to richard allen (eb2 )

[the record spot]

Thank you Big Boss.

Glad you approve. Just hope everyone else does too. With EB3 imminent, this needs to be right.

Haven't been through all of this, but the issue - as I can tell - isn't what happens to the customer's money or how much of a deposit is set and paid upfront or whatever, it's the ability of the EB to produce the goods in a timely manner and despatch to the customer. People waiting months for a pair of speakers is pretty unacceptable.

If the production facilities are going to remain "as is", then churning out a wider product line without the means to facilitate inreased volume is a sure route to yet more customer dissatisfaction.

So yes, the 5-star review is a great thing, but it can be a double-edged sword. Good luck with the new line Richard, I really hope it works out, but I hope you can sort out the production side of things too because that's the real problem.

 

[chebby]

Possibly off topic......but..... are you the same Richard Allen that made the Minuet ? If so...thank you if not ....as you were...

I think you may mean the Minette. no, I was nothing to do with that. Sorry.

Richard Allan (note the spelling) was not a person but a company name formed from the Christian names of the children of two of the co-founders (the children were Richard and Allan).

The company started - in Batley, Yorkshire - as the Richard Allan Radio Company making radios (such as the Bafflette) during the 1940s and 1950s.

Later in the 1960s Richard Allan teamed up with another Yorkshire based company (making lab and test equipment) run by Jim Sugden to develop and market his solid-state class A amplifier design. It was called (at first) the Richard Allan A21.

 

[the record spot]

AVI don't give refunds on the ADM40s as they are built to order . ( This is not intended to reopen previous arguments about distance selling)

To be clear, this applies across the board to any product made to order. Not just AVI. However, companies like XTZ and EB are one step ahead of AVI when it comes to the means to try and return with home demo or 30-day return policy - "no risk" works for me. True, AVI would be hard pressed to do this for overseas customers, but this could work easily in the UK.

I've no doubt AVI's product is excellent, people seem to love them, but £3200 is a lot to hand over on a hope and a few user reviews.

 

[Richard Allen]

I'm addressing all of these problems RS.

The truth be known, the biggest problem was outsourcing the cabinets. you can never get the quantities right unless you have a warehouse dedicated to just those.

Now that the panic has eased off a bit. I'm able to cope with what I've got. The deposit thing and the like is to try and stay within the 45 day paypal period. communication will improve from me as well.

EB3 is essential to the plan as too many people have asked for it.

The main prob for me was finding enough hours in the day. Now I can with a bit of evening work as well of course. The inherent problems have been this end and I like to think I have sorted those out now. I hope!!.

It's funny. I wish other manufacturers would interact with the public like this. I was warned by others to stay off all forums. I don't agree.

 

[the record spot]

However, more and more people are making the move from passive to active speakers because they have better sound quality. I don't think that AVI and EB Acoustics will need to worry about competing for buisiness. IMO the speaker companies that should be worrying about losing buisiness are the ones who refuse to move with the times and persist in making passive speakers.

Having been through a good few sessions with actives and passives, I think it's hard to sit there and say "better" sound quality. I've loved Genelec's speakers for ages now, but did they bring out massive differences from where I'm at just now? No. Some speakers will be better, but if you think millions of punters out there are going to jump ship to actives on the back of a few owners generating publicity on one or two forums out there and the vocal AVI set, then I'd suggest that's an ambition too far at this stage Steve.

The consumer market isn't that technically aware by and large and is far more cost conscious. They want simple functionalty, plug-in and play and they want that at a reasonable price (i.e. not a four figure sum).

 

[Richard Allen]

AVI don't give refunds on the ADM40s as they are built to order . ( This is not intended to reopen previous arguments about distance selling)

To be clear, this applies across the board to any product made to order. Not just AVI. However, companies like XTZ and EB are one step ahead of AVI when it comes to the means to try and return with home demo or 30-day return policy - "no risk" works for me. True, AVI would be hard pressed to do this for overseas customers, but this could work easily in the UK.

