DocG
Well-known member
Yes indeed. B&O seem to finally go for full class D amplification with their BeoLab20. Whereas the Lab9 and 5 have D for the bass and AB for mid and tweeter. Do they have better ICE-modules now than before? :?
DocG said:
You are correct in that the Lab 9 has Class D ICE power for the bass, and Class AB for the mid and tweeter.
The Lab 5, which is a better speaker than the Lab 9 (and almost certainly the new Lab 20) has been a fully active, four way loudspeaker using ICE power Class D on each drive unit since it's inception.
It's only via third partyl, but i've been informed that when the Lab 9 was developed a suitable Class D ICE power module wasn't available - but cannot confirm that.
I would expect the Lab 20 to better the Lab 9 - likely later drivers, and much more use apparently of DSP - I doubt that it would better the Lab 5 though - certainly it doesn't on supplied specs.
Kind regards
JMac... :cheers:
John Duncan said:
I've never had any problems with Class D amplifications alleged problems, either in my Sony TA-DA9000ES amp (S-Master Pro, Class D technology) or with my Lab 9's (ICE power Class D on the bass drivers).
It also appears, that some of Class D's naysayers changed their anti Class D PR campaign when it came time to produce their own Class D amplifiers, due smaller speakers and less available space for a generic Class AB design.
Perhaps the 'not invented here' attitude had something to do with that.. I can't honestly comment.
Along with Hypex, B&O ICE power amps are reputedly the best examples of Class D technology available on the market, and as I say I've never had a problem - either from what I understand of it on technology grounds, and most certainly not on sound quality grounds.
PS: I hope that you are making a full and complete recovery after your recent operation John.
Kind regards & all the best
JMac :cheers:
What do you think of these?
https://www.facebook.com/pages/ATC-Loudspeaker-Technology-Ltd/205039919540608?hc_location=timeline
https://www.facebook.com/pages/ATC-Loudspeaker-Technology-Ltd/205039919540608?hc_location=timeline
John Duncan
Well-known member
JMacMan said:
So I understand. Though in the end I think they bought in
JMacMan said:
Presumably because they
JMacMan said:
JMacMan said:
I have, thank you for your kind wishes. Doctor was very happy with my scars (and other outward signs) last week.
John Duncan
Well-known member
steve_1979
Well-known member
Some more info about the new active Acoustic Energy speakers posted by AEJim on the AVI forum.
AEJim said:Those active 101 prototypes are made from all stock components so can be available very soon once I've had the chance to test and tweak, they arrived on Tuesday! They use two 50w class A/B amps per speaker and are about 295mm x 185mm x 260mm (HWD) so probably a touch larger than the ADM 5's. I expect them to retail for between £500-£600 bit that's largely out of my hands. They have RCA phono and balanced XLR inputs with +/- 2dB trim for bass/treble. The blue ring on the front is also a pop-out volume control though I expect I'll replace that with a small LED and move volume to the rear panel.
John Duncan said:
I remember the original, sounded dull and a bit flat.
Thinking back that was probably because we did not have any suitably powered amplifiers to drive them.
John Duncan
Well-known member
steve_1979
Well-known member
AEJim said:
Some more info from AEJim.
Nothing definite yet but they'll probably be called the Active 1's and have a RRP somewhere around £650. Most likely finishes will be Gloss Black, Gloss White and a Walnut veneer initially.
The Opals are fabulous but sadly they were overpowering my room.
I still miss them.
If I ever move house I might go back to them ..
I still miss them.
If I ever move house I might go back to them ..
http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/2014/05/special-edition-s50/
some more pics of the 40th anniversary special edition ATC S50 (passive or active)
Really unconventional styling.
some more pics of the 40th anniversary special edition ATC S50 (passive or active)
Really unconventional styling.
steve_1979
Well-known member
markiedee
Well-known member
Well I've just joined the active speaker club and brought a pair of bang-olufsen beolab 17s yesterday after demoing these amazing speakers. For such a compact speaker the sound quality really is unlike any speaker I've had before, and I've had many ranging from floorstanders bookshelfs, sub sats and even the classic integrated amp speaker 2 channel system which was my last system before I sold it.
