More upgrade help please

[Deleted member 160668]

Hello everyone,

I made a recent post where I asked for direction of I should go power amp/biwire/or speakers. Since then I've been away but am now back - You all communally directed me to power amp first. Thank you - it sounds very nice and was a very excellent guidance.

Setup is a humble Linn Classik, now connected to LK140 power amp and B&W 601s2 (still single wired - I listened). I have also purchased an Arcam rBlink Bluetooth which in my opinion sounds excellent.

I am again fortunate to have some more funds to spend and am loving the improvements I have gained already so after some more directions please...

Budget £1000. What should I do next. I listen to all types of music, am a massive CD collector and also stream Spotify premium at highest quality.

More clashing reviews online, but seems that the Classik can be improved upon. What would anyone suggest I do.

Thank you for any responses and please forgive my novice questions.

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

I doubt the amplification is now the weakest link in the chain and If I were you I'd be looking at a nice pair of standmounts in your budget just off the top of my head....the kef ls50's get lots of praise on the site,focal 906's are also spoken about what much affection,pmc db1i's,b&w cm5s2,another option Is if you can use the classik as a pre amp then the avi dm5's could be worth some consideration if you don't mind doing away with the power amp.I haven't heard them but those and there bigger brothers the dm10's are getting rave reviews from all that have heard or own them.

 

[BigH]

I would change the speakers. This may help: http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/finally-upgrading-my-bw-601-s2s

Or yes if you can hear AVI worth a try. I would go for the 10s or some used 9RS if you can find any.

 

[Al ears]

If not the speakers then a bit of leftfield thinking may appeal. Perhaps the aged Linn Magic could be replaced by a modern universal player such as the Oppo 105eu.

However forget that if you listen to FM radio.

 

[Deleted member 160668]

Thank you for replies.

Ive been thinking of PMC DB1i's vs Sonus Faver Toy standmounts Vs Kef LS50 as next upgrade. Unfortunately I'm going in blind (deaf) on these purely on reviews. My room won't accommodate floorstanders and neither would my neighbours. Also considering another Linn amp (sorry for my repeating of last post, but keen for more feedback) then going down the Aktiv route. Not sure how this compares to much newer PMC's etc which I'm very much leaning towards.

Thank you for any more replies.

Also considering splitting base and treble across Classik and LK140 as good reviews for this, however this contradicts previous what hifi advice.

Aaaah. In pursuit of limited, but incrementally improving, budget and musical perfection...

Any help thankful for.

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

If you can stretch your budget a bit.....then farnthorpes in Hull have some ex demo pmc twenty 21's which I own and can attest to their brilliance for £1189.Lovely aesthetically and sonically but I could be a bit biased here.lol.

 

[Gray]

If you can stretch your budget a bit.....then farnthorpes in Hull have some ex demo pmc twenty 21's which I own and can attest to their brilliance for £1189.Lovely aesthetically and sonically but I could be a bit biased here.lol.

Mark is very biased. But I agree with everything he says about the PMC 21s, because I also own a pair - so that's two biased opinions for you!

 

[luckylion100]

If you can stretch your budget a bit.....then farnthorpes in Hull have some ex demo pmc twenty 21's which I own and can attest to their brilliance for £1189.Lovely aesthetically and sonically but I could be a bit biased here.lol.

Mark is very biased. But I agree with everything he says about the PMC 21s, because I also own a pair - so that's two biased opinions for you!

the Twenty 23's, I also +3 that suggestion!

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

Yep.the 21's and the 23's use the same mid bass driver and tweeter,just the cabinet size,transmission line and oh about £700 are different.lol.

 

[rainsoothe]

As far as I know, Linn stuff is pretty warm sounding, so Sonus Faber Toy should be out of the question.

As a semi-sidenote, I visited a PMC dealer a couple of months ago, and they had a pair of PMC Twenty 23 hooked up to some Bryston integrated (not the entry-level, though) + streamer + their latest DAC iteration. It was the first time I got to hear PMC, and I found them a bit too... sharp - not harsh, but too quick to start and stop, and the highs were bothersome. Rest of the presentation was ok I guess, but a bit too cold for my tastes.

Now, two days ago, I went to the same dealer (with my Naims) to audition a pair of B&W CM5 s2 (haven't heard B&W in a while, and I used to love them). I asked what other standmounts they have in the same priceranged, and I auditioned a few. Just arrived in his shop, was a pair of PMC DB1 Gold (which is the same as DB1i), sealed in a box. He said they're a bit special. He put them on, and I just started laughing. I listend to those small boxes for half an hour, and I just started laughing out of the blue from time to time. Their sound is unreal, imo. Yes, there are limitations, and yes, they aren't neutral, but damn... The soundstage they produce is unreal. Precise but never tiresome, nice energy in the bass - which is very tight and surprisingly punchy.

If I had any money right now, that's what I would upgrade to. 'till then, guess I'll just have to attempt trading in my Focals for a pair of used Spendor S3e...

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

Hay there rainsoothe,I got my 21's on the end of the nait xs which I'm sure you know is a pretty smooth sounding amp,and they go very well together,I think the smoothness in the amp tames the excitement (as some would call it)in the speakers.give them a try with your qute.

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

News flash.A pair of harbeth p3esr are on the bay starting at £850.they don't appear very often and if my Mrs wasn't wanting to get a holiday booked I could be tempted.lol.even just to hear what the fuss is all about . you'd be able to sell them on without much loss if any.they ain't the prettiest speakers I've ever seen though . Although I doubt if my amp will get them working sufficiently with a sensitivity of db 83.5 and 6ohms.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

As far as I know, Linn stuff is pretty warm sounding, so Sonus Faber Toy should be out of the question.