Why hard pressed overseas RS?. My 30 day money back policy works worldwide and I have had returns from places like the USA. If I can do it, why can't others??. Possibly they don't want to?? and I'm not pointing at anyone with that last comment.

 

[the record spot]

I'm addressing all of these problems RS.

The truth be known, the biggest problem was outsourcing the cabinets. you can never get the quantities right unless you have a warehouse dedicated to just those.

Now that the panic has eased off a bit. I'm able to cope with what I've got. The deposit thing and the like is to try and stay within the 45 day paypal period. communication will improve from me as well.

EB3 is essential to the plan as too many people have asked for it.

The main prob for me was finding enough hours in the day. Now I can with a bit of evening work as well of course. The inherent problems have been this end and I like to think I have sorted those out now. I hope!!.

It's funny. I wish other manufacturers would interact with the public like this. I was warned by others to stay off all forums. I don't agree.

Good luck with it Richard - I think once the production rollout issues are addressed, the rest will fall into place. Fingers crossed!

 

[the record spot]

It's much easier to convince the wife to allow a pair of Dynaudio XEO 5s, AVI ADM40s or EB4's into the living room than a pile of hifi seperates.

I suppose that depends if you mean a "pile" in terms of the kind of stuff you see on the Steve Hoffman forum (some guys post their systems up there and they are truly man-cave setups if ever there were any!) or if you think a CD player, amp and speakers constitute clutter. "Clutter" is another fave word of the active-phile. Personally, I think many of them have an OCD complex on the go on that score... :O

 

[richardw42]

AVI don't give refunds on the ADM40s as they are built to order . ( This is not intended to reopen previous arguments about distance selling)

To be clear, this applies across the board to any product made to order. Not just AVI. However, companies like XTZ and EB are one step ahead of AVI when it comes to the means to try and return with home demo or 30-day return policy - "no risk" works for me. True, AVI would be hard pressed to do this for overseas customers, but this could work easily in the UK.

I've no doubt AVI's product is excellent, people seem to love them, but £3200 is a lot to hand over on a hope and a few user reviews.

RS - no, I don't think I would have bought the 40s but Im lucky to live close to do the demo. Heck of a chunk of money to commit without one. At the moment they seem to sell all of them. But when the initial demand dies down a bit hopefully they'll adapt the way they sell, so all can at least give them a try.

 

[Richard Allen]

RS - no, I don't think I would have bought the 40s but Im lucky to live close to do the demo. Heck of a chunk of money to commit without one. At the moment they seem to sell all of them. But when the initial demand dies down a bit hopefully they'll adapt the way they sell, so all can at least give them a try.

Question for you.

If your loudspeakers had been available with a 30 day money back guarantee if you didn't like them, would you have given them a chance with a home demo. Glad you do like them by the way. Just asking, that's all.

 

[plastic penguin]

Is there anything in the 'EB' pipeline regards compact floorstander?

 

[Ajani]

It's much easier to convince the wife to allow a pair of Dynaudio XEO 5s, AVI ADM40s or EB4's into the living room than a pile of hifi seperates.

I suppose that depends if you mean a "pile" in terms of the kind of stuff you see on the Steve Hoffman forum (some guys post their systems up there and they are truly man-cave setups if ever there were any!) or if you think a CD player, amp and speakers constitute clutter. "Clutter" is another fave word of the active-phile. Personally, I think many of them have an OCD complex on the go on that score... :O

I don't mind the look of a cdp/amp/speaker combo, but I can easily see why having an all in one is more visually appealing. I really wouldn't describe persons who find the combo to be cluter, as having some kind of OCD.

 

[Ajani]

Thank you Big Boss.

Glad you approve. Just hope everyone else does too. With EB3 imminent, this needs to be right.

