The Apex Club

[gosalh]

Good point Ricky, i didn't actually bother asking Sevenoaks on whether they checked with MA on why it could have been faulty. Just assumed i was unlucky with this incident. I'll ask the question though.

Regardless of this bad experience i still love my Apex and wouldnt trade it in for anything else!

Also ditto on your earlier comment "The subwoofer AW-12 was pretty underwhelming at first though, it was "boomy", but totally started to sing later on. Now its stellar." - i experienced the same thing.

I'll be posting pictures soon so stay tuned.

 

[gosalh]

Also Ricky, you should try "Thor" bluray on your system (if you haven't already)....your 2xAW-12 will love that movie. The movie sounded amazing on my setup, even the wife was impressed

 

[RickyDeg]

Also Ricky, you should try "Thor" bluray on your system (if you haven't already)....your 2xAW-12 will love that movie. The movie sounded amazing on my setup, even the wife was impressed

Haven't spun that movie yet, I've purposely stayed clear of it, but if its worth it for the sheer audio-experience alone why not? Thats partially what we live for, eh? Going to explore the "Jurassic Park" blu-rays tonight though. Ought to give my dual AW-12's a good workout and rattle my room a bit. And in regards to the run-in on this subwoofer - I've heard lots of others say the very same thing. Looking forward to your possible feedback from your dealer or MA themselves about your faulty A40. And seeing some photos! Will be cool.

 

[Anonymous]

hi have the Monitor apex running now for 6 months and sure are a fine set-up! was able to get these with the matching stands which are sure a real compliment to the cool look of the sat speakers. Far greater improvement to the B+W mt 30's and look more grown up too!

sure recommend getting decent speaker cables though, especially the centre channel as makes a big improvement too,for crisp clear dialoge. after 6 months i reckon the apex's are a great choice,and well engineered from a UK company!

Currently as have a 5.1 set up may consider a set of good main speakers give a even better compliment of sounds when playing a variety of music of all tastes, have to see what MA options I could go for to enhance further the setup!..

All in all for ma a good choice was made and no regrets on the APex here!:dance:

 

[RickyDeg]

hi have the Monitor apex running now for 6 months and sure are a fine set-up! was able to get these with the matching stands which are sure a real compliment to the cool look of the sat speakers. Far greater improvement to the B+W mt 30's and look more grown up too!

sure recommend getting decent speaker cables though, especially the centre channel as makes a big improvement too,for crisp clear dialoge. after 6 months i reckon the apex's are a great choice,and well engineered from a UK company!

Currently as have a 5.1 set up may consider a set of good main speakers give a even better compliment of sounds when playing a variety of music of all tastes, have to see what MA options I could go for to enhance further the setup!..

All in all for ma a good choice was made and no regrets on the APex here!:dance:

Nah, there's hardly much to regret when getting an Apex-system! Glad you love em as much as the rest of us! And I too agree about the important choice of cables, since that does make a difference.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Those with an issue with the A40 - have you just plugged them into the system and used them, or have you run an auto setup? An AV receiver's auto setup should take care of any major anomalies regarding the in room response of all of the speakers being used.

 

[ric71]

Hey Ricky,
Read your posts on the other well know US forum re the Anthem and Apex. When are you going to give the ARCAM a demo?
Ric

 

[MMW]

Those with an issue with the A40 - have you just plugged them into the system and used them, or have you run an auto setup? An AV receiver's auto setup should take care of any major anomalies regarding the in room response of all of the speakers being used.

Of course I tried the YPAO but the problem with my A40 is definitivetely not room acoustics related as I explained some posts ago. The faulty A40 was returned to the dealer last week and a new A40 is on the way. By the way the rest of my Apex system (4xA10s) is just absolutely superb sounding. Indeed surpassing in some aspects the sound quality of my way more expensive tubed stereo rig! I can't wait to have the new A40 plugged to my system!

 

[michael hoy]

Just added a Pioneer SC-LX85 to my system yesterday, still some tweaking to do with the MCACC before I can comment on the sound with the Apex speakers.

I will post back in a few days.

 

[ric71]

That will sound awesome!!!

 

[gosalh]

Hi Ricky,

I got news back from sevenoaks who contacted MA about my faulty A40. Apparently a fault with the tweeter. But its a one off and not a thing that occurs frequently, and theres no faulty batch of A40s. Ive just been unlucky so i dont think anyone else should worry.

