The biggest problem frequency for me is around 55hz. Theres a 10db difference between left and middle seat with just the arendal sub on.
Moving sofa not an option, sub placement doesnt really help at all. Would an antimode do anything for me? If so what would it accomplish?
I dont think ill be able to use REW for quite a while unfortunately. Would sound absorption or bass traps do anything?
With the other frequencies a few db doesnt hurt but a whole 10db at 55hz is a big deal. And i want to know all my options.
Moving sofa not an option, sub placement doesnt really help at all. Would an antimode do anything for me? If so what would it accomplish?
I dont think ill be able to use REW for quite a while unfortunately. Would sound absorption or bass traps do anything?
With the other frequencies a few db doesnt hurt but a whole 10db at 55hz is a big deal. And i want to know all my options.
Seems pointless having dual subs for my room at the moment unless i can smooth out the response and fix the 55hz seat peak.
I thought the way to fix nulls was dual subs. Not working very well!!
I thought the way to fix nulls was dual subs. Not working very well!!
Nugget that won't be the only big null you have if it is then you are bloody lucky.
If you install REW and use the REW sim feature you can put your room dimensions in and speaker and sub placement and it will give you about 90% accurate your freq response
It also highlights what mode is causing what freq null and peak - either longitude axial or trigental- think that's correct names doesn't matter.
You can use REW sim to learn about your rooms acoustics in terms of freq. It requires no measuring it just uses clever maths to work out the results as bass in a room is predictable.
To fix nulls is not easy.
You can either use treatment but 50hz is deep for acoustic treatment and will require a comprehensive approach which you won't do.
The other way is multi subs placed correctly and skill in setup.
However you need to measure properly to do this.
Or you live with it
There is No Easy Solution
If you install REW and use the REW sim feature you can put your room dimensions in and speaker and sub placement and it will give you about 90% accurate your freq response
It also highlights what mode is causing what freq null and peak - either longitude axial or trigental- think that's correct names doesn't matter.
You can use REW sim to learn about your rooms acoustics in terms of freq. It requires no measuring it just uses clever maths to work out the results as bass in a room is predictable.
To fix nulls is not easy.
You can either use treatment but 50hz is deep for acoustic treatment and will require a comprehensive approach which you won't do.
The other way is multi subs placed correctly and skill in setup.
However you need to measure properly to do this.
Or you live with it
There is No Easy Solution
FYI
I am tackling a similar problem at the minute. I know it's the longitudinal waves that are causing big peaks and nulls for me.
I already have a lot of treatment in the room. I have ordered 6 GIK soffit traps they are being shipped on Monday hopefully I will get them Tuesday.
I know I need absorption on the front and rear wall as I have used REW sim to check and it can fix my problems.
However the reality of putting in enough absorption to fully fix the problem is a different story but it will be interesting to see how much improvement I can get. Bearing in mind I have about 20 acoustics panels in my room already but I didn't concentrate on specific problems when I put it together.
Room treatments doesn't just fix nulls it drastically improves the rooms decay time for a tighter crisper more accurate sound to the original direct sound from the speaker it also removes flutter echo and comb filtering which harm sound imaging and freq response higher up.
There are some geeky but excellent videos on real traps Web page. They completely fix a room about yours size in the ultimate mixing and mastering room video. Buy as I said before the solution is very comprehensive but very effective
I am tackling a similar problem at the minute. I know it's the longitudinal waves that are causing big peaks and nulls for me.
I already have a lot of treatment in the room. I have ordered 6 GIK soffit traps they are being shipped on Monday hopefully I will get them Tuesday.
I know I need absorption on the front and rear wall as I have used REW sim to check and it can fix my problems.
However the reality of putting in enough absorption to fully fix the problem is a different story but it will be interesting to see how much improvement I can get. Bearing in mind I have about 20 acoustics panels in my room already but I didn't concentrate on specific problems when I put it together.
Room treatments doesn't just fix nulls it drastically improves the rooms decay time for a tighter crisper more accurate sound to the original direct sound from the speaker it also removes flutter echo and comb filtering which harm sound imaging and freq response higher up.
