down the line you will still want a 9 grand well 8 and a half Luxman with both.
With the Ref you will still have an amp as trade in
With the Ref you will still have an amp as trade in
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ellisdj said:down the line you will still want a 9 grand well 8 and a half Luxman with both. With the Ref you will still have an amp as trade in
My AMS35i works really well with the Refs, but the Harbeth's specs are the wrong way round for it ie. Low Sensitivity/High Impedance.
Blacksabbath25
Well-known member
plus +1 *smile*ellisdj said:down the line you will still want a 9 grand well 8 and a half Luxman with both. With the Ref you will still have an amp as trade in
the luxman seems to work really well with Kefs going by your videos they seem a great match
newlash09
Well-known member
There is something about the way you pen your thoughts. Been a exciting read, like a thriller hurtling to a big bang climax
In your impressions of the harbeths, you've mentioned several times how organic and natural, vocals and instruments sounded. So was curious to know if vocals were a priority , would the harbeths have a upper hand on the kef's. And do the harbeths also sound more natural than other speakers you have heard. Are they more like single driver full range speakers for vocals. Thanks in advance.
In your impressions of the harbeths, you've mentioned several times how organic and natural, vocals and instruments sounded. So was curious to know if vocals were a priority , would the harbeths have a upper hand on the kef's. And do the harbeths also sound more natural than other speakers you have heard. Are they more like single driver full range speakers for vocals. Thanks in advance.
Having also followed your thread I can't help thinking that maybe you may be better off keeping your old set up.
Macspur
Well-known member
It must have been a hard decision Cno, but I think in your heart of hearts you didn't really want to have to part with the AMS35I, so there could only be one winner really.
Mac
www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com
Mac
www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com
My last demo day was interesting, but I came away having felt I'd missed a trick by not hearing the 40.2s.
Given I couldn't afford them on a straight trade with my Refs, I had to get my audiophile brain in gear and come up with a Baldrick Cunning Plan. As my 35i would be a bit out of its depth driving the big Harbeths; and Alan Shaw designed them to work with any competent Amp with sufficient Power, there was only one answer - Trade in the 35i as part of the deal, if the big Harbeths wiped the floor with the Ref 3s (and drive them with the AVR600).
So another dem at Lyric was organized (from which I am just back), where we would have a long listen to the Harbeths and then compare with the Refs at the end.
Since I was not prepared to haul any further kit back to Lyric, I had to use what Michael had available...so chose a Majic DS into an Arcam AV550 (Stereo Direct) and an Akurate DSM into a Linn Power Amp. The dem room is a little small for the Ref3s and certainly not ideal for the 40.2s....but it was what it it was and I would have to try and come to a decision as to which I would bring back for a home dem.
We arrived 45 minutes late, thanks to roadworks and a convoluted "bumber to bumper" detour. Finally at 11 O'clock, we sat (coffee in hand), in front of some Monitor 40.2s, resplendent in their luxurious Rosewood overcoats, but their bulk looking somewhat incongruous, perched on the spindly Something Solid Stands.....rather like a Body Builder who has negected his legs.
We loaded up the playlist and pressed Go. (MDS + Arcam).
To be continued...
Given I couldn't afford them on a straight trade with my Refs, I had to get my audiophile brain in gear and come up with a Baldrick Cunning Plan. As my 35i would be a bit out of its depth driving the big Harbeths; and Alan Shaw designed them to work with any competent Amp with sufficient Power, there was only one answer - Trade in the 35i as part of the deal, if the big Harbeths wiped the floor with the Ref 3s (and drive them with the AVR600).
So another dem at Lyric was organized (from which I am just back), where we would have a long listen to the Harbeths and then compare with the Refs at the end.
Since I was not prepared to haul any further kit back to Lyric, I had to use what Michael had available...so chose a Majic DS into an Arcam AV550 (Stereo Direct) and an Akurate DSM into a Linn Power Amp. The dem room is a little small for the Ref3s and certainly not ideal for the 40.2s....but it was what it it was and I would have to try and come to a decision as to which I would bring back for a home dem.
We arrived 45 minutes late, thanks to roadworks and a convoluted "bumber to bumper" detour. Finally at 11 O'clock, we sat (coffee in hand), in front of some Monitor 40.2s, resplendent in their luxurious Rosewood overcoats, but their bulk looking somewhat incongruous, perched on the spindly Something Solid Stands.....rather like a Body Builder who has negected his legs.
We loaded up the playlist and pressed Go. (MDS + Arcam).
To be continued...
CnoEvil said:
I'd take caffeine over subtlety
If it were I as we listen to equipment also
Comes with the territory.
I wanted to add that if you choose harbeth you may have doubts after but with the kefs you have brand loyalty so makes more sense to me from a readers point of view.
Why don't you also go listen to some pmcs or ATC or something similar to clear the mind
Macspur said:
Mac, truth to tell, I am still not fully certain.
If I had to boil the 2 presentations down, it would be:
Harbeths - They give a sound which allows you to close your eyes, luxuriate and relax to...while being swept up in the music.
