Neutral sounding speaker cable

[rainsoothe]

Hi op. Use your ears for the cables, not the nay-sayers. I use DNM Reson speaker cable, with great results, in Naim + Spendor setup (ex-Naim + Focal). Actually, I think solid core copper cables will be able to cure your problem. Also, the DNM has specs very similar to Naim's own Naca5, but to me the DNM sounds more refined and smooth.

@TrevC - I'm willing to bet I can pick a similarly powered level matched Naim setup from a Marantz setup any time of the day. Also a DNM Reson or Audioquest Type 4 from a QED XT40 any system. Better yet, an old Naim amp can pick a high capacitance cable on its own, and signal the discovery with smoke.

 

[Tzutzu]

Solid core pure silver.

 

[lindsayt]

He's not alone. So far not a single audiophile has passed a blind test of anything, including amplifiers.

That's not true and you know it's not true.

Which I find ironic in a thread where you posted a Pinocchio image.

The very well conducted Flatpopely pfm blind Naim amplifier test from about 3 years ago was passed by a number of audiophiles. It's a test that's been mentioned a few times on this forum.

 

[TrevC]

He's not alone. So far not a single audiophile has passed a blind test of anything, including amplifiers.

That's not true and you know it's not true.

Which I find ironic in a thread where you posted a Pinocchio image.

The very well conducted Flatpopely pfm blind Naim amplifier test from about 3 years ago was passed by a number of audiophiles. It's a test that's been mentioned a few times on this forum.

OK, then post a link to it.

 

[chebby]

He's not alone. So far not a single audiophile has passed a blind test of anything, including amplifiers.

That's not true and you know it's not true.

Which I find ironic in a thread where you posted a Pinocchio image.

The very well conducted Flatpopely pfm blind Naim amplifier test from about 3 years ago was passed by a number of audiophiles. It's a test that's been mentioned a few times on this forum.

OK, then post a link to it.

This possibly?

http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/showthread.php?t=141835

TrevC, I am just the bloke who Googled it and I neither support nor oppose any/all findings of said test nor have any opinion on it because I haven't (and will probably never) read it.

Thanks

 

[Infiniteloop]

Sorry that you have been trapped by the internet bulls_it. I hope you will find some "believers" that will lie to you for making you spend a lot of money on something wrong. They will be judged by Jesus for their sins after their death anyway.

My advice : run away from anybody hearing... .. cable.

You could just as easily be judged for dictating what you believe and chastising people who don't agree with you.

Isn't it better to allow people to judge for themselves by listening?

 

[Infiniteloop]

I look for advice on a neutral sounding speaker cable for a Naim/PMC combo -- a speaker cable that doesn't push the treble "over the cliff". Or shall I actually look for a "warm" speaker cable for a slightly sweeter treble? We mainly listen to classical music, including opera -- and some arias can push the treble pretty hard (e.g. the Queen of the Night in Mozart's Magic Flute).

Cheers!!

Yes. I can recommend to you a really nice detailed cable - Atlas Hyper 2.0 or 3.0.

+1

 

[rainsoothe]

Sorry that you have been trapped by the internet bulls_it. I hope you will find some "believers" that will lie to you for making you spend a lot of money on something wrong. They will be judged by Jesus for their sins after their death anyway.

My advice : run away from anybody hearing... .. cable.

You could just as easily be judged for dictating what you believe and chastising people who don't agree with you.

Isn't it better to allow people to judge for themselves by listening?

+1. The irony always eludes these guys. But, then again, some of them admitedly never even bothered to listen to the stuff in question to begin with.

 

[Native_bon]

I like that they think that am a Hifi nut... *music2* Cables don't you just love em! *dance4* I can pick my old crystal 24cables from my TQ Blacks anyday. Yes in a Blind test. Any one willing to challenge me on their mortgage.? *dirol*

 

[abacus]

I like that they think that am a Hifi nut... *music2* Cables don't you just love em! *dance4* I can pick my old crystal 24cables from my TQ Blacks anyday. Yes in a Blind test. Any one willing to challenge me on their mortgage.? *dirol*

Could you post the full documentation on your test conditions, and the full documented outcome of the test, so that others can re-create it, thus allowing confirmation by others that your results are correct and repeatable, and not a one off.

