Building a Home Media Server

[Feral]

Also consider a platinum rated PSU which is more expensive initially but more efficient thus saving energy/cost long term/the environment and of course creating less waste heat in your cupboard under the stairs - both aspects quite important if your machine is going to be working it's ass off round the clock.

Isn't that more for gaming?

you do tend to see the PSU market aimed at gaming rigs but you'll tend to find that they are more efficient , offer a more stable power supply on all connections and are modular giving you more options for wiring but appreciate they are doing this for you so less of a bonus unless you want to upgrade. The pitfall with enthusiast PC components (much like hifi for that matter) is that you can over spec for you requirements.

Even with your current spec with 8tb mirrored drives using make MKV lets say you rip the films at 40gb you are still almost at the capacity of your current library. I would be more inclined to go with a synology 1815 (8 bay) or 1515 (5 bay) NAS with expansion space and the option for add-on units. In addition the software which comes with the NAS is great, stable and hosts my FLAC rips as well as my film collection.

I found that once you get over the pleasure of being able to browse your library through an app rather than rifling through a mountain of discs you'll realise that the storage is sting in the tail. I paid for some software which will rip the files to smaller sizes without sacrificing the quality as i was running out of space quite quickly which forced me to unraid my 2tb disks until i could afford to get a pair of 8tb WD Reds.

I would have a play and see if you can notice the difference between a Rip and a compressed rip as you might change your mind about the approach. I went through the same questions but hit a block when there were no player which would play the ISO image so had to find alternative solutions, esp when the oppo firmware removed that ability i had previously been considering getting one.

 

[pauln]

Also consider a platinum rated PSU which is more expensive initially but more efficient thus saving energy/cost long term/the environment and of course creating less waste heat in your cupboard under the stairs - both aspects quite important if your machine is going to be working it's ass off round the clock.

Isn't that more for gaming?

No. The CPU is crunching numbers whether gaming, rendering 3D CAD models or video transcoding; all are very CPU intensive which means it uses more power. Energy used is related to work done in any system not just computing. If you are doing a lot of encoding, your processor should ideally be running at 100% on all cores/threads, therefore using more electricity and producing more waste heat depending upon the efficiency of the PSU. Your unventilated understair cupboard may get rather warm. Essentially, machines that are marketed as suitable for gaming, video editing, rendering, CAD workstations etc will have considerably more powerful components than are required for general office work such as word, excel and so on. Expect to pay at least £2000 - that includes 16TB storage and 256TB SSD boot drive.

You are essentially making a machine whose primary function is video encoding rather than being a media server. Different kettle of fish altogether. The optimum set up from a speed/cost pov might be a quad core i7 together with a cuda enabled graphics card (or even two of them with a suitable motherboard), the faster (i.e. more expensive) the better. I don't think RAM makes as much difference but if you went for a set up as described, 16GB might be optimal. All this means you will need a higher power psu of maybe 650W (Seasonic Platinum highly recommended) and better cooling - maybe an aftermarket cpu cooler and extra case fans.

The more you spend the faster it will be but there may come a point where you are bottlenecked by HDD write speed or Blu Ray drive read speed. I can't remember. I would also recommend getting a 'standard' type of case, optimised for efficient cooling (Fractal Design, Silverstone, Corsair) rather than an HTPC style case and definitely not something fanless. That also gives you a lot more space for hard drives, now or in the future. Incidentally, it's currently more economical to buy two x 4TB drives than one x 8TB if you have space for them; also, the 8TB drives are quite new and there is little available data on failure rates yet. You can also obviously connect external HDD's via USB, either for back up or extra storage.

There is a wealth of information about all this kind of stuff on the web.

Edit:

This case is regarded as one of the very best for cooling efficiency/quietness with it's unconventional layout:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Silverstone-SST-FT02B-Black-Aluminium-Mid-Tower-Case-with-USB-3-0-/152231070383?hash=item2371adcaaf:g:T8wAAOSwgZ1Xr0Iz

(I have it's predecessor, the FT01)

As you are putting it in a cupboard, I presume size and design doesn't matter too much?

 

[bigboss]

Also consider a platinum rated PSU which is more expensive initially but more efficient thus saving energy/cost long term/the environment and of course creating less waste heat in your cupboard under the stairs - both aspects quite important if your machine is going to be working it's ass off round the clock.

Isn't that more for gaming?

you do tend to see the PSU market aimed at gaming rigs but you'll tend to find that they are more efficient , offer a more stable power supply on all connections and are modular giving you more options for wiring but appreciate they are doing this for you so less of a bonus unless you want to upgrade. The pitfall with enthusiast PC components (much like hifi for that matter) is that you can over spec for you requirements.

