Kef LS50 Wireless vs Hegel H360/Kef R700

[Tim2010]

Hello,

How does the KEF LS50 Wirless sounds compared to the Hegel H360/Kef R700 (or similar set ups in the 5000-1000 price range, say Moon, Nad, Arcam,...)?

- is the KEF-app finally getting stable?

- does gapless playback finally works (from KEF app or Bubble)

At the launch I read in hifi-magazines that there would be a cable upgrade-pack for the LS50 Wireless (from Chord). I can't find this at the regular KEF-retailers. Did they cancel this?

Thanks for more info!

I really would love to save some place but without losing the quality of my current setup.

(would use the speakers mainly for streaming from qnap nas - without external streamer hooked up! - and to connect tv in my hobbyroom)

 

[insider9]

BubbleUPnp should work gapless on all devices. It doesn't stream individual files.

Can't comment on the app nor the speakers. Never had interest in wireless version having demoed and wasn't blown away by passives.

One thing I will say is if you have £5k as top budget I'd be astounded if you won't go much, much better.

What's your current setup? How big is the room?

 

[Andrewjvt]

Hello,

How does the KEF LS50 Wirless sounds compared to the Hegel H360/Kef R700 (or similar set ups in the 5000-1000 price range, say Moon, Nad, Arcam,...)?

- is the KEF-app finally getting stable?

- does gapless playback finally works (from KEF app or Bubble)

At the launch I read in hifi-magazines that there would be a cable upgrade-pack for the LS50 Wireless (from Chord). I can't find this at the regular KEF-retailers. Did they cancel this?

Thanks for more info!

I really would love to save some place but without losing the quality of my current setup.

(would use the speakers mainly for streaming from qnap nas - without external streamer hooked up! - and to connect tv in my hobbyroom)

 

 

 

I had the hegl h360 and Kef r700
And I'd just say right now that the Hegel was far better than the kef's
I changed to ATC and the sound from the ATC bookshelf was far better than the Kef r700

 

[davidf]

Hello,

How does the KEF LS50 Wirless sounds compared to the Hegel H360/Kef R700 (or similar set ups in the 5000-1000 price range, say Moon, Nad, Arcam,...)?

Are asking which would sound better? Only you can really answer that after auditioning a few combinations. There will be aspects to the active LS50s that the passive system won’t be able to match, but that doesn’t mean your preference won’t be the deciding factor.

- is the KEF-app finally getting stable?

Yes. The early issue of the app not connecting after booting back up an iPad after it goes to sleep are gone - boot the iPad back up, open up the app, and it’ll connect itself. It doesn’t drop out during use. Anyone with a pair of LS50Ws can feed back to the app team anything they like through the app.

- does gapless playback finally works (from KEF app or Bubble)

Not at the moment, but hen, lots of products still don’t have gapless playback - Hegel and Oppo for example.

At the launch I read in hifi-magazines that there would be a cable upgrade-pack for the LS50 Wireless (from Chord). I can't find this at the regular KEF-retailers. Did they cancel this?

I’m guessing it would be a pack comprising of two mains cables, and either one or two ethernet cables (and possibly cables for the rear inputs), which you’ll be able to buy individually anyway.

I really would love to save some place but without losing the quality of my current setup.

Which is?

 

[Tim2010]

Current setup is Hegel H360 and KEF R700's.

But thinking of exchange with NAD M32 and keep the KEF R700's...

or Kef LS50 Wireless

or NAD M32 with ATC.

No doubt the Hegel sounds powerful and stunning, but not satisfied with the Network-function. Which was te main reason to buy that system. But lack of updates, no gapless, no decent app,...

My 500€ Bluesound Node 2 is more fun to use than the Hegel.

I know many people now are using an 'inferior' Node 2 or Auralic Aries Mini in stead of the Hegel network function.

It just doesn't feel right to me they just ignore all complaints. They promote it as a high end-streamer, but when you have one they say the main priority is not the Network function. So why are they selling it?

Many people have hiccups all the time, strange noises between two tracks,...

My network is 200% ok ... I can play even 4K movies without interruption, and stream hi-res on other devices,...

So the problem is definately Hegel-related.

 

[newlash09]

To me the Hegel h360 has always been an aspirational product. And the ultimate integrated to stop at. So please don't consider passing it on, just because of its poor network app or streaming handicaps.

It is an integrated amp first and foremost, and the inbuilt dac and streaming modules are basic add ons. If you are having streaming hiccups, you will be stunned with the ease of use of a dedicated streamer like the Yamaha wxc-50 or bluesound node or the auralic you mentioned. None of those are inferior in anyway, as you can stream digitally to an external dac of your choice or to the Hegel's internal dac of you like.

So you don't necessarily have to sell the Hegel h360 for such a small issue.

And kef ls50 wireless, will be absolutely no match to a decent speaker pairing with the Hegel. They are two very good products, but absolutely at two different levels.

 

[Pedro]

I'd never spend €5,500 on an amplifier, but if I did I would expect everything to work 100%. And what's the point of having extra features if they don't work properly?

 

[newlash09]

is a pre-amp and Poweramp in one box. Phono stages, DAC's and streaming modules are just add ons. And these three components can be upgraded to better external ones for not too much outlay if you don't mind the box count.

There are certainly amps at that price which do streaming better, but they might not sound as good as the Hegel. So unless there is something missing in the sound, I wouldn't look for a whole new unit, just for the added convenience features.

But that's just me

 

[insider9]

I'd never spend €5,500 on an amplifier, but if I did I would expect everything to work 100%. And what's the point of having extra features if they don't work properly?