If it can be repeated by others using verifiable scientific test conditions (This is the reason every part of the test has to be documented), then it will allow others to perform tests to find out what part of the cable is making a difference. (This will also be a landmark, as no cable manufacture has yet been able to provide any verifiable evidence that their cables do make a difference)

Look forward to the forthcoming documentation, which hopefully will be taken up so that this can finally be sorted.

Bill

 

[Native_bon]

I like that they think that am a Hifi nut... *music2* Cables don't you just love em! *dance4* I can pick my old crystal 24cables from my TQ Blacks anyday. Yes in a Blind test. Any one willing to challenge me on their mortgage.? *dirol*

Could you post the full documentation on your test conditions, and the full documented outcome of the test, so that others can re-create it, thus allowing confirmation by others that your results are correct and repeatable, and not a one off.

If it can be repeated by others using verifiable scientific test conditions (This is the reason every part of the test has to be documented), then it will allow others to perform tests to find out what part of the cable is making a difference. (This will also be a landmark, as no cable manufacture has yet been able to provide any verifiable evidence that their cables do make a difference)

Look forward to the forthcoming documentation, which hopefully will be taken up so that this can finally be sorted.

Bill

People are saying all cables sound the same, but I'm simply saying got friends to change the cables & play a particular track & I can tell each time which cables is in use. Lead out the room blind folded each time before the cable change happens. Its that simple. Volume set to 50 on my Av amp. If you want a challenge I'm up for it. Am placing a bet here. Lets get things a little more interesting.

 

[steve_1979]

If it's so easy to hear a difference between cables how come none of you guys have collected your $1,000,000 prize money from James Randi yet? *unknw*

 

[andyjm]

People are saying all cables sound the same, but I'm simply saying got friends to change the cables & play a particular track & I can tell each time which cables is in use. Lead out the room blind folded each time before the cable change happens. Its that simple. Volume set to 50 on my Av amp. If you want a challenge I'm up for it. Am placing a bet here. Lets get things a little more interesting.

Of course cables sound different. Try replacing that 10m long 4mm sq cable with bell flex - it will certainly sound different.

What will not sound different are two well made cables of approximately the same cross sectional area and construction. This is where the foo comes in that drives anyone with a technical background up the wall. A 50p per metre 2.5mmsq cable will sound exactly the same as a 2.5mmsq cable that has had a fortune in advertising spent on it and has a very implausible name - why would it sound any different?

 

[gasolin]

There can be a difference between cables no matter what people think

I often hear a difference in the highs

LIke audioquest flx slip 14/1 and supra ply 3.4

audioquest is more sounding and can be at times to much in the highes

supra more neutral and a less intrusive analytic top as audioquest,but lack the clarity of audioquest

Often i don't noticed a difference in the bass, 2 similar cable same thickness, price and if it just look like a oem,standard cable used in many budget speaker,cheap hifi systems, the difference might not be noticeable, even when one cable is made by a company supra/audioquest and the other cable is a no name brand

 

[andyjm]

There can be a difference between cables no matter what people think

I often hear a difference in the highs

LIke audioquest flx slip 14/1 and supra ply 3.4

audioquest is more sounding and can be at times to much in the highes

supra more neutral and a less intrusive analytic top as audioquest,but lack the clarity of audioquest

Often i don't noticed a difference in the bass, 2 similar cable same thickness, price and if it just look like a oem,standard cable used in many budget speaker,cheap hifi systems, the difference might not be noticeable, even when one cable is made by a company supra/audioquest and the other cable is a no name brand

Supra is 3.4mm sq cross sectional area, and has a screened construction.

The Audioquest flx slip 14/2 (assume 14/1 was a typo) is twisted pair, unscreened, 2mm sq cross sectional area.

Completely different construction, and different thickness. Off the top of my head, I would say the Supra has lower resistance but higher capacitance than the Audioquest.

Probably not audible in short lengths, but the difference between the cables in thickness and construction is quite marked, so for longer runs it is quite possible that they could sound slightly different.

