In which pricerange do I get most bang for the buck? (New setup)

[Stephan A]

UPDATE ON THE THREAD THE 19-03 at 22;37

So far, I have gotten a lot of great input and suggestions. To update the content in a way to sum it all up so you won't have to look through all the comments, here is where it stands right now.

I have a maximum budget of 1.000£ but wouldn't mind to spend less.

I have been suggested 2 active systems which is affordable with my budget; The NuPro A-300 from Nubert (1050£) and the ADAM ARTist6 (915 £).

I have also considered a 2nd hand system with Monitor Audio RX 1 (280 £) paired with a Yamaha A-S500 (160 £) and a Cambridge DacMagic (110£) and an airport express (80£). In total 630 £.

I do know that, in generel, it isn't fair to compare a new system with a 2nd hand, but with the active speakers, I can't seem to find any used ones. Another note is, that I don't know if the NuPro A-200 would be more equal in size to the MA RX1 in which case it costs 577 £ for a pair.

Goal: To get a nice sounding stereo with a good resolution and an open soundstage. My source being Iphone/laptop/stationary (Room size 15 m2)

Original thread start:

Hello.

Yesterday when I came home and turned on my amp - it died. To be honest, the +10 years old pioneer had deserved the retirement for some time already. It was paired up with a set of bose speakers and a subwoofer - not a setup which I have been too thrilled about (got it from a friend 2nd hand)

So, now I am looking for a new setup. I am interested in finding out in which pricerange I get the most for the money. I don't want to buy a setup too cheap and become disapointed, but I also don't have unlimited funds.

So, in which pricerange do I get most for the money when it comes to speakers? Note that I only ask about the speakers since it seems to me, that it is wiser to find the speakers I want and afterwards match them with an amp that gives the sound I want.

As a second note I wont write any budget since I don't find that relevant when it comes to my question about most bang for the buck

About the listening room: It will be standing in a room around 14-17 m2.

Kind regards

 

[jcbrum]

I am interested in finding out in which pricerange I get the most for the money.

I think the most value for money is to be found in the lower price ranges. Say, around £250 to £750. It would be helpful if you indicated some suggestion of the budget you might wish to employ.

I also think active speakers are likely to solve your problem more cost effectively than legacy separates with expensive interconnects.

You don't mention what sources you use, and whether they are digital or analogue.

Does your sub still work, and is it something you would like to continue to use ?

JC

 

[Tarxman]

How long is a piece of string?

I think with audio, given the sky really is the limit, it's worth exploring and testing to find what you're happy with. Once you have an idea, you can set yourself a realistic budget and aim for the best you can get within it.

 

[jcbrum]

How long is a piece of string?

Usually about the same length as the average basic domestic hifi interconnect cable.

But it's probably best to avoid string altogether and use wireless ethernet.

JC

 

[hg]

Hello.

Yesterday when I came home and turned on my amp - it died. To be honest, the +10 years old pioneer had deserved the retirement for some time already. It was paired up with a set of bose speakers and a subwoofer - not a setup which I have been too thrilled about (got it from a friend 2nd hand)

So, now I am looking for a new setup. I am interested in finding out in which pricerange I get the most for the money. I don't want to buy a setup too cheap and become disapointed, but I also don't have unlimited funds.

So, in which pricerange do I get most for the money when it comes to speakers? Note that I only ask about the speakers since it seems to me, that it is wiser to find the speakers I want and afterwards match them with an amp that gives the sound I want.

As a second note I wont write any budget since I don't find that relevant when it comes to my question about most bang for the buck

About the listening room: It will be standing in a room around 14-17 m2.

Kind regards

The best value for money in terms of sound quality comes from well designed, aggressively priced, mass produced products from Asia. An example would be something like http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep04/articles/behringerb2030a.htm which is an active speaker. There is a passive version but it would represent less value for money when you factor in amplifier costs. I am not particularly recommending the brand but the type of product.

 

[Stephan A]

And if you can, set a budget. I know you said you don't want to work with one, but it's worth putting a stake in the ground and aiming around it, otherwise a 50k system will be the one that *should* sound better than a £500

Overall, see it as an exciting adventure towards listening to more music in the future!

Thank you for your pointers so far. I do understand what you mean with the 50k system is probably more likely to sound better than the 500 system, but the question is more where I get the most value for the money rather than the absolute best sound quality

I let out my budget thoughts to get an opinion not colored by my thoughts. However, with that said, I would like to keep it under the 1.000£ for a system including speakers, amp and cables. The reason for not writing this earlier is, that I would rather save up a bit longer and stretch my budget a bit to become more happy in the long run.

