Why British audio companies are so slow in embracing new technologies.

[NigelF]

I wonder why British companies are so slow in embracing new technologies, Cyrus stream products should have been in the market 2 years ago, there is still no sign if Roksan is planing to launch similar products. Naim also was very late. Arcam and Rega were also very late in launching DACs.

In the near future I would like to see more one box (DAC, Streaming, Amplification) solutions from premium audio companies which should also do integrations of iTunes Services, 24bit audio support, external storage support, wireless N & gigabit network support, multi-room possibility etc.

 

[AEJim]

You have to bear in mind that the market has to be ready for said technologies... You can come out with all kinds of weird and wonderful things but unless they are widely accepted by the public you'll be left with a lot of un-shifted boxes. As my question about moving from CD to streaming/Hard disk/USB as a source in a thread a couple of weeks ago seemed to indicate - most are happy with what they know.

You can overcome this with massive marketing to a degree but we're not all Apple budget-wise!

 

[Frank Harvey]

A small British company can buy in the technology and stick it in their own casework. Add this cost to what they've already paid, as well as a few other bits and bobs and software tweaking, it ends up costing far more than the product that has been 'cloned'. Some manufacturers have come under heavy criticism for doing this.

The other way of doing it is to produce your own product from the ground up. This costs a hell of a lot more to do initially as it involves tooling costs, software programming, and all the other bits and bobs I don't know about. Many man hours of R&D and fault finding/solving. Plenty of licences to pay too.

Small companies can probably get 'something' to retail quite quickly, but I think they'd rather produce a product that is 'their own', and to be certain that the hardware and software are working flawlessly before unleashing it onto the market.

Even after all this, there needs to be enough demand. Bringing a product out quickly is usually met with high prices, and users waiting for next generation products that will be cheaper. Very little demand means their initial costs are not recouped for a very long time.

I'm sure a manufacturer here can fill in better as I'm only going by what I think I know

 

[ROTH AV]

1. Will the investment in a new technology provide an adequate return and ensure that staff retain their livelihoods ? Research for 3 months. Or these days with massively increased risk....maybe longer.

2. Are there any third party license holders / issues that one needs to address before bringing a product to market ? If yes, add 2 months.

3. Do those tech license holders require testing to ensure adherence to their standards ? If yes and product passes, add 3 months. If yes and product fails, add 4 months.

4. Component supply - if bespoke then add 4 months (and UK brands try to do things better than anyone else so this is a likely 100% yes, especially considering the Brands listed by you above - they are all superb at what they do). If standard components, even then, lead-time can be 2 months or more.

5. Start production. QC. Soak test. Try to break what you've built so that your customers can't. Then do it all again. Twice. 6 weeks.

6. Ship into retailers, plan marketing, in-store training, tech support and then hope for the best. 1 month.

7. Oh look - the standards of the tech have changed and a "feature" has been added because someone has decided that "the market needs it", even though only 1 out of every 10,000,000 customers will use this feature....once...just to prove their new product has got it. But if 1 customer might use it.........

8. Start at Point 1.

Welcome to the world of HiFi design.

 

[Helmut80]

seems to be the hifi world in general, not UK brand specific, I think. And it seems that a large segment of the target audience can barely use a computer. Broad generalisation, yes.

 

[Anonymous]

I must say, I think I agree with Helmut.
While, yes the products are doubtless behind the technology (2 or 3 digital pre-amps on the market when the technology has been around 10 years) - i'm not sure the Brits are to blame. Isn't it more that its only British companies producing these products?

I mean who else apart from Naim/Audiolab/Cyrus make true Audiophile Digital pre-amps? or Music servers (in the case of Naim)?

Happy to be proven wrong

- maybe I am just to UK focussed?

 

[manicm]

I'm quite shocked at the responses here. Any hidden agendas?

To answer the OP, Linn was the first British (Scottish to be exact) maker to release the first audiophile digital streamers on the market, which was nearly 4 years ago, starting with their still top-line Linn Klimax DS.

In fact, were it not for the Transporter (subsequently bought by Logitech), Linn would have been the first worldwide.

 

[Anonymous]

ashworth_rich:

Happy to be proven wrong

- maybe I am just to UK focussed?

