Correct wiring of jumper cables

[Anonymous]

On further thought I have come up with a potential theory.

My THEORY is that it's about the length of the circuit. If both speaker cables were plugged into the bass connections this forms a circuit. The jumper cables or metal plates take the signal to the treble inputs and create a circuit. The circuit for the treble would be longer. Only by the length of the jumper cables but still longer. If the cables are input asymmetrically the circuits for the bass and treble become an equal length. Treble circuit is length of speaker cable plus 1 jumper cable and the same for the bass circuit. Maybe this equalling of circuit paths is why I find it sounds " more together.

One of the basics is that speaker cables should be the same length.

The human ear is extremely sensitive.

There we go, a sound engineering basis.

Smug springs to mind.

 

[CnoEvil]

The human ear is extremely sensitive.

This might be so, but people will form a queue to tell you that you are not hearing, what you are hearing!

 

[Anonymous]

A theory that has basis in science is probably gonna just fan the flames but it cannot be disputed that the asymmetrical wiring method evens out the length of the circuit.

 

[CnoEvil]

A theory that has basis in science is probably gonna just fan the flames but it cannot be disputed that the asymmetrical wiring method evens out the length of the circuit.

It's a terrific theory, I'll give you that.

 

[Anonymous]

Thank you very much indeed cnoevil

 

[CnoEvil]

Thank you very much indeed cnoevil

:cheers:

 

[Craig M.]

On further thought I have come up with a potential theory.

My THEORY is that it's about the length of the circuit. If both speaker cables were plugged into the bass connections this forms a circuit. The jumper cables or metal plates take the signal to the treble inputs and create a circuit. The circuit for the treble would be longer. Only by the length of the jumper cables but still longer. If the cables are input asymmetrically the circuits for the bass and treble become an equal length. Treble circuit is length of speaker cable plus 1 jumper cable and the same for the bass circuit. Maybe this equalling of circuit paths is why I find it sounds " more together.

One of the basics is that speaker cables should be the same length.

The human ear is extremely sensitive.

There we go, a sound engineering basis.

Smug springs to mind.

What the fu... Supernik, you are a genius. :rofl:

 

[Baldrick1]

On further thought I have come up with a potential theory.

My THEORY is that it's about the length of the circuit. If both speaker cables were plugged into the bass connections this forms a circuit. The jumper cables or metal plates take the signal to the treble inputs and create a circuit. The circuit for the treble would be longer. Only by the length of the jumper cables but still longer. If the cables are input asymmetrically the circuits for the bass and treble become an equal length. Treble circuit is length of speaker cable plus 1 jumper cable and the same for the bass circuit. Maybe this equalling of circuit paths is why I find it sounds " more together.

One of the basics is that speaker cables should be the same length.

The human ear is extremely sensitive.

There we go, a sound engineering basis.

Smug springs to mind.

Hi Supernik

You may be onto something there but even more so when one considers what the difference that is being equalised out by the asymmetric set-up...it is a difference that is not of the same material as the main cables, i.e., not OFC, and the other basic is that the cables should be of the same material, and preferably the exact same cable type for that reason.

I am not sure what some of the factory fit jumpers/post connectors are made of; I have heard brass mentioned and other things, but never OFC, so if the path to treble is longer and part of that path (albeit small) is of a different and possibly inferior material then that may give a multiplier to the possible (if your theory is correct) disequilibrium in the signal path. The asymmetric approach not only equalises the path length but also removes the multiplier to the disequilibrium.

And then we come back to the suggestion that even if you conventionally single wire your speakers and change the jumpers from the factory fit one to one made of speaker cable, i.e., OFC, there also appears to be an improvement in the sound, cohesion, tonality, etc., of the speaker...etc.

This all seems to make sense...to me at least, and support your theory...but then again, as I have said before...in the final analysis it is all down to the Mark I earhole and one's hearing...but still worth a try.

 

[Al ears]

I recently un-biwired my speakers. I originally reused the cheapo bendy plates but decided to make up some jumpers. Sounds dead simple doesn't it? My speakers have the usual binding posts that accept spades that the collar screws onto or 4 mm banana plugs. The high quality banana plugs on both ends of the speaker cable aren't stackable so the obvious solution was to buy decent quality spades - QED pack of 4 for £16 from Amazon.

So the jumpers had bananas on one end & spades on the other, intending to bridge pos to pos & neg to neg. Firstly the jumpers were too short because the spades would only connect in one orientation! I ended up putting the spades onto the main speaker cable instead with the jumpers having the bananas. Tiresome yes but further problems - when I screwed the down the terminals, the spades would be pushed back out. The terminals are so close together, it was impossible to get the damn spades tight! I resorted to buying some cheapo stackable banana plugs that my speaker cable now plug into. My quest for decent stacking banana plugs continues.

This supposedly simple task of replacing the jumper plates has not only left me traumatised but has given me an abiding hatred for spade connectors!

See Furutech for decent stackable banana plugs!

 

[RobinKidderminster]

Biting my tongue. Hating myself for even reading this. Still more in commenting. But. The contact area of a brass/copper link is going to be weaker than a wire connection. I use a contact grease. Why do the wires from a mains plug loosen? Check the freezer! Keep em tight I say.

No comment on bi-metallic chemistry/physics??

 

[shadders]

On further thought I have come up with a potential theory.

My THEORY is that it's about the length of the circuit. If both speaker cables were plugged into the bass connections this forms a circuit. The jumper cables or metal plates take the signal to the treble inputs and create a circuit. The circuit for the treble would be longer. Only by the length of the jumper cables but still longer. If the cables are input asymmetrically the circuits for the bass and treble become an equal length. Treble circuit is length of speaker cable plus 1 jumper cable and the same for the bass circuit. Maybe this equalling of circuit paths is why I find it sounds " more together.

