Plagued with problems on the Sony Bravia KDL- 40W4500

[Anonymous]

How long you had the TV fowler..... (quality name)

Ive just backed off an 8 series due to all the problems with them.. lol... seems to be a massive ammount of swings and roundabouts..

Does the problem seem to be more apparent on the smaller TVs?

 

[Anonymous]

iv had it since november mpaul0055 thought id give it a chance to bed in because iv read that the clouding lessons after a month or so but its still the same so back it goes. what problems is there with the samsung i dont want to get another tv with problems its such a pain having to return faulty equipment espec from online shops .

 

[Anonymous]

Man, i feel your pain... Im sorta tempted to hear more on the new Samsungs before i buy, but as its a replacement, i need to get a TV delivered to get mine collected.

Seems you do have a faulty set as ive sat with two of these, both 52" and not seen it.. And im as fussy as they come..lol...

Sods law ill geta dodgy one now.. lol

 

[Anonymous]

mpaul0055:So whats your backlight readings guys.. i feel this tv is getting a tough time...

Here's a left-field suggestion. There are some new owners of the 40W4500 who are not happy, and there is the WHF team who have yet to see a "properly calibrated" set exhibiting the problem. Would it be feasible for a couple of representative unhappy owners to get their sets to the WHF team for independent examination?

The upshot of this could be that the WHF team persuade the unhappy owners that they are being too fussy or show them how to "properly calibrate" their sets, or it could be that the WHF team agree that the unhappy owners are dead right, and they then have some better ammunition to take back to Sony over their quality control. Either way this could offer a real service to those still trying to make a purchase decision and are considering this model.

For me it is too late, I wasn't prepared to buy a Sony lottery ticket and I am very pleased with my Panasonic, but it would be really good to get some closure on this issue.

 

[Anonymous]

If i have any of the problems that everyone has been mentioning on here when the tv arrives, i would most definately let WHFI have it.. Or they can pop to mine for some lunch and a calibrate..lol

 

[Anonymous]

smithdom:

mpaul0055:So whats your backlight readings guys.. i feel this tv is getting a tough time...

Here's a left-field suggestion. There are some new owners of the 40W4500 who are not happy, and there is the WHF team who have yet to see a "properly calibrated" set exhibiting the problem. Would it be feasible for a couple of representative unhappy owners to get their sets to the WHF team for independent examination?

The upshot of this could be that the WHF team persuade the unhappy owners that they are being too fussy or show them how to "properly calibrate" their sets, or it could be that the WHF team agree that the unhappy owners are dead right, and they then have some better ammunition to take back to Sony over their quality control. Either way this could offer a real service to those still trying to make a purchase decision and are considering this model.

For me it is too late, I wasn't prepared to buy a Sony lottery ticket and I am very pleased with my Panasonic, but it would be really good to get some closure on this issue.

Not really necessary to do this. We sell these Sony sets and it is simply the case that some are good and some are bad. The same settings on each set we put on display result in differing amounts of backlight bleed/clouding. It would seem to be a simple case of Sony's quality standards/levels being lower than they used to be, strangely (or not) seeming to get lower each year as models become cheaper and cheaper.

 

[Anonymous]

alsina:Not really necessary to do this. We sell these Sony sets and it is simply the case that some are good and some are bad. The same settings on each set we put on display result in differing amounts of backlight bleed/clouding. It would seem to be a simple case of Sony's quality standards/levels being lower than they used to be, strangely (or not) seeming to get lower each year as models become cheaper and cheaper.

So do you screen these sets before letting them loose on customers, or just offer an exchange or refund when the customer complains? Either way what do you do with the duff sets, and what is Sony's attitude to you when you return sets to Sony?

 

[Anonymous]

smithdom:

alsina:Not really necessary to do this. We sell these Sony sets and it is simply the case that some are good and some are bad. The same settings on each set we put on display result in differing amounts of backlight bleed/clouding. It would seem to be a simple case of Sony's quality standards/levels being lower than they used to be, strangely (or not) seeming to get lower each year as models become cheaper and cheaper.

