite I knew PP was right I should of stuck with MA.

In the shop I caught my jacket sleeve on the big chunky staple used to secure the speaker box - so I really must of upset somebody!

I nearly asked to take some Kudos home but was restrained by the missus who was eyeing up the bag store next door! I must say I'm reasonably in a good mood - it's only a driver!

was going to say I think you need a new hobby!

hope the speaker gets sorted and you can get back to the sound you love

 

[Macspur]

No criticism meant CJ, just speaking personally... I know what I'd be like with valves, I'm a born fiddler!

Mac

www.macsmusic.blogbubble.net

Non taken Mac, I just love my valves, been a valve man since the early 80's . . . I'm not going to change am I? I do get a bit fedup with myself sometimes, then I listen to some music . . .

CJSF

Don't get fed up CJ, it's a hobby you obviously love, just enjoy yourself and most of all the music.

Mac

Feel free to visit my blog to see if you can find some new tunes.

Mac

www.macsmusic.blogbubble.net

 

[busb]

Back in the 80's 'busb', I made my living from evaluating hifi SQ and improving it passively. I new and know when to stop, but I enjoy fiddling, be it hifi, or in other hobbies which are/were even more minute in there 'fiddleology options', we are talking to the levels that you will find in F1 racing these days. One has to say, my time is cheap these days being retired, and I dont go into the detail I used to. I sort of agree, bad music cannot be made good by putting it through a good system. However I have a few recordings that have become favorites from my too large a 'duff pile', as the improving system has revealed inner qualities of the recording, one notable is Paul Simon's 'Grace lands'. Equally, I have enjoyed records that the improving system has ripped apart . . . reveling limitations in the recording . . . Bad music is still bad music. The whole thing is a compromise in the end, some of us prefer one end of the compromise some the other, its the middle ground that is the 'holy grail' . . .

I rarely completely write off music I've bought that I've intially not liked (one has to experiment!) I have often revisited stuff to really enjoy it, I generally don't write off stuff that's just badly recorded. Hope Steve gets his speaker sorted soon!

I'm glad from reading this thread that my power amp has a switch-mode PSU with only a small auxillary transformer if any (I haven't taken the lid off to find out).

 

[stevebrock]

Well I am now speechless!

I have some old Mission speakers that I got down out of the loft - i have now discovered one of the channels is not working on the internal phono stage.

I have tried all the other iinputs with my DAC and they work fine.

Tried swapping the phono inputs from my RP6 around and the problen still exists so this is a definatw that 1 channel is out on the phono stage.

I thought it would be 3rd time lucky - maybe I am not meant to have this amp!

 

[paul darwin]

Steve,

FOC drive unit will be sent to Cymbiosis on Monday and they will replace FOC also.

Paul Darwin

Rega Research

 

[CJSF]

Well I am now speechless!

I have some old Mission speakers that I got down out of the loft - i have now discovered one of the channels is not working on the internal phono stage.

I have tried all the other iinputs with my DAC and they work fine.

Tried swapping the phono inputs from my RP6 around and the problen still exists so this is a definatw that 1 channel is out on the phono stage.

I thought it would be 3rd time lucky - maybe I am not meant to have this amp!

:help: going down for the third time . . . !!!!

What can one say Steve, I so feel for you . . . :wall:

CJSF

 

[drummerman]

Well I am now speechless!

I have some old Mission speakers that I got down out of the loft - i have now discovered one of the channels is not working on the internal phono stage.

I have tried all the other iinputs with my DAC and they work fine.

Tried swapping the phono inputs from my RP6 around and the problen still exists so this is a definatw that 1 channel is out on the phono stage.

I thought it would be 3rd time lucky - maybe I am not meant to have this amp!

:help: going down for the third time . . . !!!!

What can one say Steve, I so feel for you . . . :wall:

CJSF

I think Rega's amplifier Quality Controller may be looking for employment elsewhere from Monday ...

regards

 

[BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW]

I did think of BBB when I was staring at the offending hole

I'm not quite sure how to take that.

I do seem to have passed my bad luck on to you, plus a little bit more.

Fair play to the guy from Rega for his help, but there must come a point when you have to say no, I want my money back now.

Fingers crossed. ray:

 

[stevebrock]

Well after a length conversation with the owner at Cymbiosis the amp was left on overnight etc etc, it was tested with a CD player so the fault with the phono stage did not show itself.

I have no beef with Cymbiosis or Paul D

I don't think the Hi Fi gods want me to have a Rega amp

I will wait for some feedback Monday from Cymbiosis

 

[matthewpiano]

I'm sorry to hear this latest news Steve. Paul Darwin and Cymbiosis are clearly trying everything to ensure your issues are resolved, and good on Rega for supplying a new drive unit FOC. I hope things get sorted for you, I really do. Maybe back to a Brio-R?

 

[Hi-FiOutlaw]

I think Rega really need to pull is act together, quality control is some how failing big time... :roll:

I'm a Rega costumer my self and never experience what you are Steve!

Take a glass of wine (hell drink all the botle) and put some tunes through Rega DAC and just close your eyes...

