Arcam FMJ A19 with MA RX 6

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Vladimir said:
I'm not saying go and blind buy an amp. We are discussing here loosely what will fit the budget and the technical discussion should filter out unsuited candidates performance What you plasticpenguin heard in your room, with your gear, with your music, with your listening preferences, is of no value to the OP because he will hear something completely different with the same gear. Like you said, best for him to hear for himself, if

It has more value than someone with no experience of the combo, relying solely on promo and technical stuff.

If you think paper specs are the bible then that can create more issues than it solves, hence why this segment has dragged on for so long. There's no amount of literature that can substitute hearing it for yourself.
 

Esra

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Well I had a lot of amps for home demo for my own RX6 and all I can say,which is of course only my personal opinion, I can sec. PP´s opinion.Maybe Vlad won´t be happy but ex. the Roksan K2 would be one the amps I would not choose for them although it was the strongest and has good specs.I testet all amps in small and big room and with OP´s 21 sqm i would bet he would like the Creek most (out of his list and needs) if he found NAD 326´s treble not enough in zero and bass too forward or say he didn´t liked it at all,though I find NAD works also very good with the RX6 or MA in general,it´s more a powerfull sound and not so refined as with the others.With most NAD´s you can adjust bass and treble to your likes and the Creek has tone control too ;-),that´s a + imo.Hopefully if Ruby Dac is available soon and is a nice one,he could easily ad the dac section still having one box.Counting in all my needs,sound and price i prefered the peachtree.
 

Vladimir

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The Monitor Audio Silver RS6's estimated voltage sensitivity was 89.5dB(B)/2.83V/m, which, if slightly below the specified 91dB, is still higher than average. Its impedance (fig.1) remains above 6 ohms for almost the entire audioband, with a minimum value of 4.5 ohms at 165Hz. As well as being usefully sensitive, the RS6 is also an easy load for the amplifier to drive: textbook requirements for a speaker that will be used with inexpensive amplification. The small glitch at 20kHz in the impedance plots indicates that the metal-dome tweeter's "oil-can" resonance is a little lower in frequency than usual, and another glitch just below 300Hz implies the existence of some sort of panel resonance.
Source: http://www.stereophile.com/content/monitor-audio-silver-rs6-loudspeaker-measurements If the MA's have such impedance behaviour, you can power those with ease through small budget amps. I love me some measurements!
 

Vladimir

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And now the RX6 measurements.

I used DRA Labs' MLSSA system and a calibrated DPA 4006 microphone to measure the Monitor Audio Silver RX6's frequency response in the farfield, and an Earthworks QTC-40 for the nearfield responses. The Silver RX6 is specified as having a voltage sensitivity of 90dB/W/m. My estimate was slightly lower, at 88dB(B)/2.83V/m, which will not be a problem. The RX6's impedance (fig.1) remained below 8 ohms over most of the audioband, with a minimum magnitude of 4.35 ohms at 160Hz; this speaker will work best with 4 ohm–rated amplifiers and receivers. Fig.1 was taken with both ports open. Closing the ports with the supplied foam bungs gave the impedance shown in fig.2; the speaker now behaves as a sealed-box design with a tuning frequency of 66Hz, which will help with optimizing the sound on boomy rooms, but there is no difference in the impedance above 100Hz.

Source: http://www.stereophile.com/content/monitor-audio-silver-rx6-loudspeaker-measurements
 
Vlad -- you can keep adding links on paper specs, but these paper specs are like the Emperor's new clothes: They don't have much validity without personal knowledge or experience of the that particular speaker.

I've owned RS6s from 2007 to 2013, and within that time I've pretty much dem'd most of the big names: Roksan Kandy LIII & K2, Caspian M1, Rotel RA-06, Cyrus 8VS2, Naim Nait 5i and 5i, XS, Primare l21, numerous Arcams (DIVA and FMJ), Creek Evo2, Marantz 7001 and 8003, Audio Analogue, Musical Fidelity....

Do I really need to go on?

So I think I'm pretty well qualified to know what sounds good with RX and RS range, don't you?
 

Vladimir

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Thats all good PP, several people put their seal of aproval for the Creek coming from personal experience. I deliver my theoretical opinion. I doubt the OP will be disapointed with this thread as is.

The measurements confirm that the Creek will push MA RX6s loud. Not to the max capability and will lack control for the bottom end but it won't disapoint badly. A less experienced listener will not likely hear the issues for a while before feeling the need to upgrade. I personally would go for something with more guts from the begining, but I just love strong amps, rarely owned anything bellow 100Wpc.
 
Vladimir said:
Thats all good PP, several people put their seal of aproval for the Creek coming from personal experience. I deliver my theoretical opinion. I doubt the OP will be disapointed with this thread as is.

The measurements confirm that the Creek will push MA RX6s loud. Not to the max capability and will lack control for the bottom end but it won't disapoint badly. A less experienced listener will not likely hear the issues for a while before feeling the need to upgrade. I personally would go for something with more guts from the begining, but I just love strong amps, rarely owned anything bellow 100Wpc.

Ah, forgot to mention: My friends Cambridge 640V2 set-up, a former forumite Gerrardasnails who invited me to his place to listen to his Cambridge 840 and DacMagic (he had the RS6s too, and he owned the original Creek Evo 1 with RS6s); also at O'Briens Hi-Fi when I auditioned a pair of Totem Arros, where I took the RS6s and Leema along to compare but he had warming up a Moon 1-3, roughly the same cost as the Leema's RRP.

Ummm... that's it for now. *drinks*
 

Vladimir

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And I used to own a BSR turntable with Blaupunkt car radio integrated in the chassis, playing through cheap and hollow ITT speakers.