From what I understand it's not that the features are not working correctly, just that the OP thought it was something else than it actually is. From reading about Hegel amps and their network connectivity I would never exepct them to come up with a control app. It's Airplay (doesn't need an app) and DLNA after all and not fully fledged streamer. Just Airplay is good enough to use their amps as Roon endpoints. And lots of apps that can utilise DLNA.

If OP expected he was getting a streamer for the money fair enough he will be disappointed. If I liked an amp I would not change it just because of such thing.

 

[davidf]

I'd never spend €5,500 on an amplifier, but if I did I would expect everything to work 100%. And what's the point of having extra features if they don't work properly?

It does work, as I’ve been streaming music for over a week now using the M Connect app, which works just fine. Granted, gapless playback isn’t currently on offer, but as I have already mentioned, there are many products that still don’t offer this, including Oppo (no one is complaining about them). Hegel amplifiers are amplifiers first and foremost, with an onboard DAC allows digital sources to be plugged in and used (and generally improved). They also offer AirPlay for Apple users, and also network streaming for those with music stored locally.

There are a number of streaming apps that can be used for streaming to the Hegel amps, so why would Hegel spend time and money making their own, and also more time and money continuously making sure it’s up to date and works with the latest IOS/Windows etc firmware? This only adds cost to the product. With so many apps out there that do just what I’ve mentioned, why pay a lot more money to take on extra staff to do it yourself? Self produced, bespoke apps are at the mercy of the likes of Apple and Microsoft, who can change the whole architecture of their operating systems at the drop of a hat, and costs a lot of man hours and money to play catch up.

 

[rainsoothe]

With that money, I'd go for a used Naim Nac N272 with Nap200 or 250DR, without question. Or whatever does gapless. Coming from a "hi-fi" company, not having gapless playback seems like a humongous oversight in a streamer.

 

[QuestForThe13thNote]

The kef ls50 wireless is a totally different type of speaker to the r700 with much smaller drivers and it’s impossible to get the soundstage of those kef r700 in a speaker like the ls50with diminutive drivers. That said if you are going for something like the ls50 wireless I’d expect it to be more dynamic sounding than the r700 which are a bit lazy with bass imho compared to some other speakers. There are plenty of others to choose from between these two kefs, of other brands. I’ve never really thought the kef r range is that great in comparitive tests. Great if you want imaging, big soundstage, but not quite as good as the subtleties of some speakers with better dynamic prowess. If you want a great kef, look at the kef ref ones, but out of budget probably, hence I’d look at different brands.

 

[Romulus]

I thought the main thrust of 'Hegel' products (H160, H360, Rost & H90) is that you can connect it to other components and get the best 'possible' sound. If the main quality of most Hegel products is just the preamp and poweramp, then what is the point of Hegels in built DACS and streaming options? In HiFi Choice they praised the Hegel sound, using Cd and external Chord Dac but were dissapointed with the internal DAC - Might as well use the same money for an amp without an internal DAC?

 

[newlash09]

  I thought the main thrust of 'Hegel' products (H160, H360, Rost & H90) is that you can connect it to other components and get the best 'possible' sound.  If the main quality of most Hegel products is just the preamp and poweramp, then what is the point of Hegels in built DACS and streaming options? In HiFi Choice they praised  the Hegel sound, using Cd and external Chord Dac but were dissapointed with the internal DAC - Might as well use the same money for an amp without an internal DAC?  

My first proper amp, I wanted bass management and a inbuilt dac to start with, so I could start using the system straight away. And I enjoyed the system for a few months. Subsequently I've added an external dac when funds permitted. And it is better than the already good enough internal dac of the amp.

When I add a mini DSP , I will not need bass management. And next when I look to upgrade my amp in the future, then I will look for one without any of these added extras. So in my opinion, a pure amp is for someone with an already established audio chain. And these convenience features are for someone starting out like me or looking for a minimal box count

 

[MUSICRAFT]

To me the Hegel h360 has always been an aspirational product.

Hi newlash09

Good amp *smile*

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Naim Nac N272

Hi rainsoothe

Excellent product. Currently got a NAC N 272 with ATI’s AT528NC and Monitor Audio’s Silver 300’s. Works perfectly and a sublime combo *smile*

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Andrewjvt]

  I thought the main thrust of 'Hegel' products (H160, H360, Rost & H90) is that you can connect it to other components and get the best 'possible' sound.  If the main quality of most Hegel products is just the preamp and poweramp, then what is the point of Hegels in built DACS and streaming options? In HiFi Choice they praised  the Hegel sound, using Cd and external Chord Dac but were dissapointed with the internal DAC - Might as well use the same money for an amp without an internal DAC?  

The sound is not the issue which is very good.
I never had the gapless problem.as I used jriver media player.
I used tidal from pc and never really was aware of any gapless problem (but maybe I was not listening for it)

 

[rainsoothe]

I thought the main thrust of 'Hegel' products (H160, H360, Rost & H90) is that you can connect it to other components and get the best 'possible' sound. If the main quality of most Hegel products is just the preamp and poweramp, then what is the point of Hegels in built DACS and streaming options? In HiFi Choice they praised the Hegel sound, using Cd and external Chord Dac but were dissapointed with the internal DAC - Might as well use the same money for an amp without an internal DAC?

The sound is not the issue which is very good. I never had the gapless problem.as I used jriver media player. I used tidal from pc and never really was aware of any gapless problem (but maybe I was not listening for it)

well you're not using the Hegel's streaming bit (does it have one?) as a source, so if it's only the DAC, you won't have the gapless problem. I was refering to the Kefs, btw. It's your PC doing the streaming, so no gapless problem there.