Dealers offering advice on this site.

[The_Lhc]

I also would take 'all' the opions in a forum with a pinch of salt. The majority of recommendations may be posted by people who have only read a magazine or an advert about the product in question. Then regurgitate this information as gospel.

Yes I find that far more irritating than any dealer's opinion, at least you can have a fair degree of confidence that the dealer has actually heard what they're recommending.

 

[chebby]

I have not heard any 1930's Klangfilm speakers.

I think they were on the musical boat...

 

[nopiano]

I have not heard any 1930's Klangfilm speakers.

I'd not even heard of them. But I did find a fascinating website compiled by fans of said brand.

I'm not persuaded that I would feel my dealer was less well equipped to help had he equally never heard of them!

 

[BenLaw]

I have not heard any 1930's Klangfilm speakers.

I think they were on the musical boat...

I confess, I did wonder if it was a typo:

 

[BenLaw]

Agreed, nopiano.

If I went into a BMW dealership and the salesman started talking about Mercedes that would be a little silly no !

The proper analogy is probably walking into a second hand car dealer (lots of modern makes of car) and the dealer starting to tell you how they're nothing compared to Genevieve!

 

[Alec]

I also would take 'all' the opions in a forum with a pinch of salt. The majority of recommendations may be posted by people who have only read a magazine or an advert about the product in question. Then regurgitate this information as gospel.

Quite. Its often obvious, but no one ever owns up to it; "well, the mag said...", unless they write for the mag.

I'd be surprised if i hadnt done something similar though.

EDIT - And who is Crivens?

 

[Andrew Everard]

EDIT - And who is Crivens?

It's a typo

 

[Lee H]

EDIT - And who is Crivens?

Not a Pratchett reader then al?

 

[TheHomeCinemaCentre]

... Having been doing this for just over 20 years, and working for 3 or 4 different dealers, so I've heard many products, and will get involved in threads where people are asking opinions on used stuff - only yesterday I was advising someone about buying a used power amplifier. This has been a hobby of mine for over 30 years now, and I've heard a fair amount of stuff from the 80's too...

If I may, David, I'd like to ask you a series of questions. I'd also like to throw out these questions to any other dealers who post on this forum. Or indeed, anyone else who'd like to answer them.

The aim of these questions is to gauge the breadth of your experience on hi-fi components. To see how much experience you have of kit that isn't normally sold through UK hi-fi dealerships.

The reason for asking is that most of the dealers I've met have extensive knowledge of the kit that they've stocked, but limited or no knowledge of kit outside the dealership sphere. Which is fair enough. We can't all be experts on everything. It just helps to put into context where their advice and opinions are coming from.

Which radio broadcast record players have you heard?

Which statement direct drive Japanese turntables from the 1970's and 1980's have you heard?

Which LDR or TVC or stepped attenuator based passive pre-amps / volume controls have you heard in passive pre-amp friendly systems?

Which SET valve power amplifiers have you heard?

Which "Class A" solid state amplifiers have you heard?

Which 1930's to 1980's Bozak, Altec, JBL, EV, Klangfilm, Vitavox speakers have you heard?

Which pre 1980's cinema or theatre speakers have you heard with a hi-fi system?

Which professional active speakers have you heard?

Which field coil speakers have you heard?

And when I say heard I don't mean a few minutes at some trade show. I mean heard in your own system or in a demonstration / bake-off against known references.

I can answer none or no to most of these but I do not think that makes my opinion invalid or in anyway stops me helping my customers. I do not answer posts relating to your questions as I have insufficient knowledge but as has already been mentioned these questions are rare on this forum or others that I participate in.

Where I answer it is normally through direct experience with a view to help - and there are plenty of new users who appear to need some assistance. I have little experience in your chosen area but having supplied and installed millions of pounds of equipment, year on year has its benefits. Certianly I believe my expericence is more than enough for me to have a handle on the part of the industry I work in and crucially for me offer a high level of service to my customers.

 

[richardw42]

Personally I welcome the contribution. Whilst most of us are probably a bit over enthusiastic about recommending our own stuff. And will prob have quite a limited experience of what's out there. I find the dealer contributions seem very unbiased and helpful. They have much broader experience and never have I thought they've been anything other than genuinely helpful. I'm sue if there was anything to worry about WHF would step in.

 

[The_Lhc]

EDIT - And who is Crivens?

Not a Pratchett reader then al?

He didn't invent "Crivens!" ya scunner!

 

[Lee H]

EDIT - And who is Crivens?

Not a Pratchett reader then al?

He didn't invent "Crivens!" ya scunner!

But in my head, it'll only be associated with the Nac Mac Feegle

 

[The_Lhc]

EDIT - And who is Crivens?

Not a Pratchett reader then al?