The depth clarity and bass weight IMO is faultless and I really can't wait to get them. Specs wise they have 160 watts class D for the Bass and 160 watts class D for the tweeters which totals to 320 watts per speaker. They use B&Os adaptive bass linearisation and room adaptation via a switch on the speaker which has three settings wall, corner and free using these settings adapts the bass to your room.
to be honest I'm super excited and just can't wait to get them and set them up. They are costly but for any one looking for a compact but powerful speaker should give these a demo.
The depth clarity and bass weight IMO is faultless and I really can't wait to get them. Specs wise they have 160 watts class D for the Bass and 160 watts class D for the tweeters which totals to 320 watts per speaker. They use B&Os adaptive bass linearisation and room adaptation via a switch on the speaker which has three settings wall, corner and free using these settings adapts the bass to your room.
to be honest I'm super excited and just can't wait to get them and set them up. They are costly but for any one looking for a compact but powerful speaker should give these a demo.
markiedee said:
Congratulations!
One, for getting off the Hifi separates/upgrade/mix and match/trial and error merry go round;
And Two: for going for B&O
If my experience is anything to go by, I think you're going to be a very happy camper indeed!
Kind regards
JMac
markiedee
Well-known member
JMacMan said:markiedee said:
Congratulations!
One, for getting off the Hifi separates/upgrade/mix and match/trial and error merry go round;
And Two: for going for B&O
If my experience is anything to go by, I think you're going to be a very happy camper indeed!
Kind regards
JMac
thank you really appreciate that, yeah I think I've finally struck gold on what I think is an amazing speaker.
markiedee said:JMacMan said:markiedee said:
Congratulations!
One, for getting off the Hifi separates/upgrade/mix and match/trial and error merry go round;
And Two: for going for B&O
If my experience is anything to go by, I think you're going to be a very happy camper indeed!
Kind regards
JMac
thank you really appreciate that, yeah I think I've finally struck gold on what I think is an amazing speaker.
You're most welcome Mark
I own Beolab 9's, not the 17's, but I've had a good listen to the 17's instore and very much agree with your remarks about the sound.
Yes, I'm a little biased towards B&O as an owner, but only because after 40 odd years of faffing about with separates in this hifi 'hobby', I'm the happiest I've ever been with a system as regards my B&O kit; - considerably moreso than anything I've ever owned before over the years.
I put my deep ownership satisfaction down to a combination of things - the sonic performance obviously, but the overall quality and engineering refinement of the design, with every aspect of performance and ownership so well thought out, such as to relieve the end user of many of the audiophile concerns, is a huge blessing in terms of freeing up one from any obsessions about the setup of the kit and getting the best out of it in a given room, with relative ease and simplicity.
And then, there are the aesthetics; some may say that doesn't count, but I disagree - not just on how something 'sits' in the room, but their designs never seem to bore or cause one to get tired of them; they always look special in a room and are a constant reminder of money very well spent.
If it were possible to love a loudspeaker, I love my Beolab 9's...
My B&O system in total has finally fulfilled the promise of what HiFi was supposed to be about, and which got me onboard re the hobby in the first place - "the closest approach to the original sound".
Congratulations again, and I think you're going to be delighted with your new purchase, both when they arrive and are setup, and for many years ahead
If you'd like to feel more a part of the B&O 'familly' I'd suggest possibly joining the independant Beoworld forums - a very nice bunch of people and a great resource for info about B&O products both old and new, both from very experienced members, who like myself, have been into Hifi for many decades before coming to B&O, and then there are people like Dr. Geoff Martin who contribute from time to time - and in terms of qualified audio and acoustic engineers, it really doesn't get any better IMHO & E.
If you haven't seen it already, you might find his blog both very interesting and highly informative - not just on B&O speakers, but topics that cover the full gamut of loudspeaker design in general.
http://www.tonmeister.ca/wordpress/2013/11/07/bo-tech-what-is-abl/
Kind regards
John..
markiedee
Well-known member
Yeah I happen to be on beoworld and as you say it is a really good forum to be on. Theres a vast amount of information on b&0 and there products.
