Granite Chopping Boards Under Speaker Stands?

[The_Lhc]

johnnyjazz:ihc, esp and sixth, all valid points you,ve made guys, everyone is searching for that true sound, and at the end of the day we know it just does not exist, but having said that, it might already exist in your own systems but you don,t realise it yet. Why not set yourself a target of listening to the music for 1 month without doing anything to tweak or so called upgrade and see how happy you are.

Don't include me in the group of tweakers, I can't remember the last time I did anything to my setup, other than buy some stands for the speakers. I will need to do something about the huge amounts of resonance the dining room creates though, if we ever move into there. It's not even a subtle effect, you can feel the entire floor vibrating.

 

[6th.replicant]

johnnyjazz, another fair point.

However, when my spiked floorstanders sit on my living-room's carpet/underlay/wooden floorboards/joists, then the bass isn't as tight or deep, mid-range is less detailed and treble seems 'dead' when compared to standing on granite tiles.

However, with granite tiles removed, CD versions of recordings pre-'97 (ie AAD and ADDs, incl non-remastered) do sound less anaemic. Umm..?

 

[Anonymous]

the_lhc:johnnyjazz:ihc, esp and sixth, all valid points you,ve made guys, everyone is searching for that true sound, and at the end of the day we know it just does not exist, but having said that, it might already exist in your own systems but you don,t realise it yet. Why not set yourself a target of listening to the music for 1 month without doing anything to tweak or so called upgrade and see how happy you are. Don't include me in the group of tweakers, I can't remember the last time I did anything to my setup, other than buy some stands for the speakers. I will need to do something about the huge amounts of resonance the dining room creates though, if we ever move into there. It's not even a subtle effect, you can feel the entire floor vibrating. Go to a store that sells laminate flooring, they can sell you the matting that you put down before laying the flooring. Best way to get rid of floorboards vibrating is to take them up, lay 3mm thick hardboard onto the joists but before you nail or screw the hardboard down, soak the hardboard then fix to joists, that way when it dries it doesn,t buckle, then lay the matting onto the hardboard, then screw the floorboards back down making sure they tongue and groove tightly together. If the floorboards are totally knackered and you don,t mind then buy and lay new ones. That should solve the resonance problem, to help you could go underneath and put sheeps wool lagging in between the joists, may take a bit of time and money but the job,s done right and will last for years.

 

[The_Lhc]

Yeah that probably isn't going to happen...

I probably need to point out that currently most of the floor is held up by an RSJ supported by a column of breeze blocks in the cellar.

Tongue and groove? This floor's so old you can see the cellar when the light's on down there!

 

[Anonymous]

6th.replicant:johnnyjazz, another fair point. However, when my spiked floorstanders sit on my living-room's carpet/underlay/wooden floorboards/joists, then the bass isn't as tight or deep, mid-range is less detailed and treble seems 'dead' when compared to standing on granite tiles. However, with granite tiles removed, CD versions of recordings pre-'97 (ie AAD and ADDs, incl non-remastered) do sound less anaemic. Umm..? Sounds as if your flooring is absorbing the natural sound that the speakers are giving out and the tiles are reflecting the natural sound, hmm strange one but if it works for you and you are happy then you have just made an improvement that has not cost much. My spendors sit on top of carpet, underlay and wooden floorboards in a 1950s detached and sound fantastic, maybe different sounds come from the way that different houses are built.

 

[Anonymous]

the_lhc:Yeah that probably isn't going to happen... I probably need to point out that currently most of the floor is held up by an RSJ supported by a column of breeze blocks in the cellar. Tongue and groove? This floor's so old you can see the cellar when the light's on down there! Can,t be that old if breeze has been used in the construction unless it was built as a support later on and that may be your problem if the rest of the house is fine.

 

[The_Lhc]

johnnyjazz:the_lhc:Yeah that probably isn't going to happen... I probably need to point out that currently most of the floor is held up by an RSJ supported by a column of breeze blocks in the cellar. Tongue and groove? This floor's so old you can see the cellar when the light's on down there! Can,t be that old if breeze has been used in the construction unless it was built as a support later on and that may be your problem if the rest of the house is fine.

I don't know when the cellar was constructed but the rest of the house is solid floors, the kitchen and back room is slate, the living room (which is actually the oldest part of the house, by about 400 years) is concrete, presumably laid later!

 

[JamesOK]

johnnyjazz:When you go to a hi-fi convention do they have chopping boards under stands, no, do they have tennis balls under, no, go to your hi-fi shop, do they use them, no, i think that tells you something. Am i the only one who is satisfied enough to just press play ,sit down and listen?

Youre right, they dont. But then they normally have their kit on a concrete solid floor. I however, have to have mine upstairs. Pre chopping boards I would get a rumbling through the floor on low bass. After chopping boards I dont get it. Dont really see what the problem is, for such a noticeable difference (when you need it).

 

[Sizzers]

Well thanks for all the input but wasn't quite looking at re-flooring! lol.

