Cables, mains, interconnectors and speaker cables

[Golden Ears]

Oh poking is fun isn't it? Are you saying that you can answer all the questions I posed earlier? Whips shying away from facts. Do you believe every cable is the same regardless of composition and that the signal is transfer exactly the same regardless of material? Are there no differences in sound between some cables? I've seen many hearing saying there are, also I've demonstrated differences time and time again it's only arrogant to assume someone must be imagining that they've heard differences and can hear differences when the exist of course you know everything they're hearing.

Also have you read this challenge? Did you notice it was excepted that there are differences? The premix us that the wallet listeners claim they know a expensive cable over any cheap cable. Now I know you're not telling I've made that claim are you? So how is this test going to prove I can't hear differences when some cables are introduced into my system?

I do oh do much look forward to this reply

it is scientifically proven that construction, insulation, geometry etc can and foes have an impact on the integrity of and analogue signal. This is undisputed. Period. As to whether every cable has a signature that is audible very very doubtful.

Again, you didn't read what I (and many others have said) - you're running to your own beat on your own inner monologue and hearing what you want to hear and ignoring everything else. As I said, there's no point in trying to reply because you are just listening to what you want to and being totaly oblivious and ignoring everything else, and contradicting yourself in the process, so no form of reply would satisfy you, as I already said. So don't expect any kind of reply that's going to entertain trying to answer your questions, because it's not going to happen, and even if it did, it would be futile for the reasons I have stated.

So you've no proof nor fact and think claiming I hear what I want is correct. Oh well if that was correct I wouldn't have noticed any objecting comments or accusations. I've read what you've said and I do believe you keep trying to point to blind testing and as I pointed out that test was aimed at the myth of spending more means better. It's clear as daylight in the text and is not intended to claim there are no differences between cables. You also claim I refuse to accept the placebo effect, I'm sure occasionally people want to hear a different I'm not wanting yo. That's why I do not subscribe to this as reason for having heard a difference. I think my home made cables perform just as good as the stupid priced one and on occasion have exceeded their sound quality. So there is no placebo effect if the person is not beliving every time the listen to 2 cables they'll hear a difference then do as I'm not and have not claimed this.

There hasn't been a single taker for supplying the scientific undisputed fact that all cable perform the same as there's one claiming this other than those misreading the challenge as it's there to dispute there are differences, it us there to dispel the myth as I said money meNs you hear it better.

 

[cheeseboy]

It's not a reigion. I know to be true I've heard differences between cables FACT now there a several in this thread agreeing they've heard differences too. It's not some I wonder if there's a god and never see or hear anything but have faith none the less thing. This is an experience pure and simple so I'm not existing to a code. And really why should you care if I've heard anything? Is there something that says you've the right to claim I haven't without ever being present?

I believe you've said the same thing many times. It doesn't make it any more valid or any less full of piffle. In fact, it doesn't really say anything.

i never asked you is it possible, I don't remember asking you evaluate anything, you've chosen to believe it not possible that anyone on the planet has heard a difference between 2 cables ever now who's arrogant?

again, thank you for proving my point about not reading what people have said and beleiving what you want to believe. I never said that I believe it not possible that anyone one the planet has heard a difference.

As for my thinking people are rude then becoming 'Boorish' I do believe is a common word used, I suggest you guys look at how that came about as I began very happy and non defensive this became an exercise in there's another cables freak who thinks very expensive cables mean better sound. That's never been utter from me once and never will

Again, you're provong my point about not reading what people are posting and just reading what you want to. Most people have been objecting to the exact things that I posted about your contradictions, but don't let that put you off beleiving what you want to, even if it is incorrect in this case, as it does seem to be the way you are going.

 

[Golden Ears]

Im(h)o, EMI/RFI shielding is as or more important than most other factors that make a cable up.

You basically have a bunch of radio aerials lying around.

Use ferrite cores and/or shielded cabling.

regards

I agree that construction is important, today's wireless world is transmitting so much that poorly insulated, screened or designed cables can have a degraded sifpgnal quality

 

[Golden Ears]

It's not a reigion. I know to be true I've heard differences between cables FACT now there a several in this thread agreeing they've heard differences too. It's not some I wonder if there's a god and never see or hear anything but have faith none the less thing. This is an experience pure and simple so I'm not existing to a code. And really why should you care if I've heard anything? Is there something that says you've the right to claim I haven't without ever being present?