Even with your current spec with 8tb mirrored drives using make MKV lets say you rip the films at 40gb you are still almost at the capacity of your current library.  I would be more inclined to go with a synology 1815 (8 bay) or 1515 (5 bay) NAS with expansion space and the option for add-on units.  In addition the software which comes with the NAS is great, stable and hosts my FLAC rips as well as my film collection.

I found that once you get over the pleasure of being able to browse your library through an app rather than rifling through a mountain of discs you'll realise that the storage is sting in the tail.  I paid for some software which will rip the files to smaller sizes without sacrificing the quality as i was running out of space quite quickly which forced me to unraid my 2tb disks until i could afford to get a pair of 8tb WD Reds.

I would have a play and see if you can notice the difference between a Rip and a compressed rip as you might change your mind about the approach.  I went through the same questions but hit a block when there were no player which would play the ISO image so had to find alternative solutions, esp when the oppo firmware removed that ability i had previously been considering getting one.

 

 

Thanks. HD sound and Atmos is important for me. I think it's better to go uncompressed, especially when I'll eventually upgrade to 4K which may show the difference between compressed and uncompressed better.

 

[bigboss]

Thanks pauln. I think the size still matters, because at the moment I can't find enough space in the cupboard. I may put a shelf up.

 

[bigboss]

Kustompcs will get back to me by tomorrow with suggestions.

 

[Q5]

Kustompcs will get back to me by tomorrow with suggestions.

Have you tried Allan@idealav

 

[bigboss]

Kustompcs will get back to me by tomorrow with suggestions.

Have you tried Allan@idealav

 

Allan deals with Innuos, and I'm already in touch with David at Frank Harvey regarding this.

 

[Feral]

I'm running a copy of dredd with lossless audio and I'll let you know the file size. I use pavtube bytecopy and video converter ultimate, I need to check with an atmos disc if I have one to see if it will recognise the format and rip losslessly.

 

[Q5]

He has a link on his website for media servers, can't paste with IE and Win10, it is under home-theatre-media-servers

 

[bigboss]

Thanks Q5! That's something new I didn't notice! Just emailed Dave Whitworth.

 

[bigboss]

I'm running a copy of dredd with lossless audio and I'll let you know the file size. I use pavtube bytecopy and video converter ultimate, I need to check with an atmos disc if I have one to see if it will recognise the format and rip losslessly.

Thanks!

 

[bigboss]

Thanks Q5! That's something new I didn't notice! Just emailed Dave Whitworth.

Got a response already!

"The HTPC would feature the Kodi Media Player Software which is a free download, you can read all about it here KODI . This will catalogue and playback your blurays all in a very slick looking and easy to use interface that will update the library of films as your collection grows.

The HTPC itself I stay away from slimline cases, I tend to go for something from Silverstone, they are a very good brand name at a reasonable price. This type of HTPC case will be a similar size to an AV receiver so a decent sized unit, but they are far easier to work on and have plenty of room inside the case so you have good airflow and no overheating issues, plus there is loads of storage space to install extra hard drives to upgrade as your blurays grow.

Slimline cases are very awkward to work on and really restrict the choice of components you can use to build the HTPC, and any potential upgrades in the future.

The Kodi media player doesn`t really work with bluray menus so it`s not much use for the bonus features on a disc, so what I would do is to “strip out” all the bonus features of every bluray you add to the HTPC library so you just have the film itself. This remuxing process will be quite daunting to a beginner but I have produced a full step by step guide including screenshots on how to do this, so once you`ve done it a couple of times it is a simple process. It is well worth all the effort as you will have instant access to any film you select and it also saves you a lot of storage space so you can fit more blurays on. A full bluray rip might be 40gb filesize or more, but the film itself may only be 25-30gb filesize.

To give you an idea how many “film only” blurays you could fit onto a hard drive: -

A 2TB hard drive will store approx 60 films.

A 3TB hard drive will store approx 90 films.

A 4TB hard drive will store approx 120 films.

So anything with 6TB + of storage will give you loads of space.

I will add that 3D playback of blurays is not really feasible in this way so if 3D playback is important to you I would keep your standalone bluray player for your 3D films.

A fully built system like this starts in the region of £1000 depending on the exact spec required. When you look at building this level of HTPC there`s not many areas where you can save money on costs, pc components alone can total over £800 and their prices do tend to fluctuate a bit as well.

That should give you an idea of what`s involved and the direction I would go on a build. If you need any more information please feel free to email me and I`ll help in any way I can."

 

[Feral]

Dredd came out at 8.98gb with the DTS-HD soundtrack.

I have The Man from Uncle with Atmos and that showed as TrueHD 6 channel audio so will run that through and check how long it takes and report on the size tomorrow. Not sure if that is the same as atmos but good to experiment.