Will wall mount them on to the external wall at the weekend and see what that brings. Didn't really want to go down that route, but it's a cost nothing option so see what happens.

Thanks for all the tips and advice.

 

[WishTree]

I know that this is an old thread but thought it is better to revive than to create a new one.

I have just put a 3cm thick granite (30cm X 30cm) under each of the tannoy DC6T speakers. The flooring is some kind of wood / laminate through out the entire home (It is a duplex).

Now my initial observation is the harshness is gone and so is musicality. The bass feels extremely tight but it looks like there is some kind of disconnect among instruments. I do not know if a small tweak can result in such a big impact but as of now not impressed with Granite slabs under the speakers. Though I love the tightness in bass, I want all the other things as well!!

 

[CnoEvil]

I know that this is an old thread but thought it is better to revive than to create a new one.

I have just put a 3cm thick granite (30cm X 30cm) under each of the tannoy DC6T speakers. The flooring is some kind of wood / laminate through out the entire home (It is a duplex).

Now my initial observation is the harshness is gone and so is musicality. The bass feels extremely tight but it looks like there is some kind of disconnect among instruments. I do not know if a small tweak can result in such a big impact but as of now not impressed with Granite slabs under the speakers. Though I love the tightness in bass, I want all the other things as well!!

I take it the floor is suspended on wooden joists (rather than laid on concrete)......if this is the case, you are helping to isolate them from this, which should tighten up the bass, but that may have changed the balance of them slightly.

Have you left the spikes on?

 

[WishTree]

Thanks Cno for replying. I almost thought there is no one there anymore who are using other ways to improve the performance the system.

May be it is wooden joists.. No idea but all I can see is that it is not a hard wood floor. The Granite slabs are bought from bauhaus (big store for house construction stuff) and they look quite solid.

I was only hoping at best a very minor unobservable change but it feels like it is effecting more than what I thought! I am going to do an A/B at peace tomorrow.

Yes, the spikes are on (even the floor protectors are also there on top of the granite). May be I have changed the toe-in / toe-out differently that before.

Theoretically, this tweak should at best keep the performance at the same level but not spoil it or change drastically .. right?

 

[CnoEvil]

Thanks Cno for replying. I almost thought there is no one there anymore who are using other ways to improve the performance the system.

May be it is wooden joists.. No idea but all I can see is that it is not a hard wood floor. The Granite slabs are bought from bauhaus (big store for house construction stuff) and they look quite solid.

I was only hoping at best a very minor unobservable change but it feels like it is effecting more than what I thought! I am going to do an A/B at peace tomorrow.

Yes, the spikes are on (even the floor protectors are also there on top of the granite). May be I have changed the toe-in / toe-out differently that before.

Theoretically, this tweak should at best keep the performance at the same level but not spoil it or change drastically .. right?

The trouble with tweaks, is that you don't always know what to expect.

With a suspended floor, it is worth experimenting...I ended up with Auralex Grammas over Granite, as I photographed for Ben here (Post No.4):
http://www.whathifi.com/forum/your-system/bens-hifi?page=2

 

[WishTree]

The trouble with tweaks, is that you don't always know what to expect. With a suspended floor, it is worth experimenting...I ended up with Auralex Grammas over Granite, as I photographed for Ben here (Post No.4): http://www.whathifi.com/forum/your-system/bens-hifi?page=2

First thing is first.. WOW!

You managed to get some pics Well, I hope you do not mind if I give the credit to Ben

Your granite base plate is more of an assembly than just plopping a Granite plate under the speaker :? Now I need to improvise it.

I have a feeling that my ears need to get used to the new sound that I am hearing. In next few days or so I should be able to comment more realistic.

Since we are on this topic, I just wanted to ask you something. There is a particular frequency band in the lower bass region, which when played, feel like is getting transmitted to the coffee table / couch etc. It does not feel like a big reverbation but more like when a tram goes by the sound gets transmitted into your body kind of feel.. though it is really minute, I guess there is no harm in asking!

 

[CnoEvil]

Since we are on this topic, I just wanted to ask you something. There is a particular frequency band in the lower bass region, which when played, feel like is getting transmitted to the coffee table / couch etc. It does not feel like a big reverbation but more like when a tram goes by the sound gets transmitted into your body kind of feel.. though it is really minute, I guess there is no harm in asking!

You can ask anything you like, though I won't always guarantee to know the answer.

Is it better or worse with the Granite in place?

Is it on Bass heavy music and only with the volume turned up?

It also could be down to the room acoustics and/or the suspended wooden floor.

I get something similar, but only with the volume turned up.....the Refs can generate serious bass when pushed.

 

[WishTree]

It is a lot better with Granite in place and is not the deepest of bass but something a little lighter. It is not there at the lower vloumes to average but it is there with higher volumes.

 

[CnoEvil]

It is a lot better with Granite in place and is not the deepest of bass but something a little lighter. It is not there at the lower vloumes to average but it is there with higher volumes.

