Innuos Zen Mini basics

[Timo]

Thanks Macspur -- I have never tried Sonos, but I shall look into it. My quick internet search on the sofa suggests I would need another "box", like Sonos Connect. Am I on the right track? [Apologies for my ignorance. So far my streaming experience is limited to Naim -- the ND5XS and two MusoQBs.]

 

[Timo]

I am also quite intrigued by Innuos -- especially the Mini. Currently I have a Naim ND5XS as source, but an Innuos/Chord Qutest or Hugo 2 combo has a certain appeal, and should sound better. I have not yet heard the Qutest, but Hugo 2 -- a great DAC, which is, in my view, better than the DAC in my ND5XS.

However, I am a bit anxious about leaving the Naim app behind. As you would expect, it works well with Naim streamers; and it has Tidal integrated. We love "browsing" Tidal to find new recordings (mainly, classical music).

I wondered about first-hand user experiences with iPeng -- that is apparently the app Innuos recommends for iPad users. I went to a local dealer, who stocks and sells Innuos. But he was not at all familiar with the iPeng. I took, for instance, calling Innuos' support line twice to get Tidal running. After that I didn't dare to ask about the BBC iplayer or internet radio...

I use SqueezePad.

For your system, I’d recommend looking at the ZEN rather than the ZEN Mini - I would usually recommend the Mini for Sonos/HEOS type systems, and other multiroom and wireless speaker setups.

Thanks for your input David. Do you suggest the ZEN from a sound quality point of view? From discussions in the Naim Forum, I am aware that the "renderer" or "transport" can make a huge difference (i.e. it's not just the DAC that matters), but I have to admit I don't actually understand why -- and how much difference the transport makes... This is all fairly new to me.

 

[Macspur]

Thanks Macspur -- I have never tried Sonos, but I shall look into it. My quick internet search on the sofa suggests I would need another "box", like Sonos Connect. Am I on the right track? [Apologies for my ignorance. So far my streaming experience is limited to Naim -- the ND5XS and two MusoQBs.]

Hi Timo,

Yes, it's the Connect I've got in my main system.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[Macspur]

Thought this was quite a nice touch from Roon
-- please reply above this line --

Hi Eamonn,

Thanks for trying Roon and providing feedback! We really appreciate it.

Unfortunately as you noticed we don't do very well with sight-impaired users, I'm sorry it didn't work out! Roon uses a custom drawing engine for performance and cross platform reasons. Our entire user interface is written in OpenGL, which gets us the performance and portability we desire long term. Unfortunately, this means the graphical parts of the application are built like a video game, and less like a normal application.

Accessibility and voiceover applications are built by hooking up to the built-in OS text areas, which isn't going to work with Roon. If you have a screen reader that works via real-time OCR techniques, it may work better.

Best,
Kevin P
Roon Labs

Be sure to stop by our www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[davidf]

Thanks for your input David. Do you suggest the ZEN from a sound quality point of view? From discussions in the Naim Forum, I am aware that the "renderer" or "transport" can make a huge difference (i.e. it's not just the DAC that matters), but I have to admit I don't actually understand why -- and how much difference the transport makes... This is all fairly new to me.

In theory, the transport shouldn’t make any difference, but it does. It’s no night and day difference like you’d get with an analogue source, and the differences can be smaller than that of a digital CD transport, but with the right system, it’s appreciable enough to make you want it! And once you have something like that, you know that any shortcomings in the system lie elsewhere as they aren’t down to the source.

As the Innuos products allow access to TIDAL, Qobuz, Spotify, and internet radio, and can plug directly into a DAC with a USB input, it removes the need for a stand alone streamer, as it does everything most people need to do.

 

[Macspur]

Took delivery of a demo unit of the Zenith today, but can't get the damn thing working!

The laptop has found the dashboard, plugged both power lines in, eventually got them showing correct lights, but when I go to play anything it says it can't find the server!

Think I'm just not destined to have one of these.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[Andrewjvt]

Took delivery of a demo unit of the Zenith today, but can't get the damn thing working!

The laptop has found the dashboard, plugged both power lines in, eventually got them showing correct lights, but when I go to play anything it says it can't find the server!

Think I'm just not destined to have one of these.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

I thought the zenith has an internal hhd?

 

[Macspur]

Took delivery of a demo unit of the Zenith today, but can't get the damn thing working!

The laptop has found the dashboard, plugged both power lines in, eventually got them showing correct lights, but when I go to play anything it says it can't find the server!

Think I'm just not destined to have one of these.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

I thought the zenith has an internal hhd?

Excuse my ignorance, but what does that mean?

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[ellisdj]

It’s no night and day difference

wait until you hear the Statement. It's night and day

 

[Macspur]

I can see the Zenith via my Sonos Ap on the laptop and I've managed to play a few tracks, but only from a couple of albums... the rest are coming up restricted beside each track!

Any ideas guys?

Btw, what I have heard so far, is miles better than the Zen mini.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[nopiano]

Took delivery of a demo unit of the Zenith today, but can't get the damn thing working!

