Softdome tweeter better for rock and metal than metaldome?

[NSA_watch_my_toilet]

Page 58 : "Tube amps tame the treble"
Page 107 : "Actual masterings on vinyl are better than their counterpart on cd's"

 

[BigH]

Page 58 : "Tube amps tame the treble"Page 107 : "Actual masterings on vinyl are better than their counterpart on cd's"

Looks like its about 30 years old

 

[BigH]

I would just go to a different Hifi store and try out as meany speakers as you can until you find what your looking for and take some heavy metal CDs with you that you know well just because it's heavy metal doesn't mean you do not like a quality sound . I have some Dali opticon 8s the have a hybrid tweeters ones a ribbon tweeter and the other is a normal soft tweeter and I have a wide range in taste in music but mainly like classic rock to heavy metal and my Dalis play over kill lovely .

He has been trying for years.

I suggest he buy a decent turntable, something like a Croft amp and some Kef speakers, that should give him the sort od sound hes after. however will cost about £3k + vinyl. i think the main problem is the overly compressed music.

I tell you what heavy metal , thrash music and so on needs serious amp and speakers that can go down low on the bass so you can hear that kick drum on a drum kit probably as some thrash bands mic up there drum kits in the studio so the kick drum kind of thunders I've just about got my sound were I want it but I I've had to spend lots of money to get there . I tried nothing but book shelf speakers for a start in shop demos but none of them would give me what I was after I really do think to hear metal right you need a good set of floor standing speakers that are capable of reaching down low on the bass . This works for me and my ears but maybe different to someone else's taste but I can go and listen to pink floyd and the sound is smooth and detailed and then go and listen to manowar and I get the power of the guitars and drums .

I don't think the lows are his problem, its the high notes, drum cymbals I suspect that are his problem, I agree more bass may help. To be honest if I was into heavy/thrash metal I would be looking at a vinyl set up. Pink Floyd is not heavy metal, its well recorded rock, should not be a problem.

You could go the vinyl route, my guess is you'd spend at least 600 quid to do the job properly, on the other hand, all things being not equal, a good CD player/transport would also do the job at the same price, perhaps doing dac duty as well. It's not the medium but implementation ,implementation ,implementation.

I don't agree, its the mastering thats the problem. Ive played poor cds on decent hifi and they still sound bad. A £600 cd player I doubt will solve it. The mastering on recent vinyl albums is generally better than cds, vinyl is quite popular with that genre. A well recorded/mastered cd I agree is as good as vinyl, in sometimes its better.

Anyway he has been trying different amps/speakers for the last 7 years without luck, just look at his numerous different posts on here about the same thing. I think he should at least try something different. Maybe tube amps?

Tube amps, seriously? That will make metal sound like Sinatra, which is not what he'd want. You want the edge and punch, minus harshness, and there are systems that can achieve this. I would put turntables and valves last on the list though.

Re Tube Amps: I beg to differ. My S8 can seriously rock with the best of them, including my Devialet. What a Tube Amp could offer is a way to tame that treble.

Still beg to differ. Metal is full of aggressive guitars and crashing cymbals. You do NOT want to tame the treble, you just want to avoid harshness and undue sibilance.

I think he does want to tame it, he says "I like a warmer sound without bright highes." As said this saga is the probably the longest ever on this forum. Not sure what is available in his country.

i would not use any of the speakers in his list as they will end up sounding like a box i would go floor standing speaker route if it was me but understand that some people do not have the room to put them in but dali do sound good with heavy metal music but what county is the op from ?

Not sure of his room size, before he had a small room. Kef R300s seem to be the nearest he has found. He had B&W cm8s2 speakers before not sure what happened to them. I would not use Dyns if my demo is anything to go by.

 

[Infiniteloop]

I would just go to a different Hifi store and try out as meany speakers as you can until you find what your looking for and take some heavy metal CDs with you that you know well just because it's heavy metal doesn't mean you do not like a quality sound . I have some Dali opticon 8s the have a hybrid tweeters ones a ribbon tweeter and the other is a normal soft tweeter and I have a wide range in taste in music but mainly like classic rock to heavy metal and my Dalis play over kill lovely .

He has been trying for years.

