Ortofon tour
- Thread starter nopiano
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Gray
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Cyrus were doing similar around Audio T branches. Good for all concerned, nice for those punters with a few quid to spare.
Al ears
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Have updated Part 1 as I couldn't remember the speaker model. These are they:-
https://www.dynaudio.com/home-audio/contour/contour-30
Very elegant and a bit taller than my ATCs, but weigh about the same c. 35kg.
https://www.dynaudio.com/home-audio/contour/contour-30
Very elegant and a bit taller than my ATCs, but weigh about the same c. 35kg.
To make a start - it seems big task to cover all 7 in one gulp! - here is the methodology and the first two cartridges.
The scheme was to hear two different tracks on each cartridge. The exception was the very first, but the idea is to hear the track you just heard but this time on the next cartridge, followed by a new track that you'd hear on the following cartridge, and so on. So there was continuity between all seven.
The system was a Project 10 Signature turntable with a unipivot arm and removable head shell. There were seven cartridges all lined up in their own head shell ready to go! Moon pre and power amps. Dynaudio Contour 30 floorstanders. Phono stage was a Project 'reference' they said, but the nearest I found on their website is the RS - about £699.
First up was the 2M Red, now £95. The track was a Bryan Adams unplugged song, just him and his guitar. Sounded pretty decent, but a little "cupped hands" coloration. Especially voice and ambience/ acoustic sounded a bit shouty. Quite smooth though, if lacking a real 'live' feel.
Second was the Blue. We were reminded this is a stylus upgrade for the Red as well as a model in its own right. The same stylus as the Red, but not glued to the cantilever. So less mass I guess? The Bryan Adams song was more vibrant, better sense of the acoustic setting. Clearer voice too. Not massive but a worthwhile upgrade. Complete cartridge costs £185, a lot more than I remembered, but all have gone up recently.
The next track on the Blue was by The Doors. Not one I knew, nor quite my taste, but quite good rhythm apparent. No obvious surface noise on either so far, though these weren't necessarily all spanking new LPs.
In Part 2, two Quintet MC models.
The scheme was to hear two different tracks on each cartridge. The exception was the very first, but the idea is to hear the track you just heard but this time on the next cartridge, followed by a new track that you'd hear on the following cartridge, and so on. So there was continuity between all seven.
The system was a Project 10 Signature turntable with a unipivot arm and removable head shell. There were seven cartridges all lined up in their own head shell ready to go! Moon pre and power amps. Dynaudio Contour 30 floorstanders. Phono stage was a Project 'reference' they said, but the nearest I found on their website is the RS - about £699.
First up was the 2M Red, now £95. The track was a Bryan Adams unplugged song, just him and his guitar. Sounded pretty decent, but a little "cupped hands" coloration. Especially voice and ambience/ acoustic sounded a bit shouty. Quite smooth though, if lacking a real 'live' feel.
Second was the Blue. We were reminded this is a stylus upgrade for the Red as well as a model in its own right. The same stylus as the Red, but not glued to the cantilever. So less mass I guess? The Bryan Adams song was more vibrant, better sense of the acoustic setting. Clearer voice too. Not massive but a worthwhile upgrade. Complete cartridge costs £185, a lot more than I remembered, but all have gone up recently.
The next track on the Blue was by The Doors. Not one I knew, nor quite my taste, but quite good rhythm apparent. No obvious surface noise on either so far, though these weren't necessarily all spanking new LPs.
In Part 2, two Quintet MC models.
Great write up NP. Was going to try and get along to one of these, but unlike the sales team they rarely release us from the dungeon here in the Service Department.
;-) ;-)
;-) ;-)
For a significantly greater outlay, the Cadenza MC series is a taste of 'hi-end'. We began with the Bronze (£1499) at almost three times the price of the Quintet Bronze. It's both heavier and higher output than the previous model, so a bit of adjustment is duly made.
Same track, from the Vienna night club. Much clearer percussion this time, vocal noticeably more expressive and altogether a more engaging performance. Still not the finest recording, maybe, being a little close rather than trading on the venue's ambience. But I wasn't there, so what do I know?!
