Here is a before and after my latest edition - a Blok Stax 400 rack Before - hifi had to stand on a large sideboard which whilst neat looking was never quite what i wanted and a bit cramped into the corner too After - the hifi finally gets its own rack after 2 years of building up slowly and yes it really did seem to improve the overall sound - this was partly helped by being able to move the right speaker away from the side wall a little more I think the Blok Stax is a very nice product, solidly built and a decent price too. I only found it from the WHF review so my thanks to the website. The last few months have seen me upgrade my mains cables, speaker cables and the rack and which combined have really lifted the Arcam's performance. There are many doubters but i think the infrastructure really can push your separates up a level if you get it right. I think though its now possibly time to sell off my Rega P3-24 and move what few records i do have over to cd or digital. The journey continues and is great fun......
Hi-Fi Finally Gets A Proper Rack
- Thread starter crusaderlord
- Start date
scene
Well-known member
Looks good, though I think you're right as it must be a little awkward playing records in the current configuration...
Yes i tried the turntable on the top which would clearly be the most obvious but to be honest my heart wasnt in that look - the wadia on the frosted glass just looks too good.
Anyway i realised the time for the Rega was over and i have placed it on the bottom shelf while i list it for sale, although there is sufficient space to use it with my 20 or so LP's.
That said the turntable really does like the rack where it was much much better than on the sideboard and clear of any vibrations.
Anyway i realised the time for the Rega was over and i have placed it on the bottom shelf while i list it for sale, although there is sufficient space to use it with my 20 or so LP's.
That said the turntable really does like the rack where it was much much better than on the sideboard and clear of any vibrations.
idc
Well-known member
Looks brilliant and I am not surprised you have noticed an improvement. Hifi is more sensitive to vibration than many think. If I open a can near my hifi I can hear a ring come through the headphones that my setup, I think the amp's valves have picked up.
mitch65
Well-known member
jaxwired
Well-known member
crusaderlord, looks terrific. Much less crowded. And the rack matches the speakers nicely. Well done!
BTW, how do you like the wadia? I've been on the fence about getting one for a long time.
BTW, how do you like the wadia? I've been on the fence about getting one for a long time.
chebby
Well-known member
I think that - ideally - you still need to have empty space between the speakers. (Or at least pull the speakers forward so the front baffles are just a little in front of the rack.)
The RH speaker (RH as you face them) may benefit from being further from the side wall/radiator.
The RH speaker (RH as you face them) may benefit from being further from the side wall/radiator.
Have been looking for racks for a while for my hi fi, but always too pricey or too ugly.
Thanks for posting these seem just right and I think it'll be my first piece of new furniture when I move next month
Thanks for posting these seem just right and I think it'll be my first piece of new furniture when I move next month
That looks excellent. Flog the TT and get the new Rega DAC that's coming out soon
I think Chebby's right, if you can nudge the front of the speakers to be nicely clear of the rack then your imaging will benefit. I have to (so I tell the fiance) due to the fireplace.
I think Chebby's right, if you can nudge the front of the speakers to be nicely clear of the rack then your imaging will benefit. I have to (so I tell the fiance) due to the fireplace.
Thanks i will nudge the speakers out as far as i dare - i am still constrained by the room a little but they can move a touch more.
It has taken a good while of negociating to get rid of the sideboard and 'take over' the room with my hifi - but it has been very worthwhile and sounds better than ever.
What i love about hi-fi as a hobby is that it is an ongoing journey, change bit by bit in my case and still going. My next move is to sell the turntable and probably upgrade the speakers to the Neat Petite SX (or at least demo them). The v-dac actually does a great job but i may look out for an upgrade there too one day.
It has taken a good while of negociating to get rid of the sideboard and 'take over' the room with my hifi - but it has been very worthwhile and sounds better than ever.
What i love about hi-fi as a hobby is that it is an ongoing journey, change bit by bit in my case and still going. My next move is to sell the turntable and probably upgrade the speakers to the Neat Petite SX (or at least demo them). The v-dac actually does a great job but i may look out for an upgrade there too one day.
Onto the wadia question i think it does a great job. I use it mainly to stream music from the itouch wirelessly - radio paradise and bbc iplayer for instance, and have some downloaded music that i also play on the itouch. I run it through the v-dac to the stereo.
In reality it matches up really well to the Arcam CD player. I have a real soft spot for the CD36 as it just has a timbre that i really like with great depth, is detailed but not bright and is still my favourite source.
