Cable Directionality - do you want proof

[Infiniteloop]

Oh yes of course so many variables still same result its a guy filming if you look at his other videos on you tube they are completely non related to audioquest or the company or the guy promoting

My bet is he sat Down and filmed it and start running low on mem or battery towards the end. If you watch the video stays constant through that whole bit.

But of course he has bothered to edit it after to change the sound.

It's ridiculous pessimism of the highest order and you know it as well. Just being awkward to not say yes he showed a difference in that demo several times

Why this doesn't change my view on the subject I can admit that is what happened

That is not difficult but has to a relentless battle with certain stubborn people on here

Once again you have missed the whole point of what I said in a most spectacular fashion.

IT.

DOESN'T.

MATTER.

IF.

YOU.

CAN.

HEAR.

A.

DIFFERENCE.

ON.

THE.

VIDEO.

BECAUSE.

THERE.

ARE.

OTHER.

FACTORS.

WHICH.

COULD.

BE.

CAUSING.

THE.

CHANGE.

BUT.

THE.

WHOLE.

POINT.

IS.

THERE.

IS.

A.

DIFFERENCE.

IN.

SOUND.

TO.

THE.

PEOPLE.

IN.

THE.

DEMO.

ROOM.

NOT.

JUST.

ON.

THE.

VIDEO.

The only thing he changes are the ends of the wire........

 

[Native_bon]

Ok I must say there is a difference in sound quality. Second play was more rounded & smooth than the first. So a single capacitor can make such a difference.

 

[Infiniteloop]

BUT.

THE.

WHOLE.

POINT.

IS.

THERE.

IS.

A.

DIFFERENCE.

IN.

SOUND.

TO.

THE.

PEOPLE.

IN.

THE.

DEMO.

ROOM.

NOT.

JUST.

ON.

THE.

VIDEO.

The only thing he changes are the ends of the wire........

So there we have it then. Indisputable scientific proof that cable directivity can effect the sound!

Well I'm glad we've got that one cleared up. I'm now off to gouge out my eyes with a rusty spoon so that I'll never be tempted to take part in a cable thread again.

That's not what I said at all.

I said that I could hear a difference in sound seemingly caused by the guy swapping the wire around and that no other factors in the room appear to have changed. I did not say it was scientific proof or anything of the sort.

Unless you are saying that the guy is intentionally misleading his company's customers, for which he should be sacked and Audioquest should be taken to task, I do not have (and so far, nor do you have) any other explanation for the change in sound I and others can hear, other than directionality appears to make a difference. You say that there are 'other factors' at play. - Any idea what they might be?

I'm not trying to be funny, I'm genuinely interested.

 

[Infiniteloop]

Ok I must say there is a difference in sound quality. Second play was more rounded & smooth than the first. So a single capacitor can make such a difference.

Alleluia! - Someone else brave enough to be honest! *shok*

 

[Infiniteloop]

That's not what I said at all.

I said that I could hear a difference in sound seemingly caused by the guy swapping the wire around and that no other factors in the room appear to have changed. I did not say it was scientific proof or anything of the sort.

Unless you are saying that the guy is intentionally misleading his company's customers, for which he should be sacked and Audioquest should be taken to task, I do not have (and so far, nor do you have) any other explanation for the change in sound I and others can hear, other than directionality appears to make a difference. You say that there are 'other factors' at play. - Any idea what they might be?

I'm not trying to be funny, I'm genuinely interested.

Well there are several possible ways in which the whole setup could just be a hoax of some kind. Or maybe it's good old expectation bias at play as there are no proper blind controls used.

However IMO the real reason why it sounds different is... Our understanding of the basic principles of how electrical conduction works (which is backed up by over a century of testing by millions of people) are actually totally wrong and in fact speaker cable directivity is a real phenomenom. This is a true scientific revelation which will require immediate reasearch by CERN.

So you think that a company like Audioquest would risk its entire reputation (and a multi-million dollar business) by staging a hoax to what looks like less than a dozen people in a small room at a HiFi show do you? - Honestly?

There isn't any 'expectation bias' from me because I wasn't expecting to hear quite such a difference, especially on a YouTube video, yet I (and others) can.

You still haven't given any examples of 'other factors' apart from a snide attempt at involving CERN.

Do I assume then that you cannot come up with any?

If you can't come up with any from a scientific standpoint, surely the only logical thing to surmise is that the effect I can hear is in fact real.