The laptop has found the dashboard, plugged both power lines in, eventually got them showing correct lights, but when I go to play anything it says it can't find the server!

Think I'm just not destined to have one of these.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

I thought the zenith has an internal hhd?

Excuse my ignorance, but what does that mean?

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

Hi Mac, I think Andrew meant to write HDD, or hard disk drive. I imagine he was thinking you’d be able to play from the Zenith rather like a CD player, without the need for an app or PC.

I hope you get it sorted; I’m sure you will! (The very nice chap whose Linn Sneaky Music DS I’ve just bought has moved to a Zenith, so I will try to find out how he’s getting on with it).

 

[davidf]

It’s no night and day difference

wait until you hear the Statement. It's night and day

I don’t want to! I’ll probably update my ZENith to a MkIII, but the Statement is completely out of my reach at the moment, and would be wasted based on my current system.

 

[davidf]

I can see the Zenith via my Sonos Ap on the laptop and I've managed to play a few tracks, but only from a couple of albums... the rest are coming up restricted beside each track!

Any ideas guys?

Btw, what I have heard so far, is miles better than the Zen mini.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

Have you gone into the settings of the ZENith and set it for use with Sonos? In the Innuos settings, there’s a choice of UPnP (default), Roon, or Sonos. Should be dead easy from there. If not, you’ll need to enter the ZENith’s file name into the Sonos in the settings for it to see it.

 

[ellisdj]

It’s no night and day difference

wait until you hear the Statement. It's night and day

I don’t want to! I’ll probably update my ZENith to a MkIII, but the Statement is completely out of my reach at the moment, and would be wasted based on my current system. 

Its a lot of money but it's a lot of source.
Goes to show what I have been banging on about for years - going to surprise a lot of people

 

[Macspur]

I can see the Zenith via my Sonos Ap on the laptop and I've managed to play a few tracks, but only from a couple of albums... the rest are coming up restricted beside each track!

Any ideas guys?

Btw, what I have heard so far, is miles better than the Zen mini.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

Have you gone into the settings of the ZENith and set it for use with Sonos? In the Innuos settings, there’s a choice of UPnP (default), Roon, or Sonos. Should be dead easy from there. If not, you’ll need to enter the ZENith’s file name into the Sonos in the settings for it to see it.

Yes, done that already thanks David, but despite the Zenith showing on the Sonos Ap the majority of albums are restricted

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[Macspur]

Took delivery of a demo unit of the Zenith today, but can't get the damn thing working!

The laptop has found the dashboard, plugged both power lines in, eventually got them showing correct lights, but when I go to play anything it says it can't find the server!

Think I'm just not destined to have one of these.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

I thought the zenith has an internal hhd?

Excuse my ignorance, but what does that mean?

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

Hi Mac, I think Andrew meant to write HDD, or hard disk drive. I imagine he was thinking you’d be able to play from the Zenith rather like a CD player, without the need for an app or PC.

I hope you get it sorted; I’m sure you will! (The very nice chap whose Linn Sneaky Music DS I’ve just bought has moved to a Zenith, so I will try to find out how he’s getting on with it).

Ah thanks for that

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[davidf]

Any restrictions on the types of files the Sonos can read?

 

[Andrewjvt]

Took delivery of a demo unit of the Zenith today, but can't get the damn thing working!

The laptop has found the dashboard, plugged both power lines in, eventually got them showing correct lights, but when I go to play anything it says it can't find the server!

Think I'm just not destined to have one of these.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

I thought the zenith has an internal hhd?

Excuse my ignorance, but what does that mean?

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

Hi Mac, I think Andrew meant to write HDD, or hard disk drive.   I imagine he was thinking you’d be able to play from the Zenith rather like a CD player, without the need for an app or PC. 

I hope you get it sorted; I’m sure you will!  (The very nice chap whose Linn Sneaky Music DS I’ve just bought has moved to a Zenith, so I will try to find out how he’s getting on with it). 

Ah thanks for that

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

That was what I meant

 

[Andrewjvt]

I can see the Zenith via my Sonos Ap on the laptop and I've managed to play a few tracks, but only from a couple of albums... the rest are coming up restricted beside each track!

Any ideas guys?

Btw, what I have heard so far, is miles better than the Zen mini.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

How are you comparing the zen to the zenith?
Do you have them both with you?

 

[Macspur]

Firstly, top class service customer service from Innuous... they called me this morning and took over my laptop and now able to play all albums, except one that's in 96KHZ 24 bit.

@Andrew no I haven't got both the Zenith and the Zen mini, but I knew as soon as I heard the mini that the sq was inferior to that of my CDP and even Sonos playing via my DAC... I trust my ears, lets face it, I have to lol!

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[Andrewjvt]

David f
Do you stock both products?
Mini and zennith?
I'd like to check for myself side by side any difference in sound quality using same dac.
Seems it's just a transport (and a dedicated transport at that) I can't believe of the large differences between them.
I have no difference using my laptop/cheap laptop on same music files
Called up benchmark and asked their opinion and they advised not to waste my money and carry on using laptop.
So I'd like to see if the differences are really real or imagined.

