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Calling David @ Frank Harvey

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davedotco

New member
Apr 24, 2013
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manicm said:
davedotco said:
Snikoes said:
Hi David,

I noticed in a different thread that you recommended it was good practice to connect single wired speaker cables to the top terminals of biwirable speakers.

Would this be your recommendation for all speakers? I ask as I was about to change mine but noticed KEF specify the bottom connections in my R500 manual.

Is it safe to use either? Does it make much difference to the performance?

(Your recommendation was to a blade owner I believe)
Is the kind of thing those in the hi-fi trade say to enthusiasts in order to appear knowledgeable and to impress them.

Do you seriously think it is going to make a real difference, really...*ROFL*
You're being unnecessarily combative here, whether it's right or wrong it doesn't really matter, FYI my old 685 manual did suggest connecting single wire to the HF section, while my dealer suggested playing around with connecting across left to LF and right to HF. You're right doesn't probably make a difference but doesn't excuse aggression.
It's bullsh!t, just the hi-fi industry's ridiculous attempts to impress the punters with arcane 'knowledge'.

It's the sort of thing that leads to all sorts of ridiculous 'foo' and should be called out whenever it is put forward, particularly so when made by people in the business who really should know better.

BTW. Combative is good, if I stray into the realms of personel insults, then call me on it.

I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
 

Frank Harvey

Well-known member
Jun 27, 2008
567
0
18,890
davedotco said:
I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
So what is nonsense about me recommending the HF terminals as something I do out of habit? Most of this thread has been nonsense.

The way I see it, you did have a go at me, because I am here as "me", and I'd be saying the same thing if I wasn't working where I am. And regardless of any attacks by yourself.
 

lpv

New member
Mar 14, 2013
47
0
0
David@FrankHarvey said:
davedotco said:
I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
So what is nonsense about me recommending the HF terminals as something I do out of habit? Most of this thread has been nonsense.

The way I see it, you did have a go at me, because I am here as "me", and I'd be saying the same thing if I wasn't working where I am. And regardless of any attacks by yourself.
just behave and don't spread bullsh!t.. but then it's hard not to as part of the hifi business is based on bullsh!t and popular beliefs and you as a part of that business, you simply follow.. you're not here as a private individual but as a dealer as your nick name suggest.. if you want to share your private opinion then open another account.. but it also might be that your private opinion is exactly the same as your business/ dealer side of you and therefore...
 

gel

Moderator
lpv said:
David@FrankHarvey said:
davedotco said:
I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
So what is nonsense about me recommending the HF terminals as something I do out of habit? Most of this thread has been nonsense.

The way I see it, you did have a go at me, because I am here as "me", and I'd be saying the same thing if I wasn't working where I am. And regardless of any attacks by yourself.
just behave and don't spread bullsh!t.. but then it's hard not to as part of the hifi business is based on bullsh!t and popular beliefs and you as a part of that business, you simply follow.. you're not here as a private individual but as a dealer as your nick name suggest.. if you want to share your private opinion then open another account.. but it also might be that your private opinion is exactly the same as your business/ dealer side of you and therefore...
Dont tell him what to do, he is free to do what he likes.
 

Frank Harvey

Well-known member
Jun 27, 2008
567
0
18,890
lpv said:
just behave and don't spread bullsh!t..
Excuse me.

but then it's hard not to as part of the hifi business is based on bullsh!t and popular beliefs and you as a part of that business, you simply follow.. you're not here as a private individual but as a dealer as your nick name suggest..
I'm not following anything. I am here as a representative of the company I work for (because I have to be to comply with the rules), but what I post is what I would post regardless. If I had a different view as a dealer and as an individual, then one of those views would be fake, and influenced by the business.

if you want to share your private opinion then open another account..
Not allowed.

but it also might be that your private opinion is exactly the same as your business/ dealer side of you and therefore...
Which it is. I've said many times before that if I wasn't working where I am, I'd still be posting here and posting exactly the same as I currently do. The business I work for in no way influences what I post.
 

bigboss

Moderator
Both davedotco and lpv need to stop this non sense now. You don't know David at all. He actually recommended me to buy a subwoofer he doesn't sell, when he could've easily recommended one of the subs he sells (I was buying my AV kit from him, so this would've been a guaranteed sale).
 

RobinKidderminster

New member
May 27, 2009
582
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Agreed BB. PS how's the Jag? I have found no difference with connecting my speakers in my room with my system but I spent no money and little time to experiment and David s comment was clearly an opinion expressed by invitation so deserves no rude or argumentative response. Grow up!
 

bigboss

Moderator
RobinKidderminster said:
Agreed BB. PS how's the Jag?
I cancelled the order, because they gave me a 6-month lead time for delivery. Jag dealership called me yesterday and I said I'm willing to wait for a good offer if they have. They will get back to me with their best offers.
 

