Speaker audition and suggestions for Cyrus 8 xpd..

[pgoody]

Good evening!

I am thinking of replacing my B&W 685's. I am currently running them with a Cyrus 8 XPD (with PSX - R) and a Squeezebox touch as the source. I am from Germany wich makes finding the right british speaker a bit difficult. ATC, Spendor and ProAc are not very easy to get and even if I found a dealer (witch of course I would eventually - my wife hates the looks of these )

So I called my local hifi guy who does not stock Cyrus and asked him for a few recomendations. We decided I'd pack up my amp and source and bring them with me. The speakers we decided on listening to where B&W cm 9 (since he just sold his last pair of cm8), Neat Motive 1 and the Naim Ovator S-400 (more of an experiment than a real possibility)

So when I arrived he had the Ovator running in on a Supernait and I built up my Cyrus and we connected the speakers. To the defense of the Cyrus it was cold. I know from home that it needs to run a couple of hours before it really starts sounding good. But I think it just did not controll the Ovators very well. Female voices where very sharp and everything was very laid back. We then switched to the Supernait to compare. This sounded better but it was not the sound I was after. So on to the next speaker.

We connected the Motive 1 and after 5 seconds we both noticed that this was a better match. Mutch more controll over all ranges. A more forward presentation with a lot of drive witch suits the Cyrus very well. AMAZING bass for such a diminutive speaker and very detailad treble. The soundstage was very nice and the stereo imaging (at the beginning of Pink Floyds "Welcome to the machine) made us both grin and turn up the volume. It was just fun to listen to music with this combination with may let me overlook the mid range with is not the most detailed.

We then connected the B&W CM9. This sounden good. But somehow a little boring. Mids were very good. Listened to a few Dave Matthews tracks and the voices are very realistic and detailed but the presentation somehow did not really excite me.

So the winner in this short group test was the Motive 1 wich brings me to the questions I have for you all, dear forum members.

Is the lack of excitement with the CM9 due to not enough amplifier power (the 8xpd has 70 WPC)? Would the CM 8 sound better with the Cyrus 8 XPD?

I noticed with the Motive 1 that my volume controll had to be turned up very high (the Motive's have a sensibility of 86 db...). Is the Motive 1 a good choice for the 8 XPD? Should I rather bi-amp with another 8 or X power?

My dealer did not have the Motive 2 SE or Motive 2 there, unfortunately. I read in a lot of reviews that the Motive 2 sounds better than the 1. Is the EMIT tweeter on the Motive 2 SE better?

My room is approximately 25 sqm.

And one last question. Has anyone heard the AUDIUM Comp 5? It is built in Berlin and looks like a very interesting speaker.

Are there any other Speakers I should try? Music is mixed from Classical over Jazz to Rock.

Sorry for any mistakes (I am german..) and for the rather long text.

Any suggestions are welcome!

 

[pgoody]

EDIT

cm 8) should have meant cm 8 ...

 

[bluebrazil]

dynaudio focus or excite range speakers or any vienna acoustics speakers are both good with cyrus. i know from experience 86db speakers make the cyrus intergrateds run hot and in your fairly large room i think your gonna need something more sensitve or add an x power, (forget bi-amping, one x power is twice the amp anyways), for difficult loads. out of the three you mentioned i cant see how anybody could find the spendors ugly.

 

[matthewpiano]

I'll second the Vienna Acoustics suggestion. These sound gorgeous with Cyrus amplification and should be on your audition list. In fact I'd say this is one of the best combinations I've ever heard.

 

[plastic penguin]

Heard a lot of good things about Vienna Acoustics, although I've not had the pleasure.

Another vote Dynaudio speakers. Also Epos should be a good combo, along with PMC i series.

 

[pgoody]

Thank you for your replies! I found a dealer who stocks both the dynaudios and the viennas. i will try to audition the focus 260 against the beethoven baby grands (and maybe the 160 against mozart). The dynaudios have 87 db. So might still need to upgrade on the amp side...

Would the new PMC twenty series be another option?

 

[plastic penguin]

Thank you for your replies! I found a dealer who stocks both the dynaudios and the viennas. i will try to audition the focus 260 against the beethoven baby grands (and maybe the 160 against mozart). The dynaudios have 87 db. So might still need to upgrade on the amp side...

Would the new PMC twenty series be another option?

Not heard the new Twenty, but guess the i series may have better synergy.

 

[ngibbs]

Vienna Acoustics Baby Grands (see sig.)! Superb speakers and very sensitive (and revealing) so perfect for Cyrus. A wonderful combination!

 

[philipjohnwright]

I've heard Cyrus and Vienna together at shows and they pulled me back into the room the sound was that good. Overall a slightly warmer sound, with great bass; certainly more so than the PMC's that I personally found quite cool. But that's personal taste; I use Harbeths myself so thatells you where my preferences are (don't even think about Harbeths if aesthetics are important!).

 

[ngibbs]

Previous threads on the same subject, which helped me make up my mind:

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/what-speakers-for-cyrus

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/speakers-for-cyrus-system-2

And I'm delighted with the results!

 

[pgoody]

Looks like I really have to audition the Baby Grands. Just looked at the spec sheet. 91 db and 4 Ohms looks like they'll work well with the 8 xpd. But at 3600 € I will have to save up at least a couple of months longer..

So thank you all for your input. I'm very excited about auditioning the viennas against the dynaudios!

 

[philipjohnwright]

Don't rule out the Mozart Grands - next one down in the range from the Beethoven. Bass doesn't go as low, but that may mean they are easier to accomodate in your room (or may not be, I don't know your room!)

