VT30 vs D8000 - Which one should I get?

[admin_exported]

Hi,

I have a thread in the home-cinema forums, but since it is not getting answered I figured it must be in the wrong place because this is the TV forum.

So here it is...

I need to buy a TV for my home cinema. The room is 13x13 feet and the viewing distance will be 10-11 feet from the TV.

I went to see the Panasonic VT30E and I must say the picture was amazing, although they had only the 50" in stock. The D8000 is not in stock where I live however I can buy it on order, but I can not view it.

Here's what I need answered.

1. Is there a difference between the VT30E and VT30B?? I think only Freeview HD and Freesat HD?

2. The 65VT30E costs 3450 Euros, the 64D8000 costs 3150 Euros, while the 55VT30E costs 2300 Euros. Which is a better TV for my needs for 10-11 feet viewing distance? So Panasonic vs Samsung? Which one?

Thanks

 

[Anonymous]

1. As far as I'm aware the VT30E is the European (mainland) model while the VT30B is the British model (Europe has 230 VAC and the UK 240 VAC as well as a different mains plug). All the VT series have built-in tuners fot DVB-C, DVB-S and DVB-T. On any of them you should be able te receive the free (read unencrypted) channels. For DVB-S you still need a dish.

2. If you look through the WHF blogs there is an extensive buyers guide. At the end of it screen size is covered foor HD viewing. Assuming that, according to the guide a 50" model is good after 2.1 meters. Since 10ft is over 3 meters the 65" model may not be that bad an idea. I am at just under 3 meters and consider the 50" smallish and would rather have a 55" or perhaps even 60"

 

[Oldboy]

You need to decide if you want plasma or LED first as the D8000 is a full array LED tv as opposed to the VT30's plasma tech. Each has it's positives and negatives so it really would be a good idea to try to view the D8000 before you decide which suits your personal taste even if it's just in a smaller screen size. If you really can't view the D8000 then try to see if you can view a D7000 as they are virtually identical when it comes to picture quality and it will give you an idea of the PQ you should expect on the 8000.

Just for your info Panasonic recommend a minimum viewing distance for a 42" plasma of 10ft, this goes against the advice from WHF which i also trust but thought it was worth mentioning as it may affect your decision on what size VT30 to get if you do indeed choose it. For a 50" screen it goes up to 12ft-15ft BUT just how much you trust that is up to you, personally i took the average of the two and it seems about right for me.

I auditioned the 7000 and 8000 before i bought my GT30 (couldn't quite stretch to the VT30) and i was swayed by the more natural image from the plasma and i would go for the VT30 if it was my money but as ever that's just my personal taste so it's well worth auditioning before you buy as the two tvs have vastly different positives and negatives.

Hope that's of some help.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi, The TV's I am considering are ALL plasma.

The Samsung is a plasma model PN64D8000. It is not an LED.

So any opinions on which one is better between the Samsung and Panasonic?

Thanks

 

[Anonymous]

Forgot to mention.

I cannot audition the Samsung plasma as we don't get it where I live. I only saw the samsung LED but I definately want a plasma.

I think the price difference is not much (also with the panasonic I get 2 3D glasses worth 100 euros).

I just need to decide which one is better.

Also I am leaning away from the samsung because some users say that after some 900 hours of usage, the black filter begins to wear off? I read it somewhere on AV forums in the PN64D8000 review. Any idea if this is true and if the panasonic suffers from the same problem?

Thanks again

 

[Anonymous]

From my personal experience I'd favour Panasonic. Apart from now considering 50" a bit small I'm very happy with it and it has seen very extensive use with just about everything you can throw at it for a year now. Mainly blu-ray but also DVD, TV (HD and SD), gaming with both XBOX and PS3, streaming among others. It still performs admirably and the blacks don't seem to have suffered.

 

[Oldboy]

Forgot to mention.

I cannot audition the Samsung plasma as we don't get it where I live. I only saw the samsung LED but I definately want a plasma.

I think the price difference is not much (also with the panasonic I get 2 3D glasses worth 100 euros).

I just need to decide which one is better.

Also I am leaning away from the samsung because some users say that after some 900 hours of usage, the black filter begins to wear off? I read it somewhere on AV forums in the PN64D8000 review. Any idea if this is true and if the panasonic suffers from the same problem?

Thanks again

Apologies...i thought you meant the UED8000 LED tv from Samsung. Well out of the two i would throw my cash at the Panasonic just as patrick suggested as i too came across the black issue when doing a quick search on the web for the Samsung plus WHF have not reviewed this tv so i would be dubious about getting one, you simply can't rely on a web review in my opinion when spending a significant ammount of money.

I have seen the VT30 myself and it's a luxurious looking tv but when i viewed it side by side with a GT30 i could see absolutely no difference in PQ but the tv was far better looking than the GT30 and a real head turner, no doubt the VT30 has more features and a different screen etc and if i'm being honest if i had the money i would have got the VT30 myself! If you look at the reviews for the VT30 they are all very positive and after all it is the flagship plasma tv from Panasonic this year PLUS don't forget that Panasonic now employs alot of the Kuro team from Pioneer when they left the tv market and it seems to be paying off.

Get the VT30, if was in your situation that's what i would get

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the replies,

I am leaning towards the VT30 since I was able to see the picture myself yesterday and was very impressed with it!

Any other suggestions?

Like for example, what cons does the VT30 have? I know reviews are good, but it can't be all good!

Btw I will be using it for Blu ray, 3D, DVD, Sky HD and PS3

 

[Anonymous]

I too would choose Panasonic over samsung plasmas (after owning a few Samsungs) the black levels are much better. I too, viewed both the VT30 & GT30 side by side and saw little difference. The only differences I actually saw where the VT handled ambient light better due to it's extra filter, and the sound was much better (for me not an issue as I have a 5.1 set up). I actually preferred the looks of the GT, very reminisant of the Pioneer plasmas but thinner.

 

[Deleted member 2457]

Hi, The TV's I am considering are ALL plasma.

The Samsung is a plasma model PN64D8000. It is not an LED.

So any opinions on which one is better between the Samsung and Panasonic?

Thanks

I've seen both and I've read reviews comparing the two, and I'm not sure which one I would go for. The black levels would definitely go to the Panasonic, Blu-ray also looked very good, although I don't like the judder action on it. Football on the Samsung was very good indeed, whereas football on the Panasonic at 50Hz was woeful - again.

Both are good TVs though and have reviewed very well.

 

[Oldboy]

Image retention is the one to look out for with plasma.

The GT30 has a pixel orbiter option plus a screen wipe but the VT30 doesn't have both of these, it's missing the orbiter if i remember correctly. I asked the salesman about this when i auditioned it myself and all he could suggest was that perhaps the VT30 had a different screen so it was less of an issue but he couldn't be sure.

Most modern plasmas shouldn't suffer from much IR but my GT30 has shown some instances of it, however it soon disappears and i've had no screen burn. Plasmas can suffer from screen burn if a static image is present on the tv for very long periods (game huds for example) but it just means being a little careful that's all.

The first 200 hours of a plasmas life are crucial, you have to run the screen in as during this period the pixels are at their most exciteable and you can do permanant damage so try to avoid gaming for long periods and leave no static images on the tv, also, avoid 4:3 aspect tv or dvds as this too can cause problems.

Plasma is a very different beast to LCD/LED but a little care for the first 200 hours is all you need and don't forget to calibrate the screen too with at least a THX dvd or bluray and then take the contrast back a few notches for the initial run in period. Unfortunately it's not just plug in and go like an LCD or LED but the pay off is a far more natural picture and for the sake of some patience during the run in it's a price worth paying!

 

[Oldboy]

Yep as gel points out the 50hz image hasn't been improved much from last year although it's better than on my old G20 it's still not as good as it should be. If you are going to be watching alot of SD tv then it might be an issue for you but i found that putting the IFC on medium solved alot of the issues with minimum impact on PQ but of course it still causes some problems although they are minimal. What will you being using it for the most??

 

[laserman16]

whereas football on the Panasonic at 50Hz was woeful - again.

Watched some football in an HD broadcast on a P50GT30 in a shop at the weekend and to be honest it was awful.

Everytime the ball was kicked it left a "trail " across the screen, looked like 2-3 balls at once all following the same trajectory.

No idea whether it was a fault of the TV or the shop had not bothered to set it up correctly

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the replies

Will be using it most for blu ray 1080p, and sky hd (football) and some dvd's (SD) as well. So all in all movies and sports. I will have TV but I won't be watching much TV on it tbh.

Now with these comments, I am more confused as which to get!

 

[Anonymous]

whereas football on the Panasonic at 50Hz was woeful - again.

Watched some football in an HD broadcast on a P50GT30 in a shop at the weekend and to be honest it was awful.

Everytime the ball was kicked it left a "trail " across the screen, looked like 2-3 balls at once all following the same trajectory.

No idea whether it was a fault of the TV or the shop had not bothered to set it up correctly

You will probably find they had IFC on high, I've seen it a number of times in shops, with a plasma there's just no need for these motion processing settings, I'm sure they are just there to compete with LCD/LED set (some of which do need it).

There are no double centre lines or multiple balls on my GT30 watching HD footie.

 

[Anonymous]

Need to ask something about calibration, as I've never had a plasma or calibrated a TV before.

Is it something you can do youself? Is there a guide or suggested settings for the 65VT30?

Thanks

 

[Anonymous]

I usually start by searching for another well known forum for calibration settings and then use a THX disc I have for tweaking the picture to suite my room / taste. But an outlay of this size really deserves a professional set up like an ISF Engineer or similar to set it up.

 

[bigblue235]

Like for example, what cons does the VT30 have? I know reviews are good, but it can't be all good

Depends if you want to believe what's commonly said on forums I think people make mountains out of molehills, but there are a few things which are fairly commonly reported:

Panasonic VT30: Fluctuating Brightness, Green patches on screen
Samsung D8000: Fluctuating Brightness, peeling Filter

And, as with most plasmas, quite a few people report overly loud buzzing.

Our current living room would be spoiled by anything bigger than 50/51", so I looked at the 51" D8000 & D6900 and 50" GT30 and G30. I saw a different model Samsung in-store which did have fluctuating brightness and that really put me off. That, combined with the need for brightness in my living room meant I bought... an LCD

My first choice has always been plasma, but I just couldn't buy one of this year's models. I accept that lots of people buying this year's plasmas wouldn't want my LCD, but I've been pleasantly surprised by how good LCDs now are.

 

[bigboss]

Will be using it most for blu ray 1080p, and sky hd (football) and some dvd's (SD) as well. So all in all movies and sports. I will have TV but I won't be watching much TV on it tbh.

I would strongly recommend you to demo the TV in the shop prior to purchase. Stand/sit at a distance equal to your normal viewing distance at home & check DVD, blu-ray & satellite channels for 5 minutes at least. Bear in mind that satellite feeds are often shared and therefore poor in most shops. Buy what looks best to you.

DVD (SD) pictures can be unwatchable if you sit too close. I wasn't comfortable watching a 60-inch plasma from 10 feet distance; that's why I went for a 50-inch one.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the replies, will go for a demo again!

Regarding calibration, this is what the salesman told me:

"The VT30 series has the “Advance Calibration” installed and no calibration tools needed and no software needed. The old type Plasma needed the calibration which was done with external tools but this new series has everything built in."

This means that they will calibrate the TV for me, w/o using any tools or software...

Is that right?

If not, what kind of tools and software should I be looking for when searching for a professional engineer to calibrate my TV?

Thanks

 

[VoodooDoctor]

I've read a fair bit about the VT30 including some posts by a professional calibrator. They recommend calibrating the screen after about 500 hours of run-in and using the proper tools. I think the salesman has mixed up having the full calibration controls available in the menus with it being able to do it automatically. Apparently the menus also affect the picture when doing the calibration so the operator has to flick out of the menus after making a change thus making it a very time consuming procedure. On the positive side the calibrator reported that it was one of the best pictures he'd seen in a consumer TV once fully calibrated.

 

[Oldboy]

The VT30 has an IFC calibration mode in the menu that opens up extra calibration options for you and is meant as a tool for professional calibration as these options are only available in this mode and no other.

They include all manner of colour and white balance options that require a colour meter (such as an eye one) and computer/laptop in order to calibrate correctly, you can buy these from most online retailers and attempt to calibrate it yourself as there are guides online on exactly how to do this but it is a tricky thing to do yourself and requires alot of research before you attempt it not to mention the extra expense (£100-£150) of the meter and for that money you can get an ISF engineer out to do it for you!

You can of course use the THX calibration tool that is found on many dvd's (such as Star Wars) and some blurays but it only covers the basics and is a good starting point, if you got the VT30 i would recommend you got an ISF engineer out to calibrate it for you as it's the most cost effective option.

You can use other forums for calibration settings BUT they are often useless as they don't account for the differences in screens and the ambient conditions of rooms, every room is different and calibration results vary wildy from one room to another plus all screens are not the same as there are variences in the manufacture process so what works for one person won't work for someone else. They can be a good starting point in some instances but in my opinion better avoided.

If you end up wanting to get an engineer out to get the tv calibrated then make sure they come recommended by ISF and are listed on their website, here's a link to all the UK listed companies that can calibrate your screen:

http://www.imagingscience.com/dealers.php?search=United%20Kingdom

Hope that helps

Best regards.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi,

The problem is I live in Malta and not in the UK.

So I don't know if ISF engineers even exist here.

Some questions:

1. What happens if the TV is not calibrated? Will PQ still be good? I will use the THX preset, which according to flatpanelsHD review is almost as good as his calibration. So with not much difference and since I don't know of any engineers here, I think it might be the best option? Also should I do it when I get the TV immediately?

2. When should calibration occur? After like 400 hours of burn in or immediately? Also for burn in, should I leave it at default settings? And for a successful burn in... watching blu rays, sky HD and playing games is good right?

3. I doubt you'll know this, but do you know of any list of engineers in Malta (like the list you supplied of UK)?

Thanks

 

[Oldboy]

Hi,

The problem is I live in Malta and not in the UK.

So I don't know if ISF engineers even exist here.

Some questions:

1. What happens if the TV is not calibrated? Will PQ still be good?

2. When should calibration occur? After like 500 hours of burn in or immediately? Also for burn in, should I leave it at default settings?

3. I doubt you'll know this, but do you know of any list of engineers in Malta (like the list you supplied of UK)?

Thanks

No problem that you live in Malta just follow this new link and select your country from the world map, my geography isn't too good but isn't malta south of sicily? Anyhow here is the new link:

http://www.imagingscience.com/dealers.php

I doubt you will find a dealer in malta from the map but at least you can find out for yourself, if not then just google tv calibrator Malta or similar as i did...i came across a dealer in malta that may be able to help you but had no accreditation that i could see and house rules prevent me from linking directly to the dealer i'm afraid. Your only option may just be to go through the dealers in Malta and see if any of them can help you out with calibration and i'm sure there will be someone in Malta that can help you even if it means going through a phone book if you have one!

The picture won't be spot on out of the box but won't be rubbish as you get the option for a 'home' setting when you first plug it in it's just that calibration will help prolong the life of the tv and give you optimal PQ which you won't get without calibration...after all if you paying that much for a tv you want to get the most out of it eh!

If you hit a brick wall then don't forget that a THX dvd calibration is much better than nothing atall! You can get a list of dvds that carry the calibration tool from the web with a quick google search and this is far better than just leaving the tv on the settings straight from the box as brightness and contrast can be calibrated properly which are the main offenders when it comes to calibration, it won't be perfect though but close.

Calibration should occur after the initial run in period after the tv has settled down as black levels can fluctuate during this time but it's a good idea to just do a THX calibration straight out of the box so that you don't have excessive contrast and brightness showing during the run in period as this can cause damage. If you are going to get professional calibration i would recommend that it's done after the first 200 hours period as black levels would have settled by then.

Hope that helps.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks, The THX preset, which according to flatpanelsHD review is almost as good as their calibration.

So with not much difference and since I don't know of any engineers here, I think it might be a good option?

This is what it says on their review:

"The THX preset is very accurate and we also expected that. Panasonic - and LG – has been using THX presets for a few years now and they always provide users with accurate, natural looking colors and great picture quality.

There’s no need to elaborate because gamma is very close to our 2.2 target, color temperature is very close to 6500 Kelvin and the brightness value is optimal for movie watching and gaming in dark rooms."

Also should I do it when I get the TV immediately?