RobinKidderminster

New member
May 27, 2009
582
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bigboss said:
RobinKidderminster said:
Agreed BB. PS how's the Jag?
I cancelled the order, because they gave me a 6-month lead time for delivery. Jag dealership called me yesterday and I said I'm willing to wait for a good offer if they have. They will get back to me with their best offers.
Blame the EU. Surprised 6-months - maybe they are selling a few - my dealer 'says' he is busy daily taking orders. Yea wrong thread I know! Keep us informed - a pleasant change from silly knockin' threads. :)
 

davedotco

New member
Apr 24, 2013
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David@FrankHarvey said:
davedotco said:
I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
So what is nonsense about me recommending the HF terminals as something I do out of habit? Most of this thread has been nonsense.

The way I see it, you did have a go at me, because I am here as "me", and I'd be saying the same thing if I wasn't working where I am. And regardless of any attacks by yourself.
Apologies if you think I was being too personal, I mean that, I don't know you and didn't mean that, That said you clearly identify yourself as a dealer, in that respect I consider you 'fair game'.

What I was attacking was the seemingly overwhelming 'need' of everyone in the trade to be seen to possess a fount of 'arcane' knowledge with which to impress the ordinary punter.

I know about this for the simple reason that, when working, I used to do it all the time, in fact I was really pretty good at it, full of 'it in fact. To be honest, it was only when I 'retired' (about 12 years ago) and became a civilian that I started to realise how much this went on. Being asked on ocasion (as an 'expert' of course...*dirol*) to help out non expert friends buying a setup, I was astonished at the sheer guff and nonsense that was handed out as 'advice' to the unwary, appalling really.
 

Al ears

Moderator
davedotco said:
David@FrankHarvey said:
davedotco said:
I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
So what is nonsense about me recommending the HF terminals as something I do out of habit? Most of this thread has been nonsense.

The way I see it, you did have a go at me, because I am here as "me", and I'd be saying the same thing if I wasn't working where I am. And regardless of any attacks by yourself.
Apologies if you think I was being too personal, I mean that, I don't know you and didn't mean that, That said you clearly identify yourself as a dealer, in that respect I consider you 'fair game'.

What I was attacking was the seemingly overwhelming 'need' of everyone in the trade to be seen to possess a fount of 'arcane' knowledge with which to impress the ordinary punter.

I know about this for the simple reason that, when working, I used to do it all the time, in fact I was really pretty good at it, full of 'it in fact. To be honest, it was only when I 'retired' (about 12 years ago) and became a civilian that I started to realise how much this went on. Being asked on ocasion (as an 'expert' of course...*dirol*) to help out non expert friends buying a setup, I was astonished at the sheer guff and nonsense that was handed out as 'advice' to the unwary, appalling really.
I quite understand your feelings but, ultimately, it is this 'guff and nonsense' that keeps the industry ticking over. Why do you think Russ Andrews is still in business? ;-)

Everyone is entitled to their opinions on this forum, whether they are heeded or not is down to a person's own gullibility.
 

davedotco

New member
Apr 24, 2013
20
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0
Al ears said:
davedotco said:
David@FrankHarvey said:
davedotco said:
I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
So what is nonsense about me recommending the HF terminals as something I do out of habit? Most of this thread has been nonsense.

The way I see it, you did have a go at me, because I am here as "me", and I'd be saying the same thing if I wasn't working where I am. And regardless of any attacks by yourself.
Apologies if you think I was being too personal, I mean that, I don't know you and didn't mean that, That said you clearly identify yourself as a dealer, in that respect I consider you 'fair game'.

What I was attacking was the seemingly overwhelming 'need' of everyone in the trade to be seen to possess a fount of 'arcane' knowledge with which to impress the ordinary punter.

I know about this for the simple reason that, when working, I used to do it all the time, in fact I was really pretty good at it, full of 'it in fact. To be honest, it was only when I 'retired' (about 12 years ago) and became a civilian that I started to realise how much this went on. Being asked on ocasion (as an 'expert' of course...*dirol*) to help out non expert friends buying a setup, I was astonished at the sheer guff and nonsense that was handed out as 'advice' to the unwary, appalling really.
I quite understand your feelings but, ultimately, it is this 'guff and nonsense' that keeps the industry ticking over. Why do you think Russ Andrews is still in business? ;-)

Everyone is entitled to their opinions on this forum, whether they are heeded or not is down to a person's own gullibility.
Ahhh, Russ Andrews....?

I used to know him quite well back in the day, when he still had his shop. He was actually pretty good fun believe it or not.

It would have been around the time of cable 'directionality' and similar stuff, a little before Peter Belt took the p!ss so magnificently.

