The new AVI ADM5 active loudspeakers.

[plastic penguin]

Holy fishcake (that's the polite version)

They are described like it's a close-knit secret society, who wear Jackboots and coal skuttle headgear. The more I read about this particular company the more I'm convinced their marketing techniques are humungusly flawed. Does this mean that within in the product warranty they have to take special vow before acceptance?

I'm pretty easy going with most things in life, including what format is used, but I find this all bizarre - and very unsettling.

 

[chebby]

The introduction of the '5 seems to be driven, in large part, by the realiseation that for many people the '9s are actually too big, the money is not a factor but size and performance is.

If that were the case (money not a factor) then they'd have kept the USP of integrated DAC/Pre in the smaller product.

 

[the record spot]

Depends if they'll sell you any in the first place PP. You might not be their 'sort' of customer...

 

[John Duncan]

The introduction of the '5 seems to be driven, in large part, by the realiseation that for many people the '9s are actually too big

As I've said many times.

the money is not a factor but size and performance is.

Agreed. I'd pay double for a speaker of the same performance just by dint of its being 16cm wide.

 

[John Duncan]

If that were the case (money not a factor) then they'd have kept the USP of integrated DAC/Pre in the smaller product.

Waste of money, a TV headphone output is all you need.

 

[davedotco]

AVI state, clearly and often, that they are not interested in the traditional hi-fi separates market, with any of their products. The fanboys are not typical of their customers who, once again according to AVI, are in the main not remote interested in hi-fi values but want good quality music from modern, non hi-fi sources with the minimum of effort.

Without a good system, properly set up, 320mbs mp3 is indistinguishable from CD for most people, which leavea AVI clear to concentrate on a product that delivers music with clarity, presence and a remarkable control from speakers that are often far from optimally positioned.

For many coming to ADMs for the first time the presence and control that they exhibit, even when not optimally positioned is what is so convincing, that they do not have the last word in resolution or the refinement of the better passive speakers is beside the point.

I think you'll find that AVI (and their customers) regularly claim that their products exceed the quality of more traditional hi-fi by a massive margin.

They are on record stating that a pair of ADMs will out-perform £5K and even £10K hi-fi systems in all respects including resolution and refinement.

They don't qualify such statements in the context of non hi-fi sources or systems. They clearly - and frequently - claim absolute superiority of their products over traditional hi-fi (at any price/performance level) and won't tolerate any discussion on this matter.

Not disputing anything you say, chebby.

Having been round the block a fair few times I was offering a view on what AVI are really trying to achieve with this new model. The confluence of lifestyle products with a high level of performance is what this is all about and I was just giving my take on this.

What AVI are attempting to achieve with all their marketing hyperbola is open to debate, but it does appear to get their name into the marketplace and this forum is instrumental in doing just that.

Again, for what it is worth, I have heard a fair number of £5-£10k systems in peoples homes that would be quite easily outperformed by a pair of ADMs, an awful lot of these higher priced systems find their way into the hands of non enthusiasts and these may be the kind of peope being targeted.

 

[plastic penguin]

Depends if they'll sell you any in the first place PP. You might not be their 'sort' of customer...

You have to be of a certain breed then? With that attitude I'm more than happy "not to be their sort of customer" I can actually think for myself.

Them and us? So juvenile. Bloody ridiculous.

 

[BigH]

The introduction of the '5 seems to be driven, in large part, by the realiseation that for many people the '9s are actually too big, the money is not a factor but size and performance is.

If that were the case (money not a factor) then they'd have kept the USP of integrated DAC/Pre in the smaller product.

Chebby there is no room to fit a integrated DAC/Pre, thats the reason otherwise they probably would, although some prefer their own DAC with whatever connections they need.

 

[davedotco]

The introduction of the '5 seems to be driven, in large part, by the realiseation that for many people the '9s are actually too big, the money is not a factor but size and performance is.

If that were the case (money not a factor) then they'd have kept the USP of integrated DAC/Pre in the smaller product.

There has been considerable debate on exactly this point, two explanations are offered, firstly that space in the enclosure is limited and secondly, that it is designed to be driven from something simple like an AEX.

I would add a third reason, that of 'product differentiation', the '9s do what they do rather well, I do not think that AVI want to confuse the issue.

 

[John Duncan]

Again, for what it is worth, I have heard a fair number of £5-£10k systems in peoples homes that would be quite easily outperformed by a pair of ADMs

So have I.

What's odd is that some people will find this statement quite odd coming from me, what with me being an industry stooge an' all.

 

[John Duncan]

Depends if they'll sell you any in the first place PP. You might not be their 'sort' of customer...

You have to be of a certain breed then? With that attitude I'm more than happy "not to be their sort of customer" I can actually think for myself.

Them and us? So juvenile. Bloody ridiculous.

This seems news to you.

 

[davedotco]

Depends if they'll sell you any in the first place PP. You might not be their 'sort' of customer...

I'm intrigued.

If you were to email an order for a pair of ADMs, are you then required to takesome sort of test?

 

[chebby]

Having been round the block a fair few times I was offering a view on what AVI are really trying to achieve with this new model. The confluence of lifestyle products with a high level of performance is what this is all about and I was just giving my take on this.

I don't think someone in the market for high performance lifestyle audio products is going to have wood veneered boxes on their 'radar' no matter how good they are.