 

[ellisdj]

It's not any show it's the show the Munich High End show that's the industries biggest stage

In front of people like top nobs from arcam

It's the last place they would pull a fast one

But the best place to show off a new and by the sounds of it cracking new complete product line for the company

Seems pretty clear to me what their doing

That niagra is going to be stonking but probably stonking expensive

 

[Infiniteloop]

There isn't any 'expectation bias' from me because I wasn't expecting to hear quite such a difference

I am now going to throw myself of a very tall building.

No need for that.

Perhaps I should elaborate. I didn't expect to hear a difference and was surprised at the difference when I heard it.

Honestly, can you really not hear a difference?

- Could that be perhaps because you are expecting to not hear a difference? - in other words 'expectation bias'......

 

[RobinKidderminster]

Well respected aeronautical engineers

https://www.asti-usa.com/support/faq/cabling/08.html

A more accurate and convincing statement than any marketing demo

 

[steve_1979]

Honestly, can you really not hear a difference?

- Could that be perhaps because you are expecting to not hear a difference? - in other words 'expectation bias'......

I'm not saying that I can't hear a difference. I'm saying I haven't heard a difference because I haven't tried to compare them.

It's pointless comparing them because it's a YouTube video. Even if a difference is heard it proves nothing.

Is that really such a difficult concept to grasp?

 

[steve_1979]

There isn't any 'expectation bias' from me because I wasn't expecting to hear quite such a difference

I am now going to throw myself off a very tall building.

 

[steve_1979]

There isn't any 'expectation bias' from me because I wasn't expecting to hear quite such a difference

I am now going to throw myself of a very tall building.

No need for that.

That was a joke.

I made it because your statement shows you have no understanding of how expectation bias works.

 

[Infiniteloop]

Honestly, can you really not hear a difference?

- Could that be perhaps because you are expecting to not hear a difference? - in other words 'expectation bias'......

I'm not saying that I can't hear a difference. I'm saying I haven't heard a difference because I haven't tried to compare them.

It's pointless comparing them because it's a YouTube video. Even if a difference is heard it proves nothing.

Is that really such a difficult concept to grasp?

Of course it proves nothing. I never said it did. All I said is that I can hear a difference. Maybe you could too - if you listened to it instead of arguing about something you haven't even heard.

This is an apparently real effect, which you are arguing against, even though you haven't witnessed it.

What are you afraid of?

- And why do you need to be so condescending? - Do you feel threatened or something?

 

[steve_1979]

Really. I am typing this with my forehead.

 

[steve_1979]

So you think that a company like Audioquest would risk its entire reputation (and a multi-million dollar business) by staging a hoax to what looks like less than a dozen people in a small room at a HiFi show do you? - Honestly?

There isn't any 'expectation bias' from me because I wasn't expecting to hear quite such a difference, especially on a YouTube video, yet I (and others) can.

You still haven't given any examples of 'other factors' apart from a snide attempt at involving CERN.

Do I assume then that you cannot come up with any?

If you can't come up with any from a scientific standpoint, surely the only logical thing to surmise is that the effect I can hear is in fact real.

To say that cable directivity is a real phenomenon is to say that our understanding of the basic principles of electrical conduction is in fact totally wrong.

Are you actually saying that the discoveries made by Volta, Ampere and Ohm which are backed up by over a century of testing by millions of people are incorrect? Because this is what you're implying by saying that cable directivity is a real phenomenon.

 

[RobinKidderminster]

and

Clicky

And

Clicky

 

[steve_1979]

Of course it proves nothing. I never said it did. All I said is that I can hear a difference. Maybe you could too - if you listened to it instead of arguing about something you haven't even heard.

This is an apparently real effect, which you are arguing against, even though you haven't witnessed it.

What are you afraid of?

- And why do you need to be so condescending? - Do you feel threatened or something?

It doesn't matter if you can hear a difference. It doesn't matter if I can hear a difference. Even if I did listen to it and heard a difference I would still say exactly the same thing:

It's meaningless! It's a YouTube video. It is in no way shape or form a piece of evidence which shows that cable directivity is a real pheonomen.

I wasn't joking when I said that someone would get a Nobel prize if they could actually prove (in a real peer reviewed, repeatable scientific experiment) that these cables are directional. Really this would mean re-writing the science books because directivity in cables goes against all of the current accepted scientific models of how electrical conduction works.

 

[Infiniteloop]

Of course it proves nothing. I never said it did. All I said is that I can hear a difference. Maybe you could too - if you listened to it instead of arguing about something you haven't even heard.

