I'm a LiAV(!) and the future is Not Vinyl or CD, it's DAC / Streaming, what do yo think?

Jasonovich

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So many threads about turntables, kind of felt left out, I don't have one of those rotating biscuit tins and I so want to get into the Groove and here's my Spin :)
I know, I know, it's not all about me but I thought I share my thoughts.

It's no secret I love my DACs, kind of embrace streaming but too tight to pay subscription. I prefer the adhoc nature of downloading my music. Some people like all the fluff that comes with vinyl. Turntable ownership is almost ritualistic and has all these personal qualities, oh joys of analogue. Some biscuit tins are structurally amazing and the digital alternative is superficial by comparison.

I've seen a few reviews on YouTube in respect of the LiAV Harmony DAC and it's pretty amazing. The whole design integrity, the minimalism and the simplicity is truly beautiful and it's the only DAC I've seen to date, that is dressed up like analogue, it has a unique personalised signature with the curves of Porsche 911. It costs £2700 and I want one but I have two cats and a wife to support.
I think vinyl will be with us a while longer but it's nice to see the evolution of DACs that have taken a leaf out of vinyl, particularly LiAV Harmony; that are morphing into something else, other than plain featureless boxes with buttons.

View: https://youtu.be/-oe_gh6JX5Q?si=9jMcOEC0_No277bM
 

twinkletoes

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Until streaming, as In spotify and rest, become profitable I can't see it sticking around in its current form. Don't know what the answer is, but they can't keep running hundreds of millions in loses each year. But yeah its streaming one way or another just not as it is, it unsustainable.

Who cares about dac's they all sound the same!

Until CD disappears it will remain the dominant resolution. I have enough resolution to see me into next century.

Ah the huff, a person who literally needs to clean up off camera after every review, ill give him this though he a good sales man and im sure he Amazon links work well for him.
 

podknocker

Well-known member
I'm paying £11.99 for Spotify and I still think it's a bargain. I've been listening to it all day again. I don't know why they are struggling. They have servers and bills to pay and of course royalty fees, but it's not like they are buying parts to build stuff and then need a physical logistics service to send stuff all over the world. It does baffle me at times.

CD and vinyl will be around for a while, but there is zero chance of streaming services ending and the world being told to start buying even more CDs and LPs. It's just not going to reverse and go back to pre-streaming days. It's good against illegal downloads also, as people are less inclined to use the dodgy methods of obtaining music again. I pay a thousandth of a penny every time I play a tune online. It's too attractive and easy to use to allow this sort of platform to disappear.
 
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Gray

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I started watching the iiwi review of this DAC last night.
I like him, he's probably heard at least as many DACs as anyone else.
I usually watch all or most of each of his videos, because I usually have some interest.
I got that he likes it, but I haven't got any interest in ever purchasing a DAC at this price.
 
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Cricketbat70

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So many threads about turntables, kind of felt left out, I don't have one of those rotating biscuit tins and I so want to get into the Groove and here's my Spin :)
I know, I know, it's not all about me but I thought I share my thoughts.

It's no secret I love my DACs, kind of embrace streaming but too tight to pay subscription. I prefer the adhoc nature of downloading my music. Some people like all the fluff that comes with vinyl. Turntable ownership is almost ritualistic and has all these personal qualities, oh joys of analogue. Some biscuit tins are structurally amazing and the digital alternative is superficial by comparison.

I've seen a few reviews on YouTube in respect of the LiAV Harmony DAC and it's pretty amazing. The whole design integrity, the minimalism and the simplicity is truly beautiful and it's the only DAC I've seen to date, that is dressed up like analogue, it has a unique personalised signature with the curves of Porsche 911. It costs £2700 and I want one but I have two cats and a wife to support.
I think vinyl will be with us a while longer but it's nice to see the evolution of DACs that have taken a leaf out of vinyl, particularly LiAV Harmony; that are morphing into something else, other than plain featureless boxes with buttons.

View: https://youtu.be/-oe_gh6JX5Q?si=9jMcOEC0_No277bM
As a Yorkshire man, I have to utilise the Yorkshire shoppers battle cry here....." HOW MUCH!!!"
 