I believe you've said the same thing many times. It doesn't make it any more valid or any less full of piffle. In fact, it doesn't really say anything.

i never asked you is it possible, I don't remember asking you evaluate anything, you've chosen to believe it not possible that anyone on the planet has heard a difference between 2 cables ever now who's arrogant?

again, thank you for proving my point about not reading what people have said and beleiving what you want to believe. I never said that I believe it not possible that anyone one the planet has heard a difference.

As for my thinking people are rude then becoming 'Boorish' I do believe is a common word used, I suggest you guys look at how that came about as I began very happy and non defensive this became an exercise in there's another cables freak who thinks very expensive cables mean better sound. That's never been utter from me once and never will

Again, you're provong my point about not reading what people are posting and just reading what you want to. Most people have been objecting to the exact things that I posted about your contradictions, but don't let that put you off beleiving what you want to, even if it is incorrect in this case, as it does seem to be the way you are going.

if being honest is contradicting so be it. I don't know what I've said to be polar opposite to some cables I've noticed differences between. And now you claim that people can hear differences I don't see your point? Or is it they were imagining those differences too? I read many posts claiming I've stated expensive cables best. Read you'll see them so no I'm not dreaming.

I don't see where I've said anything other than I've experienced cables that sound depifferent from each other. This is what is said period and what you are claiming is impossible if you are disagreeing. If now you say there are differences then I wonder why you posted I the start?

 

[cheeseboy]

if being honest is contradicting so be it. I don't know what I've said to be polar opposite to some cables I've noticed differences between. And now you claim that people can hear differences I don't see your point? Or is it they were imagining those differences too? I read many posts claiming I've stated expensive cables best. Read you'll see them so no I'm not dreaming.

again, point proven about not reading what people have said. I'll try and spell this out very clearly. I'll use caps for some bits, which I know you like to use yourself ;p (tongue firmly in cheek)

People MAY or MAY NOT hear difference between cables. It's very POSSIBLE that these differences are NOT due to the cable itself, but all in the brain (placebo effect/expectation bias). And yes, this can happen in the scenario you describe that you carry out in your house. It is ALSO POSSIBLE that in some cases it MAYBE the CABLE ITSELF. However, under blind testing, MOST PEOPLE find that these differences they hear become harder if not impossible to distinguish between.

I don't see where I've said anything other than I've experienced cables that sound depifferent from each other. This is what is said period and what you are claiming is impossible if you are disagreeing. If now you say there are differences then I wonder why you posted I the start?

Again, you're not reading, or understanding (which I think is more to point) what I've said.

Let's turn this around. Why not open your mind and try some blind testing and let us know the results?

 

[Golden Ears]

It's going on way toooooooooo long

I can see maybe people are misunderstanding my point.

In this introduction I wanted to explain a little about my experiences with cables. The mention of expensive cables had different chacteristcs is generalisation as not all of them do. However I had experienced Blackmagic of Norway and Transparent Audio in the same system both displayed different sonic signatures. I in no place here have said the expensive cables were better than cheaper alternatives (To clear that up)

The rest is pretty clear and an example of a non believer purchasing another cable after hearing a noticeable difference.

So now this is said and clear where have I strayed from this belief in my posts?

 

[Golden Ears]

if being honest is contradicting so be it. I don't know what I've said to be polar opposite to some cables I've noticed differences between. And now you claim that people can hear differences I don't see your point? Or is it they were imagining those differences too? I read many posts claiming I've stated expensive cables best. Read you'll see them so no I'm not dreaming.

again, point proven about not reading what people have said. I'll try and spell this out very clearly. I'll use caps for some bits, which I know you like to use yourself ;p (tongue firmly in cheek)

People MAY or MAY NOT hear difference between cables. It's very POSSIBLE that these differences are NOT due to the cable itself, but all in the brain (placebo effect/expectation bias). And yes, this can happen in the scenario you describe that you carry out in your house. It is ALSO POSSIBLE that in some cases it MAYBE the CABLE ITSELF. However, under blind testing, MOST PEOPLE find that these differences they hear become harder if not impossible to distinguish between.

