Mains cables, lets put an end to this nonsense.

[andyjm]

For those interested;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ABX_test

In the absence of a PM facility, I will setup an email address for the test.

 

[Anonymous]

In the spirit of the OP's intentions, and not the drivel on here:

"In a domestic setting, with a HiFi amplifier, it is impossible to differentiate between different mains cables in a properly conducted blind listening test".

No.

 

[John Duncan]

...or you could just get a list of names and I will put you all in touch with each other.

FWIW, when somebody says 'coffee machine' I do not think of percolators. I only do that when someone says 'percolator'.

 

[Anonymous]

...or you could just get a list of names and I will put you all in touch with each other.

It's bad enough being slagged off on here with a moderator. No thanks!

 

[plastic penguin]

Well, I suppose this thread is a post enhancer....

 

[John Duncan]

...or you could just get a list of names and I will put you all in touch with each other.

It's bad enough being slagged off on here with a moderator. No thanks!

Er...what?

 

[BenLaw]

...or you could just get a list of names and I will put you all in touch with each other.

It's bad enough being slagged off on here with a moderator. No thanks!

Er...what?

He's suggesting that if you supplied his email address to other forum members they would abuse him via email. Please thank you scrape bow grovel.

 

[Alec]

...or you could just get a list of names and I will put you all in touch with each other.

It's bad enough being slagged off on here with a moderator. No thanks!

Er...what?

He's suggesting that if you supplied his email address to other forum members they would abuse him via email. Please thank you scrape bow grovel.

And thankyou and please. How rude.

I take my beans from a cup. No, I do mean yer actual beans. I drink my coffee from a bowl, generally.

I've bought a phone (of the antiquated landline sort) which, during the ringtone, plays a recording of someone telling me which number is ringing me. This irritates me.

I may properly RTFM at some point, but the FM is a PITA.

 

[BenLaw]

FWIW IME beanz meanz Heinz.

 

[nopiano]

I tried a blind listening test at home. But I tripped over the cable!

 

[John Duncan]

FWIW IME beanz meanz Heinz.

On the whole yes, but I can also recommend Branston.

 

[simonlewis]

FWIW IME beanz meanz Heinz.

On the whole yes, but I can also recommend Branston.

I presume you are talking about this news story.

 

[steve_1979]

...or you could just get a list of names and I will put you all in touch with each other.

You can pass my email address on to andyjm as I may be interested in attending depending on what the location is.

Thanks JD.

 

[steve_1979]

<p>my wife is not keen on me inviting (in her words) "a bunch of HifI wierdos from an internet forum"</p>

"A bunch of HifI wierdos" That sounds about right. :shifty:

 

[Alec]

<p>my wife is not keen on me inviting (in her words) "a bunch of HifI wierdos from an internet forum"</p>

"A bunch of HifI wierdos" That sounds about right. :shifty:

Where's that from? It aint from raaan 'ere...

And why did she marry him, then?

 

[BigH]

<p>my wife is not keen on me inviting (in her words) "a bunch of HifI wierdos from an internet forum"</p>

"A bunch of HifI wierdos" That sounds about right. :shifty:

Sounds about right, most sensible thing Ive read on here lately.

 

[ellisdj]

AndyJM where do you live?

 

[Anonymous]

Please thank you scrape bow grovel.

I see you're getting the hang of the manners thing! Good.

 

[Thompsonuxb]

Lol..... tell me, did I not suggest this a few months ago, during the last bout of interconnect/cable exchanges did I not suggest this?

Did I not say we could descend on Superfi of Birmingham....

What non of you have ever read me or even know who I am.....

anyhoo, if you do go ahead please consider me I am definatly up for this ....definatly.

 

[andyjm]

Sorry for the delay in progressing this, I have been travelling for the last week or so.

In the absence of a PM facility, I have set up the following email address to coordinate the test:

cableabxtest-at-gmail.com (remove the -at- and replace with @)

If those interested would send me an email and an an idea of where in the country you are (I am Surrey / West Sussex, but willing to travel), I will see what looks possible.

Thompson, do you think Superfi would be willing to host this?

If this proves to be a success, we can move on to interconnects and speaker cables at a later date. Who knows, we could even test a few HDMI cables.

 

[the record spot]

T-UXB reckons Superfi would host an ABX test? Really?? I'd be interested to hear the outcome on that. I looked at their website and they list interconnects from £350 down to low budget, digital cables, AV cables....and they're going to host a session that'd be played out in full on here?

Yes, I'd be really keen to see how that'd play out on here...!

 

[jaxwired]

T-UXB reckons Superfi would host an ABX test? Really?? I'd be interested to hear the outcome on that. I looked at their website and they list interconnects from £350 down to low budget, digital cables, AV cables....and they're going to host a session that'd be played out in full on here?

Yes, I'd be really keen to see how that'd play out on here...!

Right, cables are a high profit item for retailers. Seems unlikely that a hifi store would want to prove their uselessness.

Besides no self respecting audiophile would accept the results of an ABX test anyway. They never do.