Jasonovich

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Jul 28, 2022
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I started watching the iiwi review of this DAC last night.
I like him, he's probably heard at least as many DACs as anyone else.
I usually watch all or most of each of his videos, because I usually have some interest.
I got that he likes it, but I haven't got any interest in ever purchasing a DAC at this price.
I hear you, not cheap. I just love the look of it! Even the remote control with its brass buttons is a work of art :)

I also like the Count, he's pretty thorough with all his reviews. This guy isn't bad also.
View: https://youtu.be/s3IBRXEngtc?si=1nIVrNkNwNX2TEmF
 
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Cricketbat70

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I'm paying £11.99 for Spotify and I still think it's a bargain. I've been listening to it all day again. I don't know why they are struggling. They have servers and bills to pay and of course royalty fees, but it's not like they are buying parts to build stuff and then need a physical logistics service to send stuff all over the world. It does baffle me at times.

CD and vinyl will be around for a while, but there is zero chance of streaming services ending and the world being told to start buying even more CDs and LPs. It's just not going to reverse and go back to pre-streaming days. It's good against illegal downloads also, as people are less inclined to use the dodgy methods of obtaining music again. I pay a thousandth of a penny every time I play a tune online. It's too attractive and easy to use to allow this sort of platform to disappear.
My son pays for a family subscription to Spotify. You can't knock it for value and convenience. But I also listen to vinyl, CD and even minidisk just for the hell of it.
 

Gray

Well-known member
I hear you, not cheap. I just love the look of it! Even the remote control with its brass buttons is a work of art :)

I also like the Count, he's pretty thorough with all his reviews. This guy isn't bad also.
View: https://youtu.be/s3IBRXEngtc?si=1nIVrNkNwNX2TEmF
Looks very nice inside (if with a few too many electrolytic caps for long-term comfort).

I know talk of the need for blind testing can get tedious - and it's not going to happen but; I would really like these reviewers to be completely unaware of what they're listening to when making notes/ comments / judgements on sound performance.

(They used to do it in Hi-fi Choice magazine - and it gives you so much more confidence to believe - especially because they used a panel of listeners).

He's another one with plenty of DAC sound knowledge though and you can bet it doesn't sound bad......as well it shouldn't.
 
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manicm

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iew of this DAC last night.
I like him, he's probably heard at least as many DACs as anyone else.
I usually watch all or most of ea
Until streaming, as In spotify and rest, become profitable I can't see it sticking around in its current form. Don't know what the answer is, but they can't keep running hundreds of millions in loses each year. But yeah its streaming one way or another just not as it is, it unsustainable.

Who cares about dac's they all sound the same!

Until CD disappears it will remain the dominant resolution. I have enough resolution to see me into next century.

Ah the huff, a person who literally needs to clean up off camera after every review, ill give him this though he a good sales man and im sure he Amazon links work well for him.

The usual nonsense. Spotify have just announced record earnings. For them of-course, not necessarily the artists. Yes, DACs all sound the same, naturally. And we all have the same tastes in men or women. And everything under the sun is the same, eh twinkletoes?
 

manicm

Well-known member
My son pays for a family subscription to Spotify. You can't knock it for value and convenience. But I also listen to vinyl, CD and even minidisk just for the hell of it.

Tidal now offers so much more, now that they have just one paid tier that includes everything, Don't know how expensive their family plan is compared to Spotify though. But for me it's now a no-brainer. On my side for not a cent more, I now have access to high-res (previously limited to CD quality)., MQA, Dolby Atmos.
 