I don't see where I've said anything other than I've experienced cables that sound depifferent from each other. This is what is said period and what you are claiming is impossible if you are disagreeing. If now you say there are differences then I wonder why you posted I the start?

Again, you're not reading, or understanding (which I think is more to point) what I've said.

Let's turn this around. Why not open your mind and try some blind testing and let us know the results?

Insee we are not disagreeing now that there's a possibility that there are audible differences and that indeed I've heard them. You're saying that on occasion I might of imagined a difference, I'll go as far to say that I don't swap a cable and wow (every time!) on occasion I've listened and yes the first song I'd thought was different, I've replayed and done further test tracks and in the end decided the initial perception was wrong. I do have cables in my system I know to have different sonic signature that are audible I use to demonstrate this is possible.

I have never meant to imply I heard differences in every cable nor do I belive that's written here npby he anywhere. If this is not the reply you have been missing I'm not sure what you're wanting I'm being as honest as possible and I can't be moor then that.

 

[cheeseboy]

Insee we are not disagreeing now that there's a possibility that there are audible differences and that indeed I've heard them. You're saying that on occasion I might of imagined a difference, I'll go as far to say that I don't swap a cable and wow (every time!) on occasion I've listened and yes the first song I'd thought was different, I've replayed and done further test tracks and in the end decided the initial perception was wrong. I do have cables in my system I know to have different sonic signature that are audible I use to demonstrate this is possible.

I have never meant to imply I heard differences in every cable nor do I belive that's written here npby he anywhere. If this is not the reply you have been missing I'm not sure what you're wanting I'm being as honest as possible and I can't be moor then that.

so are you going to open your mind and try some blind testing then??

 

[the record spot]

Life's too short, let it drop mate. Nobody really cares that much. There are better things to obsess over...

Agreed I tried to end this yesterday only to be poked yet again, life's way too short. If thought a little more rationally why should I care if I'm believed or not by any doubter? The most annoying thing is people that have those opinions often haven't really tried to grasp what is being said. They manage to place hearing differences in some cables as making claims of knowing differences between all cables and being able to point out which is playing and not being able to settle for a preference of one cable over another by listening and nothing more.

I'm sure you did indeed go through several cables before you were satisfied with the sound you have. Most people who enjoy audio to a higher degree than a casual listener will experiement and listen to other systems, cables etc and in the end must make their own minds up. Anyone buying cables on recommendation alone are sadly in for some shocks and disappointments as not every cable integrates so well in every system nor does one persons experience guarantee another the same.

Do you consider yourself an Audiophile? (Note this is not a loaded question)

If so do you have a shirt list of material you use when auditioning a system, a cable, a component etc? (I'm interested as sometimes artist pop up I've never heard of and end up liking!)

I was introduced to several good artists the time this question was answered

Cheers and let the music flow!

I am more into the music than I am the gear. Cables have been unimportant since my experience with the earlier mentioned The Name cable which offered nil to the proceedings. The focus is on the gear and speaker positioning every time. Cables just don't enter into the equation.

I do use a handful of good and well known recordings for auditioning kit, virtually never remasters, usually early editions with top notch mastering and a mix of music, rather than one style.

 

[Golden Ears]

Insee we are not disagreeing now that there's a possibility that there are audible differences and that indeed I've heard them. You're saying that on occasion I might of imagined a difference, I'll go as far to say that I don't swap a cable and wow (every time!) on occasion I've listened and yes the first song I'd thought was different, I've replayed and done further test tracks and in the end decided the initial perception was wrong. I do have cables in my system I know to have different sonic signature that are audible I use to demonstrate this is possible.

I have never meant to imply I heard differences in every cable nor do I belive that's written here npby he anywhere. If this is not the reply you have been missing I'm not sure what you're wanting I'm being as honest as possible and I can't be moor then that.

so are you going to open your mind and try some blind testing then??

Where does testing come into it? We've acknowledged some cables sound different to others. In my system I have a preference. If you're suggestion to test me to see if it's consistent to satisfy whom? I'm happy people who visit have experienced it and why don't you visit Norway we can have a coffe and chat then you can test this in reality all you like assuming you're genuinely interested in audio and have yourself a desire tonhear if it's possible

You're welcome anytime my friend

 

[Golden Ears]

Life's too short, let it drop mate. Nobody really cares that much. There are better things to obsess over...