I have owned and have had various speakers and av equipment over the years and the other day really showed me what I was missing in a speaker. I know I will be satisfied for a long time as it ticks all the boxes I require, simple sleek , and most importantly incredible sound quality.
The beolab 9s are a favourite of mine and i would love to have a pair. The beolab 20s are also a very incredible sounding speaker with so much effortless power.
I have owned and have had various speakers and av equipment over the years and the other day really showed me what I was missing in a speaker. I know I will be satisfied for a long time as it ticks all the boxes I require, simple sleek , and most importantly incredible sound quality.
The beolab 9s are a favourite of mine and i would love to have a pair. The beolab 20s are also a very incredible sounding speaker with so much effortless power.
a question to B&O active speakers owners. and of other active speakers as well. can you hear "hissssss" from the tweeters when the speakers are on but no music is playing? (and yes that means with your ear right up to the tweeter).
I got really interested because yesterday I clicked into a post on another forum (link is given in this thread http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/background-noise-in-floorstanders-twitters post 12 if someone is interested) where people are asking themselves the same question. it appears no owner of actives on that forum has trully silent replay system - some hiss is constantly audible.
I think it's really strange. my amp produces no audible hiss on tweeters. and it's not some multi-thousand jobbie. could it be that amps within most actives are so poor that they can't go without audible hisssss? that's why I point this question mainly to B&O owners as it appears their actives are a premium product judged not only by the asking price but also tech involved, ie. ICE Power modules used throughout and at least on paper ICE Power looks like it's up with the best in terms of SNR.
thx.
I got really interested because yesterday I clicked into a post on another forum (link is given in this thread http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/background-noise-in-floorstanders-twitters post 12 if someone is interested) where people are asking themselves the same question. it appears no owner of actives on that forum has trully silent replay system - some hiss is constantly audible.
I think it's really strange. my amp produces no audible hiss on tweeters. and it's not some multi-thousand jobbie. could it be that amps within most actives are so poor that they can't go without audible hisssss? that's why I point this question mainly to B&O owners as it appears their actives are a premium product judged not only by the asking price but also tech involved, ie. ICE Power modules used throughout and at least on paper ICE Power looks like it's up with the best in terms of SNR.
thx.
markiedee
Well-known member
Overdose
Well-known member
oldric_naubhoff said:
My BM5As hissed a little, some Opal models do for certain, my ADMs don't. I don't think it should be of too much concern to anyone however, as it will be well below the noise floor of the music and once you have taken your ears away from right next to the tweeter, probably below the noise floor of the ambient environment too.
Overdose said:
that may be so. but it would also denote very poor engineering standards. for example I've got inexpensive Creative HD external sound card, ca. E100 when bought new a few years ago. I can attest that it's dead silent, even on my BA IEMs, ie. extremely-sensitive-earphones. I don't really think it should be a big deal to conceive an audibly silent power amp with today standard's passive and active componentry. even on a budget.
Overdose said:
clearly, the noise from the tweeter can't be below the ambient noise since it was audible. the only reason why you'd not hear it from a distance is the law of inverse square. but only because you'd sit 3m away won't improve SNR of the amp.
Overdose
Well-known member
I think that you are over analysing the situation. If you need to put your ear right next to a speaker to hear an anomaly, then clearly the problem is a moot point, as you will never be listening to music in such a situation.oldric_naubhoff said:
Personally, I am only concerned with the audible when it comes to music and systems, I have no time to obsess about inconsequential trivia. Others thrive on it though, as it seems their hobby or compulsion to do so.
Overdose
Well-known member
oldric_naubhoff said:
A small point, but I have time on my hands and I'm in pedant mode, if the location of the source of any noise makes it inaudible, it is therefore below the noise floor of the environment surely?
Moving within one inch of the speaker may well reveal the noise, however, bring in the sound of the passing vehicles to within that same distance and you will no longer hear the tweeter. It's all relative.
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