Musical fidelity M6i or Naim Nait xs to drive my B&W 683

[Roby]

Cno out curiousity what is you usual listening level because I put it between 9 an 10 an I had to turn it down :O

 

[CnoEvil]

Cno out curiousity what is you usual listening level because I put it between 9 an 10 an I had to turn it down :O

Usually between 30 (above background level) and 40 (getting pretty loud).

How loud you will need is down to personal taste, the efficiency of the speakers, your cables and how the CD is mastered.

The volume goes up very quickly indeed, making the it difficult to set with the remote.

Edit. The volume on mine goes up in 10s (10;20;30 etc).....so 9 o'clock to 10 o'clock.

 

[acalex]

Indeed an amazing amp we heard this morning...pity NZ is so far away...so a lot to process on that also. But definitely a competitor of AMS...

Will write more also on my post after my "end of the journey" post

 

[CnoEvil]

Cno out curiousity what is you usual listening level because I put it between 9 an 10 an I had to turn it down :O

Usually between 30 (above background level) and 40 (getting pretty loud).

How loud you will need is down to personal taste, the efficiency of the speakers, your cables and how the CD is mastered.

The volume goes up very quickly indeed, making the it difficult to set with the remote.

Edit. The volume on mine goes up in 10s (10;20;30 etc).....so 9 o'clock to 10 o'clock.

I've checked this morning, and I am listening at just over half way between 20 & 30.

30 is quite loud and 40 is as loud as I ever want to listen - bass rattling teeth and any loose fittings!

How are you getting on with the MF?....it's only when you own it for a while in a familiar setting, that you really start to fully appreciate its talents. It brings out detail, dynamics and especially bass, that you weren't even aware that your speakers were capable of.

As yet, I haven't found a genre of music it doesn't do justice to (though not as achingly emotional as the Jadis)

 

[Roby]

Afther a lot f questions I needed to clear my head So I went to the climbing gym....

Came back way more relaxed an started to listen again in my own envirement....Lat just say I head a great learnfull night An my dissision is still not certain for several reasons... But I'm comming closer...

It's just for know I try to have a perfect position to audition the amp an I can't find it :-(

Any way I will tell more about my findings soon.....I just try to find my perfect condition to be completly honest an acurate (tonight was pretty good)

 

[Roby]

So have the AMS home for 3 days now head a lot of listening. My first impression was wierd (that's kind of why I didn't want to write immidiatly).

My first impressio was dam to much bass, lack of controle wich is absurd. first I also had feeling the high was a bit to high wich was enoying me from time to time.

But in the mean timr the detail was amazing never heart such detail an clarity on the 683's

than afther a while an a lot of cd's an vinyls, I noticed 2 thinks

Almost all the vinyl's sound superb sweet warm an detailed like never befor (except for some new record's who sound awfull, don't know what they do sometimes on new records but....) there was a lot of bass but here I had the feeling it was much more clean an contrlled.

I switched from time to time to cd. An I can say now it really depend's of the record. Problem here I guess that the AMS is less forgivven for bad records even on my 683's.

Also the way I was living the music was blured by a lot of questions:

- it's a lot of money

- Is it wotrth it

- would I not be better of with an M6i

Than A friend said I can understand I want a bycycle costing 10K So if you want it an you can afford it. Do it if it's worth for you.....

That is a hard one an it make me think a lot.

Also the friend who is buying the NAD came by. He was truely amased he said he never heard something that good. He also told me I should not hesitate.

Because I was planning to spend that kind of cash anyway so take it an buy the rest later.

If you buy an an m6i I guess I can buy an m6i for a good price in 6 month's or less bacause you're not gone be happy an you will buy tha AMS anyway.

Beside that take in consideration that almost the only thing I do beside climbing is listening to music, I don't game anymere etc...

So it's worth it.

Also I was enoyed by the fact that I didn't had a good listening possition.....So I was saying to my self 'I know this is a great amp I enjoyed it several times already but How can I juge in this position)

So I start moving the furniture arround an this untill a few hours ago PFFFF... Finaly found decent solution, still not pefect But oké. an it will stay like this I guess untill my constructionworks are done arround september.

Beside I had to find some solution thet not make my apartmen look to much like a circus ;-) so something inbetween had to be found.

No afther al this my impression is that it is a superb amp the detail is crystal clear, the bass is great an the feeling I had at the start is IMO a record problem an a bad positioning.

Also a mather of the speakers of cours take par example when we used 683's on the Sugden IA4 an switched ti D18 it was suddenly much warmer an detailed.

