Question Is hi-fi like wine?

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Jasonovich

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Pod and Jason all you are expressing are your own personal opinions, banging on about DSD, hi-res, streamers, cables, etc. That's all they are, opinions, and are about as interesting as mine are... each to their own I say.
Welcome back Doug, wandering where you had gone, nice to have you back bud.
Yes of course, just my humble opinion and personal perference. No right or wrong, whatever puts you on the Nirvana cloud is what matters :)
 

podknocker

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Welcome back Doug, wandering where you had gone, nice to have you back bud.
Yes of course, just my humble opinion and personal perference. No right or wrong, whatever puts you on the Nirvana cloud is what matters :)
I don't want to stop people buying and enjoying LP records. My point is that CD, for example, is a technically better format and is better than LPs. People wanting to buy LPs, doesn't change this fact.
 
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DougK1

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You don't understand me at all. I LOVE CDs and still own hundreds, but they are more faff than streaming. Fact: CD sounds better than LP records. Fact: Streaming sounds as good, or better than CD, with the right service and is less faff than ANY music format in history. I can double click on over 80 million tunes and listen within a second. Try doing that with CD, never mind a large, ancient 70 year old format, such as LP records. This is the entrenched Luddite attitude I bang on about. People on here WANT to buy 12" LP records and not streamers. It's crackers.
I understand where you are coming from but you are such a streaming convert that you believe everyone else should embrace it like you, if they don't then are branded a luddite. It simply isn't true, it's just your opinion about what your likes and dislikes are.
 

DougK1

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Welcome back Doug, wandering where you had gone, nice to have you back bud.
Yes of course, just my humble opinion and personal perference. No right or wrong, whatever puts you on the Nirvana cloud is what matters :)
Good to be back Jason, I missed you and Pod :) Still don't know what happened to my previous account, guess I never will.
 

podknocker

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I understand where you are coming from but you are such a streaming convert that you believe everyone else should embrace it like you, if they don't then are branded a luddite. It simply isn't true, it's just your opinion about what your likes and dislikes are.
I would consider this forum, along with the WHF magazine, as the pursuit of HIgh FIdelity music reproduction. I know I'm closer to this aim with my streaming gadget.
 

Jasonovich

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So do I. Mine are ripped to FLAC and played back from a hard drive / riped to my DAP and then they are used in my car..... Or sold :)
Much of my listening are DSD and Flac downloads, connect SSD to your digital transport, PC/Laptop or insert the TF into your DAP slot, this is far more seamless than internet streaming and traditional formats!
 
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Jasonovich

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Good to be back Jason, I missed you and Pod :) Still don't know what happened to my previous account, guess I never will.
I had a bit of a glitch recently, WHF was asking to verify my account, not sure why but perhaps this is one of their random sanity checks. I kept giving them my email to verify my account but I wasn't receiving WHF emails to verify my account, so for a few days I was effectively banned from commenting on WHF.
It wasn't until I gave them an alternative email address, I managed to get my account verified. Really odd.
 

Jasonovich

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I've got nothing against all-in-one systems. If my main sources was on a digital platform, I would certainly have a Leema Quasar or something similar.
If I was down sizing, moving to a smaller house or the camel's back broke and my missus gave me the final ultimatum, just keep the HiFi you need, I will sell everything except the Adam active speakers including my headphone and Singxer headamp.
I will buy the Eversolo DMP-A8 and have speakers and headamp connected to this device. This probably all I need in an all in one setup.
 

Jasonovich

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So do I. Mine are ripped to FLAC and played back from a hard drive / riped to my DAP and then they are used in my car..... Or sold :)
Just out of curiousity what software are you using to rip your music?
I'm using EZ CD really excellent, does virtually all formats under sun, you can add tags, import artist original covers or custom covers. I can't remember how much I paid for one user license, I think it was about £30 - £40.