As a semi-sidenote, I visited a PMC dealer a couple of months ago, and they had a pair of PMC Twenty 23 hooked up to some Bryston integrated (not the entry-level, though) + streamer + their latest DAC iteration. It was the first time I got to hear PMC, and I found them a bit too... sharp - not harsh, but too quick to start and stop, and the highs were bothersome. Rest of the presentation was ok I guess, but a bit too cold for my tastes.

Now, two days ago, I went to the same dealer (with my Naims) to audition a pair of B&W CM5 s2 (haven't heard B&W in a while, and I used to love them). I asked what other standmounts they have in the same priceranged, and I auditioned a few. Just arrived in his shop, was a pair of PMC DB1 Gold (which is the same as DB1i), sealed in a box. He said they're a bit special. He put them on, and I just started laughing. I listend to those small boxes for half an hour, and I just started laughing out of the blue from time to time. Their sound is unreal, imo. Yes, there are limitations, and yes, they aren't neutral, but damn... The soundstage they produce is unreal. Precise but never tiresome, nice energy in the bass - which is very tight and surprisingly punchy.

If I had any money right now, that's what I would upgrade to. 'till then, guess I'll just have to attempt trading in my Focals for a pair of used Spendor S3e...

Had my PMC DB1 Golds' for about 2 years now and have never looked back; they suit my needs perfectly and never cease to surprise and amaze. Agreed, not the last thing in sonic ability but what they do have is appeal and grin-factor by the bucket-load. Their output belies their size, (they replaced a pair of MA RX2's). The cabinet finish, however, belies their price *biggrin* and not in a positive way, but who cares when you're grinning like a cheshire cat .

Who needs big floorstanders in a room 4m x 3.5m when you can have everything you need from a speaker with a frontal area smaller than a sheet of A4 paper *smile*.

The only upgrade path I would ever consider in the distant future would be a move to PMC twotwo.5 actives, but not until I have had the opportunity to fully audition them.

 

[Deleted member 160668]

Thanks for all input everyone... Decided am going to go down PMC rout and for some PMC DB1i or Gold, 21's I feel will be too big.

I will report back, hopefully grinning from ear to ear once I've picked some up. They seem to infrequently come up on eBay so hopefully in the next month or two... Tried local shop for some golds but not stocked.

Thanks again

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

The 21's are pretty small at only 15cm's wide,32.5 high and 24cm's deep.

 

[Deleted member 160668]

But my room is smalkish... Approx 5-6m long and 3.5m wide. Have corner custom shelves with acoustic foam and B&W's on them (wide ways so c6metres spread wide and toed in), pointed directly at my 'sofa chilling seat'. Think the 21's may be too large for shelves (which admittedly could be replaced), flip side advantage is the bass port is on front, where on DB1i/golds it's on rear. Slightly worried about boominess where directly in corners of room if rear ported... Any thoughts?

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

The pmc's don't have bass ports....they are the transmission line exits and they happen to work quite well close to walls,in fact the 21's actually need a wall behind them or they sound very lean...think 10 -20 cm's is OK.but I'd try and clear them a bit from the corner....no speaker sounds good stuck in a corner.

 

[Deleted member 160668]

Thanks. ATL rather than bass port, that's what I meant...

off to get out tape measure and work out if the 21's will fit, and if not what change to shelves may be required...

now im thinking...

...could also demo some 21's where I'm going blind on DB1i/golds.

pretty sure it's a monster step up either way.

Thanks.

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

Well remember what I said about farnthorpes in Hull.their ex demo units will be in as new condition with the 20 year warranty.a great saving on a new pair.give them a call very helpful guys.its where I got mine.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Just compared the specs on these two models and they are identical apart from the cabinet and ATL exit port. Guess they must sound very similar but the 21 is the upgraded model.

Mark is spot-on, definitely get them out of the corners as they will sound abysmal. Got mine on wall brackets pretty close to the wall, 550mm in from the corner and front face 350mm out from the wall, (both approx.), with about 5 degrees toe-in, this positioning sounds ok if you don't wan't night club levels. I listen at about 75dB peak, as I cherish my friendship with my neighbours, going above this does introduce some unwanted bass bloom, (music dependent). Postioning is probably the most important factor of speaker set-up, took me a couple of months of trial and error before I finally hit the sweet spot.

I know my model is not what you'd call a bass monster but these little speakers, both the DB1 and the 21, can produce a wonderful tight and punchy bass which totally belies their diminutive dimensions.

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

Sorry Dougk.but there is nothing identical about the db1's and the 21's.the 20 range was built from the ground up with nothing used in there making from any other speaker model.

 

[Al ears]

The pmc's don't have bass ports....they are the transmission line exits and they happen to work quite well close to walls,in fact the 21's actually need a wall behind them or they sound very lean...think 10 -20 cm's is OK.but I'd try and clear them a bit from the corner....no speaker sounds good stuck in a corner.

Unless they are that rare breed that are designed for corners. There are a few.

 

[hybridauth_Facebook_100004211376004]

I'm sure such rarity will come at a price though Al?And probably hellishly difficult to drive or something....to discourage mere mortals of owning such speakers.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Sorry Dougk.but there is nothing identical about the db1's and the 21's.the 20 range was built from the ground up with nothing used in there making from any other speaker model.

Rather terse and defensive for you, Mark!

I was referring to: drive cone sizes; frequency response and sensitivity specs. You probably did your homework before your purchase so I will bow to your superior knowledge in this instance. However, what you have to say just sounds like advertising spiel to me.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Unless they are that rare breed that are designed for corners. There are a few.

Ooh sounds interesting, tell me more Al, I'm all ears *smile*