Kefs - A sound that invigourates and gets your pulse racing - like a good dose of caffine
Re The 35i - yes its the best amp I've heard under 10k, but it's a means to an end. If I felt I would enjoy the Harbeths more than the Kefs, then I would be happy to let it go, as it's the music that's important.
As the 35i draws full power from the plug at all times, I never have it on in the background....so "proper" listening is a defined event. The rest of the time I listen to the LS50s/AVR600. If I had the Harbeths connected to the Arcam, every time it was used for music would be an "event". If I change my mind, this could be a significant factor.
all the pre recordings done plan to install the GAIA this afternoon all being well.
Just having a good listen.
Got the Luxman L505UX at the mo. It's a good amp for the money. Hopefully got a Unison Research coming next week Hopefully all being well
Just having a good listen.
Got the Luxman L505UX at the mo. It's a good amp for the money. Hopefully got a Unison Research coming next week
Hopefully all being wellellisdj said:all the pre recordings done plan to install the GAIA this afternoon all being well.
Just having a good listen.
Got the Luxman L505UX at the mo. It's a good amp for the money. Hopefully got a Unison Research coming next week
*good*
"Something Solid" have isolating feet called The Missing Link....very interesting looking things, using rope. Reasonable value too compared with some alternatives.
newlash09 said:There is something about the way you pen your thoughts. Been a exciting read, like a thriller hurtling to a big bang climax
In your impressions of the harbeths, you've mentioned several times how organic and natural, vocals and instruments sounded. So was curious to know if vocals were a priority , would the harbeths have a upper hand on the kef's. And do the harbeths also sound more natural than other speakers you have heard. Are they more like single driver full range speakers for vocals. Thanks in advance.
Thank you for your kind words. I try to keep the reader in mind when I write, so attempt to make it interesting and readable.
On voices alone, I would say the Harbeths are a smidgeon better....but the Kefs get close. The Harbeths have more of an Old Fashioned sound, but brought up to date....so would be closer to a big single range driver than the Kefs.
The Harbeths are the most "Natural" speaker I've ever heard. The Blade is the most "Real" speaker I've ever heard and the Ref 3s give a good taste of that. If you think these descriptions are the same thing, then it highlights the subtleties with which I'm trying to grapple.
Andrewjvt said:
....and that my Friend, is eminently sensible.....and may be what happens.
I am taking advantage of 2 models that I really like, that have become available in the right colour and at ex-dem prices. It coincides with some money becoming available, so i am looking very seriously at an upgrade....but certainly won't be changing for the sake of it.
Given the quality of the 2 challangers, I thought the Forum might enjoy coming along for the ride and be party to my thought process....and help give guidence.
Andrewjvt said:
Not easily available over here.
I listen to a lot of Classical music, which is a particular strength of the Harbeths.
When I say the Harbeths are relaxing - it's because they are so involving. They dig up remarkable detail and with room reinforcement, are a genuine Full Range speakers. They are a Studio Monitor and it shows. You will hear the differences between amps and recordings...it just does it in a slightly different way to the Kefs, which I've tried to put into words.
their in was easier than I thought had the me a holding the speaker in the air while I fitted them
Had to take my time to make sure they was all level
Had to take my time to make sure they was all level
iceman16
Well-known member
I know Andrew Mocks me for my opinion on isolation but the power of it cannot be underestimated.
Could you do me a favour please.
Could you measure the Width of the Refs:
1. Spike to Spike
2. With the Gaias in place ie. outside edge, to outside edge of the Gaia
Did you get to the bottom of the weight of one speaker...51.3kg?
Could you measure the Width of the Refs:
1. Spike to Spike
2. With the Gaias in place ie. outside edge, to outside edge of the Gaia
Did you get to the bottom of the weight of one speaker...51.3kg?
spike to spike is 11inch and it's 13inch just under GAIA to GAIA. more like 12 and 3/4 but 13inch to play safe.
I don't think the Ref are that heavy I can lift them but it hurts and is not a nice job
Hold fire on buying a set for good reason and you will need additional threads to what come included.
I will go through all this in the video series.
I am ready to film the after videos just need some peace and quiet. Will try this evening.
I don't think the Ref are that heavy I can lift them but it hurts and is not a nice job
Hold fire on buying a set for good reason and you will need additional threads to what come included.
I will go through all this in the video series.
I am ready to film the after videos just need some peace and quiet. Will try this evening.
ellisdj said:spike to spike is 11inch and it's 13inch just under GAIA to GAIA. more like 12 and 3/4 but 13inch to play safe.
I don't think the Ref are that heavy I can lift them but it hurts and is not a nice job
Hold fire on buying a set for good reason and you will need additional threads to what come included.
I will go through all this in the video series.
I am ready to film the after videos just need some peace and quiet. Will try this evening.
Thx, that's good info.
Can I ask you to look on the Speaker Box, which should list the packed weight?
gross weight 59.7kg
net weight 51.3kg
that's on one box doesn't say if that's each one they come in 2 boxes
net weight 51.3kg
that's on one box doesn't say if that's each one they come in 2 boxes
ellisdj said:
Isolation for speakers is a good thing and proven to work.
I mock you for putting isolation on top of a dac
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