Agreed I tried to end this yesterday only to be poked yet again, life's way too short. If thought a little more rationally why should I care if I'm believed or not by any doubter? The most annoying thing is people that have those opinions often haven't really tried to grasp what is being said. They manage to place hearing differences in some cables as making claims of knowing differences between all cables and being able to point out which is playing and not being able to settle for a preference of one cable over another by listening and nothing more.

I'm sure you did indeed go through several cables before you were satisfied with the sound you have. Most people who enjoy audio to a higher degree than a casual listener will experiement and listen to other systems, cables etc and in the end must make their own minds up. Anyone buying cables on recommendation alone are sadly in for some shocks and disappointments as not every cable integrates so well in every system nor does one persons experience guarantee another the same.

Do you consider yourself an Audiophile? (Note this is not a loaded question)

If so do you have a shirt list of material you use when auditioning a system, a cable, a component etc? (I'm interested as sometimes artist pop up I've never heard of and end up liking!)

I was introduced to several good artists the time this question was answered

Cheers and let the music flow!

I am more into the music than I am the gear. Cables have been unimportant since my experience with the earlier mentioned The Name cable which offered nil to the proceedings. The focus is on the gear and speaker positioning every time. Cables just don't enter into the equation.

I do use a handful of good and well known recordings for auditioning kit, virtually never remasters, usually early editions with top notch mastering and a mix of music, rather than one style.

Thats completely fair enough any tracks you could recommend to seek out

 

[cheeseboy]

Where does testing come into it?

I'm happy people who visit have experienced it and why don't you visit Norway we can have a coffe and chat then you can test this in reality all you like assuming you're genuinely interested in audio and have yourself a desire tonhear if it's possible

there's the contradiction I was talking about.

You tell people to open their mind, yet you won't open yours and try some blind testing? I think that speaks more volumes than anything else you've ever said or not said. That is hypocrisy in action.

Why are you so scared of blind testing, what do you have to lose, why don't you open your mind up to it?

 

[BigH]

Where does testing come into it?

Well you are the one who is testing, by swapping cables around? So why not do some blind testing and then see if you can hear the same differences?

Something to do this long cold dark winter?

Do you consider yourself to be an audiophile?

What music do you play?

 

[Golden Ears]

Where does testing come into it?

Well you are the one who is testing, by swapping cables around? So why not do some blind testing and then see if you can hear the same differences?

Something to do this long cold dark winter?

Do you consider yourself to be an audiophile?

Only testing I do is to obtain a preference after astabloshing a difference. If there's a test to assist in obtaining the most consistantly good cable out of the 2 I use today the. Gladly I'd be happy for such a test to see if the d result mirrors what I know to be true.

Audiophile, I do indeed consider myself an audiophile and enjoy the this hobby immensely.

 

[cheeseboy]

Only testing I do is to obtain a preference after astabloshing a difference. If there's a test to assist in obtaining the most consistantly good cable out of the 2 I use today the. Gladly I'd be happy for such a test to see if the d result mirrors what I know to be true.

That's what blind testing will help achieve. :help:

So, now maybe it's time you go away, do some blind testing. come back and let us know how you get on.

 

[Golden Ears]

Where does testing come into it?

I'm happy people who visit have experienced it and why don't you visit Norway we can have a coffe and chat then you can test this in reality all you like assuming you're genuinely interested in audio and have yourself a desire tonhear if it's possible

there's the contradiction I was talking about.

You tell people to open their mind, yet you won't open yours and try some blind testing? I think that speaks more volumes than anything else you've ever said or not said. That is hypocrisy in action.

Why are you so scared of blind testing, what do you have to lose, why don't you open your mind up to it?

offering proof of that there are difference is against my belief? You've proof are you insane? This is want the debate has gone on and on about not being possible blah blah blah then offered a chance to experience proof that if you sat a listened would here you cry I need to blind test? Open my mind hello it's an open book read my statements if you're capable of doing so because this jump just sent you off the cliff. Anyone else think this is hypocrisy?