There are some geeky but excellent videos on real traps Web page. They completely fix a room about yours size in the ultimate mixing and mastering room video. Buy as I said before the solution is very comprehensive but very effective
used room sim and there was no option of me getting better 55hz response. although they dont give option to include alcoves, so it thinks my room is perfect rectangle when in fact it is not quite.
tried subs everywhere possible not much difference and none for the better at my problem frequency
however if room is sealed box is ticked the response is way better at 20-40hz, is that possible? my door is currently wide open and broken so cant close. should be fixed in 1-2 months
clever how room dimensions not exact but they still know i get a big dip at 55..
tried subs everywhere possible not much difference and none for the better at my problem frequency
however if room is sealed box is ticked the response is way better at 20-40hz, is that possible? my door is currently wide open and broken so cant close. should be fixed in 1-2 months
clever how room dimensions not exact but they still know i get a big dip at 55..
That's because it's predictable based on room dimension and it pretty much bang on. Have confidence in it.
The reason you can't fix it is because it's to do with the length of the room most probably.
Now try increasing the absorption option on both the front and back wall and watch that null dissappear.
Then also add 2 3 and 4 if necessary subs.
Move them around front and back corners etc.
Invert one or 2 etc and watch the impact it has on the bass response.
It's huge. Very interesting lesson to learn from that software. You can see why I always harp on about it
The reason you can't fix it is because it's to do with the length of the room most probably.
Now try increasing the absorption option on both the front and back wall and watch that null dissappear.
Then also add 2 3 and 4 if necessary subs.
Move them around front and back corners etc.
Invert one or 2 etc and watch the impact it has on the bass response.
It's huge. Very interesting lesson to learn from that software. You can see why I always harp on about it
ellisdj said:
I tried 3 and 4 subs. I'll see if i can find the option to add absorption. What does inverting do?
Ive moved my front right sub to back right. See if it has any real world difference also.
If dual subs doesnt do any difference for my room. I wont get dual sub 1s i dont think. Dont need more max output as i never will reach the max output of even one sub 1
Is it a possibility that my left seat isnt actually much of a null but my middle and right seats are just getting peaks in the room?
I measured again before i was to turn the other sub on with its new position but these are the results i got playing at -20db
20hz 53db
25hz 56db
30hz 53db
35hz 56db
40hz 62db
45hz 66db
50hz 68db
55hz 68db
60hz 61.5db
What to make of these measurements?
I measured again before i was to turn the other sub on with its new position but these are the results i got playing at -20db
20hz 53db
25hz 56db
30hz 53db
35hz 56db
40hz 62db
45hz 66db
50hz 68db
55hz 68db
60hz 61.5db
What to make of these measurements?
Regarding impressions which the thread was made originally made for:
It is miles better than my previous sub in every way.
Goes lower and plays way louder at 30hz and below has better mid and upper bass and just sounds fantastic.
Had a listening session today and it made me try music i haven't listened to in months or years and i enjoyed it so much it was like listening to it for the first time.
Doesn't sound like it is giving up either as my dali did in some songs and not a boomy mess like that dali was too. Well worth the £800 pricetag and the gloss black finish makes it the best looking part of my system by far.
Just a shame i couldnt afford the subwoofer 2!
It is miles better than my previous sub in every way.
Goes lower and plays way louder at 30hz and below has better mid and upper bass and just sounds fantastic.
Had a listening session today and it made me try music i haven't listened to in months or years and i enjoyed it so much it was like listening to it for the first time.
Doesn't sound like it is giving up either as my dali did in some songs and not a boomy mess like that dali was too. Well worth the £800 pricetag and the gloss black finish makes it the best looking part of my system by far.
Just a shame i couldnt afford the subwoofer 2!
If my seating area isnt the null like i previously mentioned but others make certain frequencies peak then an antimode would possibly help get my frequency response more in line in my seat as i have a rise above 50hz?
£300 seems a bit expensive just for essentially an extra bit of EQ though.
£300 seems a bit expensive just for essentially an extra bit of EQ though.
bigboss
Moderator
bigboss
Moderator
You cant go exactly by those numbers as the spl metre your using wont be accurate and will require a calibration file to correct for its inaccusracy. All mics needs this generally.nugget2014 said:
However its not bad in terms of consistency by those numbers but again its reducing the lower it goes, ideally it should be increasing.
ellisdj said:
But my sub has a rolloff at lower frequencies. Around 8db at 20hz so it is expected to not be as loud as say 40 or 50hz.
Would having a sealed room help the lower frequencies like i mentioned before? Rew said it would on room sim.
It wont be sealed mate just by shutting the door - it would have to be pressure sealed and you have no way of doing that
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