Question Advice about buying a Marantz CD6007, sellling my CD-63 MkII KI-Signature

[WayneHarris]

Hi folks

I have owned a Marantz CD63 MkII KI Signature CD Player for many years…it’s still working perfectly with zero issues, but I’m wanting something better and more modern..and to be able to play FLAC files via USB

I have a cash buyer for my old CD63 next week and I was going to put my money on the sale to buy the Marantz CD6007 from Richer Sounds next week, but now I’m hearing about an issue with the DAC installed not being the one advertised?!!? it is not the AK4490 as Marantz state, but an ESS ES9010 K2M??

How do I get one with the AK chip? Is there a way to tell with serial numbers?

Naughty naughty Marantz!!

Home

Can this turbo-charged CD player still stir our souls 22 years on?

www.whathifi.com

View: https://youtu.be/v7kdz77iSgI?si=7sGPex2CZnEzV44u

 

[podknocker]

There has been a shortage of silicon chips, for HIFI, cars and other devices. I don't think Marantz were trying to deceive anyone, just using a substitute part, of equal quality.

There was and probably still is, a delay in the support and delivery chain and that's why sites were advertising the wrong chip, 2 or 3 years after the fire at the AK factory.

I would doubt very much anyone could hear the difference between an ESS or AK chip in this CD player.

 

[Al ears]

Indeed, the dac chip installed is probably irrelevant when it comes to actually auditioning

 

[Gray]

There's every chance that there could be the usual (subtle) difference in sound.
Let's face it, if the DAC wasn't an important component, they wouldn't list it in the specs.

But every manufacturer says that 'specifications are subject to change without notice' - and that's what's happened.

A more important question might be how much better will a 6007 be than a 'perfectly working' KI model?
But that's a done deal, so let's hope it is better 👍

 

[Dom]

ESS are an excellent manufacturer of DAC chips, I wouldn't worry about the change.

 

[Symples]

I am not so sure that the CD6007 is an upgrade to the CD63KI.... only an audition would tell.

I would seriously consider the Marantz CD60 instead (extra cost of course)

 

[podknocker]

I am not so sure that the CD6007 is an upgrade to the CD63KI....

I thought that straight away! Ken certainly knew his stuff. I've always loved the Marantz sound.

As I mentioned in another thread, new CD players can't sound much better than old ones.

The Red Book standard is the same spec and there is very little to modify/upgrade.

 

[nopiano]

I am not so sure that the CD6007 is an upgrade to the CD63KI.... only an audition would tell.

I would seriously consider the Marantz CD60 instead (extra cost of course)

Indeed, or maybe even the new Arcam CD5 if it’s as good as the rave review suggests. Apologies to the OP for doubling your budget - just try the 6007 before you get your credit card out!

 

[podknocker]

Indeed, or maybe even the new Arcam CD5 if it’s as good as the rave review suggests.

This new Arcam Radia range looks very capable and I bet hey all sound really good, but I just think it's a bit late in the day to be asking £699 for a CD player.

If you have a Marantz CD player and want to upgrade, the CD6007 is a bargain, along with the matching amp.

If you're new to HIFI, the Marantz should give you decent sound quality for years. The Arcam is expensive.

 

[nopiano]

This new Arcam Radia range looks very capable and I bet hey all sound really good, but I just think it's a bit late in the day to be asking £699 for a CD player.

Do you mean that price was justifiable a couple of years ago, but not in 2023?

There have been several new CD players launched recently, including a new one from Exposure, the Hegel Viking and the Marantz CD60 mentioned above. Audiolab have released to further transports, more costly than the CDT6000 which has been so successful. And if you’re minted Esoteric and Luxman have new models north of £10k!

 

[podknocker]

Do you mean that price was justifiable a couple of years ago, but not in 2023?

There have been several new CD players launched recently, including a new one from Exposure, the Hegel Viking and the Marantz CD60 mentioned above. Audiolab have released to further transports, more costly than the CDT6000 which has been so successful. And if you’re minted Esoteric and Luxman have new models north of £10k!