Seriously though, opinions are one thing when they come from individuals, but, I think, rather different when they come from a dealer, which, at the end of the day, is my point.
 

Frank Harvey

Well-known member
Jun 27, 2008
567
0
18,890
davedotco said:
Seriously though, opinions are one thing when they come from individuals, but, I think, rather different when they come from a dealer, which, at the end of the day, is my point.
Sorry, but I'm not altering my own personal views or recommendations in order to fit into your self appointed criteria for a hi-fi dealer.
 

chebby

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2008
1,232
4
19,195
davedotco said:
It would have been around the time of cable 'directionality' and similar stuff, a little before Peter Belt took the p!ss so magnificently.
Peter Belt just had mental health problems. You had to go to the Barbican to find someone who'd give him credibility in the magazines and eventually turn the madness into an industry!
 

manicm

Well-known member
May 1, 2008
603
70
18,970
davedotco said:
manicm said:
davedotco said:
Snikoes said:
Hi David,

I noticed in a different thread that you recommended it was good practice to connect single wired speaker cables to the top terminals of biwirable speakers.

Would this be your recommendation for all speakers? I ask as I was about to change mine but noticed KEF specify the bottom connections in my R500 manual.

Is it safe to use either? Does it make much difference to the performance?

(Your recommendation was to a blade owner I believe)
Is the kind of thing those in the hi-fi trade say to enthusiasts in order to appear knowledgeable and to impress them.

Do you seriously think it is going to make a real difference, really...*ROFL*
You're being unnecessarily combative here, whether it's right or wrong it doesn't really matter, FYI my old 685 manual did suggest connecting single wire to the HF section, while my dealer suggested playing around with connecting across left to LF and right to HF. You're right doesn't probably make a difference but doesn't excuse aggression.
It's bullsh!t, just the hi-fi industry's ridiculous attempts to impress the punters with arcane 'knowledge'.

It's the sort of thing that leads to all sorts of ridiculous 'foo' and should be called out whenever it is put forward, particularly so when made by people in the business who really should know better.

BTW. Combative is good, if I stray into the realms of personel insults, then call me on it.

I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
I think you're having a bad weekend DDC, your response just proves my case. My dealer 7 years ago did not volunteer that info, he gave me a 2 minute response to a question I asked, and he said 'TRY', he did not categorically state it would improve things. You need to calm down.
 

Al ears

Moderator
manicm said:
davedotco said:
manicm said:
davedotco said:
Snikoes said:
Hi David,

I noticed in a different thread that you recommended it was good practice to connect single wired speaker cables to the top terminals of biwirable speakers.

Would this be your recommendation for all speakers? I ask as I was about to change mine but noticed KEF specify the bottom connections in my R500 manual.

Is it safe to use either? Does it make much difference to the performance?

(Your recommendation was to a blade owner I believe)
Is the kind of thing those in the hi-fi trade say to enthusiasts in order to appear knowledgeable and to impress them.

Do you seriously think it is going to make a real difference, really...*ROFL*
You're being unnecessarily combative here, whether it's right or wrong it doesn't really matter, FYI my old 685 manual did suggest connecting single wire to the HF section, while my dealer suggested playing around with connecting across left to LF and right to HF. You're right doesn't probably make a difference but doesn't excuse aggression.
It's bullsh!t, just the hi-fi industry's ridiculous attempts to impress the punters with arcane 'knowledge'.

It's the sort of thing that leads to all sorts of ridiculous 'foo' and should be called out whenever it is put forward, particularly so when made by people in the business who really should know better.

BTW. Combative is good, if I stray into the realms of personel insults, then call me on it.

I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
I think you're having a bad weekend DDC, your response just proves my case. My dealer 7 years ago did not volunteer that info, he gave me a 2 minute response to a question I asked, and he said 'TRY', he did not categorically state it would improve things. You need to calm down.
Let them carry on. I think this dealer versus ex-dealer is entertaining. ;-)
 

davedotco

New member
Apr 24, 2013
20
0
0
manicm said:
davedotco said:
manicm said:
davedotco said:
Snikoes said:
Hi David,

I noticed in a different thread that you recommended it was good practice to connect single wired speaker cables to the top terminals of biwirable speakers.

Would this be your recommendation for all speakers? I ask as I was about to change mine but noticed KEF specify the bottom connections in my R500 manual.

Is it safe to use either? Does it make much difference to the performance?

(Your recommendation was to a blade owner I believe)
Is the kind of thing those in the hi-fi trade say to enthusiasts in order to appear knowledgeable and to impress them.

