Is upgrading Hi-Fi equipment a dance of diminishing returns?

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Gonepostal

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Apr 26, 2014
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Basically back in the 70s and 80s people only had 2 or 3 TV channels to choose from, if you didn't like anything on the TV then out came your sounds!!!!

Now days, people growing up have so many things to occupy their spare time, cable TV, subscription TV (Netflix) etc, games consoles, I pads etc etc etc. Music is just one of many things to spend your time and money on.
 
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Hi,
I think there are two main factors, that Hifi is not an aspiration as it was in the 1970's or 1980's, and the internet means the young people can listen to any song they like for free (illegal) or subscription based, on any device such as a mobile.

It has become quantity over quality. Seems to be that music is something for the background, as opposed to just sitting and listening to the album as a specific hobby or event.


There is a thread on PFM about USB cables, and another on networks where a second hand Cisco switch is seen as a hifi bargain.

This is where enthusiasts have lost the plot. If i was a commercial hifi manufacturer, i would avoid those people in a face to face discussion.

Regards,
Shadders.
Your last comment is irrelevant, please stick to answering OPs question, thanks
It simply looks like a promo for PFM and has nothing at all to do with this thread....
 

shadders

Well-known member
Your last comment is irrelevant, please stick to answering OPs question, thanks
It simply looks like a promo for PFM and has nothing at all to do with this thread....
Hi,
I was responding to what the person who quoted about cable threads.

Can you update the AUP to state that no other forums can be discussed. Thanks.

Regards,
Shadders.
 
Hi,
I was responding to what the person who quoted about cable threads.

Can you update the AUP to state that no other forums can be discussed. Thanks.

Regards,
Shadders.
His post was about why newbies do not stay long on this forum. It wasn't be call to start further debate on cables or indeed whatever people on other forums think...
Of course other forums can be mentioned if they bring clarification to the original question.
 

shadders

Well-known member
Of course other forums can be mentioned if they bring clarification to the original question.
Hi,
Had it occurred to you that the claims of USB cables or network switches having an effect on sound could also put people off ? (responding to the quote i used)

Or that a USB cable or network switch has zero effect on hifi sound hence upgrading definitely falls into the diminishing return approach ?

The PFM threads i stated (did not link to) are an example of that. If i had linked to them, then i could see that being promotional, but mentioning that they exist is not promoting them.

Regards,
Shadders.
 
Hi,
Had it occurred to you that the claims of USB cables or network switches having an effect on sound could also put people off ? (responding to the quote i used)

Or that a USB cable or network switch has zero effect on hifi sound hence upgrading definitely falls into the diminishing return approach ?

The PFM threads i stated (did not link to) are an example of that. If i had linked to them, then i could see that being promotional, but mentioning that they exist is not promoting them.

Regards,
Shadders.
Of course. But it still has nothing do with the basics of this thread.
diminishing returns obviously means something different to you unless you mean buying a network switch in the first place is a waste of money then upgrading that switch is an even greater waste of money....
 

A-Line

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Feb 3, 2022
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Yes. At some point it's inevitable that every system will reach a point of diminishing returns.

I'm a music lover so I purchase based upon the best sonics of each component that suit my needs. I'm not a audiophile hobbyist of components like many are. There are some audiophiles that have systems upwards of £500,000.00 or more with endless amounts of discretionary cash that change components as often as they change clothes. The worst are audiophiles like the kind mentioned above that have only 5 or 6 records yet they regard themselves as a authority regarding turntables while changing their tables out for other table every few weeks or months.
Meanwhile they've only been in hobby a year or so...

My current 2 systems will only see upgrades towards my existing Linn Sondek LP12. I started building these 2 systems back in 2006. Prior to that I started in 1983 with a LP12, Ittok arm/Grado moving iron pickup, ReVox B780 receiver, ReVox B77 MKII tape machine, and Linn Sara speakers. That lasted until 2006.

I sold my LP12 and Sara speakers in 2006 and started over with the intention of building a final ultimate system for both digital and analog. As it turned out I couldn't find any solid state components that satisfied my sonic needs for digital so that's when I got into tube components which smoothed out the harshness of digital so now I have 2 systems, 1 for digital playback and 1 for analog playback. The last component that I added was in 2021 for my digital playback system: ReVox Joy 119 digital receiver for HD radio as well as Bluetooth capability.

So what I currently have in my 2 systems is my final setup for both digital & analog playback.
The biggest time consuming task was auditioning so many components of the years between 2006- 2021.
Cash was not a factor for me during the process.

Just my thoughts and opinions...
 
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Stuart83

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Jul 22, 2023
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I’m not the best to support this having changed my whole system after it came out of a 20 year hibernation in the loft and wasn’t as good as it should have been, so I started afresh.

But my aim now is to spend my hard earned cash on music, in vinyl or CD format, I love vinyl so tactile, so involving, it’s what I grew up with so I’ll put up with the odd pop and click. All my LP’s have been cleaned, put in anti static sleeves and inserted in external sleeves to keep them as clean as possible, so far it’s working.

Will I upgrade again, maybe, I might look at a new cartridge in a few years and adding a subwoofer will be considered. But now every spare moment is spent listening to music whilst SWMBO watches the soaps and desperate housewive.
I did something along those lines.
Only updating an an old system (1990-93) budget award winners into the streaming world caused me to start afresh and move the older hifi into another room.

Whilst doing so, demoing and box shifting through the popular choices only to find I prefer something else, I looked primarily at streaming (even covering Bluetooth) and my favourite format for sound the CD.

After finding (the to use an old name) "separates" I liked, I felt something was missing.

I used to djay incessantly for both fun and as a part time income the (proper) and old way with vinyl and missed all the above the tactility, the reading over the sleeves whilst it plays, the collecting and the way I feel when flicking through my records to find something to put on.

I missed what the small amount of newcomer's who've sparked off a small vinyl resurgence have only just been given a taste of and that's the connection formed with the music itself through ownership and physical involvement.
It all sounds very mawkis h but it's a connection I feel with no other format.

I only use streaming as a way to discover new music then purchase the ones I like on CD primarily for quality but also secondary for nearly the same connection.
If I really like something I'll get the record if found reasonable as I did the clash recently.

I had to have a record deck it felt to me like a inherint part of a hifi gone with the new set (other than the empty rack space) and to me the most involving although not the best sounding for the most part.
I can't remember life without one maybe it's also part of the reason I defend them yet prefer CD for audio quality.

Although I'm not after many years of moving and storing them in all kinds of the persuasion that records need cotton mits to handle etc, truth is I threw mine around all the time, rested tea cups on them out of the sleeve and stuck what are now rarities on the wall 😲
But for the most part as long as not scratched and put back in the sleeve or case (I used to separate mine as regular use would destroy the sleeves) they seem to do well.
I mention this as I've heard the negativity over records usually hinges around the inherint pops etc and the bogus speak that they crumble if breathed upon.

I know I'm drifting from the original op question a tad but to me it's more than just the sound that's produced with records.
They almost record what was happening at the time with me.
I have sleeves with old girlfriends scribbles all over and friends names etc.
Certain pops trigger memories of the time I skated the needle over when mixing and my friend pushed past.
My current record collection is a lot different now of course as I only use a system deck iix and humble goldring e3 to play classical and nothing else in which it adds a certain audible body ive come to love.

As for cleaning them I just use warm slightly soaped water.
It got me by for years whilst going from smokey workman's clubs to discos and even then cleaning them for the most part was done automatically by the regular play of the needle.
I'd just grab the ball if fluff that would gather behind and flick it away.
 

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