 

[TrevC]

I like that they think that am a Hifi nut... *music2* Cables don't you just love em! *dance4* I can pick my old crystal 24cables from my TQ Blacks anyday. Yes in a Blind test. Any one willing to challenge me on their mortgage.? *dirol*

You said you had tried the cables I linked to, which clearly wasn't true. Those Russ jobbies are of the pointless woven high capacitance make unstable or blow your amp up variety. Do you know what is in them? Unless you do you might as well compare the Telluriums to bell wire. The wire I linked to was nothing like bell wire.

 

[Native_bon]

I like that they think that am a Hifi nut... *music2* Cables don't you just love em! *dance4* I can pick my old crystal 24cables from my TQ Blacks anyday. Yes in a Blind test. Any one willing to challenge me on their mortgage.? *dirol*

You said you had tried the cables I linked to, which clearly wasn't true. Those Russ jobbies are of the pointless woven high capacitance make unstable or blow your amp up variety. Do you know what is in them? Unless you do you might as well compare the Telluriums to bell wire. The wire I linked to was nothing like bell wire.

Yes I did. I tried them on my main front speakers & did not like them. Currently got them on my surround L/R speakers.. *good* Now my question to you, have you tried the TQ Black speaker cables?...

Edit: Again, all things being equal all cables should sound the same. Cables react differently in different systems. Length of cables, thickness of cable, material used to shield cable, to plugs, to resistance may alter how a cable sounds in a particular system.

Challenge for the prize money may not be that straightforward. Are some cables ridiculously priced?... Yes of course. Do we have snake oil cables in sale? yes of course.

 

[TrevC]

have you tried the TQ Black speaker cables?...

Of course not, I'm not an idiot. Whatever is in them can't, and therefore won't, be beaten by standard copper, which is probably all they are made of anyway. Electronics isn't voodoo.

 

[Fulci]

Van Damme, Mogami, Klotz or Sommercable.

 

[Gaz37]

The best advice I ever read regarding cables was to go to a retailer and ask the salesperson to recommend cables.
Then ask for a "blind" demo BUT ask if you can swap the cables and see if the salesperson can hear the difference when he/she doesn't know which cable is which.
For some reason not many retailers will allow this.

 

[Native_bon]

 have you tried the TQ Black speaker cables?...

Of course not, I'm not an idiot. Whatever is in them can't, and therefore won't, be beaten by standard copper, which is probably all they are made of anyway. Electronics isn't voodoo.

I use to sound just like you. But I respect your take on things.

 

[rainsoothe]

have you tried the TQ Black speaker cables?...

Of course not, I'm not an idiot. Whatever is in them can't, and therefore won't, be beaten by standard copper, which is probably all they are made of anyway. Electronics isn't voodoo.

Q.E.D. Never tried it, even though it's free and harmless, but dismisses it based on (questionably assimilated?) theory. Much like the EM drive thruster, which in theory (until some point in time, where a new theory will emerge probably) doesn't work.

Ironically, if it isn't voodoo, people shouldn't be affraid to test it. Let alone voodoo non-believers. But alas...

 

[Nathan]

Personally I think speaker cables do make a difference but the rules of diminishing returns definitely applies. I have tried a fair few over the years from the naff ones you'd get with cheap midi systems to those that cost £50 a metre (Audioquest type4 on loan, not bought as I'm not a total twit). I could certainly tell the difference between very cheap ones and decent ones costing a few quid a metre. In the end I settled on silver anniversary cable at £6 a metre. Anything more expensive made no difference to my ears. I'm sure that they may do in the lab but the returns are below my hearing level.

Logically I would say that speaker cables can make a difference - again to a point. The signal will degrade due to impedance, poor connections or interference - just not that I can tell the difference above £6 a metre. After all, we are happy to spend £2k on an amp with high quality wiring in it. If wiring made no odds as it 'just carries a signal' I'm sure that the manufacturers would put cheap wiring in to increase their profit margins.

Speaker cables to me definitely make a difference - just not an earth shattering one once you start paying silly money. Again as I have mentioned before - £2k+ on cabling or £200 and a state of the art turntable to get the best results?

 

[TrevC]

The signal will degrade due to impedance, poor connections or interference -

Impedance, yes, use thick low resistance wire, poor connections, no excuse for that, the result would be intermittent sound when you fiddle with the wire, interference means your amplifier isn't good at RF rejection.