This is an apparently real effect, which you are arguing against, even though you haven't witnessed it.

What are you afraid of?

- And why do you need to be so condescending? - Do you feel threatened or something?

It doesn't matter if you can hear a difference. It doesn't matter if I can hear a difference. If I did listen to it and heard a difference I would still say exactly the same thing:

It's meaningless! It's a YouTube video. It is in no way shape or form a piece of evidence which shows that cable directivity is a real pheonomen.

I wasn't joking when I said that someone would get a Nobel prize if they could actually prove (in a real peer reviewed, repeatable scientific experiment) that these cables are directional. Really this would mean re-writing the science books because directivity in cables goes against all of the current accepted scientific models of how electrical conductivity works.

Again, of course it's not evidence, but for whatever reason, the effect is there. With so many people working in this field, you'd have thought someone would have proved it one way or the other.

 

[steve_1979]

I'm bored with this now. There are only so many times you can say the same thing although the OP seems happy to keep repeating himself.

Chris

Why didn't I listen to your advice earlier?

 

[ellisdj]

You tube is just a video medium if it was on the bbc would you feel differently even though the actual thing would be exactly the same

It's good enough to hear, which is why I think the guy bothered posting it

That's probably the only demo he saw where got that good seat right in hot spot middle

 

[steve_1979]

Again, of course it's not evidence, but for whatever reason, the effect is there. With so many people working in this field, you'd have thought someone would have proved it one way or the other.

It has been proved, millions of times for over a century. Non directional cables are the accepted norm by the entire scientific and electrical engineering community. It's only hifi nutters and foo cable companies that promote directional cables. Nowhere else in any other industry will you find directional cables.

Unless of course you have access to some peer reviewed repeatable scientific tests that show otherwise? (BTW a YouTube video doesn't count ).

 

[steve_1979]

You tube is just a video medium if it was on the bbc would you feel differently even though the actual thing would be exactly the same

No it would be just the same unless it was backed up by proper scientific evidence.

If it was shown on the BBC it would be slated by the scientific and electrical engineering community because directional cables don't exist.

 

[Waxy]

 

[Infiniteloop]

Again, of course it's not evidence, but for whatever reason, the effect is there. With so many people working in this field, you'd have thought someone would have proved it one way or the other.

It has been proved, millions of times for over a century. Non directional cables are the accepted norm by the entire scientific and electrical engineering community. It's only hifi nutters and foo cable companies that promote directional cables. Nowhere else in any other industry will you find directional cables.

Unless of course you have access to some peer reviewed repeatable scientific tests that show otherwise? (BTW a YouTube video doesn't count ).

So why a cable sounds different depending on which way the current is flowing 'has been proved, millions of times for over a century', has it?

 

[steve_1979]

That's not what I said at all.

I said that I could hear a difference in sound seemingly caused by the guy swapping the wire around and that no other factors in the room appear to have changed. I did not say it was scientific proof or anything of the sort.

Unless you are saying that the guy is intentionally misleading his company's customers, for which he should be sacked and Audioquest should be taken to task, I do not have (and so far, nor do you have) any other explanation for the change in sound I and others can hear, other than directionality appears to make a difference. You say that there are 'other factors' at play. - Any idea what they might be?

I'm not trying to be funny, I'm genuinely interested.

Well there are several possible ways in which the whole setup could just be a hoax of some kind. Or maybe it's good old expectation bias at play as there are no proper blind controls used. However IMO the real reason why it sounds different is...

Our understanding of the basic principles of how electrical conduction works (which is backed up by over a century of testing by millions of people) is actually totally wrong and in fact speaker cable directivity is a real phenomenom.

This is a true scientific revelation! Somebody is going to get a Nobel prize for this discovery. Something as big as this is going to turn the whole scientific community on it's head. After all this means that physics as we know will need to be re-written. I wonder if they've contacted CERN yet as a discovery this brilliant will require immediate reasearch.

 

[steve_1979]

BUT.

THE.

WHOLE.

POINT.

IS.

THERE.

IS.

A.

DIFFERENCE.

IN.

SOUND.

TO.

THE.

PEOPLE.

IN.

THE.

DEMO.

ROOM.

NOT.

JUST.

ON.

THE.

VIDEO.

The only thing he changes are the ends of the wire........

So there we have it then. Indisputable scientific proof that cable directivity can effect the sound!