Question for What-Hi-Fi review team regarding Sony KDL-32P3020

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Hello all. I am interested in buying a new music / home cinema system for my abode, and I'm considering a wide range of options. I have quite a cosy (ie small) living space, so I think it might be a good idea to stick with a 32" tv. Anyway, I was eager to read this issue's group test of budget 32" tvs, and I very much like the look of the winner; the Sony KDL-32P3020.

One thing that concerns me though is the fact that while it will accept 1080p content, it apparently won't accept a 24 frames-per-second feed from for example, a Blu-ray player. Please can someone from What Hi-Fi tell me if this true?

The thing is I really like this tv but I know the implications if it doesn't support 24fps; that I will always have to have Blu-ray discs converted from 24Hz to 60Hz in the actual Blu-ray player which I know can cause judder. How does this tv, the Sony KDL-32P3020, cope with such material? How noticeable is the judder on this particular tv, or on any 32" set?

Also, how well do the different Blu-ray players handle the process of carrying out a 3:2 pulldown to convert 24Hz into 60Hz? One player that I am likely to buy is the Sony BDP-S1E (I can get it very cheap from a local hi-fi shop). How well does this particular player compare to other Blu-ray players at doing a frame-rate conversion from 24Hz to 60Hz?

Basically, please can someone from the review team tell me the best way to get around the problem of watching native 24fps Blu-rays on this particular tv (the Sony KDL-32P3020) that doesn't accept 24fps material? What are my options? And what are the best results I can get in this situation? In fact, how well did it cope with playing Blu-ray when you reviewed this tv in the group test?

Is it something that is pretty minor and can be sorted? Or is it something that should make me rule out the tv if I am going to be using it for watching Blu-rays? Any feedback from the What Hi-Fi team would be massively appreciated.

 

[Anonymous]

Please please can someone answer this...

 

[Cofnchtr]

Hi,

Can you not go to a local Sony dealership and ask them to set this up for you and have a look for yourself? I know my local shop (I have 2 Sony Centres close by) would set this up if I ask. I would then have control of the remotes and could fiddle with settings. As this is a known issue I would also ensure I set the player to output at 24p and see if I noticed any judder on films. If I don't notice it, I buy it but if I notice it and it's annoying, I ask what alternatives I have within the Sony range.

Although the reviewers spot these flaws and highlight them, depending how bad the problem is, some people may not actually see the issue.

I didn't like 100hz on TV's as I thought it gave a 'processed' look to the picture (similar to poor quality images on t'internet) so I didn't buy a 100hz TV but others raved about it and bought 100hz sets.

The WHFS&V teams advice is usually excellent but only your eyes will tell you if you can live with this issue.

If you turn off the 24p option on the player, there should be no judder.

As a final thought, if you perceive this to be such a major problem for you, why are you even considering buying this TV?

Cheers,
Cofnchtr.

 

[Zubkabera]

I want to buy this for my bedroom but on Sony website against HD-Ready box it say NA while 32D3000 says it is HD-Ready. Does this mean there is no downscaling for HD source available in P3020? or I have not read the specs correctly.

 

[Andy Clough]

Think you've misread the specs. Did a quick comparison on the Sony website, and the 32P3020 IS HD-ready (ie it can handle 720p and 1080i signals), but unlike the 32D3000 it is not Full HD, so can't display 1080p in its native form. However, I'm pretty sure the 32P3020 will be able to downscale Blu-ray, and the set will have no problem handling Sky HD as it's broadcast in 720p or 1080i.

 

[Zubkabera]

Hi Andy, Thanks for quick response I checked again the Sony website and it does say D3000 is not full HD but HD-Ready but it can handle 1080p.

so against 1080p on D3000 it says Yes but againts P3020 it say N/A also 24p input is not available on P3020 does that means it will not be able to handle blue-ray smoothly?

 

[Anonymous]

Cofnchtr you are mistaken if you think that 24p is something that you can simply "turn off." I think what you must mean when you say this is to use the option of having the player carry out a conversion of 24fps into 60Hz. This cannot be described as merely "turning off" 24p. Blu-ray discs are actually mastered in the studio at 24fps, and for a player to read such a disc at this speed, then output it at 60Hz, the conversion process required (known as 3:2 pulldown) is exactly the thing that causes judder.

Please could someone from the magazine answer my questions about this tv (the Sony KDL-32P3020)? I would be extremely grateful...

 

[Anonymous]

I have been asking them to tell me about how well the 32P3020 handles Blu-ray at non-24fps in another post

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, but haven't had a reply from the magazine.

