Please explain this...

[admin_exported]

Can anyone please explain why one fibre optic cable might be better than another when connecting your CD player to your amp? Surely if we are talking about digital 1s and 0s they it's either a 1 or a 0, there's no wooliness around the edges of that is there? And surely as the cable is passing light from one end to the other then quality of materials matters less than with copper cables as which may change the signal - but light which is either one or off is pretty much a straight forward thing.

I am not beng deliberately obnoxious and I appreciate decent kit but this is always the one question I can never answer.

Help explain if to me and tell me what your real world experiences of optical cables are, please.

Gary

 

[Andrew Everard]

Poorer quality cables can pass less light, and poor connections at either end can have reflection problems, scattering light: it all makes work for the error-correction to do at the receiving end.

 

[eggontoast]

Can anyone please explain why one fibre optic cable might be better than another when connecting your CD player to your amp? Surely if we are talking about digital 1s and 0s they it's either a 1 or a 0, there's no wooliness around the edges of that is there? And surely as the cable is passing light from one end to the other then quality of materials matters less than with copper cables as which may change the signal - but light which is either one or off is pretty much a straight forward thing.

As a foreword as this is a contentious issue I will say this is just my opinion.

There not, all digital cables are equal and sound the same

. Any perceived differences are down to placebo effect and anyone who says they can here a difference is pulling your chain or delusional and wouldn't pass an ABX test

.

 

[noogle]

Different optical cables don't make any difference. You could pass audio data down a bit of wet string and it would get there OK. Timing is a different matter - but the effect of the optical cable is irrelevent in comparison to the clock jitter of the source PC (or transport) and the problems inherent in the S/PDIF protocol. S/PDIF combines three signals in one and you can never recover the clock properly (clock recovery circuits use a phase lock loop which is modulated by the data). That is why companies such as Naim design DACs with asynchronous S/PDIF inputs which generate their own clocks locally. If you want to read about this there is white paper on Naim's website.

 

[Andrew Everard]

That is why companies such as Naim design DACs with asynchronous S/PDIF inputs which generate their own clocks locally. If you want to read about this there is white paper on Naim's website.

So you're taking Naim's view that there is a problem as proof that there isn't a problem? Clever stuff...

 

[noogle]

No - that's an aside. I don't think it's credible that different light transmission properties of optical cables cause any significant (or audible) effect on signal timing. You need to remove the data jitter tree trunk out of your eye before you start worrying about the miniscule mote that is cable effect.

 

[Ravey Gravey Davy]

No - that's an aside. I don't think it's credible that different light transmission properties of optical cables cause any significant (or audible) effect on signal timing. You need to remove the data jitter tree trunk out of your eye before you start worrying about the miniscule mote that is cable effect.

Noogle 6:42 ( or 7:3-5 depending on version)

 

[Andrew Everard]

No - that's an aside. I don't think it's credible that different light transmission properties of optical cables cause any significant (or audible) effect on signal timing. You need to remove the data jitter tree trunk out of your eye before you start worrying about the miniscule mote that is cable effect.

I didn't say it would affect timing, but rather jitter and the reliable transmission of data. Having heard different optical cables delivering a different sound, I am confident they do make a difference.

But I fear I am treading on absolutist territory here – bit hard to argue against those who say 'it cannot have any effect' – so I think I'll bow out now

This 'digits is digits' stuff gets tiresome after a while, and I think this is going to descend into another slanging match – it seems to be the way of all cable threads these days, but still they keep on coming.

I'll reiterate my simple maxim: try them for yourself, and if you hear a difference, be happy in your purchase; if you don't, be happy that you know better than all the rest of us idiots.

 

[noogle]

Although this is madness, I think we are still some way from the total insanity that was Hi Fi Answers in the early 80s. I seem to remember you had to leave equipment under a home-made cardboard pyramid overnight to improve sound quality...

 

[chebby]

I seem to remember you had to leave equipment under a home-made cardboard pyramid overnight to improve sound quality...

Pharaoh 'nuff.

It was that old... 'hieroglyphs is hieroglyphs' argument back then.

 

[Andrew Everard]

Although this is madness, I think we are still some way from the total insanity that was Hi Fi Answers in the early 80s.

Thank you for your words of support.

 

[eggontoast]

Having heard different optical cables delivering a different sound, I am confident they do make a difference.

In fairness (don't take this the wrong way but) would you not have to say this otherwise you wouldn't sell to many Hi-Fi magazines.

This 'digits is digits' stuff gets tiresome after a while, and I think this is going to descend into another slanging match – it seems to be the way of all cable threads these days, but still they keep on coming.

Unfortunately that is because there are no facts and figures to back up a lot of the cable company's claims and to many people can't hear any difference.

I'll reiterate my simple maxim: try them for yourself, and if you hear a difference, be happy in your purchase; if you don't, be happy that you know better than all the rest of us idiots.

I agree with this statement whole heartedly and not just on this subject. Too many people rely on reviews and other people's opinions to much, the only person who can tell you if it sounds better is......you. I think calling yourself an idiot is a bit strong and I don't think anyone suggested that.

 

[Andrew Everard]

In fairness (don't take this the wrong way but) would you not have to say this otherwise you wouldn't sell to many Hi-Fi magazines.

No, I wouldn't, as I don't sell to any hi-fi magazines.

I think calling yourself an idiot is a bit strong and I don't think anyone suggested that.

You haven't been following these threads much, have you?

 

[eggontoast]

I think calling yourself an idiot is a bit strong and I don't think anyone suggested that.

You haven't been following these threads much, have you?

No I'm a newbie on this forum. I have followed/been a participant on other forums in similar threads and some people do get rather......what's the word I'm looking for.....passionate on these subjects.

 

[Anonymous]

Wow, I didn't mean to start something...

Since posting my question I have seen that this thread has been done before and I don't want one of my questions to descend like that one did.

So, I am off to borrow a couple of cables and try it for myself, in the meantime, please, everyone, put the headphones down and step away from the amplifier...

 

[Andrew Everard]

So, I am off to borrow a couple of cables and try it for myself

Absolutely the best plan.

 

[Anonymous]

Isn't it funny how these debates get so heated and polarised. May I attempt at introducing some perspective into the argument?

What is absolutely clear to me is that the transmission of HD data, whether audio or video, involves handling an electrical current, or a beam of light, that are well into the radio frequency spectrum and need to be handled with some care if jitter is not to become an issue. It's not unreasonable to assume (as indeed I have, based on my experience of data transmission on aircraft) that the cable or pipe needs to be of "reasonable quality".

Most of the reasonably-priced cables, in my opinion, do a perfect job of moving data around, and is probably better than using the cheap ones that you can buy in the supermarket or on auction sites. The real issue for me though is whether spending over a hundred pounds on one is worthwhile - and I don't think it is.

Dave