Samsung HU8500 Curved Ultra HD 4K LED TV Review now online

[strapped for cash]

This is what AV forums says regarding blacks:

"As is the Smart LED local dimming, which is the best implemented version of this feature we have seen to date, with deep blacks, excellent dynamic range and no perceivable loss of detail. This was evidenced by watching the notorious scene in the last Harry Potter movie where Lord Voldemort's army amasses over Hogworts. It can be a torture test for many local dimming systems but the Samsung didn't break a sweat."

Sure, as I said above, the proof is in the watching, and I was only commenting on the ANSI figure.

There are two possibilities here:

1. The ANSI graphic isn't representative of what the TV can do, because the reviewer didn't engage the "local dimming" feature when taking these readings. If so, the reviewer is selling the TV short. ANSI figures should represent optimum native contrast performance. Not engaging Samsung's "edge lit local dimming" when taking ANSI readings would be like commenting on a TV's HD performance by looking at SD content.

2. The 0.01 and 0 cd/m2 readings were taken when the TV was displaying a completely black screen. The higher ANSI figure (closer to 0.1 cd/m2) therefore reflects what the TV can do when displaying lit pixels.

I'm not sure which of these is true, since it's not clear in the review. If it's the former, the Samsung would dramatically outperform every other edge lit TV in history. This seems highly unlikely. I strongly suspect that the latter is true, and the 0.01 and 0 cd/m2 readings have no bearing on actual performance.

 

[strapped for cash]

It's still in the prototype stage. Not sure when the models will come (later this year or next year if Panasonic doesn't exit TV business by then). Sony's X95 excited me the most, but they're only releasing the 85-inch version in the UK.

Admittedly Sony seems to be regaining some of its mojo.

I still maintain that this is a bad time to buy a new TV. 4K doesn't seem a viable proposition in the UK right now, and is arguably of little-to-no benefit on anything less than a 55" screen. You're therefore paying a premium for technology with very limited utility in the near future.

OLED models are currently prohibitively priced; and only LG is pressing ahead with this tech right now because its engineers have circumnavigated the "blue diode problem."

Edge lit LED TVs will still be afflicted with problems inherent to the technology, namely poor screen uniformity, poor native contrast, and limited viewing angles.

 

[bigboss]

Why is it highly unlikely for Samsung to outperform every other LED TV is history? Isn't it Samsung's flagship model for 2014?

 

[strapped for cash]

Yes, it's Samsung's flagship model; but a 0.01 cd/m2 figure (when displaying content) is so far ahead of what's been achieved with edge lighting that I'd argue it's impossible. This would put the HU8500 almost on par with the VT65 in terms of MLL, while beating every previous generation of Panasonic plasma.

Since the edge lights need to be bright enough to illuminate the entire panel, they couldn't possibly dim enough to produce such a low reading when activated. However "clever" Samsung's technology may be, its engineers can't change the laws of physics.

It'd be like reading that a diesel powered mass produced car could go from nought to 60 in 1.2 seconds.

0 cd/m2 is often cited as a figure edge lit televisions can achieve when displaying a fully black screen;* but this figure is achieved by turning the panel off. Introduce a single lit pixel and the edge lighting is reactivated. MLL then rises to around 0.05 cd/m2 on even the very best edge lit televisions.

* And also the baseline used to calculate "dynamic contrast," which again has no bearing on a television's actual performance.

 

[Frank Harvey]

I've never got the curved screen thing for TVs. Firstly, the whole of the screen of a TV is in focus. Secondly, it narrows the viewing angle, and thirdly, unless you're sitting close enough to be at the focal point of the curve, you'll get no benefit whatsoever!

Sorry David, I'm certainly with you in spirit on this one, I think that curved TVs are for people with NO FRIENDS, because the sweet spot is apparently not wide enough to accommodate even two people! However, in the context of the rest of what you say, is there a word or words missing from your second sentence, which I've put in bold? :?

No word missing. I just meant that with a flat TV, the whole screen is always in focus. Curved screens were introduced for projectors because you could focus the centre of the screen fine, but the outer part of the screen, particularly on larger screens, would be slightly out of focus - that benefit is lost on smaller screens.

 

[Paul.]

Last years F9000 did much better for blacks, according to the AV forums review it had better uniformity and ansi average of 0.33. Blacks aren't everything though.

 

[strapped for cash]

Blacks aren't everything though.

This is certainly true, but I still regard black level as the most important aspect of picture quality, since it's the foundation on which other aspects of performance are built. Both colour depth and dynamism suffer when MLL is compromised.

 

[78records]

Living in a lighthouse, as I do, these curved TVs are an absolute boon.

The flat ones don't fit on the wall properly.

 

[Son_of_SJ]

Living in a lighthouse, as I do, these curved TVs are an absolute boon.

The flat ones don't fit on the wall properly.

Do you make much money at your comedy shows?

 

[Son_of_SJ]

I've never got the curved screen thing for TVs. Firstly, the whole of the screen of a TV is in focus. Secondly, it narrows the viewing angle, and thirdly, unless you're sitting close enough to be at the focal point of the curve, you'll get no benefit whatsoever!

