Tantalising pictures of the new Devialet Expert model on their website...

[Infiniteloop]

Nobody claimed that astonishing mesures are the only factor to define a good sound. I just noticed that Devialet is announcing overwhelming performances that they are afraid to show. And yes, if you go to spend +8'000 bucks on an amplifier, it would be great to listen to him before, even if it's completely ridiculous to spend that much on an amplifier that will have very little impact on the sound.

From that comment, it is quite clear that you haven't heard a Devialet with SAM engaged.

 

[Infiniteloop]

Perhaps you prefer the coloured sound that a lot of Amplifiers give you. And that's OK, there are times when I prefer the sound of my SET Amp, like when I'm listening to classical chamber music or voices.

But to diss an Amp which clearly and measurably is giving you the most accurate path to the source recording available might come across as churlishness.

Yes, perhaps I'm an idiot like that, and can't recognise genius when I hear it. Or perhaps I just have an opinion, which is just as valid as yours, and unclouded by manufacturers' claims.....

...... and myriad reviews (including independent performance measurements) in the HiFi press and online from respected reviewers and owners.

- There. I finished it for you.

 

[spiny norman]

There. I finished it for you.

Only to your self-satisfaction.

 

[spiny norman]

I may try to pen a note to the editor of HFN as he seems to be a fan, and uses a pair of Devialet 800 in his reference system iirc.

Remember to ask him whether he thinks they're worth what he paid for them.

And he designs and sells measuring gear too...!

Yes, to hi-fi companies, apparently. No conflict of interest there, then. ;-)

 

[Al ears]

I may try to pen a note to the editor of HFN as he seems to be a fan, and uses a pair of Devialet 800 in his reference system iirc.

Remember to ask him whether he thinks they're worth what he paid for them.

And he designs and sells measuring gear too...!

Yes, to hi-fi companies, apparently. No conflict of interest there, then. ;-)

None at all m'lud.

 

[NSA_watch_my_toilet]

Nobody claimed that astonishing mesures are the only factor to define a good sound. I just noticed that Devialet is announcing overwhelming performances that they are afraid to show. And yes, if you go to spend +8'000 bucks on an amplifier, it would be great to listen to him before, even if it's completely ridiculous to spend that much on an amplifier that will have very little impact on the sound.

From that comment, it is quite clear that you haven't heard a Devialet with SAM engaged.

And form that comment it's clear that you don't know the difference between an amplification section and a DSP.

 

[NSA_watch_my_toilet]

Perhaps you prefer the coloured sound that a lot of Amplifiers give you. And that's OK, there are times when I prefer the sound of my SET Amp, like when I'm listening to classical chamber music or voices.

But to diss an Amp which clearly and measurably is giving you the most accurate path to the source recording available might come across as churlishness.

Yes, perhaps I'm an idiot like that, and can't recognise genius when I hear it. Or perhaps I just have an opinion, which is just as valid as yours, and unclouded by manufacturers' claims.....

...... and myriad reviews (including independent performance measurements) in the HiFi press and online from respected reviewers and owners.

- There. I finished it for you.

Good for you that you read so much reviews. But it would be great you listen a little bit to things and try to understand how they work before writing on the internet. You have myriads of reviews about cables making sound more transparent, about the greatness of HD music against normal format, and other great reviews about cd players that play so much better than others. In the end, when you tried the things out, you will see what kind of esoterist/corrupted marketing servant/incomptent fool, took place behind the PC. It was already impossible in the late 70's to take apart a majority of power amplifiers (not all, but 90% of them). If you want a proof, come at my home. I will demonstrate you a full accuphase rig vs a nad integrated. Feel free to bring your amp of whatever brand you want.

 

[Infiniteloop]

Nobody claimed that astonishing mesures are the only factor to define a good sound. I just noticed that Devialet is announcing overwhelming performances that they are afraid to show. And yes, if you go to spend +8'000 bucks on an amplifier, it would be great to listen to him before, even if it's completely ridiculous to spend that much on an amplifier that will have very little impact on the sound.

From that comment, it is quite clear that you haven't heard a Devialet with SAM engaged.

And form that comment it's clear that you don't know the difference between an amplification section and a DSP.

Um, no.

I also understand from experience what a difference SAM makes to the amplified sound. Therefore a Devialet has a very big impact on the performance of speakers.

But if you've never heard one - how would you know?

 

[Infiniteloop]

Perhaps you prefer the coloured sound that a lot of Amplifiers give you. And that's OK, there are times when I prefer the sound of my SET Amp, like when I'm listening to classical chamber music or voices.

But to diss an Amp which clearly and measurably is giving you the most accurate path to the source recording available might come across as churlishness.

Yes, perhaps I'm an idiot like that, and can't recognise genius when I hear it. Or perhaps I just have an opinion, which is just as valid as yours, and unclouded by manufacturers' claims.....