The P3020 will handle a 1080p feed just like the D3000. Andy says that the P3020 is supposedly unlike the D3000 because although the P3020 will accept 1080p, it can't display it natively, whereas the D3000 can... Except it can't because the D3000 has exactly the same native resolution as the P3020. In actual fact both the P3020 and the D3000 are both the same when it comes to 1080p; they will both accept a 1080p feed but then downscale it to their native 1366 x 768 resolutions.

So just to be clear: Neither the P3020 nor the D3000 can display 1080p natively, despite what Andy says. I wouldn't have thought Andy would overlook something like that.

 

[Clare Newsome]

He didn't say it could handle 1080p natively - he said 1080i, as you can clearly see above...

 

[Zubkabera]

Thanks for confirming, I wasn't able to test D3000 vs P3020 so ordered the P3020 just few minutes ago based on WHS&V 32 Feb'08 supertest review I trust them more then my own eye's!

Just wondering how much is the difference picture wise b/w these two models the price difference is only 250 euro so is it worth buying D3000 over P3020. My source will mainly be SD via scart and I read somewhere P3020 handles SD very well.

 

[Clare Newsome]

I'm pretty sure it's not 24fps - certainly not at that price, and we didn't feature the 24fps logo in our Supertest, which we do when a set can handle it.

Sorry, but we've been rather busy closing an issue, an HD supplement we've had to make a lot of adjustments to thanks to the breaking news of the last 48 hours, and handling the HD news itself!

 

[Anonymous]

[quote user="Andy Clough"]the 32P3020 IS HD-ready (ie it can handle 720p and 1080i signals), but unlike the 32D3000 it is not Full HD, so can't display 1080p in its native form.[/quote]

You see he says that the P3020 is unlike the D3000, because the P3020 isn't Full HD and cannot display 1080p in it's native form, unlike the D3000, thus implying that the D3000 is full HD and can display 1080p in it's native form.

In actual fact neither of the tvs can display 1080p in it's native form as they only have resolutions of 1366 x 768. Just to be really really extra clear I'll repeat, more simply...

[quote user="Andy Clough"]unlike the 32D3000 it is not Full HD[/quote]

See. Unlike the D3000, the P3020 isn't Full HD, which implies that the D3000 is Full HD!! (Which is incorrect!!)

Clear enough?

 

[professorhat]

Easy son!

Now, a cup of Horlicks and to bed with you!

 

[Andrew Everard]

[quote user="BenjaminHart"]

[quote user="Andy Clough"]the 32P3020 IS HD-ready (ie it can handle 720p and 1080i signals), but unlike the 32D3000 it is not Full HD, so can't display 1080p in its native form.[/quote]

You see he says that the P3020 is unlike the D3000, because the P3020 isn't Full HD and cannot display 1080p in it's native form, unlike the D3000, thus implying that the D3000 is full HD and can display 1080p in it's native form.

In actual fact neither of the tvs can display 1080p in it's native form as they only have resolutions of 1366 x 768. Just to be really really extra clear I'll repeat, more simply...

[quote user="Andy Clough"]unlike the 32D3000 it is not Full HD[/quote]

See. Unlike the D3000, the P3020 isn't Full HD, which implies that the D3000 is Full HD!! (Which is incorrect!!)

Clear enough?

[/quote]

Hmmmm... Now how should I choose a TV? Should I undertake forensic examination of forum posts or should I actually go out and have a look at some sets?

Tricky one...

 

[Anonymous]

Alright alright I was just keeping you on your toes...

How well do the different Blu-ray players perform when they are not outputting at the optimum 24fps speed? How well do each of the players, such as the Sony BDP-S1E, Sony BDP-S300E, Sony BDP-S500 or the Pioneer BDP LX70a handle doing a 3:2 pulldown and outputting at 60Hz?

 

[Clare Newsome]

IMHO this is another issue like scaling where it depends on the precise combination of player/display involved: some players do it better than the TV/projector and vice versa - depends on the quality of the picture processing involved.

Hence those Panasonic sets that do the job incredibly well - better to set the player to output at 1080p and let the TVs' excellent processing do the rest.

 

[Anonymous]

Cheers Clare. How well does, specifically, the Sony BDP-S1E cope with outputting at a non-24fps speed - ie outputting at 60Hz?

Also, how well does specifically the Sony KDL-32P3020 cope with Blu-ray, considering the fact that, like you said, it does not accept 24fps? When this tv was reviewed in the recent issue, which Blu-ray player did you test it with, and how much of an issue was the tv's non-compatibility with 24fps content?

Thankyou.