1704389348611.png
 

Juzzie Wuzzie

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I would like a new BMW if a better

I would argue a new BMW is a better car, in all areas, than a BMW made in the 70s. Some may find the older engineering more interesting and long for those 'halcyon days', when they grew up with old muck and engineering. I think that's BS. The fear of change and progress with some people, is startling. A ribeye steak IS better than a cheap 50p burger, even if some people prefer the burger. It's astounding why some people would not want all areas of their lives, including music, improved upon.
For the record, my 1972 BMW 2002 Tii was a joy to drive ...
 

DougK1

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I had a bit of a glitch recently, WHF was asking to verify my account, not sure why but perhaps this is one of their random sanity checks. I kept giving them my email to verify my account but I wasn't receiving WHF emails to verify my account, so for a few days I was effectively banned from commenting on WHF.
It wasn't until I gave them an alternative email address, I managed to get my account verified. Really odd.
Exactly the same issue I had for over a week. In the end I created a new email address and changed my username back to something more reasonable :)
 

DougK1

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Just out of curiousity what software are you using to rip your music?
I'm using EZ CD really excellent, does virtually all formats under sun, you can add tags, import artist original covers or custom covers. I can't remember how much I paid for one user license, I think it was about £30 - £40.

View attachment 5838
I, like a few others on here, use EAC. It's freeware and does everything the licensed rippers do. I'm very particular about album art so I have another app to search for that.
 

Fandango Andy

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It's not big, or clever, struggling with the large ancient formats, when the sound quality cannot be as good as a super high res file sent through a state of the art DAC. Dinosaurs died out and they aint coming back. I'm trying my best to not sound condescending, or patronising, but I really don't understand this Luddite mentality, where people are still fixated with old, poorer quality formats. Weird. If Madonna recorded an album in a new recording studio, using top class mics and mixing desk and recording kit, this album's information would not survive the pressing process and would be an approximation of the recording. The same album represented as a 24 bit /96kHz file, would be MUCH closer to the original recording than the now 70 year old format. The specs are fact and cannot be argued with. People might prefer the ritual of vinyl and the tactility and the sleeve artwork and smell etc. but the fact is, it cannot and doesn't sound as good as a modern process.

'As for old school kit, well I have source material that is over 50 years old and it still works just fine, I wonder if the latest and greatest one box solutions will still be usable in 50 years time?'

We'll obviously need to wait 50 years. It doesn't make any sense deriding a new way of working, just because an old one is still around. No logic in that. HIFI, like most things, is about the improvement of a science, or technology, not looking to the past with rose tinted glasses. Progress is what drives our species and society and I do feel many are just set in their ways and fear change. I'm old but relish change and progress. I have an Audiolab Omnia and a pair of QA speakers. There would be ZERO benefit selling this stuff and buying a record player and investing in these huge annoying records. It baffles me why anyone would do this. I guess it's fashion and a status symbol, but not one I want to get involved with.

While a lot of what you say makes sense, I don't agree with:

"It's not big, or clever, struggling with the large ancient formats, when the sound quality cannot be as good as a super high res file sent through a state of the art DAC."

Older recordings often sound better than new ones. We may have the technology to capture more "information" when recording sound, but that doesn't necessarily translate to a better sounding recording.

Most people don't listen to their music on a state of the art hifi with a state of the art DAC, they listen on a smartphone with crappy ear buds, or a bluetooth speaker, or their car stereo, therefore the music is mixed to sound good on the widest variety of third rate devices. One of the ways this is achieved is compressing the dynamic range and pushing the volume. This is something that doesn't just apply to new recording, it can also be true of remastered older recordings and modern pressings of old vinyl records. If you can find a record you have multiple versions of: an old 60's or 70's record, an 80s or 90s CD, a remastered CD, and a modern hi res stream. They will all sound different, not necessarily better or worse, just different.
 
Much of my listening are DSD and Flac downloads, connect SSD to your digital transport, PC/Laptop or insert the TF into your DAP slot, this is far more seamless than internet streaming and traditional formats!
Thank you. You think don't do this as well???
I was referring to what I do with my CDs.
Slightly cheaper than DSD downloads I find.
 