They'll be looking at things like B&W, B&O, Linn, or similar products with built-in network/streaming/wireless/AirPlay/Bluetooth type capabilities. (All of those examples -even the B&W A7 - are true active, digital designs with DSP.)

They won't be looking in hi-fi shops (more like John Lewis or Apple shops or online) and they, almost certainly, won't have heard of AVI.

 

[John Duncan]

Depends if they'll sell you any in the first place PP. You might not be their 'sort' of customer...

I'm intrigued.

If you were to email an order for a pair of ADMs, are you then required to takesome sort of test?

I'd repeat the quote from an erstwhile member, but I might get another mail from Uncle Ash...

 

[John Duncan]

They won't be looking in hi-fi shops (more like John Lewis or Apple shops or online) and they, almost certainly, won't have heard of AVI.

And they won't be for sale there either because dealers are all crooks (except AVI dealers) and it is AVI's direct sales model that makes them so cheap (though doesn't make the 9s cheaper from them than from a dealer, I notice).

 

[chebby]

Depends if they'll sell you any in the first place PP. You might not be their 'sort' of customer...

I'm intrigued.

If you were to email an order for a pair of ADMs, are you then required to takesome sort of test?

Regrettably, their most senior spokesperson - and a friend of the MD - clearly stated here that no-one should take it for granted that AVI would sell their products to them.

 

[plastic penguin]

Depends if they'll sell you any in the first place PP. You might not be their 'sort' of customer...

You have to be of a certain breed then? With that attitude I'm more than happy "not to be their sort of customer" I can actually think for myself.

Them and us? So juvenile. Bloody ridiculous.

This seems news to you.

Nope - this has been brewing up for quite a considerable time.

(Message to self: Where did I put the Ipcress File?)

 

[chebby]

From another thread...

Your final remark does assume that AVI would be prepared to supply their goods to you, which is not something you should consider a foregone conclusion.

 

[altruistic.lemon]

Remember, too, that the MD prefers to sell to people who haven't heard the speakers before. It's part of the "leap of faith"/ exclusive sect approach.

By the way, it seems there are those who think Genelec are better than the ADM 9s, which makes me wonder if there aren't more active brands that people might prefer to AVI were they able to do a comparison, which, of course, you can't.

 

[byakuya83]

Despite all this bad-mouthing of AVI and their customers it seems a majority of posts in this thread are not from the so-called fanboys but the anti-AVI brigade, who spend an awful lot of time discussing AVI products/customers and making juvenile comments regarding the same.

A case of the pot calling the kettle black.

 

[davedotco]

Having been round the block a fair few times I was offering a view on what AVI are really trying to achieve with this new model. The confluence of lifestyle products with a high level of performance is what this is all about and I was just giving my take on this.

I don't think someone in the market for high performance lifestyle audio products is going to have wood veneered boxes on their 'radar' no matter how good they are.

They'll be looking at things like B&W, B&O, Linn, or similar products with built-in network/streaming/wireless/AirPlay/Bluetooth type capabilities. (All of those examples -even the B&W A7 - are true active, digital designs with DSP.)

They won't be looking in hi-fi shops (more like John Lewis or Apple shops or online) and they, almost certainly, won't have heard of AVI.

I do not believe I said that ADMs were lifestyle products, if I implied that then my language was imprecise.

They are, in my view, an attempt to produce a high performance system that integrates into the home (lifestyle) with a minimun of fuss and can be extremely effective with sources (such as a TV or iThing) that are not traditional hi-fi.

That they can be used with real hi-fi sources and aquit themselves extremely well in a traditional hi-fi manner puts then in a category that is beyond what I would normally consider as lifestyle.

 

[richardw42]

From another thread...

Your final remark does assume that AVI would be prepared to supply their goods to you, which is not something you should consider a foregone conclusion.

i think that was a tongue in cheek remark.

PI bought mine online and there's no background checks.

And yes I demoed first. AVI encourage people to go have a listen.

 

[byakuya83]

It was clearly tongue-in-cheek and not from a representative of the company. As a PS3 owner I could say the Xbox 360 is poorly made junk but that doesn't represent the view of Sony. Some people seem unable to separate the different entities. Either that or they choose to conveniently ignore such facts as it firms up their own agenda.

 

[the record spot]

It was clearly tongue-in-cheek and not from a representative of the company. As a PS3 owner I could say the Xbox 360 is poorly made junk but that doesn't represent the view of Sony. Some people seem unable to separate the different entities. Either that or they choose to conveniently ignore such facts as it firms up their own agenda.

Oh dear, I think you;'re getting a little bit paranoid, which seems a little bit silly.

There is no anti-AVI agenda here, merely a desire for a behavioural style more representative or fitting of a company (and some of its followers) rather than what we're more accustomed to seeing. Rather preferable no?

 

[the record spot]

Despite all this bad-mouthing of AVI and their customers it seems a majority of posts in this thread are not from the so-called fanboys but the anti-AVI brigade, who spend an awful lot of time discussing AVI products/customers and making juvenile comments regarding the same. A case of the pot calling the kettle black.

I don't recall anyone in this thread posting anything offensive that's resulted in a need for it to be removed, registering under several usernames, or anything being pruned. Which other similarities to the AVI forum were you referring to?

Pots and kettles? I don't think so. Maybe you just don't like being made aware of the trough you are happy to drink from.