Would not say that is a bad thing at all! Most good quality audio products are UK designed or built. We also make the best high end kit, short of Krell (Who have went downhill recently and superceeded by Musical Fidelity and Chord in the pre/power market). We also have a bunch of the best cable manufacturers (Chord, Studio Connections (Abbey Road).. infact all cable manufacturers nearly) and arguably the best speaker manufacturers (B&W, ProAc to name a few) We're probably the leading country when it comes to audio equipment heritage, infact, not even probably. Definetly (Hence why Americans go nuts for Hi-Fi with "Made in the United Kingdom" on it!).

I also think along with some others, many of the 'Sound quality' nuts, dont want to embrance new technology (Remember when cd came out?!). Our companies respect that, so they don't try and force stuff from other industries on us too quickly and charge through the roof for it, they're not out to be annoying as companies (*cough* Apple *cough*). They'll ease us into the new technology, just be patient

.

 

[Frank Harvey]

I'd rather be buying older technology that has been tried, tested, and works flawlessly, rather than newer technology which is still under testing and hasn't matured.

 

[manicm]

Not defending them but Linn's streaming stuff is no less matured now than Naim's, for instance. I find your comment a bit baffling.

 

[Frank Harvey]

That comment wasn't aimed at anything specific, it was just a general comment

 

[Helmut80]

FrankHarveyHiFi:I'd rather be buying older technology that has been tried, tested, and works flawlessly, rather than newer technology which is still under testing and hasn't matured.

I think that's fair enough, and there are plenty more reasons why people largely stick to computer >DAC>Amp rather than getting a dedicated music streamer.

 

[Andrew Everard]

ashworth_rich:or Music servers (in the case of Naim)?

Linn, Sonneteer, Meridian...

 

[manicm]

FrankHarveyHiFi:That comment wasn't aimed at anything specific, it was just a general comment

my apologies

 

[The_Lhc]

Helmut80:
FrankHarveyHiFi:I'd rather be buying older technology that has been tried, tested, and works flawlessly, rather than newer technology which is still under testing and hasn't matured.

I think that's fair enough, and there are plenty more reasons why people largely stick to computer >DAC>Amp rather than getting a dedicated music streamer.

Largely, I suspect, because they don't know they have other options. It's never the right choice though, imo.

 

[Anonymous]

Monstrous:
ashworth_rich:

Happy to be proven wrong

- maybe I am just to UK focussed?

Would not say that is a bad thing at all! Most good quality audio products are UK designed or built. We also make the best high end kit,

I also think along with some others, many of the 'Sound quality' nuts, dont want to embrance new technology (Remember when cd came out?!). Our companies respect that, so they don't try and force stuff from other industries on us too quickly and charge through the roof for it, they're not out to be annoying as companies (*cough* Apple *cough*). They'll ease us into the new technology, just be patient

.

Absolutely!
There aren't many things this once great empire can be proud of, but HiFi is one of them....

Interestingly I noticed not long ago how little hamlets of audio design pop up like fungus and seem to breed. Here in Essex we seem to have an unfair monopoly on HiFi. I've popped in to both Monitor Audio, still based in Rayleigh (just off then A127) and also Ruark who are in a nondescript industrial park in Southend (not far from Rega). Add to that the fact at just up the road in Cambridge you have the birthplace of many a HiFi company (Arcam, Cyrus, more I'm sure).

Just coincidence, I'm sure but struck me as interesting. Feel free to throw in your own local hifi manufacturers and experiences.

PS Ruark were just fabulous. Literally just walked into their building via the metal shutters and said hello. Got a new Vifa driver for my Prologues, all tested and a quick 30 second tour. All very nice, thanks! I have to say that Monitor Audio were also great when I had a problem with my first sub. Couldn't have tried harder to make me happy and in the end just gave me the RSW12 I have now. Legendary!

More info at:
http://www.bestbuybritish.org/british_hi-fi_audio.htm

 

[shooter]

the_lhc:
Largely, I suspect, because they don't know they have other options. It's never the right choice though, imo.

What other options the_lhc?

I'm having a headache trying to get a Dac in the system with digital pot and analog input.

 

[Anonymous]

Because users like me have 300 CD's and can't see any real benefit in copying them to a PC and then doing something with a music server to then play back just like I could have have done with the cd in the drawer in the first place. I work in IT and I can't be bothered, so techo-phobes will be really put off. Internet music is rarely Hi Definition, DAB is a CON, I don't even know where to download 24-bit music and would not pay to upgrade 300 discs worth if I could. So I am some way off even considering this as an idea and makers don't make things for fun - they have to sell units.