I havent compared the wadia directly to say the onkyo dock - but i was willing to pay extra for the style and finish of the wadia. I used to have an Arcam dock (not the latest version) and whilst that was the best i had heard when i got it, the wadia / v-dac is definately better.
In reality it matches up really well to the Arcam CD player. I have a real soft spot for the CD36 as it just has a timbre that i really like with great depth, is detailed but not bright and is still my favourite source.
I havent compared the wadia directly to say the onkyo dock - but i was willing to pay extra for the style and finish of the wadia. I used to have an Arcam dock (not the latest version) and whilst that was the best i had heard when i got it, the wadia / v-dac is definately better.
chebby
Well-known member
The Rega P3-24 would never have stood a chance on a big hollow sideboard with speakers either side!
That is the exact opposite to every Rega instruction on TT positioning. (Regas don't even have suspension to rescue the situation just a little.)
I could suggest the Rega Wall-support (if the wall behing the rack is a solid masonry/brick wall and if it is plumb vertical) positioned just above the rack but I am guessing vinyl was a failed experiment in your case and you are probably better off giving it up.
(Sell it soon, Rega are starting to work through their TT range with upgrades and you will make more money whilst the P3-24 is still current.)
That is the exact opposite to every Rega instruction on TT positioning. (Regas don't even have suspension to rescue the situation just a little.)
I could suggest the Rega Wall-support (if the wall behing the rack is a solid masonry/brick wall and if it is plumb vertical) positioned just above the rack but I am guessing vinyl was a failed experiment in your case and you are probably better off giving it up.
(Sell it soon, Rega are starting to work through their TT range with upgrades and you will make more money whilst the P3-24 is still current.)
Thanks for the advice Chebby - i agree the TT never got the ideal location and i think whilst it was an enjoyable return it isnt going to last and i now want to simplify things a little in terms of sources.
6th.replicant
Well-known member
Lovely.
How do you find the Motive 3s with the Arcams? I know your Arcams are a step up from mine, but I'm hoping bi-amping redresses the balance somewhat.
I'll be looking for some new sub £1k standmounts next and would like to hear your views on the sound. I'm not worried about bass levels as I'll probably continue to use the PV1 in conjunction with any new speakers.
How do you find the Motive 3s with the Arcams? I know your Arcams are a step up from mine, but I'm hoping bi-amping redresses the balance somewhat.
I'll be looking for some new sub £1k standmounts next and would like to hear your views on the sound. I'm not worried about bass levels as I'll probably continue to use the PV1 in conjunction with any new speakers.
richardw42:Have been looking for racks for a while for my hi fi, but always too pricey
Exactly my thoughts, too. Both of my TV and Hi Fi racks are fairly cheap chrome and glass affairs, which I now hate for two reasons:
1: because they have no backs, the rats nest of cables behind them are visible. looks pants.
2: bloody EVERYBODY has them now. I now think they look tacky.
So, I want to replace them, but the idea of handing over £400-£500 for each really doesn't sit right with me. I love the look of the Milan range, but again, it's silly money. So, at the moment, i'm looking into sourcing the materials myself and getting a local cabinet maker to copy the design. From initial enquiries, it looks like i'll be saving a couple of hundred quid per unit.
Exactly my thoughts, too. Both of my TV and Hi Fi racks are fairly cheap chrome and glass affairs, which I now hate for two reasons:
1: because they have no backs, the rats nest of cables behind them are visible. looks pants.
2: bloody EVERYBODY has them now. I now think they look tacky.
So, I want to replace them, but the idea of handing over £400-£500 for each really doesn't sit right with me. I love the look of the Milan range, but again, it's silly money. So, at the moment, i'm looking into sourcing the materials myself and getting a local cabinet maker to copy the design. From initial enquiries, it looks like i'll be saving a couple of hundred quid per unit.
I bought the rack for just under £240 - so not cheap but i would say it beats a lot of the competition on price such as Atacama etc.
Onto the Neat Motive 3's - they work really well with Arcam, where the amp i would regard as neutral and the cd player has depth, detail and smoothness. The only thing Arcam are sometimes quoted as lacking is pace and here the Neat Motives are dynamic and fast and help to give the Arcam that little extra whilst retaining the smoothness. Its a good combination i think. Below is my demo notes from 2 years back as well if it helps.....
