New amplifier: my long journey...

[Neuphonix]

I might be accused of being pretty lazy here (wouldn't be the first time). But can someone tell me why you can't turn the AMS (or the M6) on/off via the remote? I know it's not that hard to get up and press a button, but come on. If the unit didn't sit in standby & you were actually switching it completely on & off I could sort of understand it. But the unit sits in standby all the time, pretty lame if you ask me. It's not like the remote has all that many functions, volume/input thats about it, why not an on/off!

With regard to the AMS, it is often the case for full Class A amps not to have a standby mode.....as soon as they're switched on, they draw max power from the mains, whether playing or not.

As far as I know, a remote can only ever put a component on standby.....turning off always requires a physical button.

I think once you hear the 35i + Focals at home, it will be there to stay - do report back with your findings!

Cno

Hey Cno,

the m6 does have a standbye mode, so i had just assumed that the ams was the same. I still can't really see why it would be such a problem. May have something to do with the less is best philosophy when it comes to circuitry design? Perhaps the a-class design simply doesn't allow for a standby stage.

I guess my thought was simply that if a device can be controlled via a remote then the first & most fundamental operation would be turning it on.

So far my impressions on the Diablos are: crisp, detailed, forward without being too in your face. It is certainly a change from my older krix Neuphonix 6way floor standers. Not quite as warm & less ooompf in the bass, but I always knew that this was going to be the case & was what I was looking for for my space. They do really show up the source though, the oppo sounds great for both movies & CDs, but the satelite box coming through the yamaha can sound fairly ordinary. So you were right about them being a little less forgiving of a poor source. I do expect them to improve as the loosen up however.

Either way, they just don't sound anywhere near as good via the m6 as I remember them being with the AMS. Somewhat colder & less silky. Also the amount of noise coming through when the volume is turned down is quite surprising. I do remember being impressed with the AMS on this front, when I put my ear up next to the tweeter you heard absolutely nothing. Do you find this to be the same with yours?

So yes I would say I'll be joining your club fairly soon! Will keep you advised.

 

[CnoEvil]

Hey Cno,

the m6 does have a standbye mode, so i had just assumed that the ams was the same. I still can't really see why it would be such a problem. May have something to do with the less is best philosophy when it comes to circuitry design? Perhaps the a-class design simply doesn't allow for a standby stage.

I guess my thought was simply that if a device can be controlled via a remote then the first & most fundamental operation would be turning it on.

So far my impressions on the Diablos are: crisp, detailed, forward without being too in your face. It is certainly a change from my older krix Neuphonix 6way floor standers. Not quite as warm & less ooompf in the bass, but I always knew that this was going to be the case & was what I was looking for for my space. They do really show up the source though, the oppo sounds great for both movies & CDs, but the satelite box coming through the yamaha can sound fairly ordinary. So you were right about them being a little less forgiving of a poor source. I do expect them to improve as the loosen up however.

Either way, they just don't sound anywhere near as good via the m6 as I remember them being with the AMS. Somewhat colder & less silky. Also the amount of noise coming through when the volume is turned down is quite surprising. I do remember being impressed with the AMS on this front, when I put my ear up next to the tweeter you heard absolutely nothing. Do you find this to be the same with yours?

So yes I would say I'll be joining your club fairly soon! Will keep you advised.

- As soon as the AMS is turned on, it's pulling 400W from the wall.....I think it's next to impossible to put this design into standby

- There is almost no noise coming from my 35i.

- I believe the sound will transform when you get the 35i and your speakers have had a chance to run in

- I think that your system won't reach anywhere near its potential until you get a source worthy of the amp (35i?) and speakers. I would strongly suggest you look to the Linn DS range which are more analogue and organic sounding. The Sneaky is the VFM model, with the Majik DS imo being the sweet spot in the range (has the Dynamic power supply).

As your system gets more revealing, it sheds a spotlight on the source.

 

[Neuphonix]

[/quote]

- As soon as the AMS is turned on, it's pulling 400W from the wall.....I think it's next to impossible to put this design into standby

- There is almost no noise coming from my 35i.

- I believe the sound will transform when you get the 35i and your speakers have had a chance to run in

- I think that your system won't reach anywhere near its potential until you get a source worthy of the amp (35i?) and speakers. I would strongly suggest you look to the Linn DS range which are more analogue and organic sounding. The Sneaky is the VFM model, with the Majik DS imo being the sweet spot in the range (has the Dynamic power supply).