Haven't been through all of this, but the issue - as I can tell - isn't what happens to the customer's money or how much of a deposit is set and paid upfront or whatever, it's the ability of the EB to produce the goods in a timely manner and despatch to the customer. People waiting months for a pair of speakers is pretty unacceptable.

If the production facilities are going to remain "as is", then churning out a wider product line without the means to facilitate inreased volume is a sure route to yet more customer dissatisfaction.

So yes, the 5-star review is a great thing, but it can be a double-edged sword. Good luck with the new line Richard, I really hope it works out, but I hope you can sort out the production side of things too because that's the real problem.

Your point is one I (and probably others) have mentioned before in this thread, but it is well worth repeating.

The real issue is not customer money tied up in paypal or even that they find it hard to get an update on their order. The issue is how long it takes to get the product.

I understand that many small businesses enjoy have a long waiting list of customers as it basically means you are guaranteed sales for the next few weeks/months, however that can be a real problem in the long run. Eventually your reputation for an excessively long wait can turn off a lot of potential customers.

My feeling is that EB needs more production staff. If they can't even handle demand for the EB1 & 2, just imagine the backlog when the 3,4 and maybe even 5 become available.

 

[richardw42]

RS - no, I don't think I would have bought the 40s but Im lucky to live close to do the demo. Heck of a chunk of money to commit without one. At the moment they seem to sell all of them. But when the initial demand dies down a bit hopefully they'll adapt the way they sell, so all can at least give them a try.

Question for you.

If your loudspeakers had been available with a 30 day money back guarantee if you didn't like them, would you have given them a chance with a home demo. Glad you do like them by the way. Just asking, that's all.

Richard. Yes, a 30 day returns policy would have made it a no brainer. I'm lucky that I only live 30 minutes or so from Ashley James so could demo in A home environment. And the dimensions of the room were not too dissimilar to my lounge. So even better.

Personally I see the 30 day trial as a real selling point, and if I'd stuck to passives perhaps the EB2s might have got a try.

 

[Richard Allen]

RS - no, I don't think I would have bought the 40s but Im lucky to live close to do the demo. Heck of a chunk of money to commit without one. At the moment they seem to sell all of them. But when the initial demand dies down a bit hopefully they'll adapt the way they sell, so all can at least give them a try.

Question for you.

If your loudspeakers had been available with a 30 day money back guarantee if you didn't like them, would you have given them a chance with a home demo. Glad you do like them by the way. Just asking, that's all.

Richard. Yes, a 30 day returns policy would have made it a no brainer.

Thank you. You have just restored my faith in human nature and myself.

 

[bigblue235]

It's funny. I wish other manufacturers would interact with the public like this. I was warned by others to stay off all forums. I don't agree.

I also wish more people like yourself would take part in forums like these, but it can go both ways. I think certain people who have problems on forums only have themselves to blame! All manufacturers know about their product, but few seem to have the knack of coming across well and many lack basic customer service/interaction skills.

I've been put off from buying a few brands (and buying from a few retailers) because of they way they've conducted themselves online, but by the same token I've been so impressed with some others that I'd now consider buying from them whereas I wouldn't have before.

Fair play to you, sir!

 

[steve_1979]

RS - no, I don't think I would have bought the 40s but Im lucky to live close to do the demo. Heck of a chunk of money to commit without one. At the moment they seem to sell all of them. But when the initial demand dies down a bit hopefully they'll adapt the way they sell, so all can at least give them a try.

Question for you.

If your loudspeakers had been available with a 30 day money back guarantee if you didn't like them, would you have given them a chance with a home demo. Glad you do like them by the way. Just asking, that's all.

Richard. Yes, a 30 day returns policy would have made it a no brainer.

Thank you. You have just restored my faith in human nature and myself.

I agree with richardw42 that a 30 day return policy is a good idea. I almost didn't buy my AVI speakers because I couldn't hear them first and £900 is a lot of money to gamble. I certainly wouldn't risk spending £3000 on a pair of speakers if I could't hear them first but if there was a 30 day return policy I wouldn't mind.

