Marantz M-CR610

[Frank Harvey]

I might add, that if hi-fi dealers were generally better and more interested in really getting to know a customer's needs, a lot of this box swapping might have been cut out. As it stands, many stock a limited range of product and either push the award winners or the stuff they like themselves. That isn't what looking after a customer is about.

Many small dealers can't support a large range of electronics and speakers, it just depends on the size of their database/footfall. Not that there is anything wrong with a small range as it can be a sign of a carefully cherrypicked product range that represents the best of the best. Of course, it could just be that they're not pro-active/busy enough to support a large range. Having a larger range gives the customer better choice, but it can be confusing for some people and you might have a few 'duds' (to put things bluntly) amongst the good stuff. Most people seem to want to audition at places with a large range where they can hear everything they want to under one roof.

How would you run things if it were your store MP?

 

[Cypher]

I might add, that if hi-fi dealers were generally better and more interested in really getting to know a customer's needs, a lot of this box swapping might have been cut out.

So the hi-fi dealers are the problem

The problem is that you never will be satisfied with anything you buy..............learn to enjoy the system you have is the answer

 

[BigH]

I might add, that if hi-fi dealers were generally better and more interested in really getting to know a customer's needs, a lot of this box swapping might have been cut out. As it stands, many stock a limited range of product and either push the award winners or the stuff they like themselves. That isn't what looking after a customer is about.

Good independants don't work that way Matthew but, in my experience, most chains do. Profit per cardboard box etc. Doesn't mean I agree with it but alas that's the way it is and a lot of people get 'suckered' in.

Actually in my area I found the opposite, the local inde was far more pushy on one brand and rubbished another brand that they did not stock than a nation chain store that has 7 in its name. In fact I found & oaks to be pretty good, wide range of brands, helpful and experienced staff. I found many store carried very limited stock esp. for speakers in the £500-£1000 band, it was very hard to compare brands, also they may stock the brand but not the speakers you want to hear, that goes for Totem, Epos and Dyn which are hard enough to find anyway.

 

[matthewpiano]

I'm not putting all the blame on to dealers and I'm certainly not admonishing my own responsibility. Ultimately I make my own purchasing decisions and in future I need to demand more when I am shopping for equipment.

However, what I really would have liked in an ideal world is a dealer who stocks enough different brands and components to be able to put together a system to suit most tastes and needs. I'd also like to be able to walk into a hi-fi shop that has more choice than just B&W and MA in speakers (at the budget end) and at least one or two brands that are slightly off the beaten path but which offer something different. You can easily find places for Naim, Rega and Cyrus but many brands are very hard to track down. Simply pushing B&W and MA (for example) because they are popular or highly rated in reviews isn't enough IMO.

Most of all, I think specialist shops should be willing to really spend time properly qualifying a customer's needs and exploring enough options to be able to find a solution which is likely to be successful. I'm not saying there aren't any that do this as there are clearly some very good dealers in the UK (I'd like to be closer to either Frank Harvey or Musicraft for example), but I do find that a lot seem to want to tell you what good sound is rather than helping to find a system that gives the sound you personally want as a customer.

It is a minor point really, but just one I felt was worth mentioning.

 

[matthewpiano]

Thanks for the good reviews of the Marantz and the new Knight 1's. I was really temped by the Knights recently. The finish appears great on the net for the Knight range. Thinking of the Knight 1 or 3's. Its a bit like when I got a pair of BA A26 speakers on sale - definitely worth the price. How do you connect the PC or laptop to the Marantz for streaming by the way? MP have you tried the Epic 2 speakers? thanks.

Hi Blackdawn.

I stream FLAC files wirelessly to the Marantz using Foobar2000 as a server on my PC. Works extremely well.

I haven't heard the Epic range. Epos are one of the brands that are badly represented. I used to have some M5is which were quite nice, but too sibilant in the treble.

 

[Blackdawn]

Hi Blackdawn.

I stream FLAC files wirelessly to the Marantz using Foobar2000 as a server on my PC. Works extremely well.

I haven't heard the Epic range. Epos are one of the brands that are badly represented. I used to have some M5is which were quite nice, but too sibilant in the treble.

[/quote]

Okay, I've always found my PC a little on the noisy side with fans etc, so never really thought of connecting it up to hifi - wired or wireless connection. Great the cd player is not so important now with so many sources/functionality at hand with the M-CR610. e.g. Spotify, PC streaming DAB etc

I see the Epics has different soft dome tweeters to the M5is metal.

Are you finding you are missing the Dali speakers yet?

 

[davedotco]

One of the big issues i find is that customers, in the main, do not use hi-fi shops in a way that is productive.

My own advice is simple and i have suggested this many times, on this thread and elsewhere.

Go and talk to you local dealer. Tell him what you want in functional and musical terms. Ask if they would be prepared to set up some systems that they think should fit your criteria and let you hear them.