I think £399 is enough for the machinery required to play a 40 year old format.

I don't believe there is anything available now, that wasn't say 20 years ago, that would improve the sound quality of a CD.

The Red Book standard is over 4 decades old and it really is set in stone.

You can get quicker transports and improve power supplies, but there's not much tweaking left now.

 

[good_enough]

I thought that straight away! Ken certainly knew his stuff. I've always loved the Marantz sound.

As I mentioned in another thread, new CD players can't sound much better than old ones.

The Red Book standard is the same spec and there is very little to modify/upgrade.

My Roksan K3 sounds infinitely better than the Marantz CD6000 OSE it replaced. Not in the same galaxy let alone the same ballpark. It would be otiose to list the many dimensions in which it knocks the old deck upside its head.

I've read this sort of thing before. There are not only DACs but high precision clocks (which nobody writes about, but are incredibly important, hence the re-clocking kits that were around for old-school CD players) as well as analogue amp output stages in a CD player. They do not contain some sort of idealized laser pickup that automagically generates good sound because (sniff) it's digital, innit? Something has to get the pits in the CD to a 5V line output - and that 'something' varies.

You may wish to contemplate the contradiction between the two statements "The Red Book standard is the same spec and there is very little to modify/upgrade." and "Ken certainly knew his stuff. I've always loved the Marantz sound."

Which one is it? All I can say is that from my experience, Touraj also certainly knows his stuff.

 

[podknocker]

I

My Roksan K3 sounds infinitely better than the Marantz CD6000 OSE it replaced. Not in the same galaxy let alone the same ballpark. It would be otiose to list the many dimensions in which it knocks the old deck upside its head.

I've read this sort of thing before. There are not only DACs but high precision clocks (which nobody writes about, but are incredibly important, hence the re-clocking kits that were around for old-school CD players) as well as analogue amp output stages in a CD player. They do not contain some sort of idealized laser pickup that automagically generates good sound because (sniff) it's digital, innit? Something has to get the pits in the CD to a 5V line output - and that 'something' varies.

You may wish to contemplate the contradiction between the two statements "The Red Book standard is the same spec and there is very little to modify/upgrade." and "Ken certainly knew his stuff. I've always loved the Marantz sound."

Which one is it? All I can say is that from my experience, Touraj also certainly knows his stuff.

I think there was more scope 20 years ago to improve CD sound quality, with better quality peripheral circuits and components and power supplies.

The components used now for CD players are state of the art, but incapable of extracting any more quality from this 40 year old format.

 

[nopiano]

I think £399 is enough for the machinery required to play a 40 year old format.

I don't believe there is anything available now, that wasn't say 20 years ago, that would improve the sound quality of a CD.

The Red Book standard is over 4 decades old and it really is set in stone.

You can get quicker transports and improve power supplies, but there's not much tweaking left now.

I don’t agree, but I respect your opinion.

I’m guessing you’re also not a fan of multi-thousand £ turntables to replay a 70 year old format? 😉

 

[podknocker]

I don’t agree, but I respect your opinion.

I’m guessing you’re also not a fan of multi-thousand £ turntables to replay a 70 year old format? 😉

Indeed! I think vinyl and CD have reached a technical dead end and you can't squeeze anything else out of them.

 

[nopiano]

Indeed! I think vinyl and CD have reached a technical dead end and you can't squeeze anything else out of them.

I think you would have appreciated the system I heard at the Ascot Hifi show a couple of weekends ago. dCS Vivaldi stack (transport, DAC, clock and upsampler, about £130k), Robert Koda amps (don’t ask, they're handbuilt, about five sets a year), the new Magico S3 speakers (£57k a pair in standard finish), Transparent Opus cables cost more than a luxury car.

Extraordinarily musical and dramatic sound.

 

[podknocker]

I've not heard these expensive items, but we've had threads about this before.

There is a finite amount of information on a CD and building CD players costing these amounts is excessive.

Most of this engineering is there to provide a status symbol, for those with deep pockets.

I've seen and read about expensive CD players, costing £5000 and when you dig around a little, you find they use £7 Sanyo CD transports.