In that case, there's a good chance it's related to how well the speakers are isolated from the suspended floor. It's obviously a frequency that agitates certain parts of the room.

One of the best solutions are from this crowd, but it's very expensive:
http://www.trackaudio.co.uk/floor/floor.html

and: http://www.townshendaudio.com/hi-fi-vibration-isolation/stella-stand

 

[CJSF]

Interesting reading . . . I had . . . :? ? Still have the answer to these problems8) . Back to the 80's, but no one listened and/or would not pay the price, a pair of stands that cost as much as the speaker???? I have two pairs of my 'Foundation stands' left that we built to my original specification . . . they are 'gold dust'.

I have even offered to 'consult' with a modern manufacturer . . . no one wants to know.

CJSF

 

[WishTree]

It is a lot better with Granite in place and is not the deepest of bass but something a little lighter. It is not there at the lower vloumes to average but it is there with higher volumes.

In that case, there's a good chance it's related to how well the speakers are isolated from the suspended floor. It's obviously a frequency that agitates certain parts of the room. One of the best solutions are from this crowd, but it's very expensive: http://www.trackaudio.co.uk/floor/floor.html and: http://www.townshendaudio.com/hi-fi-vibration-isolation/stella-stand

Removed the granite plinths to check it out but now it feels alot nicer well defined with plinths. Plinths will stay on and may be better solution in future!!

 

[CnoEvil]

Removed the granite plinths to check it out but now it feels alot nicer well defined with plinths. Plinths will stay on and may be better solution in future!!

If the Granite was cheap (and returnable), try doubling them up under each speaker, and maybe experiment with something rubbery and sound absorbent sandwiched between the two slabs.

Something like this:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SORBOTHANE-ISOLATION-SHEET-300mm-x-200mm-X-3mm-/290708572951?pt=UK_AudioVideoElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_HiFiSpeakers&hash=item43af94cb17#ht_3959wt_1265

 

[WishTree]

Removed the granite plinths to check it out but now it feels alot nicer well defined with plinths. Plinths will stay on and may be better solution in future!!

If the Granite was cheap (and returnable), try doubling them up under each speaker, and maybe experiment with something rubbery and sound absorbent sandwiched between the two slabs. Something like this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SORBOTHANE-ISOLATION-SHEET-300mm-x-200mm-X-3mm-/290708572951?pt=UK_AudioVideoElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_HiFiSpeakers&hash=item43af94cb17#ht_3959wt_1265

Thanks Cno. Yeah.. the granite plinths are pretty cheap (5 pounds per pair 30cm X 30cm X 3cm). I will get another pair and put a sound absorbing thing from the link that you posted.

It is quite interesting to see how small (money wise and other wise) tweaks make such an impact! I had to struggle very hard to see the difference in the Exotic cables to my current ones but with the granite slabs, it is so easy that my wife identified the improvement instantly!

When I stand and talk from the corner where the the right speaker is, it feels as if I am talking into an empty room. I guess there is a lot of reverberation happening there. I am so tempted with the bass traps now though I am not too sure whether a bass trap behind the speaker is an ideal solution for this situation.

 

[CnoEvil]

It is quite interesting to see how small (money wise and other wise) tweaks make such an impact! I had to struggle very hard to see the difference in the Exotic cables to my current ones but with the granite slabs, it is so easy that my wife identified the improvement instantly!

When I stand and talk from the corner where the the right speaker is, it feels as if I am talking into an empty room. I guess there is a lot of reverberation happening there. I am so tempted with the bass traps now though I am not too sure whether a bass trap behind the speaker is an ideal solution for this situation.

Proper isolation should go a good way towards sorting out the sound. If you google "Sheet of Sorbothane for sale UK", you may come up with something at a better price.....worth keeping an eye on ebay.

I think I read somewhere that a tall potted plant behind the speaker could help...but don't take that as gospel. If you have one, it could be worth trying.

Always remember - you don't have to be nuts to be an audiophile, but it definitely helps.

 

[WishTree]

I think I read somewhere that a tall potted plant behind the speaker could help...but don't take that as gospel. If you have one, it could be worth trying.

Always remember - you don't have to be nuts to be an audiophile, but it definitely helps.

Now, i know why I am posting all my queries. You have perfect solution / direction !

We have so many plants all around and there is one right next to each speaker. I will move them into corner and see how it works out

 

[CnoEvil]

Now, i know why I am posting all my queries. You have perfect solution / direction !

We have so many plants all around and there is one right next to each speaker. I will move them into corner and see how it works out

If nothing else, your wife will think you're as odd as mine believes me to be.....although she will end up thanking me if it saves her from Bass Traps!

 

[WishTree]

If nothing else, your wife will think you're as odd as mine believes me to be.....although she will end up thanking me if it saves her from Bass Traps!

Curious me, just did move few plants around! Feels a little tighter sound but it is too late in the night (for neighbours) to check it up properly but my feeling is - this works!

Yeah.. Luckily she is little bit into the hobby especially when she is up for listening / testing but not so keen on reading or working out for the tweaks!