I am just one opinion, but I expect you'll find there are a lot like me, so most makers don't want to spend the dosh because they won't tempt a lot of people for a while yet.

Of course without early adopters, there would be no stable technology for ludites like me to benefit from much more cheaply in 5 years time - so I thank them all !!

 

[6th.replicant]

Better to be cautious than wade into a new sector half-cocked? (Panasonic TV, anyone?

)

 

[plastic penguin]

NigelF:

I wonder why British companies are so slow in embracing new technologies, Cyrus stream products should have been in the market 2 years ago, there is still no sign if Roksan is planing to launch similar products. Naim also was very late. Arcam and Rega were also very late in launching DACs.

In the near future I would like to see more one box (DAC, Streaming, Amplification) solutions from premium audio companies which should also do integrations of iTunes Services, 24bit audio support, external storage support, wireless N & gigabit network support, multi-room possibility etc.

I think a lot of the bigger British (and even smaller ones) have embrassed NewTec: Cyrus have a DAC in their new amps, Leema likewise, Naim have streaming to the Uniti and Cute, Arcam produced streamers and the Solo Neo has a similar set-up to the Naims; the last two provide separate DACs, likewise Cambridge...

Don't really understand the point.

 

[Helmut80]

6th.replicant:Better to be cautious than wade into a new sector half-cocked? (Panasonic TV, anyone?

)

but that is partly the issue here if I understood the OP correctly. It's 2011. Music streaming isn't really new anymore. To go back to my agist generalisation: the younger ones among us, especially those with young kids, seem to be much quicker to move the CDs to the loft, ore space for other things and impossible to scratch them up there.

 

[Red Dragon]

I tend to agree with 6th here, and possibly the tardiness of British manufacturers is more traditional than deliberate...the British HiFi Industry is (arguably) slower than other countries to embrace and accept change, innovation and new technologies until the gremlins have been cleared out, and also maybe to see if it's a goer with the public.

But I do think that when the decision to go is made...the UK generally stands head and shoulders above other nations when it comes to quality hifi gear...and it's nearly always worth the wait. I also think that as a nation the UK are a very discerning public and won't accept low standard equipment (generally speaking) and HiFi manufacturers are well aware of this and are under pressure to get it right first time...reputation is a very valuable commodite in the industry and fans are a loyal but fickle bunch...

 

[xtsili]

Red Dragon:
I also think that as a nation the UK are a very discerning public and won't accept low standard equipment (generally speaking) and HiFi manufacturers are well aware of this and are under pressure to get it right first time...reputation is a very valuable commodite in the industry and fans are a loyal but fickle bunch...

Is it a UK nation trait this one? Japanese, Americans, Germans, Danes, French (all with outstanding hi-fi industry), to name a few, aren't they?

 

[Red Dragon]

xtsili:Red Dragon:

I also think that as a nation the UK are a very discerning public and won't accept low standard equipment (generally speaking) and HiFi manufacturers are well aware of this and are under pressure to get it right first time...reputation is a very valuable commodite in the industry and fans are a loyal but fickle bunch...

Is it a UK nation trait this one? Japanese, Americans, Germans, Danes, French (all with outstanding hi-fi industry), to name a few, aren't they?

I agree totally that it is not unique to the UK, but I would suggest that there are many more quality manufacturers/suppliers per capita than the other countries you mentioned (without detracting from the quality sold elsewhere of course).

I think this discussion went on for quite a while in a previoius thread, so don't want to loose sight of the original point being made...

 

[Anonymous]

Just because a technology is new does not mean that it is better. Linn embraced the streaming thing many years ago, probably pioneered it in Britain at least but they still build and sell turntables. If as a small British hi-fi manufacturer you have been building and selling a product that has lasted for many years and sounds fantastic then why would you want to change that. As the years have gone by more and more hi-fi components have been mass produced moulded plastic rubbish, fabricated from the lowest bidder, even most speaker enclosures now are MDF with a cheap veneer, if you want something that has had a pair of hands on it for more than 3 minutes then it is classed as a SPECIALIST finish. I know that the internet will eventually take over the choice of music you can buy but until that day comes i will stick to my CD player as the source, dinosaur it may be. There is another thread on this site which asks which watch should i buy, and most of the replies seem to be to purchase a timepiece that is built the same way as original watches, ie mechanical, not digital or anything else. Maybe in years to come the whole internet, streaming, no physical media option might just turn around and bite the manufacturers who embraced it so much. Never put all your eggs etc.