the new marantz sr7010 is showing on some web sites as coming soon,but seems to have gone up to 1699 from the usual 1399,not sure why the 300 price hike.
bigboss
Moderator
Thats the other reason to get out demoing - yes it gets you spending money but it also shows you just how good it is also. Validates the decision to do it - or not as the case may be.
You could come here for a demo - but I have a few new big toys due that I would want setup ideally, that would be more relevant to your plans. Be a fair few weeks until they are here and up and I am happy with them
I will be selling the awesome 65VT65 to a very lucky new owner - the 3D calibration I have done is worth owning this TV for on its own, Pacific Rim in 3D is literally stupid good let alone a few other 3D gems. Has cost some serious wedge to better this plasmas PQ on a bigger screen.
You could come here for a demo - but I have a few new big toys due that I would want setup ideally, that would be more relevant to your plans. Be a fair few weeks until they are here and up and I am happy with them
I will be selling the awesome 65VT65 to a very lucky new owner - the 3D calibration I have done is worth owning this TV for on its own, Pacific Rim in 3D is literally stupid good let alone a few other 3D gems. Has cost some serious wedge to better this plasmas PQ on a bigger screen.
ellisdj said:
Might take you up on that offer if your setup is relevant to mine. Get the impression your budget might be a little bigger than mine. Why sell the 65VT65? Can't you keep it and have the projector. TV for normal viewing, projector for films and gaming *biggrin*
So I've been thinking about colours and I was wondering how important it is to have the ceiling, wood work and door non white, or can I get away with them being white as long as I have dark walls and carpet?
Son_of_SJ
Well-known member
rocketrazor said:
My thoughts exactly, rocketrazor. I would have thought that ellisdj would want to keep his wonderful Panasonic 65VT65. He could do what bigboss does. Bigboss has gel's old 50VT65, and then he drops his Draper screen in front of the television for really bigscreen movie enjoyment.
Mind you, ellisdj, if you are determined to selll your 65VT65, there is a very knowledgeable man in Edinburgh who is jealous of me because I got the last one in Edinburgh, and who would snap yours up in a heartbeat, even if it means driving down from Edinburgh to Essex!
grdunn123
Well-known member
Bigboss, I didn't realise you live in York, I'm occasionally there as part of my job - would it be possible to have a listen to your system at some point? I have the same receiver and a 5.1 MA speaker system at present but I'm looking to go down the Atmos route but it's difficult to get a realitic demo?
bigboss
Moderator
rocketrazor said:
Colours don't have to be black. As it's a dedicated cinema room, the darker the walls are, the better it is. You can then get away with a cheaper projector screen. If the walls start bouncing off a lot of light, you'll end up spending more on the screen suitable for ambient light.
bigboss
Moderator
bigboss
Moderator
Son_of_SJ said:
Personally, I reserve projector watching only for movies and sports. If I start watching all TV programmes on projector as well, I'll lose that special cinematic experience.
Son of SJ please have a word with your pal if you dont mind to see if he would be interested. I would rather the 65VT65 went to someone who appreciated it and appreciated the effort I have put in to squeeze as good pic from it as I have been able to. It will be a couple of weeks before can do anything, but am flexible - things to sort out for the PJ etc and need something good to watch in the mean time 
On this topic - this really highlights the importance of demoing based on your own parameters - since we had all the work done here back end of last year we have another family TV so the 65VT65 only goes on for serious viewing - movies, Blu Ray Box Sets the odd TV programme - Great British Bake off for example So its hardly on, I have never gamed on it - I have darkened the room a lot already so for me the PJ will be the only source necessary, to keep the TV would be a complete waste as It wont go on
- I went for a demo day organised by a dedicated seller and installer and was really impressed with the big image and Picture Quality from a PJ in a truely blackened room - literally no ambient light. The cost of this image was instantly prohibitive depsite how much I liked it
That seed was planted however and I started making enquiries, what could I have / could I make this work with how I have things setup now that I like for sound - that is my biggest issue yet to face.