Listen to them, give your observations and let the dealer tune a system to your taste.

Repeat with as many local dealers as you can.

Buy the the system you like most from the dealer who was most helpful and knowledgeable. Get him to deliver and help with the setup, do not let him leave until you are happy.

Things to avoid.

Quoting reviews. The dealer will then just recomend anything with a 5* review.

Asking about product he doesn't stock. You wouldn't ask an Audi dealer what he thinks of a BMW, would you!

Playing any music by Dire Straits or Pink Floyd. The dealer will just laugh!

 

[matthewpiano]

One of the big issues i find is that customers, in the main, do not use hi-fi shops in a way that is productive.

My own advice is simple and i have suggested this many times, on this thread and elsewhere.

Go and talk to you local dealer. Tell him what you want in functional and musical terms. Ask if they would be prepared to set up some systems that they think should fit your criteria and let you hear them.

Listen to them, give your observations and let the dealer tune a system to your taste.

Repeat with as many local dealers as you can.

Buy the the system you like most from the dealer who was most helpful and knowledgeable. Get him to deliver and help with the setup, do not let him leave until you are happy.

Things to avoid.

Quoting reviews. The dealer will then just recomend anything with a 5* review.

Asking about product he doesn't stock. You wouldn't ask an Audi dealer what he thinks of a BMW, would you!

Playing any music by Dire Straits or Pink Floyd. The dealer will just laugh!

All good advice which I'll certainly heed in future, though I take exception to the final line. I couldn't give a monkeys what a dealer thinks of my taste in music. If he/she laughs they wouldn't get my business.

 

[matthewpiano]

Hi Blackdawn.

I stream FLAC files wirelessly to the Marantz using Foobar2000 as a server on my PC. Works extremely well.

I haven't heard the Epic range. Epos are one of the brands that are badly represented. I used to have some M5is which were quite nice, but too sibilant in the treble.

Okay, I've always found my PC a little on the noisy side with fans etc, so never really thought of connecting it up to hifi - wired or wireless connection. Great the cd player is not so important now with so many sources/functionality at hand with the M-CR610. e.g. Spotify, PC streaming DAB etc

I see the Epics has different soft dome tweeters to the M5is metal.

Are you finding you are missing the Dali speakers yet?

Not yet, though they are still here at present. Great though the Zensor 3s are I haven't felt even slightly tempted to put them back on. I think that is a pretty good test.

 

[chebby]

Playing any music by Dire Straits or Pink Floyd. The dealer will just laugh!

But that's fifty percent of the people on this forum

 

[BigH]

Asking about product he doesn't stock. You wouldn't ask an Audi dealer what he thinks of a BMW, would you!

Well hifi is not like cars, think its fairly obvious what cars a dealer stocks, not so clear what hifi brands or items they stock, for instance my local has Kef on their website turns out they only stock their 5.1 speakers. Apparently Kefs are boomy.

Also not everyone has a wide choice of dealers so its not so easy to find gear you want to demo in many areas. Try finding dealers that stock Creek or Harbeth or Epos or Dyns or Totems or Dali or Spendor or even Kef.

 

[tino]

Glad you like the Knight 1's and nice to hear the positive write-up. I got myself a pair at a very good price in my last year's (never to be repeated) hifi splurge ... they are going to hang off the end of a Teac A-H01 when I get round to it.

 

[Frank Harvey]

One of the big issues i find is that customers, in the main, do not use hi-fi shops in a way that is productive.

My own advice is simple and i have suggested this many times, on this thread and elsewhere.

Go and talk to you local dealer. Tell him what you want in functional and musical terms. Ask if they would be prepared to set up some systems that they think should fit your criteria and let you hear them.

Listen to them, give your observations and let the dealer tune a system to your taste.

Repeat with as many local dealers as you can.

Buy the the system you like most from the dealer who was most helpful and knowledgeable. Get him to deliver and help with the setup, do not let him leave until you are happy.

Things to avoid.

Quoting reviews. The dealer will then just recomend anything with a 5* review.

Asking about product he doesn't stock. You wouldn't ask an Audi dealer what he thinks of a BMW, would you!

Playing any music by Dire Straits or Pink Floyd. The dealer will just laugh!

Spot on.

Although the music used for audition really doesn't matter - what should be used I the audition is what is listened to by the user.

 

[davedotco]

One of the big issues i find is that customers, in the main, do not use hi-fi shops in a way that is productive.

My own advice is simple and i have suggested this many times, on this thread and elsewhere.

Go and talk to you local dealer. Tell him what you want in functional and musical terms. Ask if they would be prepared to set up some systems that they think should fit your criteria and let you hear them.

Listen to them, give your observations and let the dealer tune a system to your taste.

Repeat with as many local dealers as you can.

