Question speakers for electrocompanient eci 80d, better alternative to kef ls50 meta

[nopiano]

Or did you mean live events?

Yes, I meant live. In person. As it happens!

But that Chesky record should be good too because the Chesky brothers were great at playing and recording others. They often used venues like churches, so all the ambience is real, not an artefact.

 

[janul]

Yes, I meant live. In person. As it happens!

But that Chesky record should be good too because the Chesky brothers were great at playing and recording others. They often used venues like churches, so all the ambience is real, not an artefact.

Ok I will throw more of the chesky to the system and will see.

Sorry, your recomendation about to going to live venues in order to "reset expectations of natural sound" I do not understand. Can you please explain, how this could help me to admit what I told is a problem?

 

[gasolin]

Wharfedale Linton 85th Heritage

You can have triangel comete ez or triangel genese trio, my Titus ez are very comfortable in the highs despite some say triangel can be to much, might want the comete or one of there floorstand like antal ez if you wanna play loud in a big room

MONITOR AUDIO GOLD 100 5G

Dynaudio evoke 10, might be alot brighter than triangle but would give you more clarity than most speakers

 

[skinnypuppy71]

I have a friend with the Electrocompaniet eci80d, also had the kef meta at first, he's now on a pair of triangle comete 40th anniversary, he's also tried a set of kef r3 meta
and sent them back, he keeps coming back to the triangles,

 

[nopiano]

Ok I will throw more of the chesky to the system and will see.

Sorry, your recomendation about to going to live venues in order to "reset expectations of natural sound" I do not understand. Can you please explain, how this could help me to admit what I told is a problem?

I could have expressed it better. I know I welcome such an experience if I’ve listened to lots of recordings. I was concerned you were finding your speakers lacking, when the recordings are the likely culprit.

If you want something different, try to hear some Wharfedale Lintons.

Wharfedale Linton review

The best of old hi-fi combined with the best of the new

www.whathifi.com

 

[janul]

I could have expressed it better. I know I welcome such an experience if I’ve listened to lots of recordings. I was concerned you were finding your speakers lacking, when the recordings are the likely culprit.

If you want something different, try to hear some Wharfedale Lintons.

Wharfedale Linton review

The best of old hi-fi combined with the best of the new

www.whathifi.com

I have a friend with the Electrocompaniet eci80d, also had the kef meta at first, he's now on a pair of triangle comete 40th anniversary, he's also tried a set of kef r3 meta
and sent them back, he keeps coming back to the triangles,

Thank you for your interest and recomendations. Yesterday I tried Proac d2 d, proac d20 d, dynaudio contour 20s. The proac dt8 must be quite a bit better behaved speaker under the eci 80d because d20 d bass was boomy and out of control using electrcompaniets own DAC. Switching to something like Lumin T3 sorted things considerably but not to the level of being the bass ok. This is about 5K dac and I certainly will not buy it for this amp. Yes the comparision was done against 5K accuphase E280 but the difference in bass controll was night and day.
With dynaudios it was even worst, no contest here at all, incredibly boomy.
With d2 d the result was ok, however I am still not sure if the bass was ok, I was tired already so have to go one more time to see. I did not expect this as the review says that it was tested on atc acm 50 also. Or is my and seller view mistaken?
Speaking to electrocompaniet support they also suggested not to use the amp with "very difficult" speakers. Based on the review I did not expect to have a lot of care with averadge to dificult to drive speakers.
I bought this amplifier also because of its refinment in subtle details so I do not want lintons.
Yes I expect he will drive triangles well (it would be pateticly funny already if not). But I do not want triangles because they add a bit too much color to sound for my taste and I do not like their look. Will try to drive the d2 d once again, xavian perla, aria, ambra with "some dac" at about 1K (thinking about soecris 1421) And thats it! If not, good buy and never again.

 

[nopiano]

Do you mean ProAc DT8, rather than d2 d?

These?

Home review

These towers deliver sparkling performance thanks to some clever engineering.

www.whathifi.com

I don’t really like the ribbons on ProAc, much as I had wanted to, and yes, I’ve found the bass boomy. I rejected D20R in favour of ATC SCM40 seven years ago.

 

[plastic penguin]

I seem to remember users of Electrocompaniet amps sounded good with PMC speakers. I've not had any personal experience of that exact combo. Might be worth perhaps demo the combo.

 

[janul]

Do you mean ProAc DT8, rather than d2 d?

These?

Home review

These towers deliver sparkling performance thanks to some clever engineering.

www.whathifi.com

I don’t really like the ribbons on ProAc, much as I had wanted to, and yes, I’ve found the bass boomy. I rejected D20R in favour of ATC SCM40 seven years ago.