I was recommended a certain screen material for my close viewing position. I went to demo that and demo'd a draper and another screen with good PJ's Sony 40ES and 300ES and I was not happy at all with what I saw. It just wasnt what I was looking for - I didnt like the draper - I dont think its acoustically transparent either, but either way it wasnt for me.
I then went for 2 other demo's both using the same screen material I had originally seen. I put myself in a position close to the screen like I would be at home and had the dealer shrink the image to be roughly the size I would buy. And boomb that was back to the image that I liked and that had got me interested in the first place. So I found the screen material I liked.
With TV its generally clear cut - you spend more - or buy the best you get the best - or if you cant you have to consider what compromise you can live with best based on tech performance i.e. shortfalls of LED Vs PLasma or OLED for example.
I found PJ more complicated - there are more options its not clear cut at all. You might want a wide screen to be able to zoom the image so there are no black bars top and bottom for movies - this is what I am doing as it is far more immersive - but you have the PJ snag of either having to do this manually by adjusting the zoom on the PJ its self everytime you switch from a film to 16:9 tv programmes foe example because the PJ doesnt have the options to do it automatically to save on cost Sony 40ES or 55ES for example. You have to pay more money for one that does such as the JVC X500, or Sony VW300ES or VW500ES - The choice is not as easy like it is when buying a TV. The Sony PJ PQ is very good but they are a pain to have in this setup and require a scaler which pushes the price up towards the better 4K models making the buying choice harder.
For me personally sitting where I sit very close to the screen, my 65VT65 having done what I have done to my room and to it, I found it hard to settle for a PJ - there was just too many rough edges to the image. When I would come home and see my Plasma again - yes it was small by comparison for the first hour but it was a better more polished overall picture - with no obvious flaws or rough edges. I know bigger shows these up more but I coudlnt sit there and be happy with that image quality and then I would always be regretful of spending the money, thats no good.
I only found the one PJ that was satisfying to me based on its PQ and options to have lens memory, so at the press of a button it will change one ratio 2:35.1 to 16.9 for example - this way I can train the mrs to use it easily - otherwise she would never put it on - while thats good for me really its also a bit unfair to her and my son.
So again Rocket you can take a punt on it all and possibly get it right and be happy - or you can get out and have a look at what is available and what will suit you best for what you want. You should at least see the difference between 2:35.1 to 16.9
You can come here, I can only atm show you audio demo's how I do things which is different to the typical cinema way of doing, still pretty good though.
On this topic - this really highlights the importance of demoing based on your own parameters - since we had all the work done here back end of last year we have another family TV so the 65VT65 only goes on for serious viewing - movies, Blu Ray Box Sets the odd TV programme - Great British Bake off for example
So its hardly on, I have never gamed on it - I have darkened the room a lot already so for me the PJ will be the only source necessary, to keep the TV would be a complete waste as It wont go on- I went for a demo day organised by a dedicated seller and installer and was really impressed with the big image and Picture Quality from a PJ in a truely blackened room - literally no ambient light. The cost of this image was instantly prohibitive depsite how much I liked it
That seed was planted however and I started making enquiries, what could I have / could I make this work with how I have things setup now that I like for sound - that is my biggest issue yet to face.
I was recommended a certain screen material for my close viewing position. I went to demo that and demo'd a draper and another screen with good PJ's Sony 40ES and 300ES and I was not happy at all with what I saw. It just wasnt what I was looking for - I didnt like the draper - I dont think its acoustically transparent either, but either way it wasnt for me.
I then went for 2 other demo's both using the same screen material I had originally seen. I put myself in a position close to the screen like I would be at home and had the dealer shrink the image to be roughly the size I would buy. And boomb that was back to the image that I liked and that had got me interested in the first place. So I found the screen material I liked.
With TV its generally clear cut - you spend more - or buy the best you get the best - or if you cant you have to consider what compromise you can live with best based on tech performance i.e. shortfalls of LED Vs PLasma or OLED for example.