Buy the the system you like most from the dealer who was most helpful and knowledgeable. Get him to deliver and help with the setup, do not let him leave until you are happy.

Things to avoid.

Quoting reviews. The dealer will then just recomend anything with a 5* review.

Asking about product he doesn't stock. You wouldn't ask an Audi dealer what he thinks of a BMW, would you!

Playing any music by Dire Straits or Pink Floyd. The dealer will just laugh!

All good advice which I'll certainly heed in future, though I take exception to the final line. I couldn't give a monkeys what a dealer thinks of my taste in music. If he/she laughs they wouldn't get my business.

Some years ago we had a collection tin for the childrens ward at the local hospital. Started off as a £1 'swear box' but we ended up putting up a list of charges if people wanted to play certain recordings. Brothers in Arms was, at one point, a fiver.

Most of our customers were great, contributing freely, some even deliberately bringing in 'cheesy' albums so they could contribute. Some, who did not know us very well just ignored it, we never 'pushed' it with anyone.

I can only remember one person who got the hump, wasn't you was it.....?

 

[matthewpiano]

Glad you like the Knight 1's and nice to hear the positive write-up. I got myself a pair at a very good price in my last year's (never to be repeated) hifi splurge ... they are going to hang off the end of a Teac A-H01 when I get round to it.

:cheers:

 

[davedotco]

One of the big issues i find is that customers, in the main, do not use hi-fi shops in a way that is productive.

My own advice is simple and i have suggested this many times, on this thread and elsewhere.

Go and talk to you local dealer. Tell him what you want in functional and musical terms. Ask if they would be prepared to set up some systems that they think should fit your criteria and let you hear them.

Listen to them, give your observations and let the dealer tune a system to your taste.

Repeat with as many local dealers as you can.

Buy the the system you like most from the dealer who was most helpful and knowledgeable. Get him to deliver and help with the setup, do not let him leave until you are happy.

Things to avoid.

Quoting reviews. The dealer will then just recomend anything with a 5* review.

Asking about product he doesn't stock. You wouldn't ask an Audi dealer what he thinks of a BMW, would you!

Playing any music by Dire Straits or Pink Floyd. The dealer will just laugh!

Spot on.

Although the music used for audition really doesn't matter - what should be used I the audition is what is listened to by the user.

No.

I always found it useful to listen to something selected by the dealer that I had not heard before.

If it engages you from the outset, you are on the right track....... :rockout:

 

[matthewpiano]

One of the big issues i find is that customers, in the main, do not use hi-fi shops in a way that is productive.

My own advice is simple and i have suggested this many times, on this thread and elsewhere.

Go and talk to you local dealer. Tell him what you want in functional and musical terms. Ask if they would be prepared to set up some systems that they think should fit your criteria and let you hear them.

Listen to them, give your observations and let the dealer tune a system to your taste.

Repeat with as many local dealers as you can.

Buy the the system you like most from the dealer who was most helpful and knowledgeable. Get him to deliver and help with the setup, do not let him leave until you are happy.

Things to avoid.

Quoting reviews. The dealer will then just recomend anything with a 5* review.

Asking about product he doesn't stock. You wouldn't ask an Audi dealer what he thinks of a BMW, would you!

Playing any music by Dire Straits or Pink Floyd. The dealer will just laugh!

All good advice which I'll certainly heed in future, though I take exception to the final line. I couldn't give a monkeys what a dealer thinks of my taste in music. If he/she laughs they wouldn't get my business.

Some years ago we had a collection tin for the childrens ward at the local hospital. Started off as a £1 'swear box' but we ended up putting up a list of charges if people wanted to play certain recordings. Brothers in Arms was, at one point, a fiver.

Most of our customers were great, contributing freely, some even deliberately bringing in 'cheesy' albums so they could contribute. Some, who did not know us very well just ignored it, we never 'pushed' it with anyone.

I can only remember one person who got the hump, wasn't you was it.....?

No, not me. I think that is a bit different especially for such a good cause and if it is in good humour. :cheers:

However, I do think that dealers have to be careful not to make inferences about a customer's choice of music. I have to do the same in my job. The music some people choose to play on their pianos really grates on me, but at the end of the day they need to compare pianos using music they like and which is familiar to them. Me playing extracts from classical and jazz music for them can be really helpful in allowing a customer to hear a piano being stretched, but they need to feel comfortable testing the instrument for themselves. For many customers a piano shop (readily interchangeable with 'hi-fi shop') is quite a daunting place to be in the first place without staff making them feel uncomfortable.

 

[matthewpiano]

One of the big issues i find is that customers, in the main, do not use hi-fi shops in a way that is productive.

My own advice is simple and i have suggested this many times, on this thread and elsewhere.