 

[Stephan A]

I am interested in finding out in which pricerange I get the most for the money.

I think the most value for money is to be found in the lower price ranges. Say, around £250 to £750. It would be helpful if you indicated some suggestion of the budget you might wish to employ.

I also think active speakers are likely to solve your problem more cost effectively than legacy separates with expensive interconnects.

You don't mention what sources you use, and whether they are digital or analogue.

Does your sub still work, and is it something you would like to continue to use ?

JC

My budget thoughts are around 1000£ maximum, but as I just stated in the comment above, I would rather save up a bit more if I get most for the money by waiting a bit longer. So, I would rather have your honest opinion about which price-range I should aim for.

My sub is as bad as the bose speakers so I don't want to destroy any good sound coming from a new setup with that muddy sound.

My primary source will without any doubt be my computer or laptop. I would also like to connect the speakers to my TV though. So, I guess my focus is on a digital source?

 

[ID.]

[uestion is more where I get the most value for the money rather than the absolute best sound quality

I let out my budget thoughts to get an opinion not colored by my thoughts. However, with that said, I would like to keep it under the 1.000£ for a system i

And here I was about to recommend the 1000-1500 pound range to be a sweetspot for speakers. That and building your system around the amp

1000 for the system pretty much makes your initial question pointless as you will be pretty much limited to budget kit (unless you go 2nd hand). Still, theres nice enough equipment around your budget, just don't go expecting too much from it.

 

[jcbrum]

Hmmm, well, I use AVI ADM9RS active remote control loudspeakers, with an Apple Airport Express, or Apple TV, for exactly the purposes you describe.

The cost of ADM9 is around £1250, and an Aex is around £70.

AVI DM5s are about half that price at £699. You can get more info from the AVI website, and their forum.

They are very high quality, and a British manufacturer. They welcome visitors to the factory.

Hope this helps.

JC

 

[CarlDW]

There is some decent kit around the £800-£1600 mark - I would visit a good hi-fi dealer and listen to what they have to offer.

Active speakers are an option - not just AVI (look at Adam, Genelec etc).

I suppose it depends what sources you have and how you listen to your music (CD, iPod etc).

Happy hunting!

 

[wilro15]

Your budget should be whatever you can afford. That may sound unhelpful, but your first decision should be "how much can I spend?", then look around at what fills your needs to make a shortlist, once you have that go an listen to what you can.

 

[english mustard]

[UNPUBLISHED]

come on . how long for sure is a china man !

 

[EvPa]

For a completely new system around £1,000 I would, just like in another recent thread, recommend Nubert electronic's nuPro A-300. You likely won't even need a subwoofer with those.

Genelecs are more expensive and, like most ADAM Audio models, you would still need to a separate volume control for ease of use.

ADAM Audio's ARTist 3 and ARTist 5 are pretty nice too (and within budget) but only have XLR, RCA and USB inputs whereas the nuPro A-300 features RCA, USB, TOSLINK and S/PDIF. They do not have DSP or remote control either.

However, if you are looking for floorstanders, I can vouch for ADAM Audio's ARTist 6, you should be able to get a nice B-Stock pair from Musikhaus Thomann within your budget (though you would still require some sort of preamp or at least a volume control, the gain knob on the back is not really practical day-to-day).

Of course there are other options available, both active and passive, I am just talking about those I am familiar with.

 

[lindsayt]

StephenA the big question on which this thread is based is impossible for me to answer at the moment, because I'd need some more information before I could form any sort of answer.

When you say "New setup" do you mean new to you, which means that we can include both brand new and 2nd hand equipment? Or do you mean brand new?

If you mean new to you, how confident would you be that you could do simple repairs on anything you bought? The sort of repairs where there a few youtube videos showing you what to do?

Also how fussy are you over sound quality? Which to some extent will depend upon how much listening to your hi-fi is part of your life? Are you looking for something that sounds better than what you had before, or something that is about as good as what you had before in order for you to be content? Can you please give us the models of Pioneer and Bose you've been using till your amp failed? Plus also tell us what CD player / turntable / other source you've been using?