I found PJ more complicated - there are more options its not clear cut at all. You might want a wide screen to be able to zoom the image so there are no black bars top and bottom for movies - this is what I am doing as it is far more immersive - but you have the PJ snag of either having to do this manually by adjusting the zoom on the PJ its self everytime you switch from a film to 16:9 tv programmes foe example because the PJ doesnt have the options to do it automatically to save on cost Sony 40ES or 55ES for example. You have to pay more money for one that does such as the JVC X500, or Sony VW300ES or VW500ES - The choice is not as easy like it is when buying a TV. The Sony PJ PQ is very good but they are a pain to have in this setup and require a scaler which pushes the price up towards the better 4K models making the buying choice harder.
For me personally sitting where I sit very close to the screen, my 65VT65 having done what I have done to my room and to it, I found it hard to settle for a PJ - there was just too many rough edges to the image. When I would come home and see my Plasma again - yes it was small by comparison for the first hour but it was a better more polished overall picture - with no obvious flaws or rough edges. I know bigger shows these up more but I coudlnt sit there and be happy with that image quality and then I would always be regretful of spending the money, thats no good.
I only found the one PJ that was satisfying to me based on its PQ and options to have lens memory, so at the press of a button it will change one ratio 2:35.1 to 16.9 for example - this way I can train the mrs to use it easily - otherwise she would never put it on - while thats good for me really its also a bit unfair to her and my son.
So again Rocket you can take a punt on it all and possibly get it right and be happy - or you can get out and have a look at what is available and what will suit you best for what you want. You should at least see the difference between 2:35.1 to 16.9
You can come here, I can only atm show you audio demo's how I do things which is different to the typical cinema way of doing, still pretty good though.
ellisdj said:Son of SJ please have a word with your pal if you dont mind to see if he would be interested. I would rather the 65VT65 went to someone who appreciated it and appreciated the effort I have put in to squeeze as good pic from it as I have been able to. It will be a couple of weeks before can do anything, but am flexible - things to sort out for the PJ etc and need something good to watch in the mean time
On this topic - this really highlights the importance of demoing based on your own parameters - since we had all the work done here back end of last year we have another family TV so the 65VT65 only goes on for serious viewing - movies, Blu Ray Box Sets the odd TV programme - Great British Bake off for example
- I went for a demo day organised by a dedicated seller and installer and was really impressed with the big image and Picture Quality from a PJ in a truely blackened room - literally no ambient light. The cost of this image was instantly prohibitive depsite how much I liked it
That seed was planted however and I started making enquiries, what could I have / could I make this work with how I have things setup now that I like for sound - that is my biggest issue yet to face.
I was recommended a certain screen material for my close viewing position. I went to demo that and demo'd a draper and another screen with good PJ's Sony 40ES and 300ES and I was not happy at all with what I saw. It just wasnt what I was looking for - I didnt like the draper - I dont think its acoustically transparent either, but either way it wasnt for me.
I then went for 2 other demo's both using the same screen material I had originally seen. I put myself in a position close to the screen like I would be at home and had the dealer shrink the image to be roughly the size I would buy. And boomb that was back to the image that I liked and that had got me interested in the first place. So I found the screen material I liked.
With TV its generally clear cut - you spend more - or buy the best you get the best - or if you cant you have to consider what compromise you can live with best based on tech performance i.e. shortfalls of LED Vs PLasma or OLED for example.
I found PJ more complicated - there are more options its not clear cut at all. You might want a wide screen to be able to zoom the image so there are no black bars top and bottom for movies - this is what I am doing as it is far more immersive - but you have the PJ snag of either having to do this manually by adjusting the zoom on the PJ its self everytime you switch from a film to 16:9 tv programmes foe example because the PJ doesnt have the options to do it automatically to save on cost Sony 40ES or 55ES for example. You have to pay more money for one that does such as the JVC X500, or Sony VW300ES or VW500ES - The choice is not as easy like it is when buying a TV. The Sony PJ PQ is very good but they are a pain to have in this setup and require a scaler which pushes the price up towards the better 4K models making the buying choice harder.