...... and myriad reviews (including independent performance measurements) in the HiFi press and online from respected reviewers and owners.

- There. I finished it for you.

Good for you that you read so much reviews. But it would be great you listen a little bit to things and try to understand how they work before writing on the internet. You have myriads of reviews about cables making sound more transparent, about the greatness of HD music against normal format, and other great reviews about cd players that play so much better than others. In the end, when you tried the things out, you will see what kind of esoterist/corrupted marketing servant/incomptent fool, took place behind the PC. It was already impossible in the late 70's to take apart a majority of power amplifiers (not all, but 90% of them). If you want a proof, come at my home. I will demonstrate you a full accuphase rig vs a nad integrated. Feel free to bring your amp of whatever brand you want.

Thanks for the kind offer, but no thanks.

 

[Infiniteloop]

Perhaps you prefer the coloured sound that a lot of Amplifiers give you. And that's OK, there are times when I prefer the sound of my SET Amp, like when I'm listening to classical chamber music or voices.

But to diss an Amp which clearly and measurably is giving you the most accurate path to the source recording available might come across as churlishness.

Which measurements are those?

I'm not aware of any measurements that indicate that.

This may help:

http://en.devialet.com/expert/#technologies/exclusive/dac/

 

[lindsayt]

This may help:

http://en.devialet.com/expert/#technologies/exclusive/dac/

Nope didn't help one single bit.

When I clicked on the link it gave no measurements at all that indicated that Devialet amps are measurably giving the most accurate path.

 

[lindsayt]

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/devialet

 

[NSA_watch_my_toilet]

Same for me. No useable mesures under your link.

"I also understand from experience what a difference SAM makes to the amplified sound."

You are turning around. This makes not your point be right. BOBBY can have an impact on the amplified sound. But it's not coming from the amplification section. And we spoke about amplifier only. Not about DSP/SAM/ALBERT or other things. Please stay focussed in the discussion and don't try to open backdoors for escaping.

 

[NSA_watch_my_toilet]

Perhaps you prefer the coloured sound that a lot of Amplifiers give you. And that's OK, there are times when I prefer the sound of my SET Amp, like when I'm listening to classical chamber music or voices.

But to diss an Amp which clearly and measurably is giving you the most accurate path to the source recording available might come across as churlishness.

Yes, perhaps I'm an idiot like that, and can't recognise genius when I hear it. Or perhaps I just have an opinion, which is just as valid as yours, and unclouded by manufacturers' claims.....

...... and myriad reviews (including independent performance measurements) in the HiFi press and online from respected reviewers and owners.

- There. I finished it for you.

Good for you that you read so much reviews. But it would be great you listen a little bit to things and try to understand how they work before writing on the internet. You have myriads of reviews about cables making sound more transparent, about the greatness of HD music against normal format, and other great reviews about cd players that play so much better than others. In the end, when you tried the things out, you will see what kind of esoterist/corrupted marketing servant/incomptent fool, took place behind the PC. It was already impossible in the late 70's to take apart a majority of power amplifiers (not all, but 90% of them). If you want a proof, come at my home. I will demonstrate you a full accuphase rig vs a nad integrated. Feel free to bring your amp of whatever brand you want.

Thanks for the kind offer, but no thanks.

And this closes the discussion about your "understanding by experience".

 

[Gazzip]

Good for you that you read so much reviews. But it would be great you listen a little bit to things and try to understand how they work before writing on the internet. You have myriads of reviews about cables making sound more transparent, about the greatness of HD music against normal format, and other great reviews about cd players that play so much better than others. In the end, when you tried the things out, you will see what kind of esoterist/corrupted marketing servant/incomptent fool, took place behind the PC. It was already impossible in the late 70's to take apart a majority of power amplifiers (not all, but 90% of them). If you want a proof, come at my home. I will demonstrate you a full accuphase rig vs a nad integrated. Feel free to bring your amp of whatever brand you want.

NSA, I think your view on Devialet's technology is cynical. Devialet have registered 88 (eighty eight) new patents relating to their Expert series. Patentability requires that a product is both novel and/or involving a definable and innovative step. Any such new/advancement in technology also needs to be useful in its application, which for many of the 88 patents is in the arena of amplification. Devialet would not be able to register one single patent against it's technologies if the above criteria had not been satisfied.

You are tarring them with the same brush as cable companies with their scientifically impossible (snakeoil) claims of greater transparency, which is grossly unfair and frankly ridiculous.

Devialet have managed to get very, very close to a pure Class A sound using Class D amplification, all from a box which is no bigger, and no more power hungry, than a laptop. Quite an achievement in my opinion, regardless of how it measures on paper.

You really should listen to one in combination with a great pair of speakers if you have not already. My Le 800 is a revelation which easily matches in all areas the ARC Ref 5SE and Bryston 28BSST2's which proceeded it in my system at twice the price, AND you get a great DAC and (adequate) phono stage thrown in!