Cricketbat70

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Tidal now offers so much more, now that they have just one paid tier that includes everything, Don't know how expensive their family plan is compared to Spotify though. But for me it's now a no-brainer. On my side for not a cent more, I now have access to high-res (previously limited to CD quality)., MQA, Dolby Atmos.
I'm trying to convince my son to switch to tidal. It's not going well🤣
 
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podknocker

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Spotify users will leave and migrate to TIDAL in large numbers, when they realise TIDAL is mostly (not all) high res tunes and is now cheaper. I've had the TIDAL free trial and it's OK, but I honestly can't hear a difference in quality. Perhaps it's the tunes I listen to and they are all medium res. I'm not sure if I will cancel Spotify and move to TIDAL. I do like the Spotify UI and suggesting tunes I might like. It's spot on most of the time. I would love Spotify to move everything to high res and actually sound like CD. I really don't think TIDAL does. It sounds great, but still a bit soft and smeared round the edges, like Spotify. I thought Sony would have a go and just give everyone all the tunes they want in studio master quality, at a reasonable price, with no MQA nonsense, just honest highest quality streaming and no smoke and mirrors. They have the financial muscle to sweep everyone else aside and make a real difference, but they show no signs of entering this sector.
 
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podknocker

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I think it's a really well executed design and I bet it sounds great. With the 5 separate circuit boards, it means you could, in theory, remove one and upgrade to a higher spec. Having everything on one board prevents this and you would need to buy a complete unit again. If they add a streamer and class D amp to the range, I think you'd get some exceptional performance and it also looks spectacular. The internals do look pretty decent and I love the triple location holes on top. Adding more kit and using 3 holes means no wobbling, a bit like a 3 leg chair. With 4 holes or legs, you have the possibility of wobbling across 2 of the legs, if they are not perfectly machined. It's a great design and if it does perform better than DACs costing 3 times the price, then it's a bargain. DACs do need ancillary circuits to do them justice, but they don't sound the same, because the values they pass to the analog stages can be wildly different. If you get it wrong in the digital domain, you can't recover the quality in the analog stages. Garbage in garbage out.
 
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Stuart83

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Looks very nice inside (if with a few too many electrolytic caps for long-term comfort).

I know talk of the need for blind testing can get tedious - and it's not going to happen but; I would really like these reviewers to be completely unaware of what they're listening to when making notes/ comments / judgements on sound performance.

(They used to do it in Hi-fi Choice magazine - and it gives you so much more confidence to believe - especially because they used a panel of listeners).

He's another one with plenty of DAC sound knowledge though and you can bet it doesn't sound bad......as well it shouldn't.
Yes I agree on what you say.

" I would really like these reviewers to be completely unaware of what they're listening to when making notes/ comments / judgements on sound performance"

It would be very interesting to see that happen, I think reviews of things would change overnight.

Blind testing is a great way to ensure fairness and a more accurate less tinted review.
 

abacus

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Our hobby is very niche and 99% of the world couldn't care less about it.
Most people have the attitude of if it isn't broke don't fix it, so again they have no interest in the latest and greatest.
As to whether it's the future, then in the short term yes, but long-term no, as something better will always come along to replace it.

Bill
 
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podknocker

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I think the HIFI sector is a small part of the bigger picture, when it comes to media and entertainment, but the industry is gearing up for streaming to take over physical sales. Your TV can stream anything these days and headphones will be the next item to allow this, along with mobile phones obviously. It's short sighted to think the current technology won't become a bigger part of society and everything you can buy will soon be available on the internet, with easy access to all sorts of media and nonsense probably. Streaming TVs, streaming phones, streaming amps and even streaming devices in cars, will be the preferred method of accessing media. At some point, your kit will be completely immersed inside this streaming bubble and it will also allow other forms of communication, whilst out and about. Many people still prefer the old ways of doing things, but society develops and so will technology. Who thought back in 1991 for example, we'd have the internet and mobile phones and be able to stream our tunes everywhere we go? There are so many things on the way and although some stuff will be useless, much of what will arrive is going to improve work and leisure time. I wish all the stuff we have now was around in my youth. I think the future looks great, from a technology perspective and many of us will miss out.
 
My daughter pays for our Spotify, which is played via the TV/Dac & amp. It sounds fine but would I make that my main source? No, but streaming and Dacs offers another method of musical playback, along with CDs, vinyl and Freeview or digital radio.

In the 80s when CDs first came out people were saying 'it's the death of vinyl', and more recently it's mentioned about vinyl revival.... vinyl has never really been away, certainly not in our household. Vinyl has been a constant since the parents monogram.
 

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