As your system gets more revealing, it sheds a spotlight on the source.

[/quote]

I will look into the Linn product, thanks for your recommendation. It would appear that we only have one distributor here in Sydney.

I haven't put too much time and energy into a DAC/streamer yet, have been wanting to focus on amp/speakers. But now having almost settled this area it would probably be a good time to start researching.

Can i ask if you have had any experience with the M1-clic? It seemed like a fairly logical fit, but I've heard mixed reports. Seems to sound good, but the interface leaves a bit to be desired.

have you heard much about the Nuforce oppo? Not that I want to compare it to a $12000 CD player, but I have to say it sounds great & is an impressive all in one disc playing solution, especially for the money.

Thanks again for your advice.

Alex,

whats happening? Did you reach a decision yet?

 

[CnoEvil]

Can i ask if you have had any experience with the M1-clic? It seemed like a fairly logical fit, but I've heard mixed reports. Seems to sound good, but the interface leaves a bit to be desired.

have you heard much about the Nuforce oppo? Not that I want to compare it to a $12000 CD player, but I have to say it sounds great & is an impressive all in one disc playing solution, especially for the money.

Thanks again for your advice.

I have heard other MF Dacs but not the Clic....I like what they do, but imo you should set your sights higher.

The Nuforce Oppo is excellent at what it does, but imo it won't compete with a fairly highend source. I have an Arcam DV79, which is one of the best DVD players for using as a CDP, but my Majik DS walks all over it. Its hard to explain until you hear it for yourself.

 

[Macspur]

Gosh! came back to the forum this morning expecting Alex to be regailing us with his experiences from yesterday, but no, nothing... me thinks he's teasing us... ranking up the anticipation.

 

[Roby]

I know :silenced:

Up to Perreaux domo....

 

[acalex]

I know :silenced:

Up to Perreaux domo....

Yes...decision was made! A good night sleep to see it clearer this morning...

building up the tension :cheer:

The afternoon and the demo needs an attentive review...as it was fantastic experience overall. Can't believe I found this great shop where I feel at home every time. Arrived at 15.30 and left at 20.45 more or less...loads of music, wine and fun

Do I break any rule if I communicate the name of the shop? I think everybody in the neighborhood deserves to know what a great place this shop is...

 

[CnoEvil]

Do I break any rule if I communicate the name of the shop? I think everybody in the neighborhood deserves to know what a great place this shop is...

There is no problem mentioning the shop....there's even a section on the forum for doing do.

Without giving the game away, was it a close fight, or was the decision much easier, when the amps were inserted into the right system?

 

[acalex]

Do I break any rule if I communicate the name of the shop? I think everybody in the neighborhood deserves to know what a great place this shop is...

There is no problem mentioning the shop....there's even a section on the forum for doing do.

Without giving the game away, was it a close fight, or was the decision much easier, when the amps were inserted into the right system?

Here I am, sorry been very busy deciding and demoing another great amp this morning. Indeed it was quite an easy choice once everything was in place...

 

[CnoEvil]

Here I am, sorry been very busy deciding and demoing another great amp this morning. Indeed it was quite an easy choice once everything was in place...

I have my suspicions....... :silenced:

 

[acalex]

Ok...in the end I chose the....nhaaaaaa, too early, you need to read all the post first :read:

Ok...booked a Friday afternoon at my favorite shop which I have to mention as I never got this kind of service anywhere in Brussels and Antwerpen (and I can assure you we visited almost all the hi-fi shops here).

The shop is Technology Factory in Antwerpen (http://www.technologyfactory.eu) and the owner is Francis, a very knowledgeable, honest and nice guy who let me try everything at home!

Ok, we got there with my gf a bit earlier at around 15.30 (roby got there 1h later) and uncharged and unpacked the Jadis, Lavardin and AMS. We took the beast and connected to the Sonus Faber Guarneri Memento. We put CD on and left the amp warm up for a while before sitting and listening. Source was a Clearaudio Innovation (10k eur TT) and a 3.6l eur cd player. We used the most expensive Lavardin cables as SC and the most expensive clearaudio cables as I/C. Power cable was a thick Primaluna. Unfortunately he sold already Cardas cables.

