Mains Regeneration...

[Gazzip]

Strapped my setup on to a PS Audio P10 mains regenerator this weekend. NB: Not simply a "conditioner" but a "regenerator", which (they say) rebuilds the incoming AC and outputs it as a perfect sine wave. It also stabilises voltage as well as conditioning/circuit protecting etc. as it goes.

I have to say I gave this a try with a fair amount of cynicism in my heart and expected to be disapointed, but the results have been remarkably positive. Worth a try if you have the opportunity and the means. Power Inspired also a much less expensive range of regenerators - the AG500 at £249 or the AG1500 at £499 - which I understand do a similar thing. Some say they do it better so I will be checking these out.

BTW I know that many on here will say that "scientifically" this should not have made any discernible difference to the SQ of my system, and that my existing power supplies should be more than adequately designed for the purposes described, but the P10 has made a huge difference. Simple as that. I am experiencing increased dynamics (I was expecting the opposite) and a boost in clarity, especially on vocals, which I put down to a lower noise floor. I am seriously impressed!

 

[TrevC]

Strapped my setup on to a PS Audio P10 mains regenerator this weekend. NB: Not simply a "conditioner" but a "regenerator", which (they say) rebuilds the incoming AC and outputs it as a perfect sine wave. It also stabilises voltage as well as conditioning/circuit protecting etc. as it goes.

I have to say I gave this a try with a fair amount of cynicism in my heart and expected to be disapointed, but the results have been remarkably positive. Worth a try if you have the opportunity and the means. Power Inspired also a much less expensive range of regenerators - the AG500 at £249 or the AG1500 at £499 - which I understand do a similar thing. Some say they do it better so I will be checking these out.

BTW I know that many on here will say that "scientifically" this should not have made any discernible difference to the SQ of my system, and that my existing power supplies should be more than adequately designed for the purposes described, but the P10 has made a huge difference. Simple as that. I am experiencing increased dynamics (I was expecting the opposite) and a boost in clarity, especially on vocals, which I put down to a lower noise floor. I am seriously impressed!

LOL. Unfortunately for you poor mains quality doesn't affect decent hifi equipment in the slightest, but you have the mother of all placebo effects going on in your head.

 

[CnoEvil]

I didn't like the effect that an Isol8 regenerator had on my system, but it did change the sound.

 

[abacus]

Re-generators and conditioners are in common use with many types of electronic equipment, in both labs and testing facilities, where a constant is required, thus will also help with Hi-Fi etc. (Anyone who tests equipment without using at least a conditioner, is not testing correctly) They will also aid in increasing the longevity of the equipment and causing less lock-ups, however it will not be a huge difference (Except in your imagination) but subtler, like bi-amping a passive speaker.

Bill

 

[lpv]

 

[ID.]

Sorry, this carries no scientific weight unless your wife, etc., who didn't even know you'd done anything, came in from the kitchen and commented on how much better your system sounded. Extra points would also have been awarded for describing it like a veil being lifted.

Double blind testing with statistically significant results would also have been accepted.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Strapped my setup on to a PS Audio P10 mains regenerator this weekend. NB: Not simply a "conditioner" but a "regenerator", which (they say) rebuilds the incoming AC and outputs it as a perfect sine wave. It also stabilises voltage as well as conditioning/circuit protecting etc. as it goes.

I have to say I gave this a try with a fair amount of cynicism in my heart and expected to be disapointed, but the results have been remarkably positive. Worth a try if you have the opportunity and the means. Power Inspired also a much less expensive range of regenerators - the AG500 at £249 or the AG1500 at £499 - which I understand do a similar thing. Some say they do it better so I will be checking these out.

BTW I know that many on here will say that "scientifically" this should not have made any discernible difference to the SQ of my system, and that my existing power supplies should be more than adequately designed for the purposes described, but the P10 has made a huge difference. Simple as that. I am experiencing increased dynamics (I was expecting the opposite) and a boost in clarity, especially on vocals, which I put down to a lower noise floor. I am seriously impressed!

Enjoy.

One of our customers bought a top Cyrus system along with KEF Reference initially, and used it along with his not insubstantial Clearaudio mains regenerator. He then upgraded to Blades, which was when I got to hear his system. Obviously, I have no prior experience of his virtually bare, harwood floored room, nor the Clearaudio, but the system sounded absolutely stunning. I can only presume that part of that was down to his regenerator, which he pointed out the wildly fluctuating readings he has had over time with regards to mains voltages.