Next up and unannounced, but rather magical, a track from London Grammar. I've heard some their output, but don't own any albums. I gather this was from side two, possibly their first album, so lesser played. Beautiful and ethereal. I felt totally drawn into the music. For the first time today it was simply music playing, where the equipment seemed immaterial.
Next up was the Cadenza Black, the top of this range, for £1825. The first we'd heard with the famous Shibata stylus profile, said to most closely match the cutting head. On the same London Grammar track the music stood in greater relief, more three-dimensional. I'd felt the previous Cadenza Bronze had moved the game on substantially. But here the music seemed free of any of the normal constraints of being replayed, with an unimpeded freedom even at climaxes and great clarity during the subtlest passage. A bit like hearing a master tape I suppose.
Incidentally, the records were almost miraculously free of any extraneous clicks - it turns out they had been cleaned on a decent machine, but were otherwise regular pressings. The second album on the Black was the immortal track Take Five, from a Dave Brubeck, and not a 180 gram remaster either. It has rarely sounded so fresh yet not overblown. I think the volume was about spot on for me. Really excellent!
In Part 4, the MC Windfield.
Same track, from the Vienna night club. Much clearer percussion this time, vocal noticeably more expressive and altogether a more engaging performance. Still not the finest recording, maybe, being a little close rather than trading on the venue's ambience. But I wasn't there, so what do I know?!
Next up and unannounced, but rather magical, a track from London Grammar. I've heard some their output, but don't own any albums. I gather this was from side two, possibly their first album, so lesser played. Beautiful and ethereal. I felt totally drawn into the music. For the first time today it was simply music playing, where the equipment seemed immaterial.
Next up was the Cadenza Black, the top of this range, for £1825. The first we'd heard with the famous Shibata stylus profile, said to most closely match the cutting head. On the same London Grammar track the music stood in greater relief, more three-dimensional. I'd felt the previous Cadenza Bronze had moved the game on substantially. But here the music seemed free of any of the normal constraints of being replayed, with an unimpeded freedom even at climaxes and great clarity during the subtlest passage. A bit like hearing a master tape I suppose.
Incidentally, the records were almost miraculously free of any extraneous clicks - it turns out they had been cleaned on a decent machine, but were otherwise regular pressings. The second album on the Black was the immortal track Take Five, from a Dave Brubeck, and not a 180 gram remaster either. It has rarely sounded so fresh yet not overblown. I think the volume was about spot on for me. Really excellent!
In Part 4, the MC Windfield.
Thanks! I don't suppose you have access to the LP 'playlists', so the folks here can try the same tracks?brownz said:
OK, so here is the climax of two hours listening. It is clearly at item of which Ortofon are very proud. It is named after their ex-Chief Engineer. And it costs a cool £3,100.
Now the transformer required makes more sense. This has half the output of the Cadenza Bronze we heard a few tracks ago!
Following the established pattern, we first hear the track we just enjoyed from the Cadenza Black. It does need a fair twist of the volume knob but Take Five has never sounded better (and I heard it not so long ago on an excellent VPI turntable). It pretty much gave very little indication of its age, as a recording But most of all, it didn't really sound like a record at all! That's about the highest compliment I can pay, I think.
To explain that last remark a bit further, though I've not heard much high end vinyl recently, even past glories like Koetsu pickups on Oracle decks never sounded this neutral. Exciting, rich, alluring, yes - all that and more. But not super accurate, just very enjoyable. This, however, was master tape clear and even-handed. Very impressive.
For the second track, we returned to The Doors for Riders on the Storm. This one really rocked, and again scarcely sounded of its age. In some ways I might have chosen something more recent, but it was pretty spectacular and the thunderstorm very realistic.
Offering the audience a chance to hear another genre, someone pointed to the LP propped against the wall - Orff 'Carmina Burana', the EMI recording by Andre Previn. (I have the original release) It apparently had been payed in the morning session but had a fault. Anyway, we had a blast of Side 2, and I'd happily have heard more. Then, at owner, Simon's suggestion, we had The Chain from Fleetwood Mac. And yes, that favourite bit that is played so often sounded pristine yet full of impact.