So AMS on air...some CDs (Bob Dylan, Clapton, Keb Mo, Diana Krall, Rolling Stones, B. Springsteen) and LPs as usual. We chose a nice mix of jazz, blues, rock, acoustic, vocal...material for both amps to shine! Something that straight away noticed was an amount of bass which was almost overwhelming on some specific songs...it was like the bass of the drums was too much present and almost covering the voice. It was present on both CDs and vinyls...wasn't too impressed to be honest by the matching. Then Roby came and we let him listen to some staff before swapping amp. He said the bass was too overwhelming and sometimes the music was kind of "overcharged". I will let him explain what he means.

We then plugged the Jadis with the SFs...let it warm a little bit and restarted all over....magic I felt first time was there again. Everything was balanced, not too much bass, just perfect. Asked advice to Francis and he also had an easy choice confirming exactly what I thought. We then opened a nice bottle of white whine to celebrate. He let me also take home the EAR 834p Deluxe phonostage.

Had an amazing afternoon/evening, loads of music, another two bottles of amazing spumante...and we plugged the AMS again with Audio Physics Virgo. Bam...everything was so much better...the AMS was able to shine again...so was just a matter of sinergy. But I already made my choice and took home the Jadis D50RC Signature....maybe one day the bigger brother (the 88) will come home :cheers:

I can consider than closed today my journey....after a few months, lot of beautiful amps, great songs and nice people. It was a great journey and I enjoyed every moment. Now I am writing and listening to the Jadis with Clearaudio Performance and Ear phonostage...couldn't be happier!!!
Thanks to everybody for all your support...and especially to Cno and Roby who both contributed greatly to my decision. Big thank to Francis also who was always there ready to help and propose me an alternative to any issue/problem.

Now next step will be the digital source....don't miss that :dance:

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

I already made my choice and took home the Jadis D50RC Signature....maybe one day the bigger brother (the 88) will come home :cheers:

congrats :clap:

may it bring you many years of audio enjoyment!

 

[CnoEvil]

Thanks to everybody for all your support...and especially to Cno and Roby who both contributed greatly to my decision. Big thank to Francis also who was always there ready to help and propose me an alternative to any issue/problem.

Now next step will be the digital source....don't miss that :dance:

It's hard to prove, but I felt the synergy of the Jadis + SF would win in the end....there was always a magic that was going to be hard for you to resist.

It was important for you to go through this process....not only have you reached the right decision (for you), but you have also had the kind of learning process that few ever experience.

For my part, I have enjoyed every twist and turn of it, and a chore it certainly was not....and if nothing else you put the 35i on the map.

When selecting a digital source, I will be here as usual offering any support I can.

Enjoy your new purchase (you've earned the right to do so), and one of these days I may invite myself over to check it out.

All the very best

Cno

 

[acalex]

Thanks to everybody for all your support...and especially to Cno and Roby who both contributed greatly to my decision. Big thank to Francis also who was always there ready to help and propose me an alternative to any issue/problem.

Now next step will be the digital source....don't miss that :dance:

It's hard to prove, but I felt the synergy of the Jadis + SF would win in the end....there was always a magic that was going to be hard for you to resist.

It was important for you to go through this process....not only have you reached the right decision (for you), but you have also had the kind of learning process that few ever experience.

For my part, I have enjoyed every twist and turn of it, and a chore it certainly was not....and if nothing else you put the 35i on the map.

When selecting a digital source, I will be here as usual offering any support I can.

Enjoy your new purchase (you've earned the right to do so), and one of these days I may invite myself over to check it out.

All the very best

Cno

It was indeed very difficult to let the AMS go. It is a great amp...and at home with my speakers (RX6) was a winner in the end. But the magic Jadis produces with SF Guarneri was indeed hard to resist for me. It is coloured and to some might not like...but it is so full of emotions that I do not care...

Who knows...maybe one day I will be happy owner of both amps! :dance:

You will be more than welcome to come whenever you want...we will open a great bottle of wine and eat an unforgettable italian dinner :cheers:

 

[BenLaw]

Congratulations I look forward to some pics when you're able to tear yourself away from the music (in a few months....)

 

[acalex]

Picture is bad quality but I still have to recharge my Reflex...here the final setup so far. You can't see the SB Touch as it is on the desk...