When I heard the Beethovens they were being driven by Cyrus' top of the range Mono blocks, which might also suggest the Mozarts as a better match. Although to contradict myself I'm a great believer in spending budget on the speakers, as they make the most difference in my experience (experience, not opinion. Of B&W 802's vs 803's as one example - I bought the 802's with less amplification rather than the other way round, as the differences were not subtle))

 

[ngibbs]

They come up on Ebay from time to time, though make sure you check age, condition etc. . I bought mine on Ebay quite recently and had quite a few conversations on the phone with the owner to check where he got them, how long he'd had them and what kind of person he was (which would hopefully give an indication of how he'd treated his speakers......). As I said before, I'm absolutely delighted with the results. The hype is justified: they really are that good. I now have to make excuses for my (admittedly difficult to power, and anyway much cheaper) ATC SCM11s, along the lines of 'Well...they're not Vienna Acoustics, are they'. And being so sensitive, they're so easy to power; I find an 8 power does just fine (though I've left an X-Power on for the sake of the ATCs).

 

[pgoody]

I will definately listen to both. And of cours to the Dynaudios. All depending on what the dealer has in stock of course. The thing is I cannot really buy for my room at the moment because I will have to move next year and it looks like the living room will be bigger. I don't have plans for a dedicated music room (yet ). So I might go with the bigger version. But if the Mozart sounds better with the Cyrus we will have to see. Maybe I'll still go for the Baby Grand and buy two mono's later on... We will see... First I'll have to audition.

 

[pgoody]

Ebay in Germany is very bad for audio equipment. Don't know why but hifi and high end audio are not as popular here as in Britain... Very sad.

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Hi pgoody

I think you should also try and audition ATC's SCM40 monitors, Monitor Audio's GX200's and Proac's D18's.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[pgoody]

Thanks Rick, but as I mentioned in the first post my wife really could not live with the ATC's or the ProAc's.. The Monitor Audios GX200's where always high on my audition list (and they look good wich will please the OH..) so I will try them!

Thank you all again for your advice. I will report back but it may take a while because my schedule is quite full in the next couple of wheeks!

 

[Thompsonuxb]

Cyrus stuff is always (over)rated very highly by WHF, like Rokson and every year they claim this years models sounds "so much better than last years", never fails to raise a smile with me - its almost criminal.

The Cyrus amp you have is seriously under powered for the speaker price range your looking at - 1000english pounds+ or so. Seriously you'd be better off going further down the speaker range, around the 500 english price range.

even WHF recommended the CD6 SE2 & Cyrus 6A amp (40W) be paired with a pair of KEF300's in last months issue

450english pounds - try the Tannoy DC4 or the signiture as an audition. go with high sensitivity into 8ohms probably 100w speakers.

 

[Frank Harvey]

There are loudspeakers above the £1,000 mark that the 8XPd will drive quite happily.

 

[pgoody]

@ Thompsonuxb: There seem to be quite a few forum members who are very happy with "low powered" cyrus amps with expensive high sensitivy speakers and I am certainly not looking at pairing my amp with less capable speakers. I would rather buy a speaker that may be a little too hard to drive for my amp and then upgrade it by adding a power amp or, if need be, the entire amp.

@ David: Thanks for defending the 8 xpd!

 

[Thompsonuxb]

Sorry, not knocking the amp....

I actually auditioned the 8xpd amp earlier this year (1200english pounds) along with the Rotel 1520 (60w) which I bought and which I am now trying to sell due to its inability to drive my speakers - it sounded more full bodied than the 8xpd in the demo on a pair of epos12i - I think.

like I said if you have not made your purchase yet it may be worth testing it with easier and less demanding speakers than you'd get the higher up the price range you go......

 

[Crossie]

Thomsonuxb - I take it from your comments that you have heard the Cyrus amps with the speakers you say they won't drive?

 

[Thompsonuxb]

Thomsonuxb - I take it from your comments that you have heard the Cyrus amps with the speakers you say they won't drive?

Crossie - I'm looking at your sig - I'm not knocking Cyrus honest...... :beer:

 

[pgoody]

@ Crossie: 4x Mono X: NICE

@ Thompsonuxb: I do not know what the price of a speaker has to do with how easy it is to drive.. 4 ohms and 91 db sound quite easy to drive for a 70 wpc cyrus 8 xpd. Of course its the synergy of both witch is most important, but readig the comments on this thread and others cyrus and vienna should match..

 

[Thompsonuxb]

equat price with the quality of the components used in construction. The better the components the more revealing a speaker should be. So an amp driving the more exotic speaker will be exposed in terms of the signal its amplifying. Less of a problem the lower down the price range you go.

what I found in my recent quest in search of better amplification is that these new 700poundish amps is they lack 'power' or the ability to provide a full frequencie range i.e highs and lows whilst seperating the bits inbetween.

When I read a review and hear talk of 'lean bass' 'exiciteable treble' and this new one 'synergy' etc its an indication of an amp failing to control/shift the cones properly.WHICH is why I personally think 5.1 recievers are superior to many two channel amps being lauded. PSU's capable of handling 100watts x 5 and drive a sub can deliver better sound when ran as 2channel amps.(I=VR and all that)

thats not to say 2channel amps are rubbish its just that in isolation many of us will be happy with the sound we get from our set up even speaker placement is not a consideration for most of us. Which in fairness does not stop one from enjoying ones music.

put it this way what is the real difference between the yamaha AS500 and the Cyrus 8xpd, set up correctly both could sound fantastic and in any given blind test opinions would probably differ with regard wich sounds better, but its when the speakers become more revealing you will hear what these amps are really capbable of a 70watt amp will still be a 70watt amp is all I'm saying.

Funnily best speaker I ever heard in a demo was in my local Richer sound, a pair of Eltax liberty 5 from a while back on the end of an Arcam A65 amp. 100watt, 200 pound speakers (when turned up & biwired the arcam started clipping/cutting out).