Yes I meant these.
Regarding ribbons I am not sure, maybee later but now I am pretty much ok with capabilities of softdomes. I have heart in the past audiovectors qr and first think which jump to me was the sound of tweeter and I could not identify why, so from that time I am carefull.
Well, yesterday I did finish my post with quite a bit strong saying "if, than never again". Today listening at home, electrocompaniet is defending him self absolutely well. I have to say its soundstaging with kef ls50 meta, and instrument separation, detail retrival is very nice. It seems like it is a bit different animal from naim (which realy is kind of like conect and done) this one requires a bit more attention to show what he can do. Room, speakers placement, speakers selection, good cables(I really feel like this is must). I will deffinitely give this amp more time. I mean he plays ok, but when I give him more attention he revards me well. Its soundstaging is really impressive, and I cant stress this enaugh. Thinking about this, haeving richer tonality and more dynamics on top of what he already does is not possible for 2,6 K EUR.
And yeah, PMC twenty5 21s could be interesting upgrade from ls50 metas, I was originaly looking for something with more traditional built, but why not try.

 

[janul]

Hello all,

I just want to share new experience and finding. Recently I boroved from local dealer revival atlante 3 and it seem that this speker does fit to eci 80d very nicely. I have oportunity to give a trial to mofi sourcepoint 8 and triangle signature theta from the same dealer, but this would be I guess in 2 week time steps and I am quite a bit happy with those revivals so will see. Both of the named I believe could bring something new and nice to my experience, but I do not think the mofi will disapear so easily in soundstage. Triangles I believe could match atlante.

I can happily say that my problem with "too sharp and outlined , to my ears unnatural imaging of human voices when recording is not perfect" is over and I found replacement for otherwise fantastic kef ls50 meta. Still I maybee will try the two already named and maybee harbeth c7 es3. Yes I streched my budget.

 

[My2Cents]

My issue is that the imaging is so sharp that once the singer voice does not stay on one place during play, actually when the singer changes tonality of his voice, (probably the recording is not that great), it moves sidevise and back and again.

Is this on just the one particular recording? Could you name the singer?
Does it do this with female singers?
What is the source and how is it connected to the amp (brand of interconnects would be useful to know also)?
...have you checked the polarity of all your connections? Your speaker leads may be labeled incorrectly (expensive cables in particular can sometimes be incorrectly marked).

I wouldn't be so quick as to blame the speakers. It may be to do with the recordings and the way your amp is handling the separation...

 

[janul]

Is this on just the one particular recording? Could you name the singer?
Does it do this with female singers?
What is the source and how is it connected to the amp (brand of interconnects would be useful to know also)?
...have you checked the polarity of all your connections? Your speaker leads may be labeled incorrectly (expensive cables in particular can sometimes be incorrectly marked).

I wouldn't be so quick as to blame the speakers. It may be to do with the recordings and the way your amp is handling the separation.

I am really disgusted already with the members of this forum and their use of word "blaming" the gear. One needs to discuss what he hears, what he gets here on this what hifi is being accused of blaming.
I would reather apreciate If you tell me your setup for absolutely fantastic imaging and rendition of human voices.
What I have to do with the fact that you cant accpet that I do not like rendition of human voices by ls 50 meta.
So can you tell me directly that kef ls50 meta does play vocals well for all the people on the planet very well? Please do so.
For instance:
amplifier: eci 80d
speaker cables: chord epic XL
power cable: wire word silver electra, pluged into supra dc and main filter socket,
DAC: eci 80d buit in dac
streamers, wiim pro plus, linux server, ifi zen stream, bluesound node, currently using the ifi.
positioning speakers 2,2 meter in between with sitting 2, 6 meter distance from speakers. Each speaker is 50 cm from backwall, and exactly 1.8 m from side walls. (this have been experimented and changed various times from starting this post)

Now, those play good on ls50 meta, still sounds to me better on revivals:
Freshly ground: Vanish
Monica Heldal: Boy from the north
Esther Philips: What a difference the day

One example what I simply cant listen on ls50 meta when on axis istening. And yes I can hear on revivals the same think what I hear on ls50 meta but it does not call my atention to it at all. And there are so many recordings wher the voice image is not perfect and If you do not hear it or it is ok for you I am ok with this.
Lissie: When I am allone

Oh yeah, How did you come to conclusion that "I am QUICK in concluding ("blaming") ls50 meta?!"

Maybee you can check reviews of kef speakers too, other than what hifi.
pursuit perfect system, This guy pretty much nailed what I feel like listening kef speakers.

PS: kef ls50 meta is great speaker, and I there simply is a lot of people they have absolutly no any problem listening them.