 

[BigH]

Where does testing come into it?

Well you are the one who is testing, by swapping cables around? So why not do some blind testing and then see if you can hear the same differences?

Something to do this long cold dark winter?

Do you consider yourself to be an audiophile?

Only testing I do is to obtain a preference after astabloshing a difference. If there's a test to assist in obtaining the most consistantly good cable out of the 2 I use today the. Gladly I'd be happy for such a test to see if the d result mirrors what I know to be true.

Audiophile, I do indeed consider myself an audiophile and enjoy the this hobby immensely.

Now we maybe getting somewhere.

What music do you use?

 

[cheeseboy]

offering proof of that there are difference is against my belief? You've proof are you insane? This is want the debate has gone on and on about not being possible blah blah blah then offered a chance to experience proof that if you sat a listened would here you cry I need to blind test? Open my mind hello it's an open book read my statements if you're capable of doing so because this jump just sent you off the cliff. Anyone else think this is hypocrisy?

wtf are you on about now? :wall:

 

[Golden Ears]

Only testing I do is to obtain a preference after astabloshing a difference. If there's a test to assist in obtaining the most consistantly good cable out of the 2 I use today the. Gladly I'd be happy for such a test to see if the d result mirrors what I know to be true.

That's what blind testing will help achieve. :help:

So, now maybe it's time you go away, do some blind testing. come back and let us know how you get on.

you the drowning man has made his preference and both cables are in the system. I test is preference when visitors come without them knowing. Often I placed my least favorite in first often they're impressed on,y to switch it for the other. People hear the difference but not all have the same preference. As to obtain any real preference I've spent hours with one in place enjoying the music the. I return to my reference tracks again begin to validate my preference over again. I do test my perception all the time. But blind testing to validate a preference to satisfy others seems like a fools erand. In the end if it was as I know to be the cable like best people still wouldn't belive I'd chosen in the end to use the same came as my preference.

So at least the end is here! I've shown willingness to find the blind preference to see if it matches the general test but they'll be no takers to be involved from this forum. If this subject is broached in conversation amongst my audio loving friends perhaps one weekend (if the kids are away) we can try to see if I wind up liking what I do when I change them myself.

 

[Golden Ears]

offering proof of that there are difference is against my belief? You've proof are you insane? This is want the debate has gone on and on about not being possible blah blah blah then offered a chance to experience proof that if you sat a listened would here you cry I need to blind test? Open my mind hello it's an open book read my statements if you're capable of doing so because this jump just sent you off the cliff. Anyone else think this is hypocrisy?

wtf are you on about now? :wall:

yokes looking at that I see why you ask hahaha sorry! Well mixed up. I'm on an iPad and it keeps switching to the Norwegian alphabet and the autocorrect is insane.

Can't be bothered with trying to make it readable. Just ignore the thing

 

[spiny norman]

What music do you use?

Oh, for EDITED's sake – don't you know by now that talking about music has absolutely no place on a hi-fi forum?

 

[Golden Ears]

Are you asking when testing a system? Or what do I listen to?

 

[cheeseboy]

So at least the end is here! I've shown willingness to find the blind preference to see if it matches the general test but they'll be no takers to be involved from this forum. If this subject is broached in conversation amongst my audio loving friends perhaps one weekend (if the kids are away) we can try to see if I wind up liking what I do when I change them myself.

You haven't shown willingness for anything other than sitting in a corner with your fingers in your ears going "lalalalalalala I believe what I believe and people should take a leaf out of my book, but I'm not going to entertain anybody elses suggestions". :boohoo:

I'm out.

 

[Golden Ears]

What music do you use?

Oh, for EDITED's sake – don't you know by now that talking about music has absolutely no place on a hi-fi forum?

ots probably loaded and not an olive branch. I'm getting evades all the time. I wonder which path this will go down.

The usual replies :

Og and you call yourself an audiophile listening to that

oh and what makes that track any better than a track by blah blah

this is the can of worms no doubt as people never seem to except others listen to things differently nor can they use material to test a systems weaknesses etc if they have no belief in these principles then indeed you are right they have no right on an audio forum.

 

[BigH]

Are you asking when testing a system? Or what do I listen to?

When testing?