So I will ofcourse have to wait for my speaker change to get the sound I'm looking for. it's alreaddy so good know an sertenly now my listening possition is better I can certenly happely live with it, the 683 suddenly sound so light. My vinyls sound so good.... even with the PP3 (witch is the first thing I will change togheter with the amp).

But in the mean time now that I had a lot of tinking about it an a few talks with Alex My desission is almost made. I just have this litle voice nagging me so I will wait untill the demo of M6 pre, prx, i, AMS.

But this weekend I learned that the way you notice, feel or enjoy music cab depend of so many little things.

Tomorow I might have a visid of Alex see his impression's it might get me even closer to my desission

 

[Roby]

Now it's hard to stop listening...

But have to work tomorow. need to go to sleep

 

[CnoEvil]

Now it's hard to stop listening...

But have to work tomorow. need to go to sleep

Glad you're enjoying the amp. It digs up a lot of detail, and has huge bass.....which means careful placing and isolation of speakers, as the B&Ws are far from bass shy. The Source also has its effect.

 

[Roby]

I have the feeling vinyl taking the edge of on both side high an bass witch make it smoother than on cd without losing detail.

Looking back on tha last few days I think this amp is so great, that you have to get used to it too fully apreciate it.

In one of the review you can read in one of the bullet point's

"Not for greenie's" I think I know what they mean now ;-)

 

[CnoEvil]

Edginess on CD is likely coming from the CA CDP, which is now highlighted more than it was with the Nad (which would have worked better with it).

 

[Macspur]

Have you ruled out the Sugden all together? and what about the Perreaux, or was that never in the running?

If at any time you're looking for a new CDP... you must try the Electrocompaniet EMC1UP it is fantastic! a perfect match with the Sugden and Harbeth combo and their amps are pretty good too. In fact, at this rate, I can see myself keeping the IA-4... blow the electricity bill!

Cheers

Mac

 

[Kevin Stephens]

Hmmm, the price difference between M6i and AMS could fund a lot of great climbing trips: Red Rocks, Yosemite, Arapiles etc....

 

[acalex]

Hmmm, the price difference between M6i and AMS could fund a lot of great climbing trips: Red Rocks, Yosemite, Arapiles etc....

Mmm...not a fair statement. :rofl:

Don't think buying something more expensive (but anyway within the budget) will block Roby from developing his second passion. Plus if I know him a bit now, he won't stop thinking about how the AMS was deliverithing everything just better if he bought the M6i.

Definitely worth a direct comparison now we have much more experience and developed a much better and more critical listening experience.

 

[acalex]

Have you ruled out the Sugden all together? and what about the Perreaux, or was that never in the running?

If at any time you're looking for a new CDP... you must try the Electrocompaniet EMC1UP it is fantastic! a perfect match with the Sugden and Harbeth combo and their amps are pretty good too. In fact, at this rate, I can see myself keeping the IA-4... blow the electricity bill!

Cheers

Mac

Mac, I think price difference between Sudgen and AMS was not worth the big difference between the 2 amps, as the Sudgen dealer was not keen to give any special price/discount...so at the end of the day the AMS was about "only" 500 eur more expensive...

We found Perreaux an amazing amp...not as warm as the AMS but absolutely stunning in terms of details, clarity and power.

BUT Perreaux is in NZ....what if something goes wrong and amp needs to be shipped back? It can be very expensive...and Perreaux (the one we tried) is full of electronics onboard (display, DAC, phono stage etc....)

 

[acalex]

Edginess on CD is likely coming from the CA CDP, which is now highlighted more than it was with the Nad (which would have worked better with it).

Exactly what I said :dance:

Source now (even if for the money is a great CDP) is showing its limits suddendly with the AMS which is much more revealing than your NAD

 

[Roby]

Hmmm, the price difference between M6i and AMS could fund a lot of great climbing trips: Red Rocks, Yosemite, Arapiles etc....

True I'm planning a trip to bishop this year an Hampi next year ;-) Climbing is always number one for me an I would rather cut in the music budget than the climbing budget....

climbing is cheap comparing to hi-fi even if normaly it's a one time expence (I think it's something I said before :? )

An when I'm not training I'm bussy with music so....

Alex true cdp is provably the limit so I wait you buy a good Dac so I can test i ;-)

Mac: I think Alex axplained it verry well

Let just say I think the Ia4 is unbelevable an it would sertenly stay on my list if I could have a decent deal. but if I just need to strech only 500 or even 1000 more the AMS is a winner.

250i would deffenetly be on my list, An to be honnest I was seriously hesitating, untill I tought about the shipment an electronic problem even if you don't expect something to go wrong...you never know you might have bad luck...