Mac
Don't know if you've followed the Roon thread but as a serious non believer in snake oil etc I at first heard a massive sound quality improvement using roon compared to jriver.
Same dac and same headphones.
I went back and rechecked but my audio memory failed me as the difference I thought was so large disappeared.

 

[davidf]

David f Do you stock both products? Mini and zennith? I'd like to check for myself side by side any difference in sound quality using same dac. Seems it's just a transport (and a dedicated transport at that) I can't believe of the large differences between them. I have no difference using my laptop/cheap laptop on same music files Called up benchmark and asked their opinion and they advised not to waste my money and carry on using laptop. So I'd like to see if the differences are really real or imagined.

I only have a ZENith II here at the moment. I'll be having a think about which two models to have on demo from the new range once I've sold my ZENith. Maybe ZEN mini and either the ZEN or ZENith.

 

[Macspur]

David f Do you stock both products? Mini and zennith? I'd like to check for myself side by side any difference in sound quality using same dac. Seems it's just a transport (and a dedicated transport at that) I can't believe of the large differences between them. I have no difference using my laptop/cheap laptop on same music files Called up benchmark and asked their opinion and they advised not to waste my money and carry on using laptop. So I'd like to see if the differences are really real or imagined.

Mac Don't know if you've followed the Roon thread but as a serious non believer in snake oil etc I at first heard a massive sound quality improvement using roon compared to jriver. Same dac and same headphones. I went back and rechecked but my audio memory failed me as the difference I thought was so large disappeared.

I can only speak as I find Andrew... believe me, I'd much rather pay for a Mini than the Zenith, but the sq was quite flat with the former compared to my CDP and Sonos via my Audiolab M DAC+

Perhaps with the Accuphase and Harbeths in the mix, I am able to hear the difference rather than if I were using lesser quality kit.

I'm currently listening to I Am Kloot Let It All In and it sounds superb.

Sadly, as mentioned before, I can't use Roon.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

 

[Andrewjvt]

David f Do you stock both products? Mini and zennith? I'd like to check for myself side by side any difference in sound quality using same dac. Seems it's just a transport (and a dedicated transport at that) I can't believe of the large differences between them. I have no difference using my laptop/cheap laptop on same music files Called up benchmark and asked their opinion and they advised not to waste my money and carry on using laptop. So I'd like to see if the differences are really real or imagined.

Mac Don't know if you've followed the Roon thread but as a serious non believer in snake oil etc I at first heard a massive sound quality improvement using roon compared to jriver. Same dac and same headphones. I went back and rechecked but my audio memory failed me as the difference I thought was so large disappeared.

I can only speak as I find Andrew... believe me, I'd much rather pay for a Mini than the Zenith, but the sq was quite flat with the former compared to my CDP and Sonos via my Audiolab M DAC+

Perhaps with the Accuphase and Harbeths in the mix, I am able to hear the difference rather than if I were using lesser quality kit.

I'm currently listening to I Am Kloot Let It All In and it sounds superb.

Sadly, as mentioned before, I can't use Roon.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

If someone technical can explain to me how this can be the case I'd appreciate it.

Auralic owner/designer insists the best sound quality comes from a Nas (ethernet cable) and then followed by internal ssd.

This would seem to contradict innous product.
I have not done blind ab listening tests to prove to myself

So

Please someone with technical knowledge
Please explain how data can be made to sound better transporting to the same dac?

Or better put: how to turn data into special 'audiophille' data

 

[Macspur]

David f Do you stock both products? Mini and zennith? I'd like to check for myself side by side any difference in sound quality using same dac. Seems it's just a transport (and a dedicated transport at that) I can't believe of the large differences between them. I have no difference using my laptop/cheap laptop on same music files Called up benchmark and asked their opinion and they advised not to waste my money and carry on using laptop. So I'd like to see if the differences are really real or imagined.

Mac Don't know if you've followed the Roon thread but as a serious non believer in snake oil etc I at first heard a massive sound quality improvement using roon compared to jriver. Same dac and same headphones. I went back and rechecked but my audio memory failed me as the difference I thought was so large disappeared.

I can only speak as I find Andrew... believe me, I'd much rather pay for a Mini than the Zenith, but the sq was quite flat with the former compared to my CDP and Sonos via my Audiolab M DAC+

Perhaps with the Accuphase and Harbeths in the mix, I am able to hear the difference rather than if I were using lesser quality kit.

I'm currently listening to I Am Kloot Let It All In and it sounds superb.

Sadly, as mentioned before, I can't use Roon.

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com

If someone technical can explain to me how this can be the case I'd appreciate it.

Auralic owner/designer insists the best sound quality comes from a Nas (ethernet cable) and then followed by internal ssd.

This would seem to contradict innous product. I have not done blind ab listening tests to prove to myself

So

Please someone with technical knowledge Please explain how data can be made to sound better transporting to the same dac?

Or better put: how to turn data into special 'audiophille' data

I'm not at all technical, but see if this is any use:

https://darko.audio/2017/10/richer-sounds-with-the-innuos-zenith-mkii-se/

Mac

www.realmusicnet.wordpress.com