A fascinating session, and so revealing to hear seven different cartridges through a very good system. Thanks to Ortofon and Ceritech Audio of Cinderford in the Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire.
Now the transformer required makes more sense. This has half the output of the Cadenza Bronze we heard a few tracks ago!
Following the established pattern, we first hear the track we just enjoyed from the Cadenza Black. It does need a fair twist of the volume knob but Take Five has never sounded better (and I heard it not so long ago on an excellent VPI turntable). It pretty much gave very little indication of its age, as a recording But most of all, it didn't really sound like a record at all! That's about the highest compliment I can pay, I think.
To explain that last remark a bit further, though I've not heard much high end vinyl recently, even past glories like Koetsu pickups on Oracle decks never sounded this neutral. Exciting, rich, alluring, yes - all that and more. But not super accurate, just very enjoyable. This, however, was master tape clear and even-handed. Very impressive.
For the second track, we returned to The Doors for Riders on the Storm. This one really rocked, and again scarcely sounded of its age. In some ways I might have chosen something more recent, but it was pretty spectacular and the thunderstorm very realistic.
Offering the audience a chance to hear another genre, someone pointed to the LP propped against the wall - Orff 'Carmina Burana', the EMI recording by Andre Previn. (I have the original release) It apparently had been payed in the morning session but had a fault. Anyway, we had a blast of Side 2, and I'd happily have heard more. Then, at owner, Simon's suggestion, we had The Chain from Fleetwood Mac. And yes, that favourite bit that is played so often sounded pristine yet full of impact.
A fascinating session, and so revealing to hear seven different cartridges through a very good system. Thanks to Ortofon and Ceritech Audio of Cinderford in the Forest of Dean, Gloucestershire.
Al ears
Well-known member
nopiano said:
Excellent write up as always. Wish there were more of these demos to actually get to, and wish I had £3000 to spare
nopiano said:
I'll do some digging with the sales team and see what we can find out.
Bear with me as they're still on tour !
Hi NP, track details from the tour are :
2M Blue:
Ryan Adams. My Wrecking Ball from Ten Songs from Live at Carnegie Hall.
The Doors. Hyacinth House from La Woman. Double 45 LP (EKS-75011 Stereo)
Quintet Blue:
The Doors. Hyacinth House from La Woman. Double 45 LP (EKS-75011 Stereo)
Nils Frahm. Hammers from Spaces. (Erased Tapes Label, ERATP055LP)
Quintet Black:
Nils Frahm. Hammers from Spaces. (Erased Tapes Label, ERATP055LP)
The Billy Rubin Trio ft Lady S. Passenger from The Stereo Project. (more info here)
Cadenza Bronze:
The Billy Rubin Trio ft Lady S. Passenger from The Stereo Project. (more info here)
The Dave Brubeck Quartet. Take 5 from Take 5. (VNL12206LP)
Cadenza Black:
The Dave Brubeck Quartet. Take 5 from Take 5. (VNL12206LP)
London Grammar. If You Wait from If You Wait.
MC Windfeld:
London Grammar. If You Wait from If You Wait.
2M Blue:
Ryan Adams. My Wrecking Ball from Ten Songs from Live at Carnegie Hall.
The Doors. Hyacinth House from La Woman. Double 45 LP (EKS-75011 Stereo)
Quintet Blue:
The Doors. Hyacinth House from La Woman. Double 45 LP (EKS-75011 Stereo)
Nils Frahm. Hammers from Spaces. (Erased Tapes Label, ERATP055LP)
Quintet Black:
Nils Frahm. Hammers from Spaces. (Erased Tapes Label, ERATP055LP)
The Billy Rubin Trio ft Lady S. Passenger from The Stereo Project. (more info here)
Cadenza Bronze:
The Billy Rubin Trio ft Lady S. Passenger from The Stereo Project. (more info here)
The Dave Brubeck Quartet. Take 5 from Take 5. (VNL12206LP)
Cadenza Black:
The Dave Brubeck Quartet. Take 5 from Take 5. (VNL12206LP)
London Grammar. If You Wait from If You Wait.
MC Windfeld:
London Grammar. If You Wait from If You Wait.