 

[Stephan A]

So far, I would like to thank for all the response. This is not me shutting down the thread though. It is just often forgotten to show your appriciation on forums like this

I see a lot of you are pointing out active speakers. I may be stuck in a tradition trap, but active speakers aren't the first speakers that come into my mind when I thought about a new setup. In generel I see a lot of talk about active speakers on whathifi, but I havn't been able to find much information elswhere on the internet.

So, I am not rejecting the idea about active speakers though I may admit I am a bit skeptical about the idea. I am from Denmark and since there are so few of us danish people, it can be difficult to find a big hifi store to test things --> especially with recommended products that may not be available in Denmark. Another thing, is it possible to have active speakers hooked up to several sources at the same time so changing between sound coming from fx the telly or the computer goes rather smooth?

Until now my own considerations have been pointed toward passive speakers, so I will just make a note about that;

The brands I have been looking at so far are mainly Dali, Monitor Audio and B&W. I tend to lean towards Monitor Audio but I see a lot of positive response to both Dali and B&W as well. Maybe even more than what I have read about MA. Also if I compare the review from WhatHifi. So, am I wrong when it comes to MA? Do you, in generel, get more for your money when buying Dali or B&W when you compare the quality. I do know that sound is subjective but in some way I guess the quality of the components and such should indicate if it is a ripoff or not. I guess noone of you would pay 10.000£ for a set used Dali Concept 6 speakers.

The reason I think I lean towards MA may have something to do with the store where I have heard them. The room has without doubt been more optimized for listening than at the other store. The MA's have therefore been more impressive to me since I have been able to hear a lot of details and the sound image have been very clear.

The other store selling B&W and Dali havn't really had a dedicated listening room and just played it as they stood in the store. Compared with the experince from the store dealing MA, I havn't been nearly as impressed there. So, once again. Have I been given a bad impression of Dali and B&W compared to MA?

The models I have been looking at so far have been the BX-serie (BX2 or BX5), Silver 1, 2 or 6, Dali Ikon 1, 2 or 5, B&Ws new 685 serie.

I would like to highlight once again, though a big part of my post involves passive speakers, that this is merely due to lacking knowledge about active speakers and that I would like to know more about these as well. Especially when it comes to versus passive speakers and the sound differences.

 

[AlmaataKZ]

this will help to identify options for actives:

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/the-active-speakers-club

This will help understand some of the advantages of active design (plus you will find more info around if you look)

http://www.tonmeister.ca/wordpress/2013/11/15/bo-tech-whats-so-great-about-active-loudspeakers/

My 'my system' thread (linked in the signature) will have some examples of active systems (one based on biggies and two on tinies).

This will give an example of a an active-based system serving 5 rooms with superb sound and very slick control on 2,500 budget.

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/your-system/a-5-zone-multiroom-airplay-system-for-a-friend

 

[AL13N]

I am from Denmark and since there are so few of us danish people, it can be difficult to find a big hifi store to test things --> especially with recommended products that may not be available in Denmark.

AVI have a dealer in Denmark, Vassago HiFi.

http://www.vassagohifi.dk/cms/butikken.html

Another thing, is it possible to have active speakers hooked up to several sources at the same time so changing between sound coming from fx the telly or the computer goes rather smooth?

The AVI ADM9RS have 1 RCA analogue and 2 TOSLINK digital inputs. Inputs are selected via the remote control and the speakers remember the volume setting for each input.

I would like to highlight once again, though a big part of my post involves passive speakers, that this is merely due to lacking knowledge about active speakers and that I would like to know more about these as well. Especially when it comes to versus passive speakers and the sound differences.

Vassago HiFi have a "Demo and Loan" facility. So you can listen to the speakers in their listening room (and compare with the passive speakers they also stock) or borrow them for listening in your own home.

http://www.vassagohifi.dk/cms/demo-og-udlaan.html

 

[Stephan A]

For a completely new system around £1,000 I would, just like in another recent thread, recommend Nubert electronic's nuPro A-300. You likely won't even need a subwoofer with those.

Genelecs are more expensive and, like most ADAM Audio models, you would still need to a separate volume control for ease of use.

ADAM Audio's ARTist 3 and ARTist 5 are pretty nice too (and within budget) but only have XLR, RCA and USB inputs whereas the nuPro A-300 features RCA, USB, TOSLINK and S/PDIF. They do not have DSP or remote control either.

However, if you are looking for floorstanders, I can vouch for ADAM Audio's ARTist 6, you should be able to get a nice B-Stock pair from Musikhaus Thomann within your budget (though you would still require some sort of preamp or at least a volume control, the gain knob on the back is not really practical day-to-day).