For me personally sitting where I sit very close to the screen, my 65VT65 having done what I have done to my room and to it, I found it hard to settle for a PJ - there was just too many rough edges to the image. When I would come home and see my Plasma again - yes it was small by comparison for the first hour but it was a better more polished overall picture - with no obvious flaws or rough edges. I know bigger shows these up more but I coudlnt sit there and be happy with that image quality and then I would always be regretful of spending the money, thats no good.
I only found the one PJ that was satisfying to me based on its PQ and options to have lens memory, so at the press of a button it will change one ratio 2:35.1 to 16.9 for example - this way I can train the mrs to use it easily - otherwise she would never put it on - while thats good for me really its also a bit unfair to her and my son.
So again Rocket you can take a punt on it all and possibly get it right and be happy - or you can get out and have a look at what is available and what will suit you best for what you want. You should at least see the difference between 2:35.1 to 16.9
You can come here, I can only atm show you audio demo's how I do things which is different to the typical cinema way of doing, still pretty good though.
I have a quote next week for the actual conversion work in the garage/loft so it all depends on what that comes back at as to if I even bother or what budget I have left to use, or just wait a few years and get a 4K OLED for the lounge. At the mo just trying to investigate different options that I might want to demo rather than just turning up and saying 'show me what you have!' I'll have to take different environments into account as well but I do remember having a demo last year at Rayleigh HiFi and was very impressed with the JVC projector and Epson, preferred the JVC but both were very good. It's certainly what's planted the seed for me! Needless to say i won't be purchasing anything without having demos to be sure. The only thing im 100% certain on at the moment is I want Dolby Atmos 7.1.4. Nothing else firmly decided yet but I'm holding off with the demos as it's not worth it if the conversion cost is just to much.
I would say you sould be looking at 7.2.4
If you are using small sattelite type speakers - dual subs allows a lot more flexibility with higher crossovers which really works,
That I can demo for you Its all about the bass
EDIT - for wall colours - if you can live with it Black Velour Everywhere!!
If you are using small sattelite type speakers - dual subs allows a lot more flexibility with higher crossovers which really works,
That I can demo for you
Its all about the bassEDIT - for wall colours - if you can live with it Black Velour Everywhere!!
ellisdj said:I would say you sould be looking at 7.2.4
If you are using small sattelite type speakers - dual subs allows a lot more flexibility with higher crossovers which really works,
That I can demo for you
EDIT - for wall colours - if you can live with it Black Velour Everywhere!!
I was looking at 7.2.4 but I could'n't find Amps that did the 2 subs. They all seemed to do 1 sub?
bigboss
Moderator
bigboss
Moderator
ellisdj said:Son of SJ please have a word with your pal if you dont mind to see if he would be interested. I would rather the 65VT65 went to someone who appreciated it and appreciated the effort I have put in to squeeze as good pic from it as I have been able to. It will be a couple of weeks before can do anything, but am flexible - things to sort out for the PJ etc and need something good to watch in the mean time
On this topic - this really highlights the importance of demoing based on your own parameters - since we had all the work done here back end of last year we have another family TV so the 65VT65 only goes on for serious viewing - movies, Blu Ray Box Sets the odd TV programme - Great British Bake off for example
- I went for a demo day organised by a dedicated seller and installer and was really impressed with the big image and Picture Quality from a PJ in a truely blackened room - literally no ambient light. The cost of this image was instantly prohibitive depsite how much I liked it
That seed was planted however and I started making enquiries, what could I have / could I make this work with how I have things setup now that I like for sound - that is my biggest issue yet to face.
I was recommended a certain screen material for my close viewing position. I went to demo that and demo'd a draper and another screen with good PJ's Sony 40ES and 300ES and I was not happy at all with what I saw. It just wasnt what I was looking for - I didnt like the draper - I dont think its acoustically transparent either, but either way it wasnt for me.
I then went for 2 other demo's both using the same screen material I had originally seen. I put myself in a position close to the screen like I would be at home and had the dealer shrink the image to be roughly the size I would buy. And boomb that was back to the image that I liked and that had got me interested in the first place. So I found the screen material I liked.