Wow, thanks very much Brownz! I think the Take 5 is one that Ceritech often use for other dems as well, because it's a reference for so many people.brownz said:
BTW I heard the Windfield again on Saturday in Oxford, with the whole of the remastered Sgt Pepper. It was awesome! They used a Unison Research tube phono stage as well as the transformer, then an Audio Research preamp into ATC SCM100 actives!
So, moving to MC cartridges, the guy doing all the demos connected a Step-up transformer for the next demonstration (an ST-7, I think, costing £450). This fed into the Project phono preamp. He explained there are MC preamps and other ways, but they wanted to show it this way. It also meant no changes to the system would be needed for the remaining 5 cartridges.
First MC was the Quintet Blue, £349, on the Doors LP from before. Some adjustments to arm and volume were necessary, but if anything this was played slightly quieter than before. A more live sound, definitely, and better detail. Not as dramatic as I'd perhaps anticipated, but they said the colour models - red, blue, bronze and black - all have a corresponding tonality. The Reds are the mellowest. The Blacks are the most detailed.
A big change of style next, to a Nils Frahm track of several piano and keyboard types, overdubbed. Interesting but not easy to compare with a 'straight' piano. Atmospheric though, if a bit diffuse
Switching to the Quintet Bronze, costing £515, was a big improvement. On reflection I wondered if the Blue had been a bit in need of a stylus clean! This was sounding more realistic now.
Next LP was a ten inch record made in Vienna. Apparently at a Project factory tour for dealers, the boss took everyone to a club with a jazz quartet (actually a trio plus a guest!), which was recorded live. They later acquired the record. A nice strong recording, but in particular I felt the brushed cymbals sounded quite dull and distant. Voice was quite present, but definitely not a stunning live sound as I'd anticipated.
In Part 3, we move up a level to the Cadenza range!
First MC was the Quintet Blue, £349, on the Doors LP from before. Some adjustments to arm and volume were necessary, but if anything this was played slightly quieter than before. A more live sound, definitely, and better detail. Not as dramatic as I'd perhaps anticipated, but they said the colour models - red, blue, bronze and black - all have a corresponding tonality. The Reds are the mellowest. The Blacks are the most detailed.
A big change of style next, to a Nils Frahm track of several piano and keyboard types, overdubbed. Interesting but not easy to compare with a 'straight' piano. Atmospheric though, if a bit diffuse
Switching to the Quintet Bronze, costing £515, was a big improvement. On reflection I wondered if the Blue had been a bit in need of a stylus clean! This was sounding more realistic now.
Next LP was a ten inch record made in Vienna. Apparently at a Project factory tour for dealers, the boss took everyone to a club with a jazz quartet (actually a trio plus a guest!), which was recorded live. They later acquired the record. A nice strong recording, but in particular I felt the brushed cymbals sounded quite dull and distant. Voice was quite present, but definitely not a stunning live sound as I'd anticipated.
In Part 3, we move up a level to the Cadenza range!
No Probs. Sounds like a killer combo. I love the engineering that goes into high end carts, fascinating stuff.
Al ears
Well-known member
nopiano said:
That much for a step-up transformer and I would vcertainly expect it to sound good. If you tot up the total price of that 'front end' setup it's going to be a lottery-win purchase for most people.. ;-)
Aproximately £8300 I guess, in the great scheme of things hi-end analogue, I guess this isn't that mad..
Al ears
Well-known member
I think I might have identified the wrong transformer in the audition of the seven cartridges. I thought it must be a Project model, but having seen a similar set up again last weekend, for the Windfield cartridge, I think it was almost certainly the Ortofon transformer.
More here, and note the €1650 price tag. No wonder it sounded so good!
https://www.ortofon.com/st-80-se-mc-transformer-p-434-n-3447
More here, and note the €1650 price tag. No wonder it sounded so good!
https://www.ortofon.com/st-80-se-mc-transformer-p-434-n-3447
Yes, that's the weird thing. On the one hand it costs as much as a decent system - about the same as the list price of my cd, amp and speakers, with cables. On the other, less than half the price of a top of the range Linn LP12. Actually, I think Ceritech had that too, so maybe I should have asked for a comparison!Al ears said:
Al ears
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Al ears
Well-known member
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