So do you screen these sets before letting them loose on customers, or just offer an exchange or refund when the customer complains? Either way what do you do with the duff sets, and what is Sony's attitude to you when you return sets to Sony?

The sets are not screened, as the manufacturer (Sony) does not deem bleed/clouding as a fault. In other words, Sony are saying it is a risk you take when buying their sets and they have maintained this stance for a few years now. They do not accept returns with these 'faults' and the few (and it is a few) that actually come back for a refund are resold as 'returns' at a reduced price. Simple fact is that most people don't see the bleed/clouding as a problem until it is pointed out to them.

 

[Anonymous]

alsina:We sell these Sony sets and it is simply the case that some are good and some are bad.

alsina:The sets are not screened, as the manufacturer (Sony) does not deem bleed/clouding as a fault. In other words, Sony are saying it is a risk you take when buying their sets and they have maintained this stance for a few years now. They do not accept returns with these 'faults' and the few (and it is a few) that actually come back for a refund are resold as 'returns' at a reduced price. Simple fact is that most people don't see the bleed/clouding as a problem until it is pointed out to them.

You couldn't afford to do this if the level of returns was high, so it evidently is not. But if the level of return is so low I don't understand why Sony seem so reluctant to acknowledge that there are a few sets worse than others. Such an enlightened attitude would sure give rise to more customer confidence and more sales. Or maybe they are afraid that to acknowledge the fault would legitimise the complaints and lead to more returns?

This is basically saying that those who complain are more sensitive and/or very unlucky, but if they stand up for their consumer rights some enlightened merchants such as yourself will see them right. Still a rum do, and still a lottery that I'm glad I steered clear of. Thanks for your candid feedback as a merchant.

 

[Anonymous]

alsina:smithdom:

alsina:Not really necessary to do this. We sell these Sony sets and it is simply the case that some are good and some are bad. The same settings on each set we put on display result in differing amounts of backlight bleed/clouding. It would seem to be a simple case of Sony's quality standards/levels being lower than they used to be, strangely (or not) seeming to get lower each year as models become cheaper and cheaper.

So do you screen these sets before letting them loose on customers, or just offer an exchange or refund when the customer complains? Either way what do you do with the duff sets, and what is Sony's attitude to you when you return sets to Sony?

The sets are not screened, as the manufacturer (Sony) does not deem bleed/clouding as a fault. In other words, Sony are saying it is a risk you take when buying their sets and they have maintained this stance for a few years now. They do not accept returns with these 'faults' and the few (and it is a few) that actually come back for a refund are resold as 'returns' at a reduced price. Simple fact is that most people don't see the bleed/clouding as a problem until it is pointed out to them.

This makes me sick, the Engineer is coming tomorrow so it looks like tempers will be flared! I will boycott Sony for the rest of my life. I know this won't make the slightest difference to the electronics giant, but now in the economic downturn Sony will eventually get what they deserve. If all disgruntled owners who feel let down by Sony just boycott the brand for life, the house of cards will come crashing down as we are the foundations of success.

p.s there are a lot of unhappy 40W4500 owners! Their time will come.

 

[professorhat]

 

[Anonymous]

...For Sony.

 

[Tonya]

Well, I might as well throw my hat into the ring . . . . I'm an audio/video engineer living in Norway and our Sony sets are sourced from Slovakia, if that makes any difference. I spent literally hours examining and testing the 40W4500, the 52, 55 and even the 70 inch versions in this series. Every set was stunning and passed every signal test I threw at them. The 70" model was particularly spectacular even running SD sources, although the garbage in - garbage out rule still applies here.

The only anomoly I noticed on the KDL-52W4500, which I went for in the end, was a series of black bands slowly moving vertically up the screen, when all inputs were wired up, however I traced this down to a fully wired scart cable connected to a Pioneer DVD recorder that was causing the interference.
Making a custom cable using only the required signal wires cured the problem.
I remember a few cases many years ago, when our Sony CRT sets came from a factory in Wales rather than Japan, and at that time they did have a QC problem with the UK sets and indeed had to modify the design to take into account the fluctuation in quality of some of the locally sourced parts. I guess the simplest solution here is to try and buy from a reputable dealer who will let you audition the equipment using your own reference disc that you can bring to the shop. Dealers like this may charge a few pounds more than the box-shifters but how much for peace of mind? As a footnote, any electrical item purchased in any shop here in Norway, be it mail order or local, can be returned for a full refund during the first thirty days.
Any manufacturer that ships in volumes can have some rogue sets in the wild, but at least here in Scandinavia, we haven't seen any of this clouding effect that everyone is talking about and believe me, I've been looking.