Do you seriously think it is going to make a real difference, really...*ROFL*
You're being unnecessarily combative here, whether it's right or wrong it doesn't really matter, FYI my old 685 manual did suggest connecting single wire to the HF section, while my dealer suggested playing around with connecting across left to LF and right to HF. You're right doesn't probably make a difference but doesn't excuse aggression.
It's bullsh!t, just the hi-fi industry's ridiculous attempts to impress the punters with arcane 'knowledge'.

It's the sort of thing that leads to all sorts of ridiculous 'foo' and should be called out whenever it is put forward, particularly so when made by people in the business who really should know better.

BTW. Combative is good, if I stray into the realms of personel insults, then call me on it.

I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
I think you're having a bad weekend DDC, your response just proves my case. My dealer 7 years ago did not volunteer that info, he gave me a 2 minute response to a question I asked, and he said 'TRY', he did not categorically state it would improve things. You need to calm down.
Thank you.

Dealers are of course totally variable, some are undoubtably excellent, others not, this is just the way it is.

The 'we are the experts' attitude is fairly commonplace though, I didn't really realise how pervasive it was until I quit and, as described above, visited a few dealers as a 'civilian'.

Please note that in this instance I am talking about 'opinion' being given as if from 'on high', some punters actually believe this stuff.

As for the instance of dealers giving advice that is simply factually incorrect, that is another story and one deserving of its own thread.
 

davedotco

New member
Apr 24, 2013
20
0
0
Al ears said:
manicm said:
davedotco said:
manicm said:
davedotco said:
Snikoes said:
Hi David,

I noticed in a different thread that you recommended it was good practice to connect single wired speaker cables to the top terminals of biwirable speakers.

Would this be your recommendation for all speakers? I ask as I was about to change mine but noticed KEF specify the bottom connections in my R500 manual.

Is it safe to use either? Does it make much difference to the performance?

(Your recommendation was to a blade owner I believe)
Is the kind of thing those in the hi-fi trade say to enthusiasts in order to appear knowledgeable and to impress them.

Do you seriously think it is going to make a real difference, really...*ROFL*
You're being unnecessarily combative here, whether it's right or wrong it doesn't really matter, FYI my old 685 manual did suggest connecting single wire to the HF section, while my dealer suggested playing around with connecting across left to LF and right to HF. You're right doesn't probably make a difference but doesn't excuse aggression.
It's bullsh!t, just the hi-fi industry's ridiculous attempts to impress the punters with arcane 'knowledge'.

It's the sort of thing that leads to all sorts of ridiculous 'foo' and should be called out whenever it is put forward, particularly so when made by people in the business who really should know better.

BTW. Combative is good, if I stray into the realms of personel insults, then call me on it.

I had a bit of a go at David, not as a person but as a dealer for spreading this nonsense.
I think you're having a bad weekend DDC, your response just proves my case. My dealer 7 years ago did not volunteer that info, he gave me a 2 minute response to a question I asked, and he said 'TRY', he did not categorically state it would improve things. You need to calm down.
Let them carry on. I think this dealer versus ex-dealer is entertaining. ;-)
Hope you are enjoying it. Some people seem to forget that part of the enjoyment of hi-fi and a forum like this is the fun factor, hi-fi nerds can be so bl**dy serious.

Do you recall the story I told about 'charging' our clients if they wanted to play particularly 'cheesey' records during their dems, 'Brothers in Arms' being the most expensive?
 

spiny norman

New member
Jan 14, 2009
293
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0
davedotco said:
chebby said:
Peter Belt just had mental health problems. You had to go to the Barbican to find someone who'd give him credibility in the magazines and eventually turn the madness into an industry!
As indeed did our resident of the Barbican. I had the pleasure of dinner with 'our resident' 3 or 4 years ago and he was very well and in good form.
I think this thread has definitely overstepped the mark when it starts talking about people having mental health problems. Unless, of course, corroborative evidence is available to be presented. Until then it just becomes distasteful 'he's a nutter' comments.
 

Snikoes

New member
Jun 11, 2016
10
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0
Prince wrote a song called 'Joy In Repetition'. He obviously hadn't read any of DDC's forum posts!
 

davedotco

New member
Apr 24, 2013
20
0
0
spiny norman said:
davedotco said:
chebby said:
Peter Belt just had mental health problems. You had to go to the Barbican to find someone who'd give him credibility in the magazines and eventually turn the madness into an industry!
As indeed did our resident of the Barbican. I had the pleasure of dinner with 'our resident' 3 or 4 years ago and he was very well and in good form.
I think this thread has definitely overstepped the mark when it starts talking about people having mental health problems. Unless, of course, corroborative evidence is available to be presented. Until then it just becomes distasteful 'he's a nutter' comments.
I had no idea Peter Belt was actually ill. He appeared totally in control when he was ripping a living of the industry. Sad to hear that.

As to the other post, I shall delete mine, it is inappriate.
 

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