So if you find a good technician for pereaux it's defenetl worth the comparision with the AMS.

 

[Macspur]

Hmmm, the price difference between M6i and AMS could fund a lot of great climbing trips: Red Rocks, Yosemite, Arapiles etc....

True I'm planning a trip to bishop this year an Hampi next year ;-) Climbing is always number one for me an I would rather cut in the music budget than the climbing budget....

climbing is cheap comparing to hi-fi even if normaly it's a one time expence (I think it's something I said before :? )

An when I'm not training I'm bussy with music so....

Alex true cdp is provably the limit so I wait you buy a good Dac so I can test i ;-)

Mac: I think Alex axplained it verry well

Let just say I think the Ia4 is unbelevable an it would sertenly stay on my list if I could have a decent deal. but if I just need to strech only 500 or even 1000 more the AMS is a winner.

250i would deffenetly be on my list, An to be honnest I was seriously hesitating, untill I tought about the shipment an electronic problem even if you don't expect something to go wrong...you never know you might have bad luck...

So if you find a good technician for pereaux it's defenetl worth the comparision with the AMS.

YepI understand, , all fair comments.

Cheers

Mac

 

[Roby]

Thanks

This mean also that If I manage to have the same kind of deal on the A4i The choice would be extreemly complicated

Reeeealy hard (mission imposible).

So maybe it's best like it's now...

 

[Roby]

Here I'm listening to music again an it's really sweet.

But at this boint cant really make my self put a cd on....that's prvably not a good thing.

except that, for me I found 2 negative points that have nothing to do with the sound.

1 the remote....first it look's impressive an I found it pretty cool. NowI just find it big, enoying, haevy an unpractical.

for one it's not really precise an ask a bit of training to get the volume level you want; secoundly the volume up buto is not in an intwetive place, when ever I want to volume up I hit the 'mute' but oke that's me an I guess you get used to it.

It looks like MF have a problem with remotes look at the one you get with the M6 serie it look like a cheap piece of plastic junk...

True I usely don't use the remote for my hifi syste except when I'm sitting in the couch my feet on the 'poef' an the laptop on my leg's like now :?

2 Is more a personal problem.

I find my self sometimes hesitating to shut it down, while I'm watching the news or something else on tv. Becaus I might listen to it again aftherwards an I don't want to wait it's warming up again. So with what it's consuming this might be something to avoid certenly if I change my mind an go to sleep.

With actualy is not really a big problem what is, is that I have a tendency to forget turning of my gear an that might bring me some surpises on the end of the year. :doh:

Also I sitting here loving the sound of the vinyl.

In case I buy the AMS what should be the next upgrade?

Except the speakers of course

- cdp

- TT

- Phono stage

- Dac

- Cables

- Streamer

....

Because afther this couple of day's I'even not shore any more the speakers are the first thing to change as that normaly will be the most expensive.

 

[toyota man]

Hi roby I use my roksan remote that came with my cdp and have no problems enjoy your music you have earnt a brake from your auditioning :cheers:

 

[acalex]

Here I'm listening to music again an it's really sweet.

But at this boint cant really make my self put a cd on....that's prvably not a good thing.

except that, for me I found 2 negative points that have nothing to do with the sound.

1 the remote....first it look's impressive an I found it pretty cool. NowI just find it big, enoying, haevy an unpractical.

for one it's not really precise an ask a bit of training to get the volume level you want; secoundly the volume up buto is not in an intwetive place, when ever I want to volume up I hit the 'mute' but oke that's me an I guess you get used to it.

It looks like MF have a problem with remotes look at the one you get with the M6 serie it look like a cheap piece of plastic junk...

True I usely don't use the remote for my hifi syste except when I'm sitting in the couch my feet on the 'poef' an the laptop on my leg's like now :?

2 Is more a personal problem.

I find my self sometimes hesitating to shut it down, while I'm watching the news or something else on tv. Becaus I might listen to it again aftherwards an I don't want to wait it's warming up again. So with what it's consuming this might be something to avoid certenly if I change my mind an go to sleep.

With actualy is not really a big problem what is, is that I have a tendency to forget turning of my gear an that might bring me some surpises on the end of the year. :doh:

Also I sitting here loving the sound of the vinyl.

In case I buy the AMS what should be the next upgrade?

Except the speakers of course

- cdp

- TT

- Phono stage

- Dac

- Cables

- Streamer

....

Because afther this couple of day's I'even not shore any more the speakers are the first thing to change as that normaly will be the most expensive.