 

[DocG]

We have a very annoying flickering in our LED lighting every once in a while, like a ripple in the mains. Our electrician doesn't know how to solve it so far.

Could a regenerator/conditioner/balanced mains supply/... be of help here?

(Sorry for the OT, Gazzip. But since there seem to be a couple of educated posters in your thread, I thought I might get an answer here. Actually, have you had any such issues in your building projects?)

 

[CnoEvil]

Sorry, this carries no scientific weight unless your wife, etc., who didn't even know you'd done anything, came in from the kitchen and commented on how much better your system sounded. Extra points would also have been awarded for describing it like a veil being lifted.

Double blind testing with statistically significant results would also have been accepted.

A good case for a Drugs Test, methinks.

 

[CnoEvil]

We have a very annoying flickering in our LED lighting every once in a while, like a ripple in the mains. Our electrician doesn't know how to solve it so far.

Could a regenerator/conditioner/balanced mains supply/... be of help here?

(Sorry for the OT, Gazzip. But since there seem to be a couple of educated posters in your thread, I thought I might get an answer here. Actually, have you had any such issues in your building projects?)

Maybe a UPS might help.

 

[Gazzip]

We have a very annoying flickering in our LED lighting every once in a while, like a ripple in the mains. Our electrician doesn't know how to solve it so far.

Could a regenerator/conditioner/balanced mains supply/... be of help here?

(Sorry for the OT, Gazzip. But since there seem to be a couple of educated posters in your thread, I thought I might get an answer here. Actually, have you had any such issues in your building projects?)

Hi DocG, we do have similar issues my own home included. We also suffer from dipping in LED levels and having monitored my mains voltage it can swing from 225V right up above 250V.

What the experts will tell you is that our equipment is designed to operate with full and interupted functionality across this range. I don't dispute that. However the mains regenerator has made a difference to the SQ of my system, so something beyond functionality across a voltage range is at play here. Perhaps voltage and frequency fluctuations don't play nice with the timing circuitry in DAC's? Who knows, but something positive has happened for sure by introducing the P10 at the start of the chain.

The experts on this forum, one or two of whom are extremely well educated electronic engineering graduates, can only provide advice relating to what they were taught about electronic design and functionality. I am pretty sure that electronics degrees (as all technical degrees) are about practical application of existing technology/theory. If we have an electronics engineer with a PHD in this particular field amongst us then I would be interested to hear what they have to say. Not too bothered about what the jobbing electronics mob have to say on the matter TBH.

 

[lpv]

 

[ellisdj]

Imagine what some proper power cabling would do the system Gazzip - there is only 1 brand that I can recommend when it comes to cabling.

 

[drummerman]

We have a very annoying flickering in our LED lighting every once in a while, like a ripple in the mains. Our electrician doesn't know how to solve it so far.

Could a regenerator/conditioner/balanced mains supply/... be of help here?

(Sorry for the OT, Gazzip. But since there seem to be a couple of educated posters in your thread, I thought I might get an answer here. Actually, have you had any such issues in your building projects?)

You are not talking about TrevC do you?

 

[Rethep]

Imagine what some proper power cabling would do the system Gazzip - there is only 1 brand that I can recommend when it comes to cabling.

Dream on, the 2 of you! ;-)

 

[Rethep]

Nice 1 !

 

[lpv]

Imagine what some proper power cabling would do the system Gazzip - there is only 1 brand that I can recommend when it comes to cabling.

two glasses of wine could do more

 

[andyjm]

We have a very annoying flickering in our LED lighting every once in a while, like a ripple in the mains. Our electrician doesn't know how to solve it so far.

Could a regenerator/conditioner/balanced mains supply/... be of help here?

(Sorry for the OT, Gazzip. But since there seem to be a couple of educated posters in your thread, I thought I might get an answer here. Actually, have you had any such issues in your building projects?)

Hi DocG, we do have similar issues my own home included. We also suffer from dipping in LED levels and having monitored my mains voltage it can swing from 225V right up above 250V.

What the experts will tell you is that our equipment is designed to operate with full and interupted functionality across this range. I don't dispute that. However the mains regenerator has made a difference to the SQ of my system, so something beyond functionality across a voltage range is at play here. Perhaps voltage and frequency fluctuations don't play nice with the timing circuitry in DAC's? Who knows, but something positive has happened for sure by introducing the P10 at the start of the chain.