ABX tests have in the past "proved" that all amps sound the same, all cd players sound the same, all DACs sound the same, and all cables sound the same. Yet here we all are buying amps, DACS, and cables like they actually do sound different. Anyone that is willing to be satisfied from an ABX test that mains cables all sound the same should then sell their amp and DAC and CDP and replace them with the cheapest on the market since those have also failed the ABX challenge.

 

[davedotco]

T-UXB reckons Superfi would host an ABX test? Really?? I'd be interested to hear the outcome on that. I looked at their website and they list interconnects from £350 down to low budget, digital cables, AV cables....and they're going to host a session that'd be played out in full on here?

Yes, I'd be really keen to see how that'd play out on here...!

Right, cables are a high profit item for retailers. Seems unlikely that a hifi store would want to prove their uselessness.

Besides no self respecting audiophile would accept the results of an ABX test anyway. They never do.

ABX tests have in the past "proved" that all amps sound the same, all cd players sound the same, all DACs sound the same, and all cables sound the same. Yet here we all are buying amps, DACS, and cables like they actually do sound different. Anyone that is willing to be satisfied from an ABX test that mains cables all sound the same should then sell their amp and DAC and CDP and replace them with the cheapest on the market since those have also failed the ABX challenge.

Jax, you normally talk a fair amount of sense but that paragraph is nonsense of the highest order.

In my experience an ABX or properly conducted blind tests prove only one thing, simply that it is a hell of lot harder to tell the difference between items of hi-fi equipment when you do not know what you are listening to.

The amplifier test usually requires amplifiers (power amplifiers in reality) to be working 'within their capabilities' but in the real world this simply is not the case much of the time so differences can be heard often quite obviously so.

 

[jaxwired]

ABX tests have in the past "proved" that all amps sound the same, all cd players sound the same, all DACs sound the same, and all cables sound the same. Yet here we all are buying amps, DACS, and cables like they actually do sound different. Anyone that is willing to be satisfied from an ABX test that mains cables all sound the same should then sell their amp and DAC and CDP and replace them with the cheapest on the market since those have also failed the ABX challenge.

Jax, you normally talk a fair amount of sense but that paragraph is nonsense of the highest order.

In my experience an ABX or properly conducted blind tests prove only one thing, simply that it is a hell of lot harder to tell the difference between items of hi-fi equipment when you do not know what you are listening to.

The amplifier test usually requires amplifiers (power amplifiers in reality) to be working 'within their capabilities' but in the real world this simply is not the case much of the time so differences can be heard often quite obviously so.

You think so huh, have to disgree. Even in the real world as long as volume levels are closely matched the people have consistently failed to win ABX challenges with power amps. Or pretty much any other hifi component i've ever heard being tested other than speakers (and perhaps turntables). Turns out the differences are not obvious at all. People simply cannot pass ABX challenges for amps or CD players or DACs or any type of cables. This is not debatable, this is fact. It's been done and the skeptics win every time. Therefore there are only two possibilities as far as my simple mind can detect.

1. All that equipment actually does sounds close enough as to be effectively identical for a human listener

OR

2. ABX tests are flawed.

If the former is true, then we are all wasting our money on anything but speakers. If the later is true, then ABX testing is worthless as it relates to hifi components.

I would much rather believe answer number 1 since it appeals strongly to my rational senses. However, my personal experience so strongly points to number 2. It's a mystery for sure. We are either all a bunch of easily fooled dullards wasting our money on voodoo or we are reacting to something that is not revealed by ABX testing. As much as I prefer the more rational path, I tend to think the latter is the truth.

Consider for a moment the possibility that human beings are able to detect differences between hifi amps, but only at a subconcious level or maybe only with long exposure. The brain and how we interpret sound is complex and we do not fully understand it.

I'm reminded of the famous Pepsi Challenge that happened in the early 1980s. At the time Coke was the market leader and pepsi went around doing live taste test between Pepsi and Coke. Turns out people over whelmingly preferred the taste of Pepsi. But it also turns out that people bought Coke anyway. So what should have been painfully obvious from the blind taste test actually contradicted people's real prefrences. In fact, Coke did their own blind taste tests and found the same thing, that people preferred pepsi. So they changed their formula to taste like pepsi and people hated the product. Moral of the story? People are not good at measuring themselves. Not a perfect analogy for the hifi ABX testing, but interesting and related I'd say.

 

[TrevC]

T-UXB reckons Superfi would host an ABX test? Really?? I'd be interested to hear the outcome on that. I looked at their website and they list interconnects from £350 down to low budget, digital cables, AV cables....and they're going to host a session that'd be played out in full on here?

Yes, I'd be really keen to see how that'd play out on here...!

Right, cables are a high profit item for retailers. Seems unlikely that a hifi store would want to prove their uselessness.

Besides no self respecting audiophile would accept the results of an ABX test anyway. They never do.

ABX tests have in the past "proved" that all amps sound the same, all cd players sound the same, all DACs sound the same, and all cables sound the same. Yet here we all are buying amps, DACS, and cables like they actually do sound different. Anyone that is willing to be satisfied from an ABX test that mains cables all sound the same should then sell their amp and DAC and CDP and replace them with the cheapest on the market since those have also failed the ABX challenge.

Mains cables don't have any influence on sound quality, so there is no point in ABX testing them. Selling your gear because you know that seems rather silly.