It sounding good now anyway, system sound brilliant again! :cheers:

 

[RickyDeg]

Just added a Pioneer SC-LX85 to my system yesterday, still some tweaking to do with the MCACC before I can comment on the sound with the Apex speakers.

I will post back in a few days.

Let's hope you'll experience a better listening result than I did when I tested this baby this summer (I remember you commented on that post, michael hoy, mentioning your previous SC-LX72). I know several Apex owners who love this combo, I just never managed to make it sing (compared to my Denon). Share your detailed description later on if you can!

 

[RickyDeg]

Hey Ricky, Read your posts on the other well know US forum re the Anthem and Apex. When are you going to give the ARCAM a demo? Ric

Oh, cool. Did you leave a comment on my post there ric71? I haven't checked it in a while. My initial idea was to post my graphs there from the ARC measurements but sadly I got too caught up in my set-up sessions and I never saved the screenshots and then I got so disappointed with everything I was hearing that I just gave up. Pity, because some input on those results from the "experts" on that thread would have been interesting. Only got myself to blame. Arcam would be awesome to test next, its just I've put-off a little after these two bad experiences in a row. I think I'll hold off for a while. Plus, I kinda need to give my dealer a break from me returning things over and over, hehe.

 

[RickyDeg]

Hi Ricky,

I got news back from sevenoaks who contacted MA about my faulty A40. Apparently a fault with the tweeter. But its a one off and not a thing that occurs frequently, and theres no faulty batch of A40s. Ive just been unlucky so i dont think anyone else should worry.

It sounding good now anyway, system sound brilliant again! :cheers:

I'm glad you checked up on this, just for interests sake, and that you got a respons. So let us hope it's true that there is no fault batch of A40's floating around like they said. I suppose manufacturing issues with quality speakers is not unheard of, it's just seems pretty rare, right? (compared to electronics) Glad all is well in your audio-world right now gosalh!

 

[ric71]

Hey Ricky No I didn't leave a post but very interesting reading. Would love to hear your system but I know you are not in the UK. I am about to purchase a Sonus ZP90 and Qnap NAS drive to play all my music through the Arcam. Gonna sell the Micromega CD transport. Will def purchase the Oppo in the New Year for blu ray. Still want the second sub but just have to be patient !

 

[RickyDeg]

Hey Ricky No I didn't leave a post but very interesting reading. Would love to hear your system but I know you are not in the UK. I am about to purchase a Sonus ZP90 and Qnap NAS drive to play all my music through the Arcam. Gonna sell the Micromega CD transport. Will def purchase the Oppo in the New Year for blu ray. Still want the second sub but just have to be patient !

Yeah, I hear you - patience is not an easy thing as an audio enthusiast

Cant wait to hear your findings when you get your Oppo. And hey, I'm certain the Sonus ZP90 and Qnap NAS drive will be awesome. Not to mention convenient. I use my Yamaha CDR-HD1500 myself with a 400GB hard-drive and feed my favorite CD's to it as I'm still a CD collector (we're a rare breed these days, I know lol). I've been eyeing an Olive 4HD but the price has so far put me off a bit.

 

[Anonymous]

I set mine up this evening and thought the A40 wasn't quite right either. I'll listen some more tomorrow but it sounds like what you describe MMW.

Have a question, if anyone can answer...

The speakers are 8 ohms. My amp has only two options to set the ohm value, 4 or 6. What do I do here, and is this important?

Thanks.

I'm still not sure about the centre, trying various amp settings. Different settings do make big differences in how the speaker sounds. I definitely do not have the much mooted super-clarity I read about and was expecting. Maybe my expectations were too high.

Another problem unfortunately. When I do level calibration on the amp the sound is very different on the left and right rears. It is a much higher frequency on the right. Amp settings for both speakers are identical and the wiring is correct. Anyone know what that is about? I will swap the speakers around tomorrow.

Also, the terminals do not stay tight. I tighten them, not too tight, and the next day they are loose again. Not so loose that the wires fall out but certainly looser than I set them and they move easily with a very light grip! Might try banana plugs.

 

[RickyDeg]

I set mine up this evening and thought the A40 wasn't quite right either. I'll listen some more tomorrow but it sounds like what you describe MMW.

Have a question, if anyone can answer...

The speakers are 8 ohms. My amp has only two options to set the ohm value, 4 or 6. What do I do here, and is this important?

Thanks.

I'm still not sure about the centre, trying various amp settings. Different settings do make big differences in how the speaker sounds. I definitely do not have the much mooted super-clarity I read about and was expecting. Maybe my expectations were too high.