 

[acalex]

Congratulations I look forward to some pics when you're able to tear yourself away from the music (in a few months....)

When I get opportunity to recharge the battery of my reflex I will for sure upload some nice pics of the set-up. Now counting days to take these amazing Sonus Faber home... :boohoo:

 

[Macspur]

Many congratulations on your final choice Alex .

I like many have thoroughly enjoyed this journey.

When do you think you'll be getting the speakers?

Cheers

Mac

 

[WishTree]

We then plugged the Jadis with the SFs...let it warm a little bit and restarted all over....magic I felt first time was there again. Everything was balanced, not too much bass, just perfect. Asked advice to Francis and he also had an easy choice confirming exactly what I thought. We then opened a nice bottle of white whine to celebrate.

Now next step will be the digital source....don't miss that :dance:

This is great news! Congratualtions on your new acquisition !!

It is tough to escape the magic of tubes and SF.. If I remember it right, the Jadis is an ex-demo piece. If so, I would say the decision is even more worth it as I see not too much value in brand new in box compared to ex-demo.

Reg. SF Guarneri Memento , there is a pair from a German dealer for 6000 Euros (I guess used / ex-demo) just to give you a ball park on pricing possibility. I don't know how you will manage to wait to get your speakers but if it was me, I would just yiled to the temptation of a new equipment (like n number of times before )

I also enjoyed the part where you write about opening bottles of wine !!!

I have just opened a bottle of wine and my wife asks me why. I show her the new M-DAC from Audiolab and I say that's why !!

 

[Neuphonix]

Hey Alex,

congratulations mate. Well done.

Thanks again for sharing this with us, it's been fascinating reading.

Look forward to hearing about your digital experience.

 

[acalex]

Many congratulations on your final choice Alex .

I like many have thoroughly enjoyed this journey.

When do you think you'll be getting the speakers?

Cheers

Mac

Mac, thanks a lot. For now speakers are planned around Xmas...if I change job they might come after the summer also...needs to put money aside as I am going to the States for 3 weeks in September! :bounce:

 

[acalex]

We then plugged the Jadis with the SFs...let it warm a little bit and restarted all over....magic I felt first time was there again. Everything was balanced, not too much bass, just perfect. Asked advice to Francis and he also had an easy choice confirming exactly what I thought. We then opened a nice bottle of white whine to celebrate.

Now next step will be the digital source....don't miss that :dance:

This is great news! Congratualtions on your new acquisition !!

It is tough to escape the magic of tubes and SF.. If I remember it right, the Jadis is an ex-demo piece. If so, I would say the decision is even more worth it as I see not too much value in brand new in box compared to ex-demo.

Reg. SF Guarneri Memento , there is a pair from a German dealer for 6000 Euros (I guess used / ex-demo) just to give you a ball park on pricing possibility. I don't know how you will manage to wait to get your speakers but if it was me, I would just yiled to the temptation of a new equipment (like n number of times before )

I also enjoyed the part where you write about opening bottles of wine !!!

I have just opened a bottle of wine and my wife asks me why. I show her the new M-DAC from Audiolab and I say that's why !!

Wish, thanks a lot.

Yes, Jadis was basically 4 months old when I took home for first time as another customer oredered both the Jadis D50 and the 88 to demo and took the 88...of course when money is not an issue is an easy choice! :clap:

Congrats for your MDAC, waiting for you to review it. Thanks for pointing to the speakers...I might get back to you when time will come.

Yes...wine is part of the process...as Francis is also selling wine as an hobby (Music & Wine) and all the bottles he has come strictly from small wine producers all over Italy :cheers:

 

[acalex]

Hey Alex,

congratulations mate. Well done.

Thanks again for sharing this with us, it's been fascinating reading.

Look forward to hearing about your digital experience.

Thanks a lot.

Yes digital will be fun also...plan to listen to a series of DACs first and then compare the best combo (SBT + DAC) to a Linn DS product...we will see. Dealer has already in stock the rega and the M2Tech Young which apparently is great value for the money (furthermore it's an italian brand )

 

[CnoEvil]

We took the beast and connected to the Sonus Faber Guarneri Memento. We put CD on and left the amp warm up for a while before sitting and listening. Source was a Clearaudio Innovation (10k eur TT) and a 3.6l eur cd player. We used the most expensive Lavardin cables as SC and the most expensive clearaudio cables as I/C. Power cable was a thick Primaluna. Unfortunately he sold already Cardas cables.

