The new AVI ADM5 active loudspeakers.

[fr0g]

Hi David, I will be based in Londoninium for the next couple of weeks so plan to do a little research. It's not that anything is lacking .....just fancy a change.

Come for beers!

Careful :shifty:

That actually made me laugh !! Thanks Benlaw !!

I'm not all bad.

Wiii-hooo!

(I'll get my coat)

 

[the record spot]

I'm very surprised they're using Class D amplification with these new speakers. I do recall the CEO of the company telling me ( quite loudly and on numerous occasions) that Class D was markedly inferior to Class AB as regards distortion and sonic characteristics of the sound.

I guess they must have just perfected Class D where everyone else 'failed'.

Good to hear :wall:

JB 8)

Well JB, apparently they're going to smoke the competition. It's the humility I find most touching I think. Aherm.

 

[shropshire lad]

I'm very surprised they're using Class D amplification with these new speakers. I do recall the CEO of the company telling me ( quite loudly and on numerous occasions) that Class D was markedly inferior to Class AB as regards distortion and sonic characteristics of the sound.

I guess they must have just perfected Class D where everyone else 'failed'.

Good to hear :wall:

JB 8)

Well JB, apparently they're going to smoke the competition. It's the humility I find most touching I think. Aherm.

What's humility got to do with it ? They've got a new product in the pipeline which they will be wanting to sell . What do you think they are going to say ? " Oh , these new speakers are going to be quite good , possibly not as good as some of the competition but we have tried our best and think that you might like to try them " ? ... Of course they are going to say that their speakers are the best , just like all the other speaker manufacturers do .

Amongst other things Ashley James is a salesman and he is doing his job of selling them .The way he goes about might not be to some people's liking but so what ? Don't buy them . If they were your speakers how would you sell them ?

 

[altruistic.lemon]

Sl, you're well aware that AVI use methods few other manufacturers consider using to plug their products, particularly as regards disciples spreading the message.

Remind me, what speakers do you have?

 

[Ajani]

I'm very surprised they're using Class D amplification with these new speakers. I do recall the CEO of the company telling me ( quite loudly and on numerous occasions) that Class D was markedly inferior to Class AB as regards distortion and sonic characteristics of the sound.

I guess they must have just perfected Class D where everyone else 'failed'.

Good to hear :wall:

JB 8)

It's not suprising really: Everything is utter crap until they find a way "to do it right". Anyway, seems they are indeed using Class D and the "explanation" is as follows:

Class D in this application works far better than we expected. This is because the lower the power, the faster the output devices can switch, the higher the frequency the output filter and the greater the amount of feedback that can be added. This means that by using less power than we thought we should, we've saved money and got less distortion and stunning sound. I'm really surprised, especially if my technical description is correct.

The other factor that improved sound quality is Martin's very clever limiting circuit that stops the amp clipping in way that you won't be able to hear. Digital Amps clipping are not nice, but ours always sound nice.

I think AVI is now my favourite HiFi brand. Not only do they make good products, but they also provide an endless source of comedy. :rofl:

 

[the record spot]

I'm very surprised they're using Class D amplification with these new speakers. I do recall the CEO of the company telling me ( quite loudly and on numerous occasions) that Class D was markedly inferior to Class AB as regards distortion and sonic characteristics of the sound.

I guess they must have just perfected Class D where everyone else 'failed'.

Good to hear :wall:

JB 8)

Well JB, apparently they're going to smoke the competition. It's the humility I find most touching I think. Aherm.

What's humility got to do with it ? They've got a new product in the pipeline which they will be wanting to sell . What do you think they are going to say ? " Oh , these new speakers are going to be quite good , possibly not as good as some of the competition but we have tried our best and think that you might like to try them " ? ... Of course they are going to say that their speakers are the best , just like all the other speaker manufacturers do .

Amongst other things Ashley James is a salesman and he is doing his job of selling them .The way he goes about might not be to some people's liking but so what ? Don't buy them . If they were your speakers how would you sell them ?

Don't be so naive. If we can take away the hyperbole, then we are on the same page.

AEJim would be one example, or several others, who have brought new products to market without adopting such ridiculous statements.

Please...