So much for my authority on the topic. *drinks*
 
Vladimir said:
And I used to own a BSR turntable with Blaupunkt car radio integrated in the chassis, playing through cheap and hollow ITT speakers.

So much for my authority on the topic. *drinks*

I was just taking the rise, Vlad -- albeit very true. The point I'm trying to make is your opinion is, by your own admission is "theoretical", whereas my experience is hard fact (and many miles leg work over the years).

IMHO, and you won't agree, but the Creek Evo drives those Silver ranges as easy as the Kandy LIII & K2, despite the Creek being less watts PC. I can only assume that the Creek has a purer current than the Kandys. This proves that watts without quality counts for very little.
 

Vladimir

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Purer current? Special watts? From a 250VA transformer?

So theory is silly and personal experience is hard facts. Hmm , we are becoming more and more alike to the Atheist vs Creationist debates. *yahoo*
 
Vladimir said:
Purer current? Special watts? From a 250VA transformer?

So theory is silly and personal experience is hard facts. Hmm , we are becoming more and more alike to the Atheist vs Creationist debates. *yahoo*

As I'm not a spec monkey, I'm only guessing that's the Creek sounds as powerful as the Kandys, despite being 40 watts lower than the LIII and 50 watts lower than the original K2.
 

Vladimir

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duty_calls.png
 

dan25

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Hello all, Sorry for my late response but I was quite busy during last week. I see different opinions concerning amps but this is quite normal in my opinion due to different likes concerning music auditions. I will still go for Arcam taking into consideration price/quality. The dealer is selling now Arcam a28 at the same price with a19, 660 EUR. I would go also for the irdac. Which one fits better the MA RX6? Can irdac be used with a28 taking into consideration the 6v supply? I think there must be some users using this combos inside the forum...
 

unsleepable

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dan25 said:
Hello all, Sorry for my late response but I was quite busy during last week. I see different opinions concerning amps but this is quite normal in my opinion due to different likes concerning music auditions. I will still go for Arcam taking into consideration price/quality. The dealer is selling now Arcam a28 at the same price with a19, 660 EUR. I would go also for the irdac. Which one fits better the MA RX6? Can irdac be used with a28 taking into consideration the 6v supply? I think there must be some users using this combos inside the forum...

I don't think that the A28 has the 6v plug—the A19 does. Anyway, it doesn't work with the irDac since this uses a 12v power supply. It'd work with the rDac, for example.

Funny thing, the A39 also has this plug, and again limited to 6v. So it also doesn't work with the irDac. I really don't get that.
 

dan25

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This is new for me. As far as I know irdac is using dac33 internal dac. Maybe that's the reason why they changed the supply voltage. I suppose their focus is cover most of their amp accesories (rpac, rblink, etc) which works on 6 V. I am happy to see that you are using the A19. How do you rate the amp? Since it's a low power amp does it have enough bass control over the speakers? How does it sounds with poor recordings?
 

unsleepable

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I auditioned quite a few amplifiers before settling for the A19. I liked it the best in comparison with others in its price class, and also more expensive ones. It's a matter of synergy with the speakers, too, and I only auditioned these amplifiers with Kef speakers. I understand that Arcam should also match well with the MA you are considering, but I haven't listened to those.

Regarding bass, what it produces is deep and well defined. I found it better in this regard than most of the other amplifiers I auditioned. Bass is actually a bit tighter than the larger A38 and my current P38—so it's not just a matter of power at my normal listening volume. I believe that Arcam may have raised the damping factor in its latest designs, and anyway the A19 has one of the largest power supplies you'll find in a 50w amp.

The sound is neutral verging the warm, and detailed but very refined—probably a tad too much so in its midrange. I have never found it bright, and also haven't found a recording that I have deemed "unlistenable" with this amplifier and my speakers.

All in all it's a superb amp.
 

unsleepable

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The thread that Vladimir is running about volume control matching reminded me that I should mention that the A19 has the best volume control that I have laid my hands on in my life.

Hope more vendors learn from this. Naim is already implementing resistor network volume controls in their latest devices.
 

dan25

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Thank you all for the usefull input. @unsleepable: What other amps have you auditioned together with your speakers? I found Marantz pm8005 (new pearl lite) for a good price (1000 eur). Since pm8005 is quite new not many reviews are available. Does somebody has experience with this amp or with pm ki pearl lite?
 
dan25 said:
Thank you all for the usefull input. @unsleepable: What other amps have you auditioned together with your speakers? I found Marantz pm8005 (new pearl lite) for a good price (1000 eur). Since pm8005 is quite new not many reviews are available. Does somebody has experience with this amp or with pm ki pearl lite?

No, but I have had experience with other Marantz amps (7001 and the 8003) and the RS6.

However, the trick is with RX or RS range, due to their metal dome tweeter is to dem. How good or how bad may come down to room acoustics as much as amplification.
 

dan25

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Thankx PP! There are significant differences concerning sound quality between Marantz and Arcam amps? As far as I know they are both neutral.
 

BigH

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dan25 said:
Thank you all for the usefull input. @unsleepable: What other amps have you auditioned together with your speakers? I found Marantz pm8005 (new pearl lite) for a good price (1000 eur). Since pm8005 is quite new not many reviews are available. Does somebody has experience with this amp or with pm ki pearl lite?

I heard the Pearl Lite with Dyn X14 and Tannoy Precision 6.1, did not really like the Dyns, but the Tannoys were pretty good if a bit laid back and comfortable. I heard about 10 amps in various demos, I would have picked the Creek 50A as my favourite, did not like the Arcam A19, too refined for me but only short demo with B&W CM1s. I don't think Arcam are neutral but the A19 maybe more neutral than previous Arcam amps. Marantz also tend to be on the warm side?
 

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