 

[Feral]

57 mins to create lossess MKV with the TrueHD audio and the file came in at 19gb. I set another run run going to transcode the video to x.264 same frame rate, size and quality, i excluded other audio and foreign language subtitble but you should always include subtitles (forced) as you would be surprise how many films have small sections which you only realise after sitting down to watch.

I'm trying to see if i can find a way to transcode the video with x.265 leaving the audio as lossess but the investigation continues.

 

[bigboss]

Thanks Feral! It'll probably take me a year to rip my entire collection.

 

[bigboss]

Got further response to my queries including quote:

"These media players such as Kodi don`t support the advanced menu structure and copy protection systems on blurays as they didn`t want to trigger the Cinavia playback issues. So when you are browsing your films and select one to play it will not display any menu screens for scene selections, and if you remux the discs to just have the film on its own it will start playing instantly, far quicker than a normal player would.

It will keep chapter marks though so you can skip through chapters to find any specific scenes.

Apart from the really expensive HTPC cases, IR control is an extra option. You can have a Media Centre IR remote control that comes with a USB IR receiver, this receiver normally is placed on top of the case or at the side on the same shelf just as long as it has line of sight to the remote.

I`m pretty sure these type of HTPC remotes will be in the Harmony database to setup on the remote you have now, if not you could easily use the feature of copying the IR commands from the media centre remote to your Harmony.

This Silverstone case is a good example, http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=488&area=enhttp://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=488&area=en , it also lists the dimensions at the bottom of the page. This case can have 3 internal drives. There is also the model GD07 that is bigger internally and can have 7 drives, but I wouldn`t recommend having so many inside as you still need some internal breathing space and good airflow.

The GD09 case would be a good place to start and you can always add a NAS drive setup later on as your collection grows and storage space runs out.

It wouldn`t autorip blurays as such but you can setup the ripping software to open as soon as it reads the bluray disc, then you just click to start ripping the disc.

I have no experience with Linux at all so it would be Windows based, and yes the OS and other software will be on a separate SSD.

I have priced up a system built using the Silverstone Grandia GD09 case. The spec would have Windows 10, 8gb system memory, Intel i5 Quad Core CPU and upgraded quiet CPU fan cooler, 240gb SSD for OS and 2 x 4TB drives for storage, wireless keyboard and mouse, media remote and IR USB receiver, bluray read / write drive.

A system of this spec would cost £1100 plus delivery.

Kodi used to be able to play 3D but only the SBS format, similar to 3D on Sky TV, but this is half the resolution of 3D blurays and you had to try and convert the bluray to this poorer SBS version and it was all a bit hit and miss and the quality suffered as well.

But I`ve had a look on the Kodi site and it does appear that the latest version supports 3D blurays ripped as an iso so should work if that`s the case, but not being a 3D fan myself I`ve not tested this personally."

Price doesn't seem bad. Will it be noisy?

 

[pauln]

I have priced up a system built using the Silverstone Grandia GD09 case. The spec would have Windows 10, 8gb system memory, Intel i5 Quad Core CPU and upgraded quiet CPU fan cooler, 240gb SSD for OS and 2 x 4TB drives for storage, wireless keyboard and mouse, media remote and IR USB receiver, bluray read / write drive.

A system of this spec would cost £1100 plus delivery...

...Price doesn't seem bad. Will it be noisy?

Sounds like a reasonable price. You could specify 'quiet' CPU & case fans (Scythe, Noctua) and an Asus motherboard with Fan Expert 3 software that enables you to easily control the fan speeds dependent on temperature so that they only spin up when required. Same with the PSU, as mentioned earlier, high efficiency combined with fan control means the fan only spins up when required and indeed Silverstone make fanless PSUs but you need good case cooling.

The other main source of noise is from mechanical HDDs and this can be reduced by soft mounting them with rubber grommets.

I have to admit that I am a bit obssessive about quiet computers, the intrusiveness of the noise obviously depends on the ambient noise levels where you live; by a busy main road or, as I do, in the depths of the countryside.

Hope that helps.

 

[Feral]

Are you comfortable with PC components and messing around inside the box? Asking because some of the tweaks are easy but if you are not comfortable messing around then it can be a bit daunting and you might be better getting something built to spec. The old adage of beware of overspeccing applies but there are plenty of good companies that can build and over lock for you like Scan, overclockers.co.uk (my current water cooled rig). Worth having a play as you would be surprised how easy it is and you can upgrade parts yourself much cheaper than getting someone to do it for you. For example, I took the bluray drive from my broken vaio laptop and installed that in my rig to back up by bluray collection.

btw I've raised a query with pavetube to see if they have a way of keeping the lossless audio with H.265 video compression. The h.265 files are .mp4 extension but the shield plays pretty much anything you can throw at it. I'll share their reply once I get it.