Oxfordian

Well-known member
It's not big, or clever, struggling with the large ancient formats, when the sound quality cannot be as good as a super high res file sent through a state of the art DAC. Dinosaurs died out and they aint coming back. I'm trying my best to not sound condescending, or patronising, but I really don't understand this Luddite mentality, where people are still fixated with old, poorer quality formats. Weird. If Madonna recorded an album in a new recording studio, using top class mics and mixing desk and recording kit, this album's information would not survive the pressing process and would be an approximation of the recording. The same album represented as a 24 bit /96kHz file, would be MUCH closer to the original recording than the now 70 year old format. The specs are fact and cannot be argued with. People might prefer the ritual of vinyl and the tactility and the sleeve artwork and smell etc. but the fact is, it cannot and doesn't sound as good as a modern process.

'As for old school kit, well I have source material that is over 50 years old and it still works just fine, I wonder if the latest and greatest one box solutions will still be usable in 50 years time?'

We'll obviously need to wait 50 years. It doesn't make any sense deriding a new way of working, just because an old one is still around. No logic in that. HIFI, like most things, is about the improvement of a science, or technology, not looking to the past with rose tinted glasses. Progress is what drives our species and society and I do feel many are just set in their ways and fear change. I'm old but relish change and progress. I have an Audiolab Omnia and a pair of QA speakers. There would be ZERO benefit selling this stuff and buying a record player and investing in these huge annoying records. It baffles me why anyone would do this. I guess it's fashion and a status symbol, but not one I want to get involved with.
@podknocker I think you and I are on the opposite sides of the track, and will have to agree that we will never agree.

I enjoy the physical medium, as long as my TT goes round and produces a sound that pleases me, involves me and gets me listening to music then I will continue to do as I am doing now.

Will I move to a one box system that does lots of things I won’t use, very unlikely, at least it is not in my plans for the foreseeable future.

Other people enjoy this one-box way of getting their music fix, well that’s fine, who am I to say that it’s not for them.

At the end of the day it doesn’t matter how we get our musical fix as long we enjoy the experience.
 

Oxfordian

Well-known member
Yes, we are all entitled to our own opinions, but opinions are not facts. State of the art recordings though state of the art DACs sound better than the same music on LP records. My opinion is also a fact. Being factually correct is not being arrogant, it's just an attempt to convey something real. I'm not offended if people disagree with me, but many people do get offended and get on the defensive, when their opinions and experiences are challenged. It's not very grown up, in my opinion.
No, your opinions are not fact, they are just your opinions.

You have a set-up that you like, gives you want you want and most importantly you enjoy listening to it, that is brilliant, congratulations.

But other people are different and don’t all share your enthusiasm for the way that you enjoy your music.

In reality how I listen to music is very much the same as you, it is via a set-up I like, it gives me what I want and most importantly I enjoy listening to it.

Isn’t that all that matters?
 

Gray

Well-known member
In reality how I listen to music is very much the same as you, it is via a set-up I like, it gives me what I want and most importantly I enjoy listening to it.

Isn’t that all that matters?
Well no, you see Pod has got 80 million tracks at his fingertips.

(Although he conveniently overlooks the fact that 75 million of those are complete ***t 😉).
 

Oxfordian

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Well no, you see Pod has got 80 million tracks at his fingertips.

(Although he conveniently overlooks the fact that 75 million of those are complete ***t 😉).
So a bit like having all these TV channels to watch, you spend so long trying to decide what it is you want to watch that you eventually realise that it is too late to watch anything.

;)
 

skinnypuppy71

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I don't believe vinyl playback is as bad as some make out....in fact recently..it has been brought to light that the format cannot be as dynamically compressed as poorly mastered digital music can be ..so any reissues of music from yesteryear and indeed contemporary released albums might sound better on the vinyl record format...I'm not saying this is true in all cases but just something to be mindful of.
the turntable part of my system easy outbests the digital part....yes it has more cost apportioned to it, but it's a joy to flick through the records as opposed to scrolling a tablet...
..oh yeah! "the question" " is hifi like wine ".....No! it's a bit more like having a heroin addiction .😁
 
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