 

[shropshire lad]

Sl, you're well aware that AVI use methods few other manufacturers consider using to plug their products, particularly as regards disciples spreading the message.

Remind me, what speakers do you have?

You're right , he employs all these people to criticise him and his products as a way to obtain negative publicity and thereby attracting attention . It worked for me , as I was barely aware of AVI before reading about them here last year .

My position is neutral as I haven't heard any of his products yet .

ATC SCM 11s

 

[drummerman]

Well, I can see why he does it and I do enjoy participating in his forum on occasions.

However, they just started censoring heavily again, 'pruning' anything and everything out that doesn't conform and that makes for a very 'staged' forum.

Still, its his marketing tool and I guess he can do as he likes.

I just dont like heavy censorship, thats all.

regards

 

[John Duncan]

A steamroller, earlier today:

 

[nara]

Well, I can see why he does it and I do enjoy participating in his forum on occasions.

However, they just started censoring heavily again, 'pruning' anything and everything out that doesn't conform and that makes for a very 'staged' forum.

Still, its his marketing tool and I guess he can do as he likes.

I just dont like heavy censorship, thats all.

regards

Ever been on the Naim forum?

 

[JMacMan]

Well, I can see why he does it and I do enjoy participating in his forum on occasions.

However, they just started censoring heavily again, 'pruning' anything and everything out that doesn't conform and that makes for a very 'staged' forum.

Still, its his marketing tool and I guess he can do as he likes.

I just dont like heavy censorship, thats all.

regards

Ever been on the Naim forum?

i was a member there once and the two forums are comparable in many respects, in my experience.

JB

 

[ROTH AV]

Is "smoking the competition" a euphemism ?

Just asking.

 

[Ajani]

Well, I can see why he does it and I do enjoy participating in his forum on occasions.

However, they just started censoring heavily again, 'pruning' anything and everything out that doesn't conform and that makes for a very 'staged' forum.

Still, its his marketing tool and I guess he can do as he likes.

I just dont like heavy censorship, thats all.

regards

I've generally found manufacturers' forums to be the last place to expect censor free discussion. I remember the beating myself and some other persons took on the Emotiva forum for complaining about the poor volume implementation on a DAC. The fanboys acted as if we had insulted their mothers, by daring to suggest that Emotiva had made a mistake with the volume control.

Another thing I find really strange (Just to be clear: I'm not talking about you DM) is that so many fanboys will completely trust the opinion of a manufacturer, yet will claim that HiFi mags can't be trusted because they rely on advertising revenue. So they don't trust HiFi mags because they think the mags are "puppets" of manufacturers, but they trust manufacturers... Huh? :wall:

 

[Frank Harvey]

A manufacturer with their own forum is in the perfect position to get immediate feedback from their users, which they can then use to improve the existing product, or future ones. Therefore, they should use it as such, which will probably bring them more business long term than just using it as a sales desk and somewhere to tell everyone that everything else is grossly inferior and useless.

 

[JMacMan]

I'm very surprised they're using Class D amplification with these new speakers. I do recall the CEO of the company telling me ( quite loudly and on numerous occasions) that Class D was markedly inferior to Class AB as regards distortion and sonic characteristics of the sound.

I guess they must have just perfected Class D where everyone else 'failed'.

Good to hear :wall:

JB 8)

Well JB, apparently they're going to smoke the competition. It's the humility I find most touching I think. Aherm.

What's humility got to do with it ? They've got a new product in the pipeline which they will be wanting to sell . What do you think they are going to say ? " Oh , these new speakers are going to be quite good , possibly not as good as some of the competition but we have tried our best and think that you might like to try them " ? ... Of course they are going to say that their speakers are the best , just like all the other speaker manufacturers do .

Amongst other things Ashley James is a salesman and he is doing his job of selling them .The way he goes about might not be to some people's liking but so what ? Don't buy them . If they were your speakers how would you sell them ?

In sales, humility in ones approach, respect for the customer and his/her views, politeness, courtesy and good manners, along with a viewpoint that up to a certain point the customer is always right, is the professional way to deal with people. Getting into arguments with customers, insulting them, and denigrating your competition is not.

Having been involved in sales at many different levels at various times in my working life, I've seen many approaches to dealing with people in the sales arena, including the ones I've mentioned, and generally speaking voiciferously and vehemently arguing your point and denigrating and insulting people makes you many more enemies than it wins you friends.