Something that straight away noticed was an amount of bass which was almost overwhelming on some specific songs...it was like the bass of the drums was too much present and almost covering the voice. It was present on both CDs and vinyls...wasn't too impressed to be honest by the matching.

'...and we plugged the AMS again with Audio Physics Virgo. Bam...everything was so much better...the AMS was able to shine again...so was just a matter of sinergy.

I find this fascinating, and would like to dig into it a little more.

- What size of room was the demo held in, and how much room did the SFs have round them? They are obviously capable of producing prodigious bass for their size, and with the 35i overwhelmed the sound.....so my question is, do you think the problem would have sorted itself out in a bigger room where they had more room to breathe?

- The next query is about the speaker cable. If you used the Lavardin cable, which was designed to bring their own amp "to life", it may have exacerbated the problem. I have heard cables sound lean (Nordost), while others sounding richer (Cardas GC). I recommended the Golden Reference as it is more neutral than the Golden Cross.

- Did the same thing happen when you tried the cheaper Cremonas?

- Did the dealer have any insights as to what was going on, as in theory, it should have been a good match.

The reason for so many questions, is that I have a (very) long term plan to try some Sonus Fabers...maybe when I can have a seperate 2 channel room (ie. after the kids have left home - by which time I'll probably be too deaf to hear the difference).

 

[acalex]

We took the beast and connected to the Sonus Faber Guarneri Memento. We put CD on and left the amp warm up for a while before sitting and listening. Source was a Clearaudio Innovation (10k eur TT) and a 3.6l eur cd player. We used the most expensive Lavardin cables as SC and the most expensive clearaudio cables as I/C. Power cable was a thick Primaluna. Unfortunately he sold already Cardas cables.

Something that straight away noticed was an amount of bass which was almost overwhelming on some specific songs...it was like the bass of the drums was too much present and almost covering the voice. It was present on both CDs and vinyls...wasn't too impressed to be honest by the matching.

'...and we plugged the AMS again with Audio Physics Virgo. Bam...everything was so much better...the AMS was able to shine again...so was just a matter of sinergy.

I find this fascinating, and would like to dig into it a little more.

- What size of room was the demo held in, and how much room did the SFs have round them? They are obviously capable of producing prodigious bass for their size, and with the 35i overwhelmed the sound.....so my question is, do you think the problem would have sorted itself out in a bigger room where they had more room to breathe?

- The next query is about the speaker cable. If you used the Lavardin cable, which was designed to bring their own amp "to life", it may have exacerbated the problem. I have heard cables sound lean (Nordost), while others sounding richer (Cardas GC). I recommended the Golden Reference as it is more neutral than the Golden Cross.

- Did the same thing happen when you tried the cheaper Cremonas?

- Did the dealer have any insights as to what was going on, as in theory, it should have been a good match.

The reason for so many questions, is that I have a (very) long term plan to try some Sonus Fabers...maybe when I can have a seperate 2 channel room (ie. after the kids have left home - by which time I'll probably be too deaf to hear the difference).

Cno, room was around 5x3 and speakers were sitting on the wide side so listening position was around 2/2,5mt from speakers. Dealer confirmed it might also depends on the room. I might dig a bit more if interested.

Speakers had plenty of spaces on the sides and maybe bit less than 1mt behind. These monitors look small but they indeed have an huige sound. It was weird as I said the combination of AMS and SF Guarneri Memento was quite overwhelming on same records.

Cables might have indeed played a role but unfortunately he sold already Cardas cables. I was exoecting same effects at home as my room is quite same size.

Regardimg the Cremona, I never tried the monitors with the AMS. I tried the Cremona floorstanders with the AMS but it was in another shop with different room and acoustic. To be honest we both were not very impressed by the combo as it sounded a bit flat...but it was long time ago and we had little experience. Now I would feel much more confident.

Anyway Roby at 95% will take home an AMS...and when I get my SF we can have a try at his place...!

Btw I am listening now to a beautiful jazz vinyl (Oscar Peterson, We get requests) and the amount of bass with Jadis and RX6 is stunning...I am quite impressed. I guess the great phonostage is playing a big role here also...