 

[Anonymous]

Well all I can say is QC must be better in slovakia. Ive now seen serveral examples on dem in shops with slight bleed top right corner and also some that I could detect no bleed on , alas I had to cancel my enginner call out as the defect doesnt show when temperatures are down (Hot = Bleed). I will say that the amout of bleed on my set has reduced significantly in the 2months ive owned it so there is still some hope it will go completly No thanks to the Spanish Sony production facility. Also no amount of Backlight tweeking / calibration will cure Bleed. it just makes it a little less offensive grrrrr.

 

[Anonymous]

There are reports that Sony are about to post their first loss for 14 years. Maybe this has something to to with the apparent quality control issues being experienced? In this financial climate the last thing Sony needs to be doing is alienating a segment of its customer base by not treating complaints seriously, however small that segment is.

 

[Anonymous]

Im going to suggest something radical now, I know all the consensus is that we should be running with low backlight settings but each time my bleed has reduced its been after running the set for a night on full power with a setting of 8, perhaps the panel needs to be run hot inorder to bed in faster and low settings (ie cold) are just prelonging the bedding inprocess. anyone else care to comment on this theory

 

[Andrew Everard]

smithdom:There are reports that Sony are about to post their first loss for 14 years. Maybe this has something to to with the apparent quality control issues being experienced?

No, it's mainly due to the strength of the Yen on world currency markets.

 

[Anonymous]

I had to sign up and comment on the Sony TV farce. I have consistently put off upgrading to plasma or lcd due to poor SD performance. Our old 32 inch CRT Philips is vastly superior if a little on the bulky side!

I recently started to look at the sets again and shortlisted a 42 inch Panasonic or a 46 inch Sony. After a couple of weeks of obsessive visits to local stores I concluded that the Sony was a better set than the Panasonic although, I remain unconvinced about fast motion, black levels and narrow viewing angles.

Then I started to hear about colour bleed and sure enough a quick visit to the local store provided an excellent demonstration in support of the many complaints on this forum. I'm certainly not going to take a chance on the Sony set and I am dismayed that What HiFi continue to heap superlatives on this set despite so much negative comment on the forum. It should certainly come with a gigantic health warning.

So, I'm keeping my cash in the bank (or should it be under the mattress?). The Panasonic set can't even get close to the clarity of the Sony but it is superior on faced paced action. Both still suck compared to my Philips on SD transmissions although I accept a drop off in quality is inevitable given the larger screen size.

What I want to see is a set that combines the best of plasma and lcd, that doesn't bleed and can show a decent SD picture. Until that happens, or all transmissions are HD I'll continue to look on in envy at the deisign of my flat screen owning friends tvs but take comforrt that the good old Philips is far more watchable.

 

[professorhat]

What's this colour bleed issue? I've only heard of a few backlight / clouding issues...

 

[Anonymous]

Ooops - backlight bleed is what I meant. Must get the gremlins out of the keyboard

 

[Anonymous]

Kitjunky:Im going to suggest something radical now, I know all the consensus is that we should be running with low backlight settings but each time my bleed has reduced its been after running the set for a night on full power with a setting of 8, perhaps the panel needs to be run hot inorder to bed in faster and low settings (ie cold) are just prelonging the bedding inprocess. anyone else care to comment on this theory

Would also be interested to hear other's opinions about this too.

Kitjunky - what do you run your b/l on? Are you really noticing reduced bleed on this higher setting? Or do you think it could just be your eyes / brain fooling you. I mean once you've had the b/l on max for a while do you reduce it and check the bleed has reduced more on the lower settings?