 

[DougK1]

I am really disgusted already with the members of this forum and their use of word "blaming" the gear. One needs to discuss what he hears, what he gets here on this what hifi is being accused of blaming.
I would reather apreciate If you tell me your setup for absolutely fantastic imaging and rendition of human voices.
What I have to do with the fact that you cant accpet that I do not like rendition of human voices by ls 50 meta.
So can you tell me directly that kef ls50 meta does play vocals well for all the people on the planet very well? Please do so.
For instance:
amplifier: eci 80d
speaker cables: chord epic XL
power cable: wire word silver electra, pluged into supra dc and main filter socket,
DAC: eci 80d buit in dac
streamers, wiim pro plus, linux server, ifi zen stream, bluesound node, currently using the ifi.
positioning speakers 2,2 meter in between with sitting 2, 6 meter distance from speakers. Each speaker is 50 cm from backwall, and exactly 1.8 m from side walls. (this have been experimented and changed various times from starting this post)

Now, those play good on ls50 meta, still sounds to me better on revivals:
Freshly ground: Vanish
Monica Heldal: Boy from the north
Esther Philips: What a difference the day

One example what I simply cant listen on ls50 meta when on axis istening. And yes I can hear on revivals the same think what I hear on ls50 meta but it does not call my atention to it at all. And there are so many recordings wher the voice image is not perfect and If you do not hear it or it is ok for you I am ok with this.
Lissie: When I am allone

Oh yeah, How did you come to conclusion that "I am QUICK in concluding ("blaming") ls50 meta?!"

Maybee you can check reviews of kef speakers too, other than what hifi.
pursuit perfect system, This guy pretty much nailed what I feel like listening kef speakers.

PS: kef ls50 meta is great speaker, and I there simply is a lot of people they have absolutly no any problem listening them.

Appreciate that English is not your first language but people here are really trying to help you. No one is blaming anything, they are just trying to cancel out some possibilities to assist you. Maybe the LS50's are not your kind of speaker, they certainly aren't for everyone, speaker choice is very personal to the listener.

 

[janul]

one more song I picked right now,

I cant stand the rain, Sara K
her position in soundstage simply moves between being quite a bit far in the soundstage and than almost right between the speakers. Kefs do show this and to me it is unlistenable on them.

 

[My2Cents]

Your system is not balanced.
You have a £3,000 amplifier with a £350 streamer. Your seem happy to spend £2,500 on speakers. You've spent £1,300 on cables (including a Supra DC filter, which is 'snake oil' and could be causing some of your problems - even Supra admits on their own web site that DC filtering can affect the sound in ways that some people find unnatural)... and ditch the Silver electra, just plug the amp into the wall, that's how it was designed to be used.
The whole point of a hi-fi system is to produce the music as closely to the original studio recording/ final master as possible. It seems that your choice of gear is doing anything but.
Many recordings are far from perfect and the better the system the more you will notice poorly recorded, mixed and mastered material.
I have listened to all of the tracks you have mentioned and, on my system, the vocals all sound fine - they certainly don't move around the sound stage as the vocalists pitch changes like you described in an early post. Perhaps you should consider a more budget system that is more balanced?
All of the music that you mention is well recorded, and some of it does have a very wide sound stage - especially the Monica Heldal's 'Boy From The North' album (a wide sound stage is a big feature in many modern mixes these days).
On my 'budget system', the track 'Conman Coming' gets a little 'cluttered' and instrument separation gets a bit muddled near the end of the track (partly because my room actually needs some treatment ). However, it sounds great at lower volume levels and through my AKG K701's. Either way, the vocals stay nuts on where the mix engineer probably intended them to be.
BTW the main vocals on 'Boy From The North' are heavily double tracked, are very 'wide' and have a slightly 'phased' quality to them, which is most likely intentional and part of the desired sound.
One way to check a system is to switch it to mono. In the studio, mono is used a lot during the mixing process to check eq and balance between tracks. Perhaps if you don't like 'depth of field' and a 'wide sound stage' you could just switch to a mono system?

 

[janul]

Thank you for your broad advice. In the meantime the problem was solved with room acoustical treatment. That said, I strongly belive now that good soundstage and imaging almost does not have sense to try to achive, in the room which has not AT LEAST good carpet,still if it is square room. If the room is not squere like in my case it is necesary to fight the problem quite a bit further, which was done with result almost eliminating my problem to level that I am OK now with listening to vocals. So, full carpet instead of smaller one, bass traps with absorbtion over 200 Hz, and absorbers were applied.
For critical testing I used this album

Surround Spectacular!

An audiophile's dream collection assembled by Delos' acclaimed acoustical guru John Eargle and Stereo Review's David Ranada. Specially priced 2-disc set

delosmusic.com

Now kef ls50 meta really shows what they can do, maybee with better setup they still can scale. For 1K I did not find better speaker however I can imagin people prefering different speakers. What I love about them is their little to nothing coloration to sound. Classical, instrumental music sounds great.
I have tried powering with and withour DC filter and I did not notice difference yet but I did not any extensive comparison so...ECI anyways has its own DC filter.
With naim xs2 I belive using DC filtering has sence even using powercable, I might be wrong, maybe it is only bias.
Ifi zen stream coax, easly overplays for example bluesoundnode digital output so price is totally irelevant paramenter to evaluate its quality. But please do not take me wrong this is the only thing I disagree with what you wrote. Are there better streamers ? sure. I am very open to recomandations. The rest I agree or I simply do not know yet as I obviously do not have your level of audiotech knowledge.

Will go trough your advice again later, becouse it has some new info about audio which I didnt know, so thank you again.