Ah yes, we finally agree now! This is what the ams does...if you enjoy vinyl more than cd like I am doing now I thing you should look at tt and phono stage maybe

 

[CnoEvil]

There is no doubt the remote is a pain....I use a Linn one for the volume. If you end up buying it, I would try and get a cheap MF plastic one off ebay.

Your next upgrade will depend on how much money you are willing to spend, and where your priorities lie. If CD/Streaming is important, then it should be here.... oke: Linn DS

You may be able to tie in with Acalex, to see the effect of changing the TT .

Your speakers can be provoked into brightness, which I believe is what your CDP is doing.

 

[Roby]

There is no doubt the remote is a pain....I use a Linn one for the volume. If you end up buying it, I would try and get a cheap MF plastic one off ebay.

Your next upgrade will depend on how much money you are willing to spend, and where your priorities lie. If CD/Streaming is important, then it should be here.... oke: Linn DS

You may be able to tie in with Acalex, to see the effect of changing the TT .

Your speakers can be provoked into brightness, which I believe is what your CDP is doing.

You might be right,

I remember auditioning the sugden with Alex I had the same feeling at first. using the 683's an the ca cdp. It was way better when we conected the D18 even with cd, far from what I would call perfect but I'm provably getting pickie.

so it provably a bit of both cdp an speakers (btw didn't listen to any cd tonight)

I have quite a lot of cd's an have tendencie to buy theme all the time. When I buy music I like to have it in my hand I have kind of a wierd feeling buying music digitaly, call me old school ;-) so I feel kind of obligated to have a cdp :wall:

 

[Macspur]

There is no doubt the remote is a pain....I use a Linn one for the volume. If you end up buying it, I would try and get a cheap MF plastic one off ebay.

Your next upgrade will depend on how much money you are willing to spend, and where your priorities lie. If CD/Streaming is important, then it should be here.... oke: Linn DS

You may be able to tie in with Acalex, to see the effect of changing the TT .

Your speakers can be provoked into brightness, which I believe is what your CDP is doing.

You might be right,

I remember auditioning the sugden with Alex I had the same feeling at first. using the 683's an the ca cdp. It was way better when we conected the D18 even with cd, far from what I would call perfect but I'm provably getting pickie.

so it provably a bit of both cdp an speakers (btw didn't listen to any cd tonight)

I have quite a lot of cd's an have tendencie to buy theme all the time. When I buy music I like to have it in my hand I have kind of a wierd feeling buying music digitaly, call me old school ;-) so I feel kind of obligated to have a cdp :wall:

Roby,

When it comes to looking for a CDP, look no further than Electrocompaniet EMC1UP... as you may have read from my thread, I've tried quite a few high end players and the EMC1UP is without doubt the best... so far... yet to hear the new Sugden, but I will be amazed if it's better!

Cheers

Mac

 

[acalex]

There is no doubt the remote is a pain....I use a Linn one for the volume. If you end up buying it, I would try and get a cheap MF plastic one off ebay.

Your next upgrade will depend on how much money you are willing to spend, and where your priorities lie. If CD/Streaming is important, then it should be here.... oke: Linn DS

You may be able to tie in with Acalex, to see the effect of changing the TT .

Your speakers can be provoked into brightness, which I believe is what your CDP is doing.

You might be right,

I remember auditioning the sugden with Alex I had the same feeling at first. using the 683's an the ca cdp. It was way better when we conected the D18 even with cd, far from what I would call perfect but I'm provably getting pickie.

so it provably a bit of both cdp an speakers (btw didn't listen to any cd tonight)

I have quite a lot of cd's an have tendencie to buy theme all the time. When I buy music I like to have it in my hand I have kind of a wierd feeling buying music digitaly, call me old school ;-) so I feel kind of obligated to have a cdp :wall:

Roby...I also like to have music I like in my hand...that's why I keep buying CDs...do I have a CDP?

You can still keep buying CDs but ripping them and streaming them. It is more convenient and easy...and plus you get always better for your money with a stremer than a CDP. I tried myself the SB Touch against a Rega Saturn and I could hear no difference using a Plinius amp and Kef reference speakers.

As already said...start buying a SB Touch which is an absolutely no risk purchase (especially at the price you can get) to get the feeling of streaming...then you can decide which road to take. I am pretty confident you will stay on this way and come with me to listen to the Akurate DS :rofl:

If you get tired of SBT you can always sell it on ebay or I will buy it from you for my bedroom :dance:

At the beginning you don't even need a dedicated NAS but a notebook can do the trick easily. 8)