He didn't invent "Crivens!" ya scunner!

But in my head, it'll only be associated with the Nac Mac Feegle

Ah, I have Seth Govan to thank.

 

[John Duncan]

Whereas I tend to think of it as an Oor Wullie/Broons thing. But then I have to since my brother wrote them.

I remember going out with somebody a long time ago who wondered what a boab (pronounced bow-ahb, as in "help ma boab!") was...

 

[John Duncan]

Ah, I have Seth Govan to thank.

I had to look him up - didn't know he was Guthrie's brother...

 

[The_Lhc]

Ah, I have Seth Govan to thank.

I had to look him up - didn't know he was Guthrie's brother...

Yes, he always has been as well.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm with you there Lee!

 

[Anonymous]

For a complete AV novice like myself I welcome different retailers comments/advice/opinions. Nobody is holding a gun to my head saying "You must buy from my shop or else". I'm not naive enough to think because a certain retailer suggests a certain system or pairing then that must be the perfect setup for my house and more importantly my ears and taste. You can't buy experience, and for this reason it pays to learn from people who know more about the subject than I do whether it be WHF staff, retailers or some of the people on here who kindly give people like myself good advice without any sort of hidden agenda. Long may it continue.

P.S. My wife would say that all I get when I come on here is bad advice because it keeps costing us a fortune!!! ray:

 

[Anonymous]

P.S. My wife would say that all I get when I come on here is bad advice because it keeps costing us a fortune!!! ray:

Good hi-fi doesn't have to cost a fortune, below £2k (complete) should get you to an extremely high standard more or less 100% dependent upon the recording quality.

And yes - some dealers can help you get there

 

[CnoEvil]

And yes - some dealers can help you get there

....yes, but only if they can answer Lindsayt's questionaire.

 

[KiwiMoto]

y'know i just wonder if some people are 'anti dealer' full stop.I think you can safely say that when someone does A/V full time and is passionate about it enough to spend time answering all the (sometimes dumb) questions on here they should be given encouragement!

I used to sell A/V at retail years ago,and believe me putting up with people that say stupid things like "could you take the top off that amp for me,i think i'll build one myself" after you've spent an hour doing a demo is enough to warrant a medal IMO :wall:

 

[jaxwired]

How cynical can you get!

I for one am very happy to read advice from anyone in the business. They have experience a consumer can't possibly obtain. And if they get a sale out of it occassionally, so what...

 

[Anonymous]

My 10p worth, for what it's worth...

There are good dealers, and not so good dealers. I've been to a few over the years and they range from the

1. Worst - "quite obvious which bit of kit they make the most commission on as they extole the virtues of it, almost exclusively and make slight digs at other products",

through 2. Slightly annoying - "gentle, friendly persuasion via almost subliminal cues",

to 3. Best - "only gives advice where asked for and NEVER tells you which components they prefer unless you force it out of them".

A good dealer will never tell you what to hear, or to spend 10% on cables, or reference magazine reviews.

Mentioning no names, I've bought a system from one in the first category... "Let me save you some money" - he said, "This amplifier is every bit as good as the one you've chosen, and £100 cheaper"... The fact that they had sole distribution rights to the particular brand wouldn't have anything to do with it would it? £££

Going to a dealer in the 2nd category is harder to spot... "Listen to the way the treble simply sparkles"... And suddenly, it does... It's an amazing thing the human brain, someone tells you to think about porridge...and you will. Anyone remember the song by Captain sensible...a cover version I know, but the one that went "Happy happy talking happy talk...talk about things you like to do...If you don't have a dream....etc"... Now some of you reading will have that in your head for the rest of the day!

The 3rd category dealer is harder to find, but luckily I got it with my last bunch of purchases... I called the shots, got to borrow demo equipment and take it home, and let me simply get on with it. Advice was given when I asked, but he almost refused to say which he preferred...That, I like. He even said to listen to the kit, not the reviews, which I think all too many people seem to do.

Some dealer advice on this site is useful, but where they start to a) Compare kit they have never tried, maybe claiming x is better than y because x is more expensive (even having never heard y), then I know not to take anything they say seriously.

Good dealer advice will be open and fair, truthful and based only on fact, not assumptions...

Again, mentioning no names, I have seen good and bad dealer advice on these forums...

 

[lindsayt]

:rofl: It would appear the pupils are now setting the exam.

It would appear some of the "pupils" have a broader range of knowledge on the subject than the "teachers". Whilst the "teachers" have more in depth knowledge of their specialist topics within the subject.

To continue your analogy: what if you've got a geography teacher who has rarely travelled abroad, but who has travelled in the UK extensively with a pupil who has lived in 15 different countries including the UK? They will each have a different perspective on the world.