Also I wouldn't mind too much if I ordered some speakers from you and there were delays. But it would bother me if there was no comunication to let me know what was happening with the order. Hearing about people not having their emails or phone calls returned would be enough to make me think twice about placing an order.

 

[steve_1979]

Having been through a good few sessions with actives and passives, I think it's hard to sit there and say "better" sound quality. I've loved Genelec's speakers for ages now, but did they bring out massive differences from where I'm at just now? No. Some speakers will be better, but if you think millions of punters out there are going to jump ship to actives on the back of a few owners generating publicity on one or two forums out there and the vocal AVI set, then I'd suggest that's an ambition too far at this stage Steve.

I agree that the market for passive speakers isn't going to suddenly die out. It probably never will either.

I'm just trying to highlight that the popularity of active speakers in the hifi world seems to be increasing. I've noticed that more and more people on hifi forums are now using active speakers and the guy who works in a local pro audio shop has said that they gradually becoming more popular with non-professional people who just want to listen to music at home.

The consumer market isn't that technically aware by and large and is far more cost conscious. They want simple functionalty, plug-in and play and they want that at a reasonable price (i.e. not a four figure sum).

Active speaker setups are no more complicated than a passive setup.

Source > pre-amplifier > active speakers

or

Source > integrated-amplifier > passive speakers

 

[char_lotte]

Possibly off topic......but..... are you the same Richard Allen that made the Minuet ? If so...thank you if not ....as you were...

I think you may mean the Minette. no, I was nothing to do with that. Sorry.

Richard Allan (note the spelling) was not a person but a company name formed from the Christian names of the children of two of the co-founders (the children were Richard and Allan).

The company started - in Batley, Yorkshire - as the Richard Allan Radio Company making radios (such as the Bafflette) during the 1940s and 1950s.

Later in the 1960s Richard Allan teamed up with another Yorkshire based company (making lab and test equipment) run by Jim Sugden to develop and market his solid-state class A amplifier design. It was called (at first) the Richard Allan A21.

Thanks Chebby, I remember hearing them years ago at a friends house and thought they were lovely.

 

[Anonymous]

Richard, I have received the speakers on Monday. Only managed a couple of hours of listen thus far but I am pleased with what I see (on build quality) and hear (still need more running in though). They are as good as advertised.

In parting and not to beat a dead horse I still think your delivery on time is still the most important (and currently lacking) aspect of your business. I hope you can improve upon that and thus have less frustrated customers like me seeking help in this forum.

With this, I shall return to my world of music....

PS: Many thanks to the sympathetic voices in this forum, it helped to have a listening ear.....

 

[the record spot]

Active speaker setups are no more complicated than a passive setup.

Source > pre-amplifier > active speakers

or

Source > integrated-amplifier > passive speakers

You forget that not all active speakers come pre-packed with RCA or optical connectivity. Some, e.g. Yamaha's HS50 or HS80 monitors as a case in point, offer XLR or 1/4" jacks only.

Not necesarily complicated, but requires a little help via an adapter. Sometimes posts around "just get some actives" aren't necessarily as plug and play as the message suggest they are. And the box-saving benefits don't appear to be as obvious either going by your follow-up Steve...

 

[Overdose]

Active speaker setups are no more complicated than a passive setup.

Source > pre-amplifier > active speakers

or

Source > integrated-amplifier > passive speakers

You forget that not all active speakers come pre-packed with RCA or optical connectivity. Some, e.g. Yamaha's HS50 or HS80 monitors as a case in point, offer XLR or 1/4" jacks only.

Not necesarily complicated, but requires a little help via an adapter. Sometimes posts around "just get some actives" aren't necessarily as plug and play as the message suggest they are. And the box-saving benefits don't appear to be as obvious either going by your follow-up Steve...

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/looking-for-some-advice-for-a-new-set-up-based-around-spotify-on-an-ipad?page=1#comment-2747102

Page 2 post 3 pretty much covers your concerns over connectivity.