In my personal case, having quite recently bought some active speakers, being B&O Beolab 9's, I'd have to say the professionalism and customer service I experienced as regards a buying experience from the sales team at my local B&O Emporium was exceptional - certainly some of the very best I've ever experienced from any retail sales environment.

It would be nice to see the likes of AVI endeavouring to achieve something similar in terms of professionalism and customer service in the way they deal with people and sell their product.

JB

 

[JMacMan]

Well, I can see why he does it and I do enjoy participating in his forum on occasions.

However, they just started censoring heavily again, 'pruning' anything and everything out that doesn't conform and that makes for a very 'staged' forum.

Still, its his marketing tool and I guess he can do as he likes.

I just dont like heavy censorship, thats all.

regards

I've generally found manufacturers' forums to be the last place to expect censor free discussion. I remember the beating myself and some other persons took on the Emotiva forum for complaining about the poor volume implementation on a DAC. The fanboys acted as if we had insulted their mothers, by daring to suggest that Emotiva had made a mistake with the volume control.

Another thing I find really strange (Just to be clear: I'm not talking about you DM) is that so many fanboys will completely trust the opinion of a manufacturer, yet will claim that HiFi mags can't be trusted because they rely on advertising revenue. So they don't trust HiFi mags because they think the mags are "puppets" of manufacturers, but they trust manufacturers... Huh? :wall:

I believe that beyond fanboy, you have the term sycophant, albeit I am lead to believe the two terms sometimes go hand in hand as well.

Often when Hifi enthusiasts struggle to gain knowledge as to how to build or upgrade a system, they grasp the notion handed to them by a salesman that is simple, easy to understand, and appears to work well for them. PRaT as a sales tool from the Linn/Naim era was an excellent example of this.

They then seem to go through a stage of becomming fanboys over a particular brand or marketing term, and oddly seem very prepared to abdicate all further thought into critical aspects of HiFi reproduction, as the simple, easy to understand brand or marketing mantra, works for them, and they cling to it as an evangelist clings to his religous beliefs. Indeed, any further discourse to investigate or critique the brand or marketing term, is repelled with vehement, but often not very logical or factual argument.

However, any discourse from the salesman, or brand spokesman that reinforces the individual and group membership view is treated as Mana from Heaven, and is immediately assmilated into the now group held view with almost blind allegiance.

To my mind, this is where one can loosely term certain HiFi philosophies (such as the now largely discreditied PRaT marketing term) as having a semi faith belief, or religous aspect amongst its adherents - almost like a cult of sorts. The same thing applies to extreme brand fanboys - they become like religious faith believers about a brand and/or it's HiFi philosophy, and indeed as argument and dissent is largely frowned upon by the majority group view, many individual group members become either willing or unwilling sycophants, either too lacking in knowledge to take on the group held view, or leader, and perhaps for that reason, or just insecurity about their level of HiFi knowledge and ability to challenge, bow to the group and leader pressure to conform.

Whatever the psychological behavioural basis behind it, certainly that's been my observation and thoughts of how single brand forums tend to operate.

JB

 

[John Duncan]

:clap:

 

[altruistic.lemon]

Agreed - the religious cult is a good point. If you look at the squeaky clean site now you'll see enthusiasm has almost a religious fervour about it, and any objectivity long went out the window - it's all more like Christian Science than Hi F i

 

[Anonymous]

Nice one Chebby.

Small, nice looking, connect the pre-amp/variable-output-source of your choice; domestic and pro versions available (phono vs xlr with different gain). Add to that AVI's track record with making great sounding actives and I think if nothing else you have to say that there these have a lot of potential to be great speakers, great value for money and a great solution for many people.

He is a salesman. Gotta love capitalism err?

 

[Electro]

Well, I can see why he does it and I do enjoy participating in his forum on occasions.

However, they just started censoring heavily again, 'pruning' anything and everything out that doesn't conform and that makes for a very 'staged' forum.

Still, its his marketing tool and I guess he can do as he likes.