Standmount Speaker Demo £700 - £1250
Wife was away so after months reading others reviews i finally got a 3+ hour speaker demo in with a fairly local dealer to compare speakers to my Epos M5's (same amp and cd player as i own). I always like to read others opinions so here is what i found......
Proac Tablette Signature Reference 8 (£825)
This is the speaker i most wanted to hear and to be honest buy. So it was first up. First impressions was 'wow' this was so clear and detailed and sounded almost as if it was coming for you. I was initially very impressed and had my wallet at the ready. But after a few tracks i did begin to find the soundstage a little disconcerting - the vocals seemed like they came from quite high up and was also slightly over sharp and bright at times. In the end i would call it slightly bright and fatiguing to listen to - albeit an impressive and very bold presentation.
PMC DB1i (£825)
Pretty much a direct competitor was next up and offered to me as a very different soundstage. I agreed, the bass was more emphasised and the soundstage slightly more squashed vertically but better horizontally and actually i found i prefered this to the Proac sound. Its presentation was very nice and i also liked the cabinet style more as well. I felt a little better with this speaker although it was not quite as sharp and detailed as the Proac it was more rounded but the midrange wasnt quite so prominent compared to what i was used to.
Proac Response 1SC (£1250)
Ok the dealer was pushing the boat out here (thats his job) as this was beyond my original budget but was worth a comparison to see what the extra cash would buy. Right off this really did sound a higher quality - great balance and silky smooth vocals, no sharpness like the Signature 8 and a great overall soundstage shape. I really did enjoy this one across all the music tried out but was it really worth over a third more on the price? Long term probably yes it could be, but i would be waiting a long time for these.
Neat Motive 3 (£725)
Ok these were not even on my shortlist but the dealer thought i would like them from my comments so far to him. And how right he was. This had a lot of the smoothness of the Proac 1SC but was also detailed and dynamic and the bass came across as really punchy and tight, and arguably was the best delivered percussion of them all. The soundstage here was closer again to PMC and the 1SC and felt just about right to me. Female vocals were excellent - no sharpness here just a smooth sound. Really very good indeed and nothing i didnt really like.
Spendor SA1 (£1100)
I had demod these before but thought a reminder would be nice. This is a quality speaker but so different in its presentation to the others. Here the midrange is much more prominent revealing new details over other speakers but at a cost that it wasnt quite as rounded as the others and lost some of the higher treble and bass depth seemed to dissappear beneath the midrange. I can see this being a great speaker for certain music styles but it wasnt quite the all rounder i was looking for.
Epos M5 (£350 - although mine were bought for £250)
I thought i would compare to my own speakers against all that i had just heard. Coming back to them i was actually quite impressed with how well they held up given they are more than half the price. In fact i started to think twice about the relative worth of the new outlay. But that said the Epos are not quite as clear cut or as prominent in the bass as others on show, and although its midrange stands its ground very well indeed - it can be beaten overall by the smoothness of some of the others. For many peoples budget though i am sure this speaker would be more than sufficient - it does a great job and is great value.
Conclusions
1. The budget Epos are much better than i expected in direct competition with those twice its cost.
2. Paying a lot more for the Proac Response 1SC would be a great long term investment if you can afford it - but it wasnt so great a jump that i wasnt going to be more than happy with a £700-£800 speaker.
3. The Proac Signature 8 was in the end the most surprising - i wanted and expected it to be the best but found its soundstage presentation a bit disconcerting and the vocals a little too much.
4. PMC / Neat / Spendor all do different things well and i now understand some of the comments made about them much better.
My decision was that i simply couldnt resist the Neat Motive 3 for many reasons - the smoothness of the vocals, the presentation of the overall soundstage was the best, the bass was punchy and clear and again alongside the PMC was the best of them, the cabinet came in natural oak which would please my wife, the cost was suprisingly the lowest of the lot (i got them at £700 after a short haggle) which shows that you dont necessarily need to spend the most to get one you like best. These were the smoothest in the price bracket and my 2nd place went to the PMC which are also great sounding speakers and highly recommended.
Onto the Neat Motive 3's - they work really well with Arcam, where the amp i would regard as neutral and the cd player has depth, detail and smoothness. The only thing Arcam are sometimes quoted as lacking is pace and here the Neat Motives are dynamic and fast and help to give the Arcam that little extra whilst retaining the smoothness. Its a good combination i think. Below is my demo notes from 2 years back as well if it helps.....