Another problem unfortunately. When I do level calibration on the amp the sound is very different on the left and right rears. It is a much higher frequency on the right. Amp settings for both speakers are identical and the wiring is correct. Anyone know what that is about? I will swap the speakers around tomorrow.

Also, the terminals do not stay tight. I tighten them, not too tight, and the next day they are loose again. Not so loose that the wires fall out but certainly looser than I set them and they move easily with a very light grip! Might try banana plugs.

Not sure if you saw my reply to your other post (the one you quoted above) so here it comes:

Not to jump ahead of anything here, since several users have now reported weird findings in their A40's, but your system is brand new. You must give them time to settle in, so remember the running-in period and how essential it is. If something continues to sound off with your A40 though, I would strongly suggest you contact the dealer like the others have done! As I mentioned in my other post my Apex system sounded great out-of-the-box, perhaps slightly "closed-in" at first, but as time went by everything fell into place. The subwoofer AW-12 was pretty underwhelming at first though, it was "boomy", but totally started to sing later on. Now its stellar.

What amp/receiver do you use? In most cases I would not worry at all about an ohm setting with these speakers, and definitely not switch to 4 or 6. But again, it might depend on your machine.

Still dont know what amp/receiver you use. However, running-in your Apex system can prove to be vital. So that "super-clarity" you mention may simply not have found its way to yours yet. On the other hand, these speakers are (in my opinion) very smooth sounding above all else (with the "right" receiver) though still clear and detailed, once fully run-in, properly set-up and calibrated. What you are expecting out of your Apex is ofcourse difficult for me to comment on.

In terms of your rear speakers sounding different after calibration, I would simply say that this might have to do with the actual way the calibration itself handle things, due to your room/positioning. Unless one of your A10's are defect, ofcourse (let's hope not!). In my last apartment I noticed this phenomenon too, but when I made sure each A10 in the rear had the same surroundings (e.g. a thick curtain behind them) my calibration-system had a much easier time doing things right. After that they all sounded identical. Your situation might be completely different though.

I know what you mean about the speakerterminals - they are a bit "weak", esp with thicker cables. Also they are too small to get a good grip when working with them. I would urge banana plugs for sure - that has worked great for me.

Let us know how things pan out for you!

 

[michael hoy]

Not had any of these issues with mine thank goodness, I do however use banana plugs which are locking ones as well.

Black Rhodium

 

[Anonymous]

I set mine up this evening and thought the A40 wasn't quite right either. I'll listen some more tomorrow but it sounds like what you describe MMW.

Have a question, if anyone can answer...

The speakers are 8 ohms. My amp has only two options to set the ohm value, 4 or 6. What do I do here, and is this important?

Thanks.

I'm still not sure about the centre, trying various amp settings. Different settings do make big differences in how the speaker sounds. I definitely do not have the much mooted super-clarity I read about and was expecting. Maybe my expectations were too high.

Another problem unfortunately. When I do level calibration on the amp the sound is very different on the left and right rears. It is a much higher frequency on the right. Amp settings for both speakers are identical and the wiring is correct. Anyone know what that is about? I will swap the speakers around tomorrow.

Also, the terminals do not stay tight. I tighten them, not too tight, and the next day they are loose again. Not so loose that the wires fall out but certainly looser than I set them and they move easily with a very light grip! Might try banana plugs.

Not sure if you saw my reply to your other post (the one you quoted above) so here it comes:

Not to jump ahead of anything here, since several users have now reported weird findings in their A40's, but your system is brand new. You must give them time to settle in, so remember the running-in period and how essential it is. If something continues to sound off with your A40 though, I would strongly suggest you contact the dealer like the others have done! As I mentioned in my other post my Apex system sounded great out-of-the-box, perhaps slightly "closed-in" at first, but as time went by everything fell into place. The subwoofer AW-12 was pretty underwhelming at first though, it was "boomy", but totally started to sing later on. Now its stellar.

What amp/receiver do you use? In most cases I would not worry at all about an ohm setting with these speakers, and definitely not switch to 4 or 6. But again, it might depend on your machine.

Still dont know what amp/receiver you use. However, running-in your Apex system can prove to be vital. So that "super-clarity" you mention may simply not have found its way to yours yet. On the other hand, these speakers are (in my opinion) very smooth sounding above all else (with the "right" receiver) though still clear and detailed, once fully run-in, properly set-up and calibrated. What you are expecting out of your Apex is ofcourse difficult for me to comment on.

