Kef LS50....A technical tour de force.

[chebby]

£600 for capacitors!!

 

[Electro]

Been spending a lot of listening time recently, because my amps have, today, gone back to Icon for a major Jensenectomy capacitor upgrade transplant. I had to toss up in my mind, £600 for the capacitors or £800 for a pair of LS50?????? The Jensen Caps won, I cant see the small LS50 competing, especially at the base end with my transmission line, silk tweetered PMC LB1, its an old sound I know, but thats another reason why I favour 'in my mind' the LB1's. Not to say I dont have an open mind, but one likes the sound I get, it is a bit pipe and slippers may be, but I like it that way. However, I might still get a demo pair of LS50's for a couple of days, but with no real commitment to change, their performance would have to be remarkable? I also note the need for a bit of power . . . Valves can give power but I favouer my amps in the 20W triode mode??? A secondary medical procedure under local anathetic is booked on Wednesday on my wallet. Both patients will be transported home with great care in the afternoon. The wallet put quietly to one side to recuperate ray: . . . The ST40 to be exercised gently back into the rudeness of health for ever more pleasure giving in sound stage, reality and air in the performance . . . CJSF

I think you made the right decision the LB1's are top quality speakers regardless of their age

 

[CnoEvil]

Been spending a lot of listening time recently, because my amps have, today, gone back to Icon for a major Jensenectomy capacitor upgrade transplant. I had to toss up in my mind, £600 for the capacitors or £800 for a pair of LS50?????? The Jensen Caps won, I cant see the small LS50 competing, especially at the base end with my transmission line, silk tweetered PMC LB1, its an old sound I know, but thats another reason why I favour 'in my mind' the LB1's. Not to say I dont have an open mind, but one likes the sound I get, it is a bit pipe and slippers may be, but I like it that way. However, I might still get a demo pair of LS50's for a couple of days, but with no real commitment to change, their performance would have to be remarkable? I also note the need for a bit of power . . . Valves can give power but I favouer my amps in the 20W triode mode??? A secondary medical procedure under local anathetic is booked on Wednesday on my wallet. Both patients will be transported home with great care in the afternoon. The wallet put quietly to one side to recuperate ray: . . . The ST40 to be exercised gently back into the rudeness of health for ever more pleasure giving in sound stage, reality and air in the performance . . . CJSF

I would also spend the money on the amp, if it was going to make a big difference.....though I'm glad you are thinking of trying the LS50s anyway, as I'd value your opinion.

 

[CJSF]

£600 for capacitors!!

Thats two amps; ST40 and the Phono stage PS1. Yep, audiophile types are expensive, 'Copper Foil, Paper in Oil', same as some audiophile valves can be. A major change in direction for me, done all the upgrading myself up to now. The total fitting cost is only about £80, I have a bit of spare cash so why not?

I looked at '£800 for a pair of speakers' possibly a side ways move? . . . Replacing a pair I have had for a long time and like, the PMC's would probably cost a couple of 'K' to just replace like for like? I think the transmission line LB1 cost something £1400 in the early 90's if my memory serves? Memory a bit vague, I bet Chebby will get that sorted?

CJSF :cheer:

 

[Frank Harvey]

For home cinema?.. Nope..

You sure?

Well kind of.. I like my home cinema big & loud.. For their size the bass is very good, but it may not satisfy all in terms of real bass depth in a home cinema setup.. But hey thats just me.

They'll go loud enough - it's then up to a good sub to make them sound larger than life. They're invisible, image perfectly, blend amazingly well and bring out more detail (more cleanly and accurately) than the average speaker.

 

[Vladimir]

Thanks for the link, I gave it a read and here are some of my thoughts.

1) KEF LS50 has nothing to do with the BBC LS3/5A or am I blind? :?

2) That White Paper will do wonders for selling the LS50 in Asia.

3) Harbeth's Alan A. Shaw would aprove that paper for dog potty training only and nothing else. OK maybe fly squating.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cbGKsf2TqI

The KEF LS50 is a brilliant speaker, I love dual concentric designs and I don't mind at all if KEF is owned by Gold Peak from China. However, many would agree with me that there is only one modern BBC LS3/5A and that is the Harbeth P3ESR.

Rebuttal?

 

[CnoEvil]

Thanks for the link, I gave it a read and here are some of my thoughts.

1) KEF LS50 has nothing to do with the BBC LS3/5A or am I blind? :?

2) That White Paper will do wonders for selling the LS50 in Asia.

3) Harbeth's Alan A. Shaw would aprove that paper for dog potty training only and nothing else. OK maybe fly squating.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cbGKsf2TqI

The KEF LS50 is a brilliant speaker, I love dual concentric designs and I don't mind at all if KEF is owned by Gold Peak from China. However, many would agree with me that there is only one modern BBC LS3/5A and that is the Harbeth P3ESR.