I just dont like heavy censorship, thats all.

regards

I've generally found manufacturers' forums to be the last place to expect censor free discussion. I remember the beating myself and some other persons took on the Emotiva forum for complaining about the poor volume implementation on a DAC. The fanboys acted as if we had insulted their mothers, by daring to suggest that Emotiva had made a mistake with the volume control.

Another thing I find really strange (Just to be clear: I'm not talking about you DM) is that so many fanboys will completely trust the opinion of a manufacturer, yet will claim that HiFi mags can't be trusted because they rely on advertising revenue. So they don't trust HiFi mags because they think the mags are "puppets" of manufacturers, but they trust manufacturers... Huh? :wall:

I believe that beyond fanboy, you have the term sycophant, albeit I am lead to believe the two terms sometimes go hand in hand as well.

Often when Hifi enthusiasts struggle to gain knowledge as to how to build or upgrade a system, they grasp the notion handed to them by a salesman that is simple, easy to understand, and appears to work well for them. PRaT as a sales tool from the Linn/Naim era was an excellent example of this.

They then seem to go through a stage of becomming fanboys over a particular brand or marketing term, and oddly seem very prepared to abdicate all further thought into critical aspects of HiFi reproduction, as the simple, easy to understand brand or marketing mantra, works for them, and they cling to it as an evangelist clings to his religous beliefs. Indeed, any further discourse to investigate or critique the brand or marketing term, is repelled with vehement, but often not very logical or factual argument.

However, any discourse from the salesman, or brand spokesman that reinforces the individual and group membership view is treated as Mana from Heaven, and is immediately assmilated into the now group held view with almost blind allegiance.

To my mind, this is where one can loosely term certain HiFi philosophies (such as the now largely discreditied PRaT marketing term) as having a semi faith belief, or religous aspect amongst its adherents - almost like a cult of sorts. The same thing applies to extreme brand fanboys - they become like religious faith believers about a brand and/or it's HiFi philosophy, and indeed as argument and dissent is largely frowned upon by the majority group view, many individual group members become either willing or unwilling sycophants, either too lacking in knowledge to take on the group held view, or leader, and perhaps for that reason, or just insecurity about their level of HiFi knowledge and ability to challenge, bow to the group and leader pressure to conform.

Whatever the psychological behavioural basis behind it, certainly that's been my observation and thoughts of how single brand forums tend to operate.

JB

 

[chebby]

Would the censorship* mentioned earlier explain why we see so many AVI forum members posting over here?

*I don't visit or read that forum, and haven't been there for a very long time, so I really don't know what goes on. (i don't even click on HDD links provided in some posts.) So I am only taking the word of others about the level of censorship.

 

[altruistic.lemon]

Chebby, it's a faith. They come here as evangelists to convert the poor souls who don't have their systems.

 

[John Duncan]

Apparently we exercise censorship of AVI over here.

 

[chebby]

Apparently we exercise censorship of AVI over here.

Yes I can see how that works.

Like a certain banned member who would sneak in and leave some grossly offensive posts in the early hours (when mods were asleep), get banned again as a result, and then whine about being banned as censorship for his views on HDMI cables!

Such claims couldn't be argued with because the real reason (the disgusting and offensive posts) were always deleted by the time anyone started looking at the forum later in the morning.

A few of us saw them (I work nights on occasion) but, because discussion of moderation was not allowed (and the posts were unrepeatable) some people got the idea that the banned member was being persecuted for views on hi-fi rather than for his disgusting (and personal) comments about staff and other members.

 

[JMacMan]

Apparently we exercise censorship of AVI over here.

Yes I can see how that works.

Like a certain banned member who would sneak in and leave some grossly offensive posts in the early hours (when mods were asleep), get banned again as a result, and then whine about being banned as censorship for his views on HDMI cables!

Such claims couldn't be argued with because the real reason (the disgusting and offensive posts) were always deleted by the time anyone started looking at the forum later in the morning.

A few of us saw them (I work nights on occasion) but, because discussion of moderation was not allowed (and the posts were unrepeatable) some people got the idea that the banned member was being persecuted for views on hi-fi rather than for his disgusting (and personal) comments about staff and other members.

Interesting to hear. I've read the AVI version of events, but there's always two sides to everything, so it's very interesting to hear the other side so to speak.

Illuminating in fact.

JB