With TV its generally clear cut - you spend more - or buy the best you get the best - or if you cant you have to consider what compromise you can live with best based on tech performance i.e. shortfalls of LED Vs PLasma or OLED for example.
I found PJ more complicated - there are more options its not clear cut at all. You might want a wide screen to be able to zoom the image so there are no black bars top and bottom for movies - this is what I am doing as it is far more immersive - but you have the PJ snag of either having to do this manually by adjusting the zoom on the PJ its self everytime you switch from a film to 16:9 tv programmes foe example because the PJ doesnt have the options to do it automatically to save on cost Sony 40ES or 55ES for example. You have to pay more money for one that does such as the JVC X500, or Sony VW300ES or VW500ES - The choice is not as easy like it is when buying a TV. The Sony PJ PQ is very good but they are a pain to have in this setup and require a scaler which pushes the price up towards the better 4K models making the buying choice harder.
For me personally sitting where I sit very close to the screen, my 65VT65 having done what I have done to my room and to it, I found it hard to settle for a PJ - there was just too many rough edges to the image. When I would come home and see my Plasma again - yes it was small by comparison for the first hour but it was a better more polished overall picture - with no obvious flaws or rough edges. I know bigger shows these up more but I coudlnt sit there and be happy with that image quality and then I would always be regretful of spending the money, thats no good.
I only found the one PJ that was satisfying to me based on its PQ and options to have lens memory, so at the press of a button it will change one ratio 2:35.1 to 16.9 for example - this way I can train the mrs to use it easily - otherwise she would never put it on - while thats good for me really its also a bit unfair to her and my son.
So again Rocket you can take a punt on it all and possibly get it right and be happy - or you can get out and have a look at what is available and what will suit you best for what you want. You should at least see the difference between 2:35.1 to 16.9
You can come here, I can only atm show you audio demo's how I do things which is different to the typical cinema way of doing, still pretty good though.
Which screen is it then? If your room walls are light, you want one suitable for ambient light. Grey screens are good for this, as it's a neutral colour in photography world. But pictures can appear dull. Draper screens are silver grey (ReAct 2.1) with a gain of 1.0 which overcome this. Acoustically transparent ones with ambilight are expensive. Also bear in mind that some of the acoustically transparent screens may not be suitable for 4K depending on size of perforation. So specifically look for it, for a 4K projector in the future.
Draper has a lot of screen options. Which one did you demo?
I've found 16:9 screen to be the best compromise. Yes, there are black bars on top and bottom on most films but if I try to correct that, I'll either lose picture on either side or distort the picture. The biggest advantage of 16:9 screens is that some of the best scenes are shot in 16:9 ratio (scenes in Dark Knight rises shot with an IMAX camera, Life of Pi etc.). Watching them on 16:9 screen is absolutely breathtaking! Also, all sports are shot in 16:9.
JVC projectors are more suited for bat caves. I found Sony to be brighter and more suitable for living rooms like mine when I demoed and compared.
I prefer Seymour AV Screen in XD material. At the very close range of 2 metres I couldnt see the screen weave apart from solid white such as in clouds or very solid colour. The scene in Amercian Sniper where the sandstorm comes in I could see it then. as well. I can forgive it that for the rest which is a bright and punchy image - more like what I am used to sitting 8 feet from 65" plasma at 30+ ftl.
I have the front wall all black velour - all my front acoustic treatment is now black, I will cover what I can in black velour and hope the rest is not too much a hinderance on the image contrast. Its difficult to know until you do it. The Seymour AV screens have black velour edges which I like and I will get the case work covered in it as well
I dont really watch any sport or much TV - except some discovery shows like gold rush and some odd series and programmes. You can still have a 16:9 image on the 2.35 screen and it will still be bigger than my current screen size, actually probably very simialr in size which is not a bad thing as that is big enough from that distance
The PJ I like is the Sony VW500 - its the only one I have seen thats properly better than my PJ up at my voewing distance but its bloody expensive !!