Sorry David, I'm certainly with you in spirit on this one, I think that curved TVs are for people with NO FRIENDS, because the sweet spot is apparently not wide enough to accommodate even two people! However, in the context of the rest of what you say, is there a word or words missing from your second sentence, which I've put in bold? :?

No word missing. I just meant that with a flat TV, the whole screen is always in focus.

So "flat" between "a" and "TV" was the missing word! :wave: It did rather need to be present!

 

[bigboss]

To be honest strapped, I'm not that *nal about these numbers. I'm not as hard to please as you. I actually enjoy watching TV!

Steve Withers has commended the black levels, that's enough for me. I'm in no mood to dissect numbers.

 

[Deleted member 2457]

Living in a lighthouse, as I do, these curved TVs are an absolute boon.

The flat ones don't fit on the wall properly.

Do you make much money at your comedy shows?

 

[strapped for cash]

To be honest strapped, I'm not that *nal about these numbers. I'm not as hard to please as you. I actually enjoy watching TV!

You're of course right.

I'm quite the robot and have no interest in films and television programmes on an artistic level. I watch television from a purely technical standpoint. (A smiley after a veiled insult doesn't help, by the way.)

Steve Withers has commended the black levels, that's enough for me.

Though those numbers relate to performance. This whole discussion started from me highlighting possible inconsistencies in the AVF review. I couldn't have discussed this matter further without reference to numbers. All I've done above is stated things that are broadly true, with the caveat that I haven't seen this specific television in action.

I'm in no mood to dissect numbers.

If you'd advised me of your mood earlier I would have left the thread alone. I know now, so I'll discuss the matter with you no more.

 

[bigboss]

You're of course right.

I'm quite the robot and have no interest in films and television programmes on an artistic level. I watch television from a purely technical standpoint. (A smiley after a veiled insult doesn't help, by the way.)

It wasn't an insult at all. I've never ever read a single post of yours where you've said you've enjoyed watching TV. It's either about technical flaws in your TV or flaws in any film. I'm sure even you know you're overly critical of things. I do sometimes wonder if you enjoy anything.

 

[strapped for cash]

It wasn't an insult at all. I do sometimes wonder if you enjoy anything.

Thanks for insulting me again.

At least I've had the decency to apologise when I've said something that's offended you. I can't recall a single occasion when you've done the same.

I've never ever read a single post of yours where you've said you've enjoyed watching TV. It's either about technical flaws in your TV or flaws in any film. I'm sure even you know you're overly critical of things.

To state that every post of mine is negative isn't really fair. I fear I'm being caricatured here. I love lots of films; and I've discussed some of these films in glowing terms on this forum.

We have quite different tastes, however. Perhaps comments I've made that have stuck in your mind relate to films you've enjoyed that haven't grabbed me so much.

 

[strapped for cash]

As an addendum to the above, I'll acknowledge that I'm a pedant; but that doesn't mean I lead a joyless existence.

 

[Son_of_SJ]

Sweetness and light, boys.

I quite enjoy watching films AND ordinary TV on my calibrated but much-maligned LG 60PZ950T plasma TV in the kitchen, which looks very good even with standard definition material like Freeview channel 38, Quest, and even though its black levels remain well dodgy! But I expect that I'd enjoy this new curved 4K LED Samsung even more, apart from the curved bit ....

 

[bigboss]

Thanks for insulting me again.

At least I've had the decency to apologise when I've said something that's offended you. I can't recall a single occasion when you've done the same.

I apologise if you feel I've insulted you. It wasn't my intention at all. I can now say that you're calling me indecent.

I'm simply stating my observations to you. It's upto you how you take it.

 

[theflyingwasp]

Yes c'mon now chaps ,too cool things down let's talk about cheap v expensive hdmi cables...........or perhaps the numerous times we've all gotten our gentlemans area stuck in electrical equipment ...........

 

[strapped for cash]

I apologise if you feel I've insulted you. It wasn't my intention at all. I can now say that you're calling me indecent.

I'm simply stating my observations to you. It's upto you how you take it.

That's not an apology at all, since you're stating that it's all down to my interpretation. Your posts above were of course entirely benign.

Never mind. No point in waiting for something that'll never come.

 

[bigboss]

That's not an apology at all, since you're stating that it's all down to my interpretation. Your posts above were of course entirely benign.

Never mind. No point in waiting for something that'll never come.

As I said, my intention wasn't to insult you. That's your interpretation. I apologise if you felt that way. I honestly don't know what else should I apologise for.

 

[strapped for cash]

I can now say that you're calling me indecent.

If you can't bring yourself to apologise then I am.

At least I'm being frank rather than suggesting "it's all in your head" and "I didn't mean that at all."

 

[strapped for cash]

As I said, my intention wasn't to insult you. That's your interpretation. I apologise if you felt that way.

Forget it BB. You've done precisely the same thing again, and this isn't really going anywhere.

I honestly don't know what else should I apologise for.

I also don't believe this for a second.

 

[bigboss]

Please accept my unconditional apologies strapped.

 

[strapped for cash]

Since there was no smiley, I'll take that as sincere. In which case, apology accepted.