Standmount Speaker Demo £700 - £1250
Wife was away so after months reading others reviews i finally got a 3+ hour speaker demo in with a fairly local dealer to compare speakers to my Epos M5's (same amp and cd player as i own). I always like to read others opinions so here is what i found......
Proac Tablette Signature Reference 8 (£825)
This is the speaker i most wanted to hear and to be honest buy. So it was first up. First impressions was 'wow' this was so clear and detailed and sounded almost as if it was coming for you. I was initially very impressed and had my wallet at the ready. But after a few tracks i did begin to find the soundstage a little disconcerting - the vocals seemed like they came from quite high up and was also slightly over sharp and bright at times. In the end i would call it slightly bright and fatiguing to listen to - albeit an impressive and very bold presentation.
PMC DB1i (£825)
Pretty much a direct competitor was next up and offered to me as a very different soundstage. I agreed, the bass was more emphasised and the soundstage slightly more squashed vertically but better horizontally and actually i found i prefered this to the Proac sound. Its presentation was very nice and i also liked the cabinet style more as well. I felt a little better with this speaker although it was not quite as sharp and detailed as the Proac it was more rounded but the midrange wasnt quite so prominent compared to what i was used to.
Proac Response 1SC (£1250)
Ok the dealer was pushing the boat out here (thats his job) as this was beyond my original budget but was worth a comparison to see what the extra cash would buy. Right off this really did sound a higher quality - great balance and silky smooth vocals, no sharpness like the Signature 8 and a great overall soundstage shape. I really did enjoy this one across all the music tried out but was it really worth over a third more on the price? Long term probably yes it could be, but i would be waiting a long time for these.
Neat Motive 3 (£725)
Ok these were not even on my shortlist but the dealer thought i would like them from my comments so far to him. And how right he was. This had a lot of the smoothness of the Proac 1SC but was also detailed and dynamic and the bass came across as really punchy and tight, and arguably was the best delivered percussion of them all. The soundstage here was closer again to PMC and the 1SC and felt just about right to me. Female vocals were excellent - no sharpness here just a smooth sound. Really very good indeed and nothing i didnt really like.
Spendor SA1 (£1100)
I had demod these before but thought a reminder would be nice. This is a quality speaker but so different in its presentation to the others. Here the midrange is much more prominent revealing new details over other speakers but at a cost that it wasnt quite as rounded as the others and lost some of the higher treble and bass depth seemed to dissappear beneath the midrange. I can see this being a great speaker for certain music styles but it wasnt quite the all rounder i was looking for.
Epos M5 (£350 - although mine were bought for £250)
I thought i would compare to my own speakers against all that i had just heard. Coming back to them i was actually quite impressed with how well they held up given they are more than half the price. In fact i started to think twice about the relative worth of the new outlay. But that said the Epos are not quite as clear cut or as prominent in the bass as others on show, and although its midrange stands its ground very well indeed - it can be beaten overall by the smoothness of some of the others. For many peoples budget though i am sure this speaker would be more than sufficient - it does a great job and is great value.
Conclusions
1. The budget Epos are much better than i expected in direct competition with those twice its cost.
2. Paying a lot more for the Proac Response 1SC would be a great long term investment if you can afford it - but it wasnt so great a jump that i wasnt going to be more than happy with a £700-£800 speaker.
3. The Proac Signature 8 was in the end the most surprising - i wanted and expected it to be the best but found its soundstage presentation a bit disconcerting and the vocals a little too much.
4. PMC / Neat / Spendor all do different things well and i now understand some of the comments made about them much better.
My decision was that i simply couldnt resist the Neat Motive 3 for many reasons - the smoothness of the vocals, the presentation of the overall soundstage was the best, the bass was punchy and clear and again alongside the PMC was the best of them, the cabinet came in natural oak which would please my wife, the cost was suprisingly the lowest of the lot (i got them at £700 after a short haggle) which shows that you dont necessarily need to spend the most to get one you like best. These were the smoothest in the price bracket and my 2nd place went to the PMC which are also great sounding speakers and highly recommended.
Similar threads
TRENDING THREADS
-
I'm a LiAV(!) and the future is Not Vinyl or CD, it's DAC / Streaming, what do yo think?- Started by Jasonovich
- Replies: 43
-
-
-
-
-
-
Facebook
Twitter
Instagram