I suggest he buy a decent turntable, something like a Croft amp and some Kef speakers, that should give him the sort od sound hes after. however will cost about £3k + vinyl. i think the main problem is the overly compressed music.

I tell you what heavy metal , thrash music and so on needs serious amp and speakers that can go down low on the bass so you can hear that kick drum on a drum kit probably as some thrash bands mic up there drum kits in the studio so the kick drum kind of thunders I've just about got my sound were I want it but I I've had to spend lots of money to get there . I tried nothing but book shelf speakers for a start in shop demos but none of them would give me what I was after I really do think to hear metal right you need a good set of floor standing speakers that are capable of reaching down low on the bass . This works for me and my ears but maybe different to someone else's taste but I can go and listen to pink floyd and the sound is smooth and detailed and then go and listen to manowar and I get the power of the guitars and drums .

I don't think the lows are his problem, its the high notes, drum cymbals I suspect that are his problem, I agree more bass may help. To be honest if I was into heavy/thrash metal I would be looking at a vinyl set up. Pink Floyd is not heavy metal, its well recorded rock, should not be a problem.

You could go the vinyl route, my guess is you'd spend at least 600 quid to do the job properly, on the other hand, all things being not equal, a good CD player/transport would also do the job at the same price, perhaps doing dac duty as well. It's not the medium but implementation ,implementation ,implementation.

I don't agree, its the mastering thats the problem. Ive played poor cds on decent hifi and they still sound bad. A £600 cd player I doubt will solve it. The mastering on recent vinyl albums is generally better than cds, vinyl is quite popular with that genre. A well recorded/mastered cd I agree is as good as vinyl, in sometimes its better.

Anyway he has been trying different amps/speakers for the last 7 years without luck, just look at his numerous different posts on here about the same thing. I think he should at least try something different. Maybe tube amps?

Tube amps, seriously? That will make metal sound like Sinatra, which is not what he'd want. You want the edge and punch, minus harshness, and there are systems that can achieve this. I would put turntables and valves last on the list though.

Re Tube Amps: I beg to differ. My S8 can seriously rock with the best of them, including my Devialet. What a Tube Amp could offer is a way to tame that treble.

Still beg to differ. Metal is full of aggressive guitars and crashing cymbals. You do NOT want to tame the treble, you just want to avoid harshness and undue sibilance.

Which is exactly what a good Valve Amp will give you. To say a Valve Amp will make metal sound like Sinatra is, quite frankly, ridiculous.

 

[CnoEvil]

IMO Not all Valve amps are created equal...and personal preference, certainly isn't....so the above argument doesn't have a definitive right and wrong answer.

 

[lindsayt]

Spot on. bass refelex speakers are also great for metal music listening.

Most of the bass reflex speakers I've heard have been poor to mediocre for metal / heavier rock music.

It's the bass bloom that so many bass reflex speakers suffer from that detracts from the bass guitar and bass drum reproduction.

Coming back to the OP, as a sweeping generalisation, there is something in what that dealer said about tweeters. However there is a big fat "it depends" when it comes to tweeter dome materials.

I do find that there are very few hi-fi systems that are good at recreating the wooden stick hitting tuned metal disk with metallic shimmering decay sound that you should get from rock cymbals. Far too many systems turn cymbals into an annoying "tssss tssss" frying bacon sound.

 

[lindsayt]

Page 58 : "Tube amps tame the treble"Page 107 : "Actual masterings on vinyl are better than their counterpart on cd's"

107. Check out the DR database.

You could start with the best selling UK albums for each year in the 21st Century.

It's quite shocking how mnay of them have vinyl versions that are more dynamic than the CD versions.

 

[MajorFubar]

Page 58 : "Tube amps tame the treble"Page 107 : "Actual masterings on vinyl are better than their counterpart on cd's"

107. Check out the DR database.

You could start with the best selling UK albums for each year in the 21st Century.

It's quite shocking how mnay of them have vinyl versions that are more dynamic than the CD versions.

+1, which leads to some people actually thinking vinyl inherrently has a wider DR than CD, presumably because that's all they've experienced. Sad misuse of a technology which had the potential to deliver a SQ that was an order of magnitude higher than anything the average consumer had ever heard before.