A converted sceptic

[Tarxman]

I think this forum has reached a real low point.

It's certainly a bit poor of late. There seem to be three posters whose primary aim is to antagonise the others.

Couldnt have put it better myself guys.

 

[steve_1979]

Just kidding Trev!

Trying to illustrate that us being silly has nothing to do with hi-fi or electronic or acoustic theory. Its just a co*ck fight at this point.

:beer: :beer: :beer: :beer:

Music!

Best post in this thread!

 

[ISAC69]

Hi CnoEvil :wave:

I absolutely agree with you expensive cables are certainly not a guarantee for a better sound , But I don't accept that some peoples here saying that all cables sound the same ,

I am intresting to know after hearing many different sort of cables what is your conclusion ?

I don't want to get embroiled again, but a few of my general conclusions are:

- I generally like companies that design and build their own cables (eg. Atlas, Cardas)

- I prefer all copper cables

- I haven't liked most Silver coated cables that I've heard

- Solid silver is better (than silver coated), but not matched with bright sounding electronics.

So yes, I have heard differences, but ime, it is vital to get the electonics right before experimenting.

:cheers:

 

[matthewpiano]

I think this forum has reached a real low point.

Condescending attitudes are also a negativity. Best to steer clear of things that annoy you and leave up to the moderator's judgment to keep things in order.

Not being condescending, just saying it like it is.

Oh, and don't tell me what to do.

 

[Vladimir]

I think this forum has reached a real low point.

Condescending attitudes are also a negativity. Best to steer clear of things that annoy you and leave up to the moderator's judgment to keep things in order.

Not being condescending, just saying it like it is.

Oh, and don't tell me what to do.

One could say the shoe is on the other foot.

 

[matthewpiano]

No. It isn't.

 

[Glacialpath]

Seems you guys missed me while I was away this weekend. Nice to see you all getting along swimmingly. There's no way I was going to read all the 100+ new posts from just 2 days.

I've been off making some music with my band The Air Turned To Acid. It seem it did here too. I thought I was in a hot room but the heat coming from this thread has made the weather (not Whenther) get warm and stuffy. Seems like a good old storm would clear the air and we could all be friends again.

You know I bet if we met in a pub somewhere without knowing who each other was but started chatting I'd bet we'd all get on pretty well. None of us know each other in person though some of you may do. There are obviously some very stubbon people on here, some the get worked up easilie, some who are clearly knolegable, some who think they are knolegable (including me haha) and some who don't have a clue.

We all have different experiences and different amounts of experience. I feel really sorry for the new comers to these forums. They are usually excited about their new set up or might have a question about something that isn't right with their set up. So they come on here looking to share their enthusiasum for Hi-Fi or wanting to get help but all we can do is show them what a bunch.....well put your own thoughts there.

Some people come on here thinking they might be asking the professionals from What Hi-Fi themselves but no they get us instead.

In the short time I've actually been posting on here I think i've been part of and witnessed the same amount of to put it franky, silly behaviour that some of you guys seem to have witnessed in the past 5,6 or more years. Yet you still go through it all again and again.

We are never going to convince each other anything outside of what we believe unless something like the London double blind test goes ahead. It may do.

I post my responces based on what I have experienced. People can't then join that responce and tell me what I'm saying is nonsence because they believe I'm wrong thus giving the person asking the question or sharing an opinion incorrect info.

So why don't make our respnoces with our own opinions and thoughts but without saying the other person doesn't know what they are talking about and let the OP make up their own mind. After all we don't know things for sure until we have experienced them for ourselves and there are time that no amount of someone telling us other wise will make us believe them.

 

[hifikrazy]

So a high end 300 watt amp sounds no different than a cheap 30 watter because they share some cheap electronic parts.

An expensive TV performs no better than a budget model because it’s the basically the same thing dressed in fancy clothes.

A Jag is no different than a Fiesta because both take their passengers from point A to B.

A mansion in The Hamptons is no different than a house in a Bombay slum because they’re just a roof over the head.

As a remedy for inferiority complex, I have to say it’s not actually a bad strategy to convince yourself of the above “truths”. I’m not materialistic and not saying that any of the above stuff really matters, but this kind of thinking is pure fantasy made up by people who feel the need to console themselves, and there seem to be quite a few hanging around this forum. Ironically they’re the ones accusing others of being delusional.

The above "truths" are strawmen arguments and not what was actually said at all.

The first two are directly credited to you actually.

"Expensive amplifiers can, and do, often use exactly the same parts as cheap ones because electronics is cheap. Those that do will invariable sound the same. "

"Of course the cheapie would probably be put in a cheap case and look rubbish, but that's beside the point. Much of the expensive stuff is cheaply made stuff dressed up"

Nope. I didn't say "a high end 300 watt amp sounds no different than a cheap 30 watter" or "An expensive TV performs no better than a budget model because it’s the basically the same thing dressed in fancy clothes". Actually.

Misrepresenting what I said is as bad as tossing out insults, IMO.

FWIW, expensive amplifiers are generally higher powered (hence the 300 watt example, although there are ultra expensive low powered SET amps) and cheaper ones tend to be lower powered hence the 30 watt illustration. I would apologise for misrepresenting you, but I don't think I am.

Your second quote was taken from a point you were making about plasma TVs... so again I don't think I'm misrepresenting you....IMO.

 

[TrevC]

So a high end 300 watt amp sounds no different than a cheap 30 watter because they share some cheap electronic parts.

An expensive TV performs no better than a budget model because it’s the basically the same thing dressed in fancy clothes.

A Jag is no different than a Fiesta because both take their passengers from point A to B.

A mansion in The Hamptons is no different than a house in a Bombay slum because they’re just a roof over the head.

As a remedy for inferiority complex, I have to say it’s not actually a bad strategy to convince yourself of the above “truths”. I’m not materialistic and not saying that any of the above stuff really matters, but this kind of thinking is pure fantasy made up by people who feel the need to console themselves, and there seem to be quite a few hanging around this forum. Ironically they’re the ones accusing others of being delusional.

The above "truths" are strawmen arguments and not what was actually said at all.

The first two are directly credited to you actually.

"Expensive amplifiers can, and do, often use exactly the same parts as cheap ones because electronics is cheap. Those that do will invariable sound the same. "

"Of course the cheapie would probably be put in a cheap case and look rubbish, but that's beside the point. Much of the expensive stuff is cheaply made stuff dressed up"

Nope. I didn't say "a high end 300 watt amp sounds no different than a cheap 30 watter" or "An expensive TV performs no better than a budget model because it’s the basically the same thing dressed in fancy clothes". Actually.

Misrepresenting what I said is as bad as tossing out insults, IMO.

FWIW, expensive amplifiers are generally higher powered (hence the 300 watt example, although there are ultra expensive low powered SET amps) and cheaper ones tend to be lower powered hence the 30 watt illustration. I would apologise for misrepresenting you, but I don't think I am.

Your second quote was taken from a point you were making about plasma TVs... so again I don't think I'm misrepresenting you....IMO.

I accept your apology.

 

[ISAC69]