The experts on this forum, one or two of whom are extremely well educated electronic engineering graduates, can only provide advice relating to what they were taught about electronic design and functionality. I am pretty sure that electronics degrees (as all technical degrees) are about practical application of existing technology/theory. If we have an electronics engineer with a PHD in this particular field amongst us then I would be interested to hear what they have to say. Not too bothered about what the jobbing electronics mob have to say on the matter TBH.

Apologies if my humble BSc (hons) doesn't cut it around here.

For various historical reasons, the UK supply is rated at a nominal 230V with a tolerance of +10% and -6%. Thats 253V to 216V (RMS). Every device sold in the UK has to be able to operate correctly within this range of voltage by law. The electricity companies have to be able to supply electricity within this range in the face of vastly different loads - the chances are your road draws very little current at 3am and quite a bit when the adverts come on during X factor and everyone boils their kettle.

The supply companies use tranformers with 'automatic tap changers' - they monitor the output voltage, and as the voltage sags under load, or increases as load is reduced, the transformer automatically changes the transformers turns ratio (the amount it increase or decreases voltage) by connecting the output to a different connection or 'tap'. This happens very quickly, and was generally invisible in the days of incandescent bulbs as the blip while the tap changed was too short to effect the filament brightness. These days with LED lamps, the flicker can be seen.

It is most noticable late afternoon and early evening in my area as the system loads up as people come home from work. It does however depend where you are located 'electrically' in relation to the local distribution transformers and ultimately the grid.

The power supply smoothing circuitry in any decent electronic device should be easily able to bridge this blip - which is why your PC doesn't crash or your TV flicker two or three times a night when (if) the taps change.

 

[TrevC]

We have a very annoying flickering in our LED lighting every once in a while, like a ripple in the mains. Our electrician doesn't know how to solve it so far.

Could a regenerator/conditioner/balanced mains supply/... be of help here?

(Sorry for the OT, Gazzip. But since there seem to be a couple of educated posters in your thread, I thought I might get an answer here. Actually, have you had any such issues in your building projects?)

Hi DocG, we do have similar issues my own home included. We also suffer from dipping in LED levels and having monitored my mains voltage it can swing from 225V right up above 250V.

What the experts will tell you is that our equipment is designed to operate with full and interupted functionality across this range. I don't dispute that. However the mains regenerator has made a difference to the SQ of my system, so something beyond functionality across a voltage range is at play here. Perhaps voltage and frequency fluctuations don't play nice with the timing circuitry in DAC's? Who knows, but something positive has happened for sure by introducing the P10 at the start of the chain.

The experts on this forum, one or two of whom are extremely well educated electronic engineering graduates, can only provide advice relating to what they were taught about electronic design and functionality. I am pretty sure that electronics degrees (as all technical degrees) are about practical application of existing technology/theory. If we have an electronics engineer with a PHD in this particular field amongst us then I would be interested to hear what they have to say. Not too bothered about what the jobbing electronics mob have to say on the matter TBH.

So if someone with a PHD came along and told you it was a placebo effect you would then believe them, yes?

 

[TrevC]

We have a very annoying flickering in our LED lighting every once in a while, like a ripple in the mains. Our electrician doesn't know how to solve it so far.

Could a regenerator/conditioner/balanced mains supply/... be of help here?

(Sorry for the OT, Gazzip. But since there seem to be a couple of educated posters in your thread, I thought I might get an answer here. Actually, have you had any such issues in your building projects?)

LED bulbs have very low persistence compared with CFL and incandescent types. Are they on a dimmer?

 

[lpv]

unfortunately 'electronics engineer with a PHD in the field of mains regenerator' is required at this stage.

 

[Gazzip]

unfortunately 'electronics engineer with a PHD in the field of mains regenerator' is required at this stage.

Yes it is. In my experience you should only take advice on a specific area or field from an expert in that field. You don't go to a GP to have brain surgery.

 

[lpv]

... and in the same spirit, I wouldn't buy audio from a hifi dealer

 

[rainsoothe]

... and in the same spirit, I wouldn't buy audio from a hifi dealer

actually, the correct analogy here is "I wouldn't have my dealer repair my broken amp themselves", which doesn't negate Gazzip's point. Strawman detected.

 

[DocG]

Maybe a UPS might help.

Yeah, maybe...

Ehr, what's a UPS, Cno?