Of course there are other options available, both active and passive, I am just talking about those I am familiar with.

I have now followed up on the models you are suggesting. Have you demo'ed both the nuPro and the ARTist series? When I look on the specs on the ARTist 6, they only go down to 48 Hz which could worry me a bit since I would like to avoid a subwoofer - especially if I go with floorstands since I thought this was one of the main reasons to buy floorstands.

When it comes to the nuPro, I found a review which I found very informative. In generel it sounds very promesing though but I would like to highlight a quote "Solid resolving power meets long-term comfort. What more could one want for the money? Perhaps a tick more sorting accuracy in the soundstage; or a tad more three-dimensional plasticity which often are the strengths of small two-way monitors?". I am not too familiar with all the terms yet so correct me if I understand it wrongly, but as I interpret it, I won't get the most detailed sound image where you would be able to "follow" the sound moving around you. As I stated earlier, I was very impressed with detail and "3D effect", big soundstage and detail, or what you call it, from the Monitor Audio Silver 1.

A pair of Silver 1 goes for 560£ in Denmark where I can get nuPro 300 for 920 £ and the ARTist 6 for 910 £. So, if taken into consideration, that I would need an amp for the Silver 1 (or silver 2) speakers, I think that the price would be around the same among the 3 options listed above. When it comes to this matchup, where would I get the most for the money? Or would there be better options with my concerns taken into consideration?

Kind regards

 

[SpursGator]

If I lived in Denmark I would buy the 'Ellam Flex' 3-way floorstanders that Troels Gravesen is selling. He doesn't have a price but they've been for sale for awhile and you could probably speak some Danish with him and talk him down a little. And they are pick-up only so you don't have too much competition.

http://www.troelsgravesen.dk/sale.htm

These are DIY-built speakers but Troels is probably the single greatest speaker designer on this planet who can/will share his knowledge with you. And these were built by him. They will probably cost your budget or a little more; I have no idea. You'll still have to buy a more-than-decent used amp (he could advise you).

But speakers this good are going to cost at least 8-10 grand if you bought them commercially. You happen to live within driving distance of a once in a lifetime buying opportunity for a set of speakers. The answer to your question about bang for buck is, 'DIY,' but of course that is only for a few who pursue the hobby.

Apologies since I realize this is not at all what you are seeking but I would be remiss to not share this with a good Dane. You should email Troels just in case these somehow are affordable. You can buy fancy electronics later (when this opportunity is long gone).

 

[matthewpiano]

I can only help with ideas for a passive system.

You live in a country that produces some of the finest passive speakers in the world. The two speaker brands that have given me the most pleasure are Dali and Dynaudio and I don't think you can go wrong with either. Combine Dali's Zensor 3s or, for a bit more, the Dynaudio DM2/6 with a good, basic integrated amp that focuses on the important things (IMO either a Rotel RA-10 or, for a bit more, the frankly superb Exposure 1010) and you've got the makings of an extremely talented system. I've owned a great deal of different kit and heard lots more, but I know that I couldn't comfortably improve my current system without spending serious cash and even then there would be no guarantees I would enjoy the music more than I am now.

There is a lot of average gear out there. Find the gems and you can get serious sound for affordable prices.

 

[matt49]

You live in a country that produces some of the finest passive speakers in the world. The two speaker brands that have given me the most pleasure are Dali and Dynaudio and I don't think you can go wrong with either.

Continuing the Danish theme: Audiovector!

Matt

 

[the record spot]

I've heard plenty of actives over the years and while the design may be advantageous over more traditional hifi separates, the differences aren't as enormous to the ear as you might think. Go out and listen to a few, but do make sure you check out some of the more traditional setups on offer too. They offer additional functionality, connectivity and so on, that might be a factor for you. I'd considered the active route before, but settled on the setup I have now, which sounds excellent.

 

[radiorog]

How long is a piece of string?

Usually about the same length as the average basic domestic hifi interconnect cable.

But it's probably best to avoid string altogether and use wireless ethernet.

JC

I had a piece of string once, that was about 30-40cm long.it was very useful on many occasions.

 

[jcbrum]

 

[SpursGator]

You live in a country that produces some of the finest passive speakers in the world. The two speaker brands that have given me the most pleasure are Dali and Dynaudio and I don't think you can go wrong with either.

Continuing the Danish theme: Audiovector!

Matt

And for that matter, GamuT, not cheap but impressive.