In terms of your rear speakers sounding different after calibration, I would simply say that this might have to do with the actual way the calibration itself handle things, due to your room/positioning. Unless one of your A10's are defect, ofcourse (let's hope not!). In my last apartment I noticed this phenomenon too, but when I made sure each A10 in the rear had the same surroundings (e.g. a thick curtain behind them) my calibration-system had a much easier time doing things right. After that they all sounded identical. Your situation might be completely different though.

I know what you mean about the speakerterminals - they are a bit "weak", esp with thicker cables. Also they are too small to get a good grip when working with them. I would urge banana plugs for sure - that has worked great for me.

Let us know how things pan out for you!

Thanks for the comments Ricky.

I have an Onkyo 805. The speakers are ex-demo. Not sure how long they were on demo, will find out, but this might mean that they have at least some running in. How long of a run-in did you give your speakers before they started to improve?

The rears sound different with the noise the amp uses to manually set the volume of each speaker in dB, not the test tone during calibration. They sound completely different. One is of a much higher frequency. I recorded them but it was on my phone's voice recorder then converted to mp3 and while the difference in the sound between the two speakers is noticeable in the mp3 file, it is not nearly as obvoious as when standing between the speakers listening. Should they sound the same? I can upload the file if you or anybody else would like to hear it.

I hate to moan, but I'm getting seriously worried about these speakers. Watched Lord of the Rings last night and I thought the speakers were insipid to be honest, particulary with the soundtrack. On multiple scenes where the soundtrack was the focus it was just weak. I have a pair of BX5s which I had as a front pair for a few weeks and I remember these being very good. I will swap the Apex with these tomorrow for another listen.

Regarding the ohms, what I was wondering was if it was ok to have the 8 ohms speakers powered by the Onkyo which has an ohm setting of 4 and 6 only, no 8 setting. I left it at 6 after doing a bit of reading about this.

I suppose my expections might have been a bit high after reading the reviews:

Trusted Reviews:

powerful, insightful audiophile sound

the way those Apex A10 satellites zap effects around the room will leave you feeling like a kid at a fireworks display

They dig out the smallest, most insignificant high-frequency details in the movie’s soundtrack, stuff you probably never even noticed before

Dynamic shifts are effortlessly handled, surround effects are expansive and dialogue is crystal clear yet full-bodied. We defy anyone to hear this system in action and not be completely and utterly hit for six.

Tech Radar:

speech couldn't be clearer if the actors were in the room and the rear soundstage is willfully expansive.

I was expecting fireworks, but what I got was Bonfire Night and Bastille Day rolled into one.

They are nowhere near any of the above, I'm afraid. There is virtually no surround experience. The rear speakers are there and sound can be heard from them but it's just distracting direct sound.

Oh, the source was a Pansonic BDT110 bitstreaming DTS HD Master Audio.

 

[RickyDeg]

Dont worry Fionn, its ok to moan if you are displeased. I perfectly understand. Given what you've now told us above my initial reaction is a) your demo-ex Apex are faulty, atleast one of the A10's you are using as a rear speaker b) a setting or the calibration in your Onkyo is causing the unsatisfactory result c) the Onkyo and Apex simply dont match well, which is not too unusual in regards to receivers and speakers (goodness knows, I personally could not get the Pioneer SC-LX83 or the Anthem MRX700 to play well together). Perhaps its a combination of all of the above? Or... this just isn't your cup of tea. I have no clue, just my two cents.

Regarding the ohms - what does the Onkyo manual say in terms of using 8ohm speakers? Surely they must have mentioned it somewhere?

I'd say the running-in period is crucial, as it is for most speakers. However, the difference is seldom night-and-day, but rather in nuances as things start to "fall into place" after propber running-in has been carried out. If your Apex set is demo then I too would assume they've had several hours of playtime already. But who knows under what conditions they've used them, and with what? Personally I've never dared buying demo-stuff. Thats not to say all demo-stuff is bad, its just my own preference. With my own set I started getting more delicate details and a bigger soundstage after perhaps 150-200 hrs or so, not to mention a more punchy and controlled bass from the AW-12. From the off though, I found the Apex to provide a very layered, immersive and impactful listeningexperience. One that's never let me feel distracted, but simply draw me into the film or the music I'm playing. Thats no small feat for a small speaker.