Go and talk to you local dealer. Tell him what you want in functional and musical terms. Ask if they would be prepared to set up some systems that they think should fit your criteria and let you hear them.

Listen to them, give your observations and let the dealer tune a system to your taste.

Repeat with as many local dealers as you can.

Buy the the system you like most from the dealer who was most helpful and knowledgeable. Get him to deliver and help with the setup, do not let him leave until you are happy.

Things to avoid.

Quoting reviews. The dealer will then just recomend anything with a 5* review.

Asking about product he doesn't stock. You wouldn't ask an Audi dealer what he thinks of a BMW, would you!

Playing any music by Dire Straits or Pink Floyd. The dealer will just laugh!

Spot on.

Although the music used for audition really doesn't matter - what should be used I the audition is what is listened to by the user.

No.

I always found it useful to listen to something selected by the dealer that I had not heard before.

If it engages you from the outset, you are on the right track....... :rockout:

I think a combination of the two is useful. Not much point in an audition if you don't try out some of the music you love, but I also think it is very enlightening to see how well a system enables you to engage with new music.

 

[tino]

Glad you like the Knight 1's and nice to hear the positive write-up. I got myself a pair at a very good price in my last year's (never to be repeated) hifi splurge ... they are going to hang off the end of a Teac A-H01 when I get round to it.

:cheers:

:cheers: ... as a fellow resident of the MCR area you are more than welcome to have a listen to my other "Toy" like speakers ...

 

[Frank Harvey]

The system auditioned will be listened to with the user's music tastes, so should be auditioned with their material first and foremost. By all means listen to something you've never heard before - this is the dealer's chance to show how good the system can sound. This is a part of the demo like. Regardless of whether someone buys from a demo or not, I always feel good when someone asks who the artist is. I can induce that response in any demo, as there's plenty of obscure artists I like that most people haven't heard of!

 

[Frank Harvey]

:cheers: ... as a fellow resident of the MCR area you are more than welcome to have a listen to my other "Toy" like speakers ...

Agreed! Fantastic little speakers - we have ours playing on the end of an MCR610 on the shop floor...

 

[davedotco]

The system auditioned will be listened to with the user's music tastes, so should be auditioned with their material first and foremost. By all means listen to something you've never heard before - this is the dealer's chance to show how good the system can sound. This is a part of the demo like. Regardless of whether someone buys from a demo or not, I always feel good when someone asks who the artist is. I can induce that response in any demo, as there's plenty of obscure artists I like that most people haven't heard of!

This is of course the percieved wisdom, as a dealer I would never stop a potential customer playing what he likes though I have seen many a demo come off the rails due to a poor choice of music.

As for playing something different and unknown, that is my choice as a punter, not as a dealer. It also gives me the chance to see if the dealer knows what he is doing, choosing to play a favourite piece that does not work too well on the system under audition does not fill me with confidence.

 

[Blackdawn]

MP you may have already mentioned - as the Marantz M-CR610 has A and B speaker outputs, just for fun - have you tested the various speakers you own against one another?It may be quite interesting to see how they compare. Have you found any good internet radio stations via the Marantz? Also how quickly does it start up from plugging it in the wall - to finding a station? Is the unit fairly quiet ? Sorry for the questions. Thanks.

 

[Johnno2]

another MCR610 convert here , Some of my stuff is now going on ebay to pay for it but I will be keeping the vinyl system seperate as I love the sound via the Yamaha and Tannoys,,

however I will be using some AE109's floorstanders which I have had a quick listen to it and its sounds rich with ample detail, very pleased, but worried the 6 ohm AE's will overstretch the unit at higher volumes I understand the AE will draw more current :? , would I be better putting the 8 ohm tannoy V4 with it ?

 

[ela-ted]

I bought into the cult of the MCR610 last month, as my Rega tuner was playing up and I really wanted to access DAB as well. I've been out of the hi-fi hobby for many years and it was interesting coming back to see how much some things have moved on. Anyway, I thought I'd take a punt on one of these, having tried an Arcam Solo Mini the previous year and not liked the sound at all. Generally I'm very pleased, and I'm struggling to hear much difference between it and my Rega set up, albeit with my now failing hearing. I'm genuinely impressed with the ease of Airplay and the quality of the sound, using cd's ripped into iTunes as Apple Lossless. The main reason for buying, and my main frustration now the honeymoon period is over, is the slow tuning of the radio tuners between presets. I've got fm, dab and internet stations saved and switching between dab stations using the call button takes 5-6 seconds, which is ridiculously long. My cheapo Roberts desktop radio does it in about 1-2 seconds. FM takes the same 5-6 seconds, whether its fm-fm or fm-dab or vice versa. Looking at the display, it seems to me that the software goes back to the mode selector and then starts again, rather than staying in tuner mode and jumping to the preset. Has anyone else experienced this? I have a good roof mounted aerial and a 100% signal.