I have the front wall all black velour - all my front acoustic treatment is now black, I will cover what I can in black velour and hope the rest is not too much a hinderance on the image contrast. Its difficult to know until you do it. The Seymour AV screens have black velour edges which I like and I will get the case work covered in it as well
I dont really watch any sport or much TV - except some discovery shows like gold rush and some odd series and programmes. You can still have a 16:9 image on the 2.35 screen and it will still be bigger than my current screen size, actually probably very simialr in size which is not a bad thing as that is big enough from that distance
The PJ I like is the Sony VW500 - its the only one I have seen thats properly better than my PJ up at my voewing distance but its bloody expensive !!
bigboss
Moderator
Wait for September IFA. I suspect Sony and others will come out with cheaper 4K projectors.
That Seymour is excellent. I demoed it last year.
That Seymour is excellent. I demoed it last year.
Son_of_SJ
Well-known member
ellisdj said:Son of SJ please have a word with your pal if you dont mind to see if he would be interested. I would rather the 65VT65 went to someone who appreciated it and appreciated the effort I have put in to squeeze as good pic from it as I have been able to. It will be a couple of weeks before can do anything, but am flexible - things to sort out for the PJ etc and need something good to watch in the mean time
I certainly will, ellisdj, I'll be able to speak to him personally, not on the phone, by Saturday at the latest. I'll ask him to contact you via John Duncan and you and he can liaise directly then. Thank you very much for this, ellisdj. He does know a great deal about televisions, in fact he helped to install my own 65VT65 and he was, and remains, very envious, in fact the last time I saw him, which was only last week, he was still chuntering on about how lucky I was to get the last 65VT65 in Edinburgh!
Oh, before I forget, do you still have the ludicrously big box that Panasonic supplied, and all the internal packaging?
I think you said that you had bought another television since getting your 65VT65? Which one, make and model number?
Lastly, when you do get your new projector screen installed, whichever one you decide - and it's clear from what you and bigboss are saying that that is a more complicated process than choosing a television - will you calibrate it yourself? Or will you get Jules / Steve Withers / Vincent Teoh etc to do it? I'm guessing that calibrating a projector / screen combination is more complicated than calibrating a televison, but I'm not sure? And will you calibrate the other television at the same time?
Son_of_SJ said:ellisdj said:Son of SJ please have a word with your pal if you dont mind to see if he would be interested. I would rather the 65VT65 went to someone who appreciated it and appreciated the effort I have put in to squeeze as good pic from it as I have been able to. It will be a couple of weeks before can do anything, but am flexible - things to sort out for the PJ etc and need something good to watch in the mean time
I certainly will, ellisdj, I'll be able to speak to him personally, not on the phone, by Saturday at the latest. I'll ask him to contact you via John Duncan and you and he can liaise directly then. Thank you very much for this, ellisdj. He does know a great deal about televisions, in fact he helped to install my own 65VT65 and he was, and remains, very envious, in fact the last time I saw him, which was only last week, he was still chuntering on about how lucky I was to get the last 65VT65 in Edinburgh!
Oh, before I forget, do you still have the ludicrously big box that Panasonic supplied, and all the internal packaging?
I think you said that you had bought another television since getting your 65VT65? Which one, make and model number?
Lastly, when you do get your new projector screen installed, whichever one you decide - and it's clear from what you and bigboss are saying that that is a more complicated process than choosing a television - will you calibrate it yourself? Or will you get Jules / Steve Withers / Vincent Teoh etc to do it? I'm guessing that calibrating a projector / screen combination is more complicated than calibrating a televison, but I'm not sure? And will you calibrate the other television at the same time?
Hi SonofSJ. I dont have the box it was too big to store. But I have eveything else except the panasonic 3d glasses I moved them on in favour of the much better 3D3 glasses. I would obviously include these especially the calibrated pair. This is prob too much info for this site - very sorry if it is!!
I dont have anything yet re pj, working it all out is not easy because of how my system is setup now. I can forsee changes coming. screens are made to order even the amount of drop down has to be perfect for perfect tension - then you have other issues.
Its all much easier if you have more space or use cinema style speakers that are hidden behind the screen. That was the whole point of my intial comments, make it easier for yourself to start with and it works really well as well
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