PM6004 - Sounds better w/o source direct

[ea25]

Just wanted to check whether anyone had a similar experience on the Marantz PM6004; that it actually sounds better with Source Direct turned off.

Some further explanation on "sounds better". The following traits were notices when switching off Source Direct; mid-range is significantly improved as it was very laid back when listening with source direct on, sound stage got wider all round, there is more musicality to the music, dynamics are slightly improved, vocals are more centred and seperation is up a notch, there is more power to the music and I'd venture to say that there is also more detail and pronounciation to the instruments.

PM6004 pushes the KEF Q300s, sourcing from an SL1200mk2 TT (no external pre-amp, hooked directly to the amp) with an Ortofon 2m Red cartidge. All components of the system are worn in as I've been using this setup for over a year now.

Thanks in advance for your input.

 

[Native_bon]

There no rules when it comes to listening to music.. Some people will say they will never listen to music with tune controls.. Am for tune controls I use it with my Arcam AVR450.. so good on you. Happy listening

 

[Blackdawn]

What settings do you have the tone controls? By the way I also use tone controls on some recordings, nothing wrong with that.

 

[Covenanter]

No!

Chris

 

[ID.]

Just wanted to check whether anyone had a similar experience on the Marantz PM6004; that it actually sounds better with Source Direct turned off.

Some further explanation on "sounds better". The following traits were notices when switching off Source Direct; mid-range is significantly improved as it was very laid back when listening with source direct on, sound stage got wider all round, there is more musicality to the music, dynamics are slightly improved, vocals are more centred and seperation is up a notch, there is more power to the music and I'd venture to say that there is also more detail and pronounciation to the instruments.

Professional interpreter checking in. What OP meant to say is "I prefer the sound of the Marantz PM6004 without source direct on".

Nothing wrong with that, although I think your findings are interesting because those are all of the traits I associate with turning source direct on for amps I've owned and auditioned in store, including a number of Marantz's recent offerings.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

I previously owned a PM6004/CD6004 and without doubt it always sounded much better with the Source Direct ON; giving a much fuller soundstage and openness. Turned OFF soundstage was much narrower - totally reverse of what you are hearing. As such I always left Source Direct ON. Just my opinion.

 

[GCE]

Is it the same with other source, like CD, radio, mp3...?

For me also is slightly better without source direct and flat tone:

I can hear a little fuller tone and same highs extension;

how do you find loudness button sound?

 

[ID.]

For me also is slightly better without source direct and flat tone:

I can hear a little fuller tone and same highs extension;

how do you find loudness button sound?

I don't know about more extension, but yes, it often sounds a little fuller, but I always feel that the fullness is coming from a lack of clarity, or fuzziness, from that extra little bit of distortion you get with the tone controls in the circuit.

BTW, my understanding is that the loudness button is for compensating for the lack of bass the human ear perceives when listening at lower volumes, and isn't really for normal listening (mumbles something about Fletcher Munson curves...).

 

[Johnno2]

For me also is slightly better without source direct and flat tone:

I can hear a little fuller tone and same highs extension;

how do you find loudness button sound?

I don't know about more extension, but yes, it often sounds a little fuller, but I always feel that the fullness is coming from a lack of clarity, or fuzziness, from that extra little bit of distortion you get with the tone controls in the circuit.

BTW, my understanding is that the loudness button is for compensating for the lack of bass the human ear perceives when listening at lower volumes, and isn't really for normal listening (mumbles something about Fletcher Munson curves...).

Loudness buttons really mess up the sound, whatever the level, I hate them, however using the normal tone controls can impove certain recording if used gently, ie just a couple of +dB boost, usually in the bass, that should suffice for low level listening .

 

[mikeparker59]

Can't say I notice ANY difference, similarly with the settings on the CD6004 where you can turn off the display to improve sound quality, can't detect any difference there either. Time for a hearing check maybe? :?

 

[ea25]

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for getting back to me.

First of all it was a bit careless of me not the mention if I had any enhancement on the Bass/Treble control; these are are set to neutral flat position as I felt no need to adjust the tonality.

As some you have pointed out the above mentioned traits are normally (expected if you wish) experienced when hitting the source direct button. I was indeed intrigued about my situation and hence started this post. Truth be told, I was on the verge of ditching the Marantz I was finding it so boring and lifeless. Then thought of turning off source direct and the unexpected happened. Tried a couple of tracks with source direct back on and you can immediately feel difference; it seems more circuitry is being added and not eliminated!

I have tried the loudness button, but as it was already stated that is for low listening volumes. Bass is boomy and highs are annoyingly harsh so I try to avoid listening in loudness mode.

Will try to fit in some time in the near future to try on different sources and see how it goes. So I'll keep you guys posted. In the meantime I'll stick to the "There no rules when it comes to listening to music.. " principle and enjoy my records w/o source direct (without source direct turned on)

 

[GCE]

Here something may interest:

testing 5003 without source direct

was better than

with source direct on >>> http://www.stereophile.com/content/

marantz-pm5003-integrated-amplifier-measurements

 

[ea25]

This looks like a very interesting read...thanks for sharing

 

[Thompsonuxb]

I have yet to come across an amp which sounds better with the source direct button on....... its more snake oil I tell yah!

the volume is just lowered - and I agree it does sound lifeless and flat, but if you like it like that.......

I personnally listen with bass boost/loudness when required and will adjust tone controls to suit my mood - some of you need to liste to the Rollin Stones 'Satisfaction' lyrics.

 

[JZC]

My current amp was the first time I had a source direct button and I did several tests with different types of music to verify which I considered best and always it was with the source direct button off. I also found it better to slightly boost the bass and treble, whether this was because of a lack of sensitivity with my hearing or because I cannot play it as loud as I would like in order to avoid annoying the neighbours but I would never buy an amp without tone controls.

 

[Blackdawn]

I agree, I wouldn't buy an amp without tone controls as recordings are so varied. I'll try my Pioneer A30 later on without the source direct on - see if I can notice any change.

 

[Covenanter]

Here something may interest:

testing 5003 without source direct

was better than

with source direct on >>> http://www.stereophile.com/content/

marantz-pm5003-integrated-amplifier-measurements

That is an interesting read. Thank you. I guess you read the "follow up" where they retested with a different sample which was "clean". It may be that some examples have a fault where "Source Direct" doesn't work properly.

I tried mine again this morning or 3 CDs (not a scientific test I know) and frankly I can't hear any difference but that may be my ageing ears.

Chris

 

[Native_bon]

Here something may interest:

testing 5003 without source direct

was better than

with source direct on >>> http://www.stereophile.com/content/

marantz-pm5003-integrated-amplifier-measurements

This is one of the reasons why my ears are my rules to listening & not the same old Hifi crazy people & geeks who frequent these pages & who seem to know it all. Really gets me mad when people tell me how my system should. sound. |(

 

[ea25]

Indeed I did read the follow up, which makes it even more interesting about the variance on the results between both samples!

Back to my personal amp, I played some other records today which I'm highly familiar with and again was mesmerized by the significant improvement in fidelity without source direct.

I am also surprised by the different views about the topic listed in this thread. TBH when I originally posted I was expecting that most of replies would be biased in favour of listening with source direct on, but here it is a mixture of in favour/against/no difference.

Thanks for all your comments