Vinyl vs digital

[podknocker]

I own music on CD that will never appear on any other format !

Same here with a few albums. It's more the opposite now for me. I can find everything I have on CD, on Spotify and I can play things online, which I can't find, or afford on CD.

Spotify et al, offer a vast choice nobody could seriously afford, or fit into shelves. I just want higher quality streaming now.

Streaming also has zero footprint. Perhaps not carbon emissions zero footprint, but then again, what's the cost to the planet, with polycarbonate CDs and vinyl records?

I try to look after the planet I live on, but my music playback choice must be at the low end, with regards to emissions. I might be wrong, but I had a declutter recently and it is cathartic, not having a lot of physical things and stuff in the flat.

I'm trying my best to me minimalistic and I think there's a lot of vinyl, CDs and other stuff lying round, which could be somewhere else. I used to be very materialistic and streaming helps with this!

 

[Deleted member 201267]

I think it is claimed that there are metals in the ink present on the CD label that causes this static "build up".

I have read that a good CD player will have a transport mechanism that will eliminate any wobble the CD may produce when spinning.

I believe the Esoteric VRDS transport does this by clamping the disk to a platter, but such engineering, costs serious money :-

VRDS ATLAS | ESOTERIC:Japan high-end audio manufacturer | エソテリック

An unprecedented transport mechanism that invites you to the furthest reaches of sound.

www.esoteric.jp

And here is the exact Sony CD player I use.

At the 15min 40sec mark you can see the CD playing, and wobbiling, whilst playing :-

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWOs_Yhpr3g

 

[podknocker]

List of SONY/ESPRIT CD players Sony / Esprit

Memory lane anyone? Sony made some fanflippingtastic players and I wish they still did.

 

[daveh75]

I just want higher quality streaming now.

Why?
When it's essentially a waste of bandwidth...

 

[Gray]

Presumably why some DAC manufacturers add filters... Inveterate tinkerers.

The cable boys must love the differences those filters give them.

 

[podknocker]

Why?
When it's essentially a waste of bandwidth...

I have 300Mb/s of this, so not concerned really. The mp3 quality I get with Spotify does sound worse than the same music on CD. I want everything I listen to online to be CD quality. I'm not bothered about higher than CD quality.

 

[Gray]

And here is the exact Sony CD player I use.

At the 15min 40sec mark you can see the CD playing, and wobbiling, whilst playing :-

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWOs_Yhpr3g

Nice player.
I'm surprised that model didn't have the headphone out (not that it would bother most people).

 

[daveh75]

I have 300Mb/s of this, so not concerned really. The mp3 quality I get with Spotify does sound worse than the same music on CD.

If it does (and I highly doubt it does in reality) then it's more likely to be because they originate from different masters/sources than any compression/encoding Spotify use.

I want everything I listen to online to be CD quality. I'm not bothered about higher than CD quality.

Though I'm almost certain this obsession you seem to have with CD quality is also influencing the differences you perceive between CD quality and lossy streaming.

 

[Al ears]

I think it is claimed that there are metals in the ink present on the CD label that causes this static "build up".

I have read that a good CD player will have a transport mechanism that will eliminate any wobble the CD may produce when spinning.

I believe the Esoteric VRDS transport does this by clamping the disk to a platter, but such engineering, costs serious money :-

VRDS ATLAS | ESOTERIC:Japan high-end audio manufacturer | エソテリック

An unprecedented transport mechanism that invites you to the furthest reaches of sound.

www.esoteric.jp

Some cheaper Pioneer decks used this process....

 

[podknocker]

If it does (and I highly doubt it does in reality) then it's more likely to be because they originate from different masters/sources than any compression/encoding Spotify use.



Though I'm almost certain this obsession you seem to have with CD quality is also influencing the differences you perceive between CD quality and lossy streaming.

I recently played one of my favourite and one of the best produced albums, from the 80s, Haircut 100s 'Pelican West' and I have played this album a gazillion times. Streaming via my Omnia, then playing the CD on the Omnia, is such a different experience.

The CD sounds better. Cleaner, tighter, quieter and with better panning and stereo separation. The soundstage and the entire acoustic is just better defined and clearer. The subtle accents and details in the recording jump out on the CD and are just not as obvious on Spotify. It doesn't sound as good.

I've owned dozens of CDs, for decades and many do sound better than my current streaming platform.

 

[Deleted member 201267]

Nice player.
I'm surprised that model didn't have the headphone out (not that it would bother most people).