 

[bigboss]

Thanks Feral. With an almost 3 year old toddler running around the house, I don't think I'll be comfortable building it myself. I'm sure it'll be easy, but I think it's best for me to get one fully assembled. I've asked Aclass whether they can use a Silverstone chassis, they'll get back to me with a quote on Monday.

 

[Feral]

I don't bother building myself but happy to swap out cpu fans, add drives and other peripherals. Can be a pain making sure all drivers and parts are compatible.

 

[bigboss]

I don't bother building myself but happy to swap out cpu fans, add drives and other peripherals. Can be a pain making sure all drivers and parts are compatible.

Oh yes, I'm happy swapping things over if needed.

 

[bigboss]

Received a response from Kustom PCs today:

To confirm, this is quoted as a PC system configured with all updates and drivers installed, but I’m afraid we can’t offer a configuration service beyond general software installation – simply, that would often require ongoing support so the position for us is at the price we offer computer assembly at, it covers hardware related assistance only, although of course I can try to keep you in the right direction in software setup.

Will detail some component choices and additional options to adjust below –

Case – Picked the Streacom FC10 Alpha as you already said you like these. The FC10 is one of the larger cases, but that gives room for good storage expansion, providing a smaller form factor motherboard is used. Eg using Mini ITX board allows 5 hard disks to be used. It looks smart and provides passive silent CPU cooling too, but is quite expensive.

If you needed to lower the cost, changing to a Fractal Node 605 would save about £150 (with saving in power supply type considered too) but would result in a system with some fan sound, although spending £30 or so on a Noctua CPU cooler would eliminate most of that again.

Processor – [/b]Aiming to strike a balance of performance and cost, I’ve suggested the i5-6400 which is an entry level quad core CPU which should handle encoding and streaming / transcoding simultaneously with ease. I3-6100 would be a reasonable option (dual core, saves £57) but at the same time, I wouldn’t bother with going much higher. I7 models are a little quicker but add a lot of extra cost but also get significantly warmer in operation (more than their TDP rating from Intel would suggest) so aren’t ideal in a passive HTPC system. For transcoding, eg sharing to non-PC media devices using an app like Plex, they H170N-WIFI - this has dual HDMI outputs (ideal if you ever need to run both TV and projector for instance) and 6 x SATA ports for plenty of storage expansion. Fitted with 1 x 8GB DDR4 memory module (second slot available to double this at a later date if required)

Storage – Included suitable slot feed Blu-Ray drive for the case, a 120GB SSD to boot operating system from (this is not strictly necessary though, could partition hard disk for operating system and data storage and do without SSD if fast responsiveness is not required) and than a 6TB WD Red hard disk. WD Red drives are quiet, power efficient and designed for home server use – not the cheapest, but engineered to be reliable. A 4TB model is £82 cheaper and represents slightly better value, but of course smaller disks would limit long term expandability. There’s easily room to install 4 disks with the current motherboard and case combination though so that’s 16TB if using 4TB disks or 24TB if using 6TB disks (or they could be mixed).

Networking – Motherboard includes wired Ethernet and Wireless AC Networking built in.

OS / Assembly – [/b]Windows 7 Home Premium hasn’t been available for a while, although can still get Win 7 Professional for about 1 more month before it’s removed from sale. As a business operating system it’s more expensive, and really it’s got to the stage where Windows Media Centre is getting a bit irrelevant – it needs numerous botches to make it relevant to modern media and ultimately isn’t being supported now, where packages like Kodi have support for many plugins to extend functionality and make a front-end more flexible than TVs. Would suggest using Win 10 as it’s cheaper than Win 7 Pro and is going to be supported longer into the future. Kodi can be used as a front-end (if required), Plex can be installed to enable media sharing and transcoding, either through DLNA (pretty much every Smart TV should support this) or through the Plex App (available on some Smart TVs). The guide I linked to below will give steps for setting up unattended blu-ray rips.

System assembly includes any items like additional cabling, materials like thermal paste, setting the system up with all updates and your choice of applications eg web browser, free office / security software if needed. Systems include a software recovery image to bring them back to day 1 condition, and have a 2 year hardware warranty. Computer assembly / testing time is 1 week, including stress tests on memory, CPU, graphics and disks, as well as checking that all ports and network devices operate within specification.

 

[Xanderzdad]

That looks a more sensible and considered spec than previous postings BB.

His comments about all of it look realistic and considered. Similar to my combined Media Server / work PC (which sits 12" to my left and is totally silent).

 

[bigboss]

That looks a more sensible and considered spec than previous postings BB.

His comments about all of it look realistic and considered.  Similar to my combined Media Server / work PC (which sits 12" to my left and is totally silent).

Yes, that's exactly what I thought as well. The quoted price is reasonable too, with them charging £57 for the build.

 

[bigboss]

What are the advantages of a media server over NAS? I already have an external blu ray drive. I can buy a NAS and rip all films directly into it.