Rebuttal?

IMO The LS50 was never meant to be a "copy" of LS3/5A, but more of a "spiritual" successor, where they took a very similar concept and applied the latest thinking and technology to it......a sort of homage to the venerable transducer, but with an open design brief.....and maybe a smidge of marketing. :shifty:

 

[shep1968]

Will a Naim Nait 5si adequately run these speakers long term? I'm torn between these and some small floor standers.

 

[manicm]

For home cinema?.. Nope..

You sure?

Well kind of.. I like my home cinema big & loud.. For their size the bass is very good, but it may not satisfy all in terms of real bass depth in a home cinema setup.. But hey thats just me.

They'll go loud enough - it's then up to a good sub to make them sound larger than life. They're invisible, image perfectly, blend amazingly well and bring out more detail (more cleanly and accurately) than the average speaker.

What's the soundstage like i.e. does the sound extend beyond the height and width of the speakers? Do they project deep as well?

 

[manicm]

Will a Naim Nait 5si adequately run these speakers long term? I'm torn between these and some small floor standers.

I don't see why not, the 5si has a solid 60w/8 ohms output.

 

[shep1968]

Will a Naim Nait 5si adequately run these speakers long term? I'm torn between these and some small floor standers.

I don't see why not, the 5si has a solid 60w/8 ohms output.

Wasnt sure if that was enough given the talk of matching power carefully on here. They certainly sounded nice when i heard them. Be interesting to hear them up against a Neat Motive X2 and ATC SCM11, think my final speaker will come from that trio.

 

[Frank Harvey]

What's the soundstage like i.e. does the sound extend beyond the height and width of the speakers? Do they project deep as well?

The drive units are free to do what they're supposed to do, unhindered by the cabinet. Listening in stereo, or 5.1, I never found them restrictive in any way.

 

[Frank Harvey]

1) KEF LS50 has nothing to do with the BBC LS3/5A or am I blind? :?

Other than the fact they both use drive units, and have cabinets and a crossover, they are entirely different speakers. What KEF have done (inspired by the LS3/5a) is produced a small, informative mini monitor, which is actually more accurate than the original, which seems to have been voiced to accentuate flaws.

3) Harbeth's Alan A. Shaw would aprove that paper for dog potty training only and nothing else. OK maybe fly squating.

I'm not sure KEF are really worried about what Alan does or thinks.

The KEF LS50 is a brilliant speaker, I love dual concentric designs and I don't mind at all if KEF is owned by Gold Peak from China. However, many would agree with me that there is only one modern BBC LS3/5A and that is the Harbeth P3ESR.

Except for those that would point out that there are many LS3/5a clones on the market, including models from Spendor...

 

[Vladimir]

Except for those that would point out that there are many LS3/5a clones on the market, including models from Spendor...

Neither the Spendor S3/5R² or the Rogers Studio 3 come close the original LS3/5a, let alone further improving it like the Harbeth P3ESR.

The Spendors don't even have the inset baffle or similar crossover. Their resemblance is by size and name only. The Rogers are tuned to work no more than 6 inches away from the back wall. They fail at so many ways (especially imaging and depth of stage), more than the original.

The only commercial successfull succesor that came of the BBC LS3/5A is the Harbeth P3ESR, and deservingly so. Its been produced and improved non stop for almost 40 years which means its not a clone. Its the sole survivor true British BBC LS3/5A monitor group. The original was developed by Dudley Harwood, the founder of Harbeth. Need I go on?

The KEF LS50 is a modern, briliant and successful story and milking the BBC brand heritage tit is just knocking on Asian doors and nothign else. They could have done without it but hey, we all like money.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Neither the Spendor S3/5R² or the Rogers Studio 3 come close the original LS3/5a, let alone further improving it like the Harbeth P3ESR.

Not many things will, but many would argue that the LS3/5a sound - which I believe was designed to highlight certain flaws/aspects of the sound - isn't something that people would enjoy in their homes nowadays.

 

[Vladimir]

Neither the Spendor S3/5R² or the Rogers Studio 3 come close the original LS3/5a, let alone further improving it like the Harbeth P3ESR.

Not many things will, but many would argue that the LS3/5a sound - which I believe was designed to highlight certain flaws/aspects of the sound - isn't something that people would enjoy in their homes nowadays.

Not to mention their natural enviroment is actually a van.

 

[bartwuster]

Sorry for the off topic, but for a room sized roughly 15m2, will Marantz Pearl Lite be enough for the LS50, or do I need to go for Roksan Kandy K2?

Another option is Odyssey Khartago, but I need to figure out the preamp with HT bypass function for future HT plan.

Again, sorry for the off topic.