Just for a direct comparison; I watched Fellowship Of The Ring aswell just recently and was struck by how big and dimentional the soundstage was. It was almost impossible to believe I was "just" using 5 satellites and 2 subwoofers (my additional pair of A10's will be mounted as height-speakers in the future, but they are unused at this time). The soundtrack was full and lively and details were projectd with pin-sharp focus, yet never distracting. I was wowed all over again.

The professional review you mention from Trusted Reviews is one that I've read several times myself. I have to agree with their positive findings, as have I done with other reviews of the Apex. Having that said, reviews are always subjective and may or may not match what you yourself will experience in your room, with your surroundings, with your electronics or with your taste.

All I can say is that Monitor Audio have managed to make a highly capable compact speakersystem, one with qualities I have not experienced from other systems in this priceclass (or size) before. I've had 9 speakersystems over the coarse of the last 16 years, 2 that were bigger and more expensive aswell, but the Apex are probably the ones that have impressed me the most. I have however, during my fairly short time with them (5 months so far), noticed they appear quite "picky" or "sensitive" to what drives them and one will definitely notice differences between amps/receivers. The quality of sources, cables, positioning etc will be noticable too. All good things in my book, but can be frustrating too in the wrong situation.

If I'm not mistaken the Onkyo does have Audyssey MultEQ with Dynamic EQ just as my Denon has, and with this calibration system I've managed to get very impressive results, far from the "insipid" or "subdued" surroundexperience you seem to be suffering. I'm very sorry to hear someone having Apex and getting this kind of result. Appears to me as extrememly weird and uncommon though, I must say. It's like something just isnt right here.

Sorry if you've already mentioned it in a previous post before, but I'm curious to know if you listened to the Apex in the store, and what your impressions of them were then?

 

[MMW]

Taken apart the unexpected problem I´ve experienced with my A40 I completely agree with the last post of RickyDeg regarding the Apex strong points, and his thoughts and comments about your bad and "not up to the expectations" experience with the Apex system. English is not my native language so it´s rather difficult to me to express some feelings with the accuracy that Ricky did but I´ve owned a few exotic and high priced systems (stereo rigs, not multichannel) in the past years and the Apex system it´s definitivetely one of the most refined, adictive and (above all) inmersive systems I´ve experienced. I say this cause I feel something is very wrong here if you feel the apex so dissapointing. Like RickyDeg I´m curious to know your first impressions when listening to the Apex at the store. Do you feel your sound at home very different than at store? Maybe this will be a good starting point to know where is the problem.

 

[michael hoy]

Started running some live concerts on Blu Ray through my LX85 last night and although I still have some tweaking to complete the sound was very very good.

My wife walked into the room on her way out and stopped for a listen, she was also impressed saying it sounded even better than the LX72 we currently have.

I will give more detail soon but so far

 

[RickyDeg]

Started running some live concerts on Blu Ray through my LX85 last night and although I still have some tweaking to complete the sound was very very good.

My wife walked into the room on her way out and stopped for a listen, she was also impressed saying it sounded even better than the LX72 we currently have.

I will give more detail soon but so far

Interesting! Tell us more later on! Oh, and I just now noticed you got my old disc-champion the Denon DVD-2500BT. It's a tank of a machine, right? Mine just retired in favor of an Oppo (brilliant upgrade!). Have you considered upgrading to Pioneers new blu-ray BDP-LX55 in order to utilize the jitter-free ability with PQLS on your SC-LX85?

 

[michael hoy]

Started running some live concerts on Blu Ray through my LX85 last night and although I still have some tweaking to complete the sound was very very good.

My wife walked into the room on her way out and stopped for a listen, she was also impressed saying it sounded even better than the LX72 we currently have.

I will give more detail soon but so far

Interesting! Tell us more later on! Oh, and I just now noticed you got my old disc-champion the Denon DVD-2500BT. It's a tank of a machine, right? Mine just retired in favor of an Oppo (brilliant upgrade!). Have you considered upgrading to Pioneers new blu-ray BDP-LX55 in order to utilize the jitter-free ability with PQLS on your SC-LX85?

Hi,

I will update as soon as I can, the Denon has certainly been and still is a fantastic player.

I had not considered the LX55 at the moment (wait for a review before I demo), I had considered the OPPO 95, had a demo a few months ago and really liked it.

I had not intended buying the amp just yet but the little devil on my shoulder talked me in to it.

The discs I ran through last night were Sting Live in Berlin and Amy Whinehouse Back to Black, Sting I had previously listened to but not Amy's Back to Black.

Sting's voice and physical presence were noticable differences, just seemed to be clearer and more focused.