There's always been an exclusive, overpriced product claiming to sound far better, but the fact is, CD technology hasn't changed for decades.

All the components in a new CD player aren't much different in those made 20 or 30 years ago.

Again, CDs have finite information on them and newer kit can't add more quality.

I had a Sony 4k Blu Ray player at £249 and it sounded incredible.

I still refuse to accept spending silly money to playback vinyl or CD is going to sound like a new format.

Remember also, human hearing has finite ability to discern and appreciate sound.

 

[good_enough]

I

I think there was more scope 20 years ago to improve CD sound quality, with better quality peripheral circuits and components and power supplies.

The components used now for CD players are state of the art, but incapable of extracting any more quality from this 40 year old format.

Please comment when you've listened to a few and stop spouting theory.

Easy enough - just head to Richers with a pair of cans (they'll even supply those) and your own CDs.

Which is - umm - what I did when I went shopping.

From everything you've been posting, you'll surprise yourself.

 

[podknocker]

I play CDs very occasionally on my Audiolab Omnia which I've had 2 years and they sound great, comparable to the Sony 4k Blu Ray player I owned until very recently. I'm not disputing modern CD players don't sound better than they did 41 years ago, but I'm not going to buy a new CD player that will give me a great sound, but not vastly different to those I've owned over the last 4 decades. My point is that there can't be massive gains in performance, using tried and tested mechanics and electronics. I've played SACDs before on the now departed Sony 4k Blu Ray player and they did sound superb. Modern DACs can easily cope with the CD format and I think it's time to see more top end DACs in streamers and then we can hear what these chips can do. You do need the software to realise their potential obviously. Higher than CD quality files on streaming platforms is going to replace CD at some point, although there will still be die hard vinyl lovers, cherishing their discs. The CD drive in my Audiolab Omnia will be the last one I own. I can get CD quality, or above, streaming services and unless you have a vast vinyl, or CD collection, the future is streaming.

 

[Dave_]

I’m guessing you’re also not a fan of multi-thousand £ turntables to replay a 70 year old format? 😉

You can't polish a turd!

 

[matthewpianist]

@WayneHarris , I think you'd be living on a prayer to hear an airtight difference

The KI-Sig was a great CD player, and as good as the 6007 is, I don't think it will be an upgrade, though as always it depends on what kind of change in sound you're looking for.

 

[WayneKerr]

Higher than CD quality files on streaming platforms is going to replace CD at some point

Another hi-res believer... It's just not necessary, CD quality is more than good enough.

the future is streaming.

In your opinion... my opinion differs.

 

[podknocker]

Another hi-res believer... It's just not necessary, CD quality is more than good enough.

In your opinion... my opinion differs.

I don't necessarily think streaming needs higher than CD quality, which is great, but I do believe that streaming will replace CD eventually, as the vehicle for playing music.

CDs have been around for over 40 years and are still selling, whereas streaming is a fairly recent platform and it could take a while for most people to adopt this method.

I really don't think CD has another10 years and streaming will overtake CD, along with vinyl, as high quality streamers, headphones and portable devices arrive.

The number of streaming services and devices really has shot up recently.

I've mentioned before that I love CD quality sound, but why have a physical format, if you don't need one?

If your streaming service provides bit perfect copies of CDs, then your streamer of choice will give you the same quality, for less cost and without the storage problem.

 

[Dave_]

Another hi-res believer... It's just not necessary, CD quality is more than good enough.

It's utterly pointless (at least as far as playback is concerned) given the majority can't even distinguish between lossy and 16/44.1...

 

[podknocker]

It's utterly pointless (at least as far as playback is concerned) given the majority can't even distinguish between lossy and 16/44.1...

When I owned my Sony 4k Blu Ray player, I could hear the difference between the CD and SACD layers.

If people are not exposed to high res audio, then they cannot decide if they can hear an improvement, or not.

If all my music on CD had been available on SACD, I would now have 250 SACDs instead.

Every format available gives you an approximation of the original master recording in the studio.

Any streaming service able and willing to offer the closest match to this, is a winner in my book.