As for space saving, apart from the speakers, my setup would fit into a generous sized lunchbox. Plenty of space saved over my last and more traditional 'passive' setup.

 

[Richard Allen]

RS - no, I don't think I would have bought the 40s but Im lucky to live close to do the demo. Heck of a chunk of money to commit without one. At the moment they seem to sell all of them. But when the initial demand dies down a bit hopefully they'll adapt the way they sell, so all can at least give them a try.

Question for you.

If your loudspeakers had been available with a 30 day money back guarantee if you didn't like them, would you have given them a chance with a home demo. Glad you do like them by the way. Just asking, that's all.

Richard. Yes, a 30 day returns policy would have made it a no brainer.

Thank you. You have just restored my faith in human nature and myself.

I agree with richardw42 that a 30 day return policy is a good idea. I almost didn't buy my AVI speakers because I couldn't hear them first and £900 is a lot of money to gamble. I certainly wouldn't risk spending £3000 on a pair of speakers if I could't hear them first but if there was a 30 day return policy I wouldn't mind.

Also I wouldn't mind too much if I ordered some speakers from you and there were delays. But it would bother me if there was no comunication to let me know what was happening with the order. Hearing about people not having their emails or phone calls returned would be enough to make me think twice about placing an order.

Ok. Points all taken on board. The issues as I see them are:

1). Communication. I have already addressed this point earlier and when an order is placed I will email the customer with a delivery date. If that changes then I will advise accordingly. I will be working within the 45 days on paypal.

2). When product is ready for shipping I will email for the balance of the money. This will be paid through the website and when received, the product will be picked up and a tracking number will be sent to the customer.

3). Returns. The 30 day moneyback guarantee will be there worldwide. All you incur is the return freight charge. On receipt of goods, a visual and electrical check will be performed. Then the full purchase price will be refunded.

4). Deposit. this is basically a gesture of good faith by the customer due to the fact that each pair of speakers is built with them in mind. There is no 'stock' as such. If delivery is going to be late then I will tell you. If it is unacceptable to you then the deposit will be repaid no quibbles.

5). Website. the revised website will be uploaded when backlog is cleared. 9 pairs to do. That's all.

I really am trying to do my best here and all criticisms have been taken on the chin accordingly. When the new site is up give me a try. See if I'm true to my word. That's all I can say to you.

Thanks.

 

[Richard Allen]

It's funny. I wish other manufacturers would interact with the public like this. I was warned by others to stay off all forums. I don't agree.

I also wish more people like yourself would take part in forums like these, but it can go both ways. I think certain people who have problems on forums only have themselves to blame! All manufacturers know about their product, but few seem to have the knack of coming across well and many lack basic customer service/interaction skills.

I've been put off from buying a few brands (and buying from a few retailers) because of they way they've conducted themselves online, but by the same token I've been so impressed with some others that I'd now consider buying from them whereas I wouldn't have before.

Fair play to you, sir!

Yes it can go both ways indeed but when you're in the wrong you put your hands up and take any flack aimed at you. It hurts yes but if you deserve it, you take it. All I can say again is give me a try and see if I'm good to my word. Either way, report back here with your experience for others to see. Fair play???. Thank you for that comment.

 

[steve_1979]

You forget that not all active speakers come pre-packed with RCA or optical connectivity. Some, e.g. Yamaha's HS50 or HS80 monitors as a case in point, offer XLR or 1/4" jacks only.

Not necesarily complicated, but requires a little help via an adapter. Sometimes posts around "just get some actives" aren't necessarily as plug and play as the message suggest they are.

Fair point.

And the box-saving benefits don't appear to be as obvious either going by your follow-up Steve...

Agreed.

I've never understood why people say that actives reduce the box count. They need a pre-amp instead of an integrated-amp so there's still the same number of boxes (unless you go for an all in one solution like the ADM's or EB4's).