 

[spiny norman]

Quite an achievement in my opinion, regardless of how it measures on paper.

So now we're saying the much-vaunted measurements are unimportant?

 

[Infiniteloop]

Same for me. No useable mesures under your link.

"I also understand from experience what a difference SAM makes to the amplified sound."

You are turning around. This makes not your point be right. BOBBY can have an impact on the amplified sound. But it's not coming from the amplification section. And we spoke about amplifier only. Not about DSP/SAM/ALBERT or other things. Please stay focussed in the discussion and don't try to open backdoors for escaping.

A Devialet is an amplifying device which employs DSP which is intrinsic to its functionality. This includes SAM and tone controls. You clearly have little understanding of how different to the norm an amplifier a Devialet is.

Perhaps if you went along and listened to one and had one demonstrated to you, you might have a better grasp.

Then perhaps you wouldn't need to make your 'BOBBY' and 'ALBERT' comments which just show that you don't know what SAM is.

 

[Infiniteloop]

Perhaps you prefer the coloured sound that a lot of Amplifiers give you. And that's OK, there are times when I prefer the sound of my SET Amp, like when I'm listening to classical chamber music or voices.

But to diss an Amp which clearly and measurably is giving you the most accurate path to the source recording available might come across as churlishness.

Yes, perhaps I'm an idiot like that, and can't recognise genius when I hear it. Or perhaps I just have an opinion, which is just as valid as yours, and unclouded by manufacturers' claims.....

...... and myriad reviews (including independent performance measurements) in the HiFi press and online from respected reviewers and owners.

- There. I finished it for you.

Good for you that you read so much reviews. But it would be great you listen a little bit to things and try to understand how they work before writing on the internet. You have myriads of reviews about cables making sound more transparent, about the greatness of HD music against normal format, and other great reviews about cd players that play so much better than others. In the end, when you tried the things out, you will see what kind of esoterist/corrupted marketing servant/incomptent fool, took place behind the PC. It was already impossible in the late 70's to take apart a majority of power amplifiers (not all, but 90% of them). If you want a proof, come at my home. I will demonstrate you a full accuphase rig vs a nad integrated. Feel free to bring your amp of whatever brand you want.

Thanks for the kind offer, but no thanks.

And this closes the discussion about your "understanding by experience".

So you expect me to bring along my amplifiers to a complete stranger's house, someone who has an irrational dislike for an amplifier brand, just so that I can indulge said stranger to try to prove something, thereby increasing my 'understanding by experience'?

That's about as likely as the NSA watching your (or anybody's) toilet, don't you think?

 

[Gazzip]

Quite an achievement in my opinion, regardless of how it measures on paper.

So now we're saying the much-vaunted measurements are unimportant?

I don't think the measurements matter at all. Never said they did/do.

 

[spiny norman]

I don't think the measurements matter at all. Never said they did/do.

Wasn't suggesting you did: just commenting on the myriad twists and turns in this thread.

 

[manicm]

Haven't read this whole thread, but for instance, unlike 99% of other hifi companies Chord program the dacs they utilize themselves. Does that entitle them to charge more if the results are commensurate? I'd say yes. Sometimes material costs are not the end all and be all of sticker price.

 

[spiny norman]

unlike 99% of other hifi companies Chord program the dacs they utilize themselves

Or rather they don't utilise DACs at all, but rather run the digital-to-analogue conversion in software on processors inside their units. But yes, agreed that this is the expensive way of doing things, even though they now seem to have got it down to a price commensurate with making the Mojo. I guess they're planning to sell a lot of Mojos (Moji?), so the cost can be spread over a substantial run.

 

[nopiano]

Haven't read this whole thread, but for instance, unlike 99% of other hifi companies Chord program the dacs they utilize themselves. Does that entitle them to charge more if the results are commensurate? I'd say yes. Sometimes material costs are not the end all and be all of sticker price.

I agree with your point that we are paying for R&D and intellectual property, which definitely has a value when the results are commensurate.

If someone invented a literal "straight wire with gain" which was better than any other amplifier, then it would be worth a lot, even for just a bit of wire!

 

[Infiniteloop]

Haven't read this whole thread, but for instance, unlike 99% of other hifi companies Chord program the dacs they utilize themselves. Does that entitle them to charge more if the results are commensurate? I'd say yes. Sometimes material costs are not the end all and be all of sticker price.

I agree with your point that we are paying for R&D and intellectual property, which definitely has a value when the results are commensurate.

If someone invented a literal "straight wire with gain" which was better than any other amplifier, then it would be worth a lot, even for just a bit of wire!

Zackly. - Some people know the price of everything and the value of nothing.

 

[Macspur]

I've got no axe to grind, but thought Devialet owners, or prospective owners might be interested in this:

http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/devialet
Mac

www.macsmusic.blogbubble.net