One of the basics is that speaker cables should be the same length.

The human ear is extremely sensitive.

There we go, a sound engineering basis.

Smug springs to mind.

Hi Supernik

You may be onto something there but even more so when one considers what the difference that is being equalised out by the asymmetric set-up...it is a difference that is not of the same material as the main cables, i.e., not OFC, and the other basic is that the cables should be of the same material, and preferably the exact same cable type for that reason.

I am not sure what some of the factory fit jumpers/post connectors are made of; I have heard brass mentioned and other things, but never OFC, so if the path to treble is longer and part of that path (albeit small) is of a different and possibly inferior material then that may give a multiplier to the possible (if your theory is correct) disequilibrium in the signal path. The asymmetric approach not only equalises the path length but also removes the multiplier to the disequilibrium.

And then we come back to the suggestion that even if you conventionally single wire your speakers and change the jumpers from the factory fit one to one made of speaker cable, i.e., OFC, there also appears to be an improvement in the sound, cohesion, tonality, etc., of the speaker...etc.

This all seems to make sense...to me at least, and support your theory...but then again, as I have said before...in the final analysis it is all down to the Mark I earhole and one's hearing...but still worth a try.

Hi,

I am not sure that equal paths is the answer - a 20kHz wave will have a wavelength of 15km (15,000 metres, or 1,500,000cm - 1.5million centimetres), so the extra 4cm is not going to make any difference.

So this is probably not the reason of the change experienced. ?

Regards,

Shadders.

 

[CnoEvil]

Supernik.......YOUR FIRED!

 

[Anonymous]

Regardless of the length of a wave there is still a different distance 2 travel. Shadders, your reply seams to suggest that equal length speaker cables are pointless.

 

[nopiano]

I'm sure the wavelength of an audio frequency is completely irrelevant. You can still hear 50Hz in a room without it being 6000Km long!

However, this thread is making me wonder if non bi-wired speakers must fall into one camp or the other as to their internal wiring. Maybe someone who has made their own, or recently dismantled a production speaker can enlighten us?

Meanwhile, happily listening to properly bi-wired speakers - hence no jumpers, save for the wooly one I'm wearing!

 

[The_Lhc]

Regardless of the length of a wave there is still a different distance 2 travel. Shadders, your reply seams to suggest that equal length speaker cables are pointless.

They are largely, in terms of delay at any rate, regardless of wavelength the signal in an electrical cable is travelling at an appreciable fraction of the speed of light, so 4cms is not going to be noticable.

I used to work with a team that designed optical delay lines, designed to slow the arrival of an optical signal at the destination by a small fraction of a second (we're talking milli or microseconds, no more than that). They weren't very sophisticated, basically just coils of optical fibre (the proper stuff, not hi-fi rubbish) typically around 3 or 4 KILOMETRES in length. 4cms? Irrelevant.

The only reason for equal length speaker cables is keep the impedence the same and even then it only usually matters with long lengths of cable.

 

[Anonymous]

Come on CnoEvil.

Am I hired again yet?

 

[CnoEvil]

Meanwhile, happily listening to properly bi-wired speakers - hence no jumpers, save for the wooly one I'm wearing!

Surely you are old enough to be in a cardigan. :shifty:

 

[nopiano]

Meanwhile, happily listening to properly bi-wired speakers - hence no jumpers, save for the wooly one I'm wearing!

Surely you are old enough to be in a cardigan. :shifty:

Well, I'm really wearing a gilet, but that didn't make a wisecrack! How's the back, anyway, you old ****? :silenced:

 

[CnoEvil]

Come on CnoEvil.

Am I hired again yet?

I will take your request under advisement..........though I do have a certain sympathy, as Shadders has a way of waiting in the wings, primed and ready to (politely) shoot any dubious theory clean out of the water.

 

[CnoEvil]

Well, I'm really wearing a gilet, but that didn't make a wisecrack! How's the back, anyway, you old ****? :silenced:

Progress is slower than I would like, but it's progress none the less.......thank you for asking.....

(He says, as he dips a biscuit in his tea while sitting in his supportive "nursing home chair", wearing "old man" wooly bootees and adjusting the thermal blanket over his knees!!)

 

[nopiano]

Well, I'm really wearing a gilet, but that didn't make a wisecrack! How's the back, anyway, you old ****? :silenced:

Progress is slower than I would like, but it's progress none the less.......thank you for asking.....

(He says, as he dips a biscuit in his tea while sitting in his supportive "nursing home chair", wearing "old man" wooly bootees and adjusting the thermal blanket over his knees!!)

Sorry it's taking so long. At least you are becoming even more invaluable here, where it's good to see new and old names alike. Take care.

 

[BigColz]

Has anyone heard or compared this amp recently? Going to book a demo for 3 weekends time for a friend probably with B&W 685's.. I have a feeling I may end up loving it and sell up all my high end gear :rockout:

 

[Anonymous]

Can't argue with that. Your response contains no "probably's".

 

[shadders]

Regardless of the length of a wave there is still a different distance 2 travel. Shadders, your reply seams to suggest that equal length speaker cables are pointless.

Hi,

Equal speaker lengths are not pointless, if you are spending £200 per metre, no point in buying more than needed.

Some speaker cables comes as a pair of conductors so you have to buy in equal lengths.

The distance from amplifier output to speaker terminals is the same for both conductors perhaps with a margin of error of 1% - so why buy more for one terminal than the other ?

Regards,

Shadders.

 

[BigColz]

Posted on the wrong thread... :doh: