The Apex Club

Page 22 - Seeking answers? Join the What HiFi community: the world's leading independent guide to buying and owning hi-fi and home entertainment products.

RickyDeg

New member
Mar 15, 2011
16
0
0
Visit site
Monitor-Audio-Apex-5.jpg


APEX OWNERS!!! Chek out this excellent new review from the Norwegian magazine "Lyd og Bilde" where the Apex 5.1 system is more or less the winner, in terms of outright performance! The compeditor Paradigm MilenniaOne 5.1 takes home the crown though, but primarily because of its lower pricetag. The magazine site is originally in Norwegian so this link comes with Google translation. Lets hope it works:

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=no&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lydogbilde.no%2Ftest%2Fmonitor-audio-apex
 

The_Lhc

Well-known member
Oct 16, 2008
1,176
1
19,195
Visit site
RickyDeg said:
The_Lhc said:
RickyDeg said:
The_Lhc said:
RickyDeg said:
I would think people who stray completely off topic in a dedicated thread probably haven't been on the internet very long.

I've got seven years on you...

Then this reflects pretty badly on you, doesn't it?

Ha ha! Genius! Of all the things that reflect badly on me this doesn't even register!

Seriously, 13 years and you've never heard of thread drift?

Who ever said I've never heard of it? Writing "perhaps you guys should keep that specific topic on a Pioneer thread" I would personally interpret as a suggestion, not to be taken personally. But obviously that got to you.

Don't flatter yourself, I found your "suggestion" amusing, nothing more.

And since this pointless discussion is also off topic, it will not contiune.

And you don't get to decide that either...
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
RickyDeg said:
Monitor-Audio-Apex-5.jpg


APEX OWNERS!!! Chek out this excellent new review from the Norwegian magazine "Lyd og Bilde" where the Apex 5.1 system is more or less the winner, in terms of outright performance! The compeditor Paradigm MilenniaOne 5.1 takes home the crown though, but primarily because of its lower pricetag. The magazine site is originally in Norwegian so this link comes with Google translation. Lets hope it works:

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=no&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lydogbilde.no%2Ftest%2Fmonitor-audio-apex

Thanks for posting! Its funny I just read this review in the magazine as me and my bf finally completed our 5.1 set of Apex and they are great!! I really love them for music! :)
 

RickyDeg

New member
Mar 15, 2011
16
0
0
Visit site
Awesome ANLI, enjoy your system! And its a good review. Its nice to find new ones every once in a while. BTW, did you guys find the ideal location for your AW-12? (yes, I remember your post on avsforum.com)
 

RickyDeg

New member
Mar 15, 2011
16
0
0
Visit site
A

Anonymous

Guest
RickyDeg said:
Awesome ANLI, enjoy your system! And its a good review. Its nice to find new ones every once in a while. BTW, did you guys find the ideal location for your AW-12? (yes, I remember your post on avsforum.com)

yes I think we did but we had to move our sofa around a bit it was not much fun! hehe but now the whole speakersystem sounds really great although the retailer told us the Apex might need several hundred hours of playtime. We were watching some blu-rays today and the sound was amazing!! I'm a bigger music-fan while my bf is into films more, but now I think I might convert hehe
 

gosalh

New member
May 27, 2010
22
0
0
Visit site
Hey Ricky,

Yeah my new A40 is doing well and im continually running it in, so all is back to normal in my audio world :)

And yes i read the very interesting article. Im surprised that there haven't been many review articles published on the Apex apart from articles by whathifi, techradar and i think home cinema. :?

Cheers
 

RickyDeg

New member
Mar 15, 2011
16
0
0
Visit site
gosalh said:
...Im surprised that there haven't been many review articles published on the Apex apart from articles by whathifi, techradar and i think home cinema...

Agreed. Equally surprised at that on my end. I'm actually trying to evoke review-interest of some local a/v magazines. We'll see how they respond. I know many of em have adopted reviews before after readers requested them. I'd love for more people to discover Apex!
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
michael hoy



Thanks for your setting I upped my centre to -1.5 (around the same as the two fronts) but it had the opposite effect and drowned out them out (which was good because I thought there might of been a fault with the centre but it's fine). I set it to about 3 and that helped but as said before I keep an eye on it and now I know that the channel level button is there I will adjust it as and when needed.
 

MMW

New member
Sep 19, 2011
26
0
0
Visit site
I got my new A40 just yesterday and it works perfectly. It sounds just superb! I´ll wait for the break in improvements but right now I´m totally satisfied with its sound. :bounce: :dance: :cheer:
 

ric71

New member
Mar 9, 2010
91
0
0
Visit site
Now this I want to hear!!!
Ricky when you are ready give us an in depth review. Let me know how it is with music particularly in any multi channel format be it Pro logic 2 music etc.
Have fun!!
ric
 

gosalh

New member
May 27, 2010
22
0
0
Visit site
Woohoo nice one Ricky :clap: . Let us know what you think of it.

I was actually thinking the other day, what else i can do to get the best out of the Apex on top of my current AV receiver:?
 

RickyDeg

New member
Mar 15, 2011
16
0
0
Visit site
gosalh said:
Woohoo nice one Ricky :clap: . Let us know what you think of it.

I was actually thinking the other day, what else i can do to get the best out of the Apex on top of my current AV receiver:?

How pleased are you with your AW-12 performance? You could always try fine-tuning it further with DSPeaker Anti-Mode 8033C (I been interested in that one myself for a while). Other than that I would strongly suggest fine-tuning your system if you haven't already, like good quality isolation feet under your components, power conditioner, cables etc. I've done all those and each upgrade was an improvement. It's in the nuances. You do have an excellent Denon-model though, that's for sure. I wish I had it, lol. I'm on to continue my listening of the Primare now, its been running since saturday. I'll hold off any viewpoints for a while.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
All is well in the world again! :)

I gave the speakers a little time, did plenty of listening and configuring and reconfiguring the amp. got stands for the rears, upgraded my bluray player, and hey the speakers sound just great. The scene in The Dark Knight where the Joker goes after Dent in the HGV is staggering. Soundtracks sound lovely too. :) Regarding the centre, I beginning to think it's so good that it actually highlights any flaws in the source. When it's good, it's very, very good. Morgan Feemans voice is a melody :grin:

Somebody earlier called these "special speakers". They are that and more.

Edit: Also, I stripped the room (it was the lounge!) of all furniture, except the TV/cabinet that is against one wall and one three-seater couch at the opposite wall.
 

RickyDeg

New member
Mar 15, 2011
16
0
0
Visit site
(as previously mentioned, I'll share my experience of the Primare SPA22 with Apex)

2zqsl93.png


Deciding to have another go at a possible upgrade for the Apex my attention turned to high-end brand Primare and their modular a/v amp SPA22 in particular. Primare have a good reputation and if anything in the world of multichannel audio aimed at downscaled simplicity, this would be it. There are no excessive features, no calibration, no extra channels, no bling-bling or gadgets. Just top-of-the-line DAC's, processing and high-class 5-channel amplification. Thats it. The quality of the unit is unmistakable, with build and finish better than anything I've encountered prior (at an asking price of approx €3200 nothing less is to be expected). Hooking it up to the Apex I started feeling excited again, despite my two previously disappointing experiences with other brands.

j0w3g6.png


However, at the risk of sounding repetitive I've once again stumbled upon a product that doesnt beat the Denon AVR-3808A with its Audyssey calibration system, at least not in certain aspects. Namely for movies. For music (especially in multi-stereo 'Party' mode) it performed admirably. Detail, musicality, focus and timing - its all there. Delicate voices were beautifully rendered and made me open my eyes to what the Apex are capable of. This part of the performance was pretty much what I expected since Primare's roots are in high fidelity stereo. These positive aspects were an improvement over the Denon, but not enough to justify the investment. The Denon is still good with music, only not as refined as the Primare. The disappointment came as soon as I popped in the first blu-ray disc to try out some movies. Immidietly I had an eerie sense of deja-vu, cause once again I was left with a multichannel experience somewhat 'subdued' with a slight 'anemic' character compared to the lively and more powerfully engrossing Denon. Surround-envelopment almost vanished in comparison, as if held-back. Despite careful calibration using my soundpressure level meter I hardly ever got the impression that the rear pair of A10's were an active part of the soundstage. The sense of space came off as withdrawn because of this and on top of that my AW-12 subwoofer lost some of its potent impact. It was almost as if it wasn't a natural part of the equasion anymore, as it is with Denon. Turning channel-levels upward to aid the situation only resulted in an ill-balanced soundstage. While certainly not a reference-machine the Denon have that unified 'completeness' to the sound and present movies with a reassuring sense of fullness and vibrancy in every single speaker. In contrast to how the Primare performed with music it just didnt seem to make the most of Apex with movies. Rather bizarre.

However, all this is very similar to my recent experience with Pioneer SC-LX83 and Anthem MRX700. Doesnt necessarily mean these units are bad they simply have a different approach than what I'm use to. One that might be considered more 'accurate' and 'correct'. But if their way of presenting sound takes me out of a movie experience as oppose to drawing me in its hardly desirable.

Suppose it had to take me a few trials until it became clear to me - all of these machines are missing the very reason behind my continued disappointments; namely Audyssey MultEQ XT and Dynamic EQ. Its now apparent what Audyssey accomplishes with the Apex in my listeningroom and how much it appeals to me. Though it certainly comes down to personal taste and preference the difference I'm experiencing is nevertheless substantial. I believe the biggest contributor is Dynamic EQ (not to be confused with Dynamic Volume) which basically acts as an advanced 'enhancement' of sorts, one that adds carefully processed 'loudness' that never lends itself to sound gimmicky. Instead, it keeps all active channels in complete balance at all times, projecting details of a broad frequency range and presenting them clearly in a way the other machines dont. No single channel is allowed to either dominate or sound subdued to another, a virtue I find extremely enjoyable. This makes movies sound a lot more believable to my ears. This balance is exactly what I find missing in the other units. And in my opinion it never gets overblown or bloated either. Once again, it may not be 'correct' but it sure is effective. In a word, it makes the Apex speakers sound bigger, more spatial with greater dynamic impact but without pushing them too far. With the other machines its as if only half their capabilites are being put to use. The engineers at Audyssey clearly know a thing or two about listeningrooms and speakers. Nowadays I run the full 8-point measurement of the calibration with impressive results. The only adjustment I've ever had to do was to change low-frequency cut-off from 60Hz to 80Hz for the center A40, then set Audyssey to 'flat' reproduction.

Might as well face it, I'm too fond of Audyssey MultEQ XT and Dynamic EQ and how it performs together with Apex. Makes it difficult abandoning it for something else, however fine of a machine it might be (and the Primare SPA22 is a fine unit). Like one of my friends said last night "give it up, you already found your perfect match" and I guess he's right. If theres going to be a next time I'll go with something that utilize the more advanced Audyssey MultEQ XT32, also with Dynamic EQ. Perhaps an Onkyo, Integra, NAD, or possibly another Denon. I'm obviously an Audyssey fan, and while I know people who dislike it I apparently love it. After three disappointments in a row I've come to the conclusion that it makes the most of my speakers. And surely an even better receiver with Audyssey are bound to bring improvements. Guess I been looking in the wrong places.

16bcxlx.png


For the record, there are a few functional aspects I found disappointing with the Primare SPA22 as well: non-flexible speaker distance settings (10cm steps), rough volume control, slow lock on digital audio inputs (bitstream especially – between 4 to 8 seconds!), crude OSD. Dont want anyone to get me wrong because in some aspects the Primare SPA22 is a fine machine. Build-quality is outstanding and music reproduction great, its just that in other areas I find it lacking compared to what I already have. I bet some people would love what it does though. High-end or no high-end, it just aint my cup of tea. Wish it could have been otherwise.
 

MMW

New member
Sep 19, 2011
26
0
0
Visit site
Thanks for sharing your experience with the Primare! I know you have tried Yamaha receivers in the past but I´m not very sure if you have tried the new Avantage series. Recently I´ve compared my 2010 vs a Denon 3312 from a friend with my Apex system and, although the 3312 it´s a lower series Denon than yours, both my friend and I felt the sound of the 2010 more fluid, atmospheric and purer than the Denon and a bit more transparent and detailed too. I´m rather familiar with the 2067 and 3067 sound and I feel the 2010 clearly better overall than both of the 67 models (but to be honest I haven´t compared them side by side with the 2010, my comments are just from memory). Anyway I´ll strongly suggest you to take a try if you have the chance to have a home demo of the 2010 or the 3010. I feel very confident you´ll like them a lot based on what I read in your last posts.
 

CnoEvil

New member
Aug 21, 2009
556
14
0
Visit site
Thank you Ricky for the insightful and detailed review. It's obvious that you start with no preconceptions, and just assess what you hear...great job.

From my on perspective, I generally don't get on with Class D, and I suspect processing is not where Primare's strength lies.

For my taste, the AVR600 is still the one to beat on 2 channel, and not far behind the best on processing. IMO The faults have now been brought to an acceptable level, but they still do exist.

Cno
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Great post Ricky! I remember seeing Primare at an electronics fair but never heard it play. My bf is about to get us a new Denon aswell (we have an older Sony) hope it will deliver the same as yours does with Apex I'm just starting to learn more about receivers but the Primare must have looked nice atleast! Your set up is pretty btw! We watched some live concerts last night and I cant wait to hear how Apex sound with something else in charge. My favorite aspect is still the sub!

:)
 

RickyDeg

New member
Mar 15, 2011
16
0
0
Visit site
MMW said:
Thanks for sharing your experience with the Primare! I know you have tried Yamaha receivers in the past but I´m not very sure if you have tried the new Avantage series. Recently I´ve compared my 2010 vs a Denon 3312 from a friend with my Apex system and, although the 3312 it´s a lower series Denon than yours, both my friend and I felt the sound of the 2010 more fluid, atmospheric and purer than the Denon and a bit more transparent and detailed too. I´m rather familiar with the 2067 and 3067 sound and I feel the 2010 clearly better overall than both of the 67 models (but to be honest I haven´t compared them side by side with the 2010, my comments are just from memory). Anyway I´ll strongly suggest you to take a try if you have the chance to have a home demo of the 2010 or the 3010. I feel very confident you´ll like them a lot based on what I read in your last posts.

Thanks MMW for taking the time to read my post! Glad you love your Yamaha with Apex! I've heard a few good things about this combination. I have actaully kept an eye on the new Yamaha models, but after my conlusion now that Audyssey with Dynamic EQ seem to be what the Apex in my situation need I think I'll keep Yamaha as a second or third choice for my next trial since the brand naturally does not emply it. Wont rule em out completely though!
 

TRENDING THREADS

Latest posts