The one featured in the video is the "U.K. tuned" red badge model. Sony made a "standard" model too that had a headphone socket on it.

The red badge model had some minor tweaks apparently to the construction / sound but i'm not sure it made any difference.

There is also a red badge version of the matching 930 minidisc deck and integrated amplifier, once again, with tweaks that were probably inaudible.

 

[daveh75]

I played one of my favourite and one of the best produced albums, from the 80s, Haircut 100s 'Pelican West' recently and I have played this album a gazillion times. Streaming via my Omnia, then playing the CD on the Omnia, is such a different experience. The CD sounds better. Cleaner, tighter, quieter and with better panning and stereo separation. The subtle accents and details in the recording jump out on the CD and are just not as obvious on Spotify. It doesn't sound as good.

That doesn't prove it's down to the lossy compression Spotify use.

You've no idea on Spotify's source for the file for starters, and when comparing the CD version to Spotify's, even knowing which is which, can and will influence the outcome. This is why blind/ABX testing is important.

A fairer test would be to compare the CD (or a lossless rip of it ) to a 320Kbps Ogg Vorbis or 256Kbps AAC rip of that CD and have someone else switch between them.

 

[Deleted member 201267]

Some cheaper Pioneer decks used this process....

Which ones ?

 

[Al ears]

Which ones ?

My mistake, meant TEAC. No idea why I typed Pioneer...., Must be Sunday
However, on investigation, it would appear they are now asking silly money for second-hand ones....

 

[Deleted member 201267]

My mistake, meant TEAC. No idea why I typed Pioneer...., Must be Sunday
However, on investigation, it would appear they are now asking silly money for second-hand ones....

I believe Esoteric is the high-end wing of TEAC hence the same company !

 

[WayneKerr]

Presumably why some DAC manufacturers add filters... Inveterate tinkerers.

Got two filters on my CDP, b*ggered if I hear any difference. A change of cartridge is far more noticeable.

 

[podknocker]

Perhaps human hearing cannot hear the subtle changes between filters. I doubt I could tell the difference.

The change in stylus can give a different sound, which may be preferred, but is it the most accurate?

There is a point where the hearing of even the luckiest person reaches its limits and spending more money won't help.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjP7B2QFB9E

 

[WayneKerr]

Perhaps human hearing cannot hear the subtle changes between filters. I doubt I could tell the difference.

The change in stylus can give a different sound, which may be preferred, but is it the most accurate?

There is a point where the hearing of even the luckiest person reaches its limits and spending more money won't help.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjP7B2QFB9E

Don't disagree with anything you say. My CD collection is 10x that of my vinyl collection but I enjoy both formats immensely, just depends on what mood I'm in

 

[plastic penguin]

I would suggest -- unproven opinion -- you'd have to get closer to £1500 for a CDP to better my turntable/cartridge in terms of realism.

 

[podknocker]

That doesn't prove it's down to the lossy compression Spotify use.

You've no idea on Spotify's source for the file for starters, and when comparing the CD version to Spotify's, even knowing which is which, can and will influence the outcome. This is why blind/ABX testing is important.

A fairer test would be to compare the CD (or a lossless rip of it ) to a 320Kbps Ogg Vorbis or 256Kbps AAC rip of that CD and have someone else switch between them.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjEcaxUk0dA


Interesting video, but I do prefer my ''raw' CD to my lossy Spotify.

 

[Gray]

There is also a red badge version of the matching 930 minidisc

Yes, I've had that actual one at home for a play.
Seriously doubt many (if any) could tell it was a MD copy of a CD that they were hearing from that - despite the ATRAC compression.

 

[Friesiansam]

Why?
When it's essentially a waste of bandwidth...

Why not? It's not your bandwidth he is allegedly wasting.

 

[Gray]

Got two filters on my CDP, b*ggered if I hear any difference. A change of cartridge is far more noticeable.

I've got a choice of 7 on the Cyrus amp 🙄

 

[Deleted member 201267]

I've got a choice of 7 on the Cyrus amp 🙄

Can you detect any differences ?

 

[Revolutions]

I've got a choice of 7 on the Cyrus amp 🙄

It’s crazy to think they’ll just be compressing or boosting lows, mods or highs. If they’re preset I presume they have minimal impact otherwise you’re gonna have effects like synths & guitars: treble boost, mid scoop etc. They’re called effects for a reasons: to be used sparingly. Especially a treble boost.

Mind you, cutting all the mids out of a Metallica album or similar would sound pretty cool. Either way, it’s messing with the master, which doesn’t make sense to me.