:cheers:

 

[stevebrock]

I did think of BBB when I was staring at the offending hole

I'm not quite sure how to take that.

I do seem to have passed my bad luck on to you, plus a little bit more.

Fair play to the guy from Rega for his help, but there must come a point when you have to say no, I want my money back now.

Fingers crossed. ray:

Take it anyway you want BBB

 

[Neuphonix]

I'm considering the purchase of a new turntable & the RP6 or RP8 was defintely on my radar. But after reading this thread I've got to say I have serious reservations & a clearaudio or VPI is looking more appealing.

Have been impressed with the way Rega have looked after you Steve so credit to them, but for you to get three dud units does to me raise serious concerns about their QC. Imagine having such a publicly discussed problem occuring on a popular forum in which the boss personally gets invoved to sort it out for you, and then still sending another dud unit! WTF?

Hope you get the solution you can live with long term once the dust settles.

 

[stevebrock]

In all seriousness Re: RP6 / RP8 there isnt much to go wrong so think you will be ok! However if you have RP8 money I would be looking at a Gyrodec SE

 

[stevebrock]

I do actually feel guilty about starting this thread now, but I am now genuinely frustrated with it all to be honest.

I am more than happy with my RP6, RS3 Speakers, DAC etc - My old Brio R gave me great service for a year so I know this is just something that hasnt come to light yet with the Elicit R.

 

[CnoEvil]

I do actually feel guilty about starting this thread now, but I am now genuinely frustrated with it all to be honest.

I am more than happy with my RP6, RS3 Speakers, DAC etc - My old Brio R gave me great service for a year so I know this is just something that hasnt come to light yet with the Elicit R.

If you have highlighted a QC problem at Rega, then you have done them, and subsequent customers a favour.

 

[Neuphonix]

Thanks for the sugesstion, will add it to the list. Spent some time at a dealers yesterday primarily to demo speakers and amps with a friend. They had the RP8 set up in the room so we gave it a spin, very nice.

Have to say that for that sort of money I think I'd like to get something more substantial, the skeletal look is nice, but the foam gives me a sense of fragilty. Just starting down the road of vinyl, got a lot more investigating to do before committing to anything. To me the RP6 does look like the sweet spot in the rega range, but the dealer was adamant the RP8 is head & shoulders. Was not able to do any side by side listening however to make a comparison.

Did you listen to any other brands before you decided on the RP6?

 

[matthewpiano]

I do actually feel guilty about starting this thread now, but I am now genuinely frustrated with it all to be honest.

I am more than happy with my RP6, RS3 Speakers, DAC etc - My old Brio R gave me great service for a year so I know this is just something that hasnt come to light yet with the Elicit R.

If you have highlighted a QC problem at Rega, then you have done them, and subsequent customers a favour.

Agreed. There clearly is a QC issue and I'm sure a company like Rega would rather know about it than not. 3 amps of the same model, all with different faults, is a bit worrying. If they don't know about it they can't put it right. It wouldn't put me off buying Rega in the future as I'm confident, given the help you are getting from Paul Darwin, that the issues will be attended to. .

 

[jonathanRD]

Just saying

I've been in customer services for nearly 20 years - sometimes, no matter how hard you try, some customers seem to get all the problems.

It happens, everything seems to go wrong and you think you have covered everything but you can't.

And I'm sure that it won't be just Steve that is not very happy at the moment.

 

[stevebrock]

Neuphonix,

I think the RP6 is the sweet spot on the Rega decks, I have heard an RP8 with various carts and IMO when I heard an RP8 with a Dyn 10x5 it pipped the RP6 at the post - but you would expect that. However I think the RP6 is great for the money and nothings beats it at the price.

I run my RP6 with a Nagaoka MP200 and it sounds great, I did run a 10x5 on it but found it a little forward, the Nagaoka is a lovely cart.

 

[Vladimir]

Wait, Steve got a thrid amp and it has a faulty phono stage now? Did the mouse chew on the wires? :?

 

[Neuphonix]

The RP6 is certainly more where I want to be budget wise esp as I will have to buy a phono stage as well.

Did I not hear you say recently that you were using the exact cart?

I'm looking after a friends house at the moment and he has a large vinyl collection with a Rega Planar. I think I may have been bitten by the bug :doh:

 

[stevebrock]

If you are getting off on the Rega Planar then you will not be dissapointed with an RP6 - I love mine, I dont care what people say about Gandys low mass philosophy it sounds bloody good, I have a GT SubPlatter, Michel Tecnoweight and white belt.

Yes I did have an Exact, I Thought the Exact was a nice cart and perfectly adequate, however I started to read about carts and I stuck a Dyn 10x5 on initially I loved it but it cam a little too forward. The Nagaoka MP200 hits me every time now.

RP6 and Fono MK2 is all you need.

Regarding carts it is very much personal - you may love the Exact, but depending where you get your deck from they will put a different cart on for you.

I have no hesitation in recommneding an RP6 - I love mine

Just want to get this amp situation resolved!