 

[CnoEvil]

Sorry for the off topic, but for a room sized roughly 15m2, will Marantz Pearl Lite be enough for the LS50, or do I need to go for Roksan Kandy K2?

Another option is Odyssey Khartago, but I need to figure out the preamp with HT bypass function for future HT plan.

Again, sorry for the off topic.

Hi there, and welcome.

There is no need for apologies, and you aren't really off topic.

Can you start at the beginning, and clarify things a little.

- What do you own at the moment?

- What is your budget?

- What sort of music do you like, and how do you like your system to sound?

 

[bartwuster]

Hi CnoEvil,

Thank you for the welcome wish.

Sorry if my English is not very good; it's not my first language.

I'll clear things a bit as per your post.

This is my first hifi setup, and I'm buying the equipment one by one due to financial constraint.

Previously the only hifi equipment that I have is Jamo Cornet 175 Floorstander driven by an old Denon receiver, both of which acquired from my elder brother.

After trying out few bookshelf speakers, I decided that LS50 is the right and best speaker for me at that budget.

Cominh from headphone world, I'll be using the Firestone Audio Spitfire DAC for now, and will eventually upgrade it in the future after buying the amp.

Source will be my laptop with FLAC files.

After conversion from my country currency, my budget is around £800, and I live in Malaysia by the way where all hifi equipment is quite expensive.

I listen to most type of music; jazz, progressive jazz, rock, progressive rock (love it), female vocals, pop, etc.

I love my system to be on neutral and a bit/slight warm, but I'm in no way basshead, and I don't like my system to be super cold and analytical either.

Hope that helps and thank you again.

 

[manicm]

Will a Naim Nait 5si adequately run these speakers long term? I'm torn between these and some small floor standers.

I don't see why not, the 5si has a solid 60w/8 ohms output.

Wasnt sure if that was enough given the talk of matching power carefully on here. They certainly sounded nice when i heard them. Be interesting to hear them up against a Neat Motive X2 and ATC SCM11, think my final speaker will come from that trio.

As I understand it Naim do not skimp on the power supply on any of their independent amplifiers i.e integrated or dedicated. The 5si has been built to cope with 4 ohm speakers as well as 8 ohms, and you can trust their specs with your life.

 

[CnoEvil]

Hi CnoEvil,

Thank you for the welcome wish.

Sorry if my English is not very good; it's not my first language.

I'll clear things a bit as per your post.

This is my first hifi setup, and I'm buying the equipment one by one due to financial constraint.

Previously the only hifi equipment that I have is Jamo Cornet 175 Floorstander driven by an old Denon receiver, both of which acquired from my elder brother.

After trying out few bookshelf speakers, I decided that LS50 is the right and best speaker for me at that budget.

Cominh from headphone world, I'll be using the Firestone Audio Spitfire DAC for now, and will eventually upgrade it in the future after buying the amp.

Source will be my laptop with FLAC files.

After conversion from my country currency, my budget is around £800, and I live in Malaysia by the way where all hifi equipment is quite expensive.

I listen to most type of music; jazz, progressive jazz, rock, progressive rock (love it), female vocals, pop, etc.

I love my system to be on neutral and a bit/slight warm, but I'm in no way basshead, and I don't like my system to be super cold and analytical either.

Hope that helps and thank you again.

Am I right in thinking:

- you have decided on the LS50s, but not bought them?

- You are still deciding on an amp?

- £800 budget for amp?

- What brands do you have available?

- What amps did you hear when you did the demos of the speakers?

 

[bartwuster]

Sorry to make you confused.

- I bought the LS50 already.

- Yeah I'm still deciding on amp.

- £800 is budget for the amp.

- Brands available includes Roksan, Marantz, ATC, Audio Analogue, Audiolab, Primare, Rega, and a few others but the problem is all the brands not carried by the same shop.

- When demoing the speaker I'm using Kandy K2 and Audio Analogue the discontinued model that I can't recalled the model now. I like the Kandy K2 pairing even more than K2 with ATC SCM7 & 11.

Reason I'm asking about Pearl Lite is because there is one seller in my area selling it after bought it just a few months due to need of money for something else.

Hope that helps.

 

[CnoEvil]

@ Bartwuster

The only way to get the right amp for your taste, is to hear it with the LS50s.

FWIW. I personally would be looking at Primare for a very clean and detailed presentation, or Audio Analogue for a smoother sound. If you have access to the Arcam A19, you could try it as well.

Let us know how you get on.

Cno

 

[bartwuster]

Hi CnoEvil,

Thank you for the recommendation, I will update back with my decision.

Regards.

 

[Vladimir]

Hi CnoEvil,

Thank you for the recommendation, I will update back with my decision.

Regards.

The new Roksan Kandy K2 BT is a must see option. It's brilliant and unbeaten at this price range.