Rob

 

[Anonymous]

mbpage:I had to sign up and comment on the Sony TV farce. I have consistently put off upgrading to plasma or lcd due to poor SD performance. Our old 32 inch CRT Philips is vastly superior if a little on the bulky side!

Having just bought a 42PZ80B Panasonic plasma to replace a 28" widescreen Philips CRT I have to say that what has most delighted me is the better than expected SD performance of the plasma. The regular DVD and blu-ray performance is excellent to my eye, but I really didn't expect SD to look better than my trusty Philips. I never saw any set look as good with SD in the showrooms so I can only put it down to having a good strong signal at home. When I got my first Freeview PVR I invested in a good aerial and proper installation and I think it has paid off.

mbpage:I am dismayed that What HiFi continue to heap superlatives on this set
despite so much negative comment on the forum. It should certainly
come with a gigantic health warning.

I think WHF would argue that by facilitating this forum they are fulfilling any obligation they might have to alert consumers to a potential problem with the Sony sets. In my case a 40W4500 was firmly at the top of my list until I started reading the forums. However, I can't help thinking that the less savvy and possibly less confident and assertive consumers might never find the forums, and will only have the magazine to go on. The message you get on the Sony sets just from the printed magazine is almost 100% positive, which of course reflects the experience of the WHF review team.

To my mind the very existence of such a lively debate about Sony's quality control is news worthy in itself, and I am mildly surprised that it is not commented on in more depth in the printed magazine. WHF have to be cautious about giving too much credence to the vehemently expressed opinions of a minority, but the steady level of measured comment from many different people would seem to put this issue out of the 'angry few' category.

 

[Anonymous]

Andrew Everard:

smithdom:There are reports that Sony are about to post their first loss for 14 years. Maybe this has something to to with the apparent quality control issues being experienced?

No, it's mainly due to the strength of the Yen on world currency markets.

and maybe due to this too:

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=203995

 

[Clare Newsome]

smithdom:
mbpage:I had to sign up and comment on the Sony TV farce. I have consistently put off upgrading to plasma or lcd due to poor SD performance. Our old 32 inch CRT Philips is vastly superior if a little on the bulky side!

Having just bought a 42PZ80B Panasonic plasma to replace a 28" widescreen Philips CRT I have to say that what has most delighted me is the better than expected SD performance of the plasma. The regular DVD and blu-ray performance is excellent to my eye, but I really didn't expect SD to look better than my trusty Philips. I never saw any set look as good with SD in the showrooms so I can only put it down to having a good strong signal at home. When I got my first Freeview PVR I invested in a good aerial and proper installation and I think it has paid off.

mbpage:I am dismayed that What HiFi continue to heap superlatives on this set
despite so much negative comment on the forum. It should certainly
come with a gigantic health warning.

I think WHF would argue that by facilitating this forum they are fulfilling any obligation they might have to alert consumers to a potential problem with the Sony sets. In my case a 40W4500 was firmly at the top of my list until I started reading the forums. However, I can't help thinking that the less savvy and possibly less confident and assertive consumers might never find the forums, and will only have the magazine to go on. The message you get on the Sony sets just from the printed magazine is almost 100% positive, which of course reflects the experience of the WHF review team.

To my mind the very existence of such a lively debate about Sony's quality control is news worthy in itself, and I am mildly surprised that it is not commented on in more depth in the printed magazine. WHF have to be cautious about giving too much credence to the vehemently expressed opinions of a minority, but the steady level of measured comment from many different people would seem to put this issue out of the 'angry few' category.

It's worth pointing out that we've changed the reviews online here (in fact did months ago), which (literally) hundreds of thousands more people have read than would have seen the original reviews.

Meanwhile our search for superior alternatives to the Sonys continues - we've got a 40-42in Supertest coming up, with some new models in it, so maybe that'll provide some fresh five-star contenders for people unwilling to take a punt on the W4500s.

 

[Anonymous]

unununium:

No its not that running on a high backlight (full power 8) instantly stops the bleed, it seems that the next day after the nights viewing at high backlight the bleed seems to be rduced from that point on, I would say that the bleed levels on my set are now about 30% of its brand new bleed